Jessa, Ben and Spurgeon Part Seven

[LawsonBatesEgo]

15 hours ago, Casserole said:

 

No, but even their taped TLC birth announcement, she wouldn't say the name. She stopped and let Ben say it. Up until recently, she never called him by name. While pregnant she nicknamed him #BabyQuincy and that's what she referred to him as for the first months of his life. 

Oddly enough, I just went through her instagram to verify and all of his pictures now have #SpurgeonElliotSeewald on them, but I swear at the time of posting she didn't have his name, just #BabyQuincy or #BabySeewald. They must have added it later because it was definitely discussed on FJ how she wouldn't use his name. 

I suspect Jessa was hoping that "Quincy" would have stuck permanently and he'd never really be called Spurgeon, but her headship clearly wouldn't have it and now she's tagging everything with his full name. 

[princessmahina]

6 hours ago, HeadshipRegent said:

I don't want your thoughts and prayers if you think Islam is the problem when three of our presidential candidates showed support for a Christian pastor who advocates for the execution of queer people.

 

I think I must be out of the loop, because I really didn't understand this reference. Which three candidates? What pastor?

[PennySycamore]

@Jinder Roles and @HeadshipRegent,  I wish I could like your powerful posts 1000 times  -no, make that 1,000,000 x.

@princessmahina, Ted Cruz was supported by a virulently anti-LGBT preacher who called for the execution of queer folk.  I don't know who else had entanglements with this POS.

[socalrules]

I am just going to say it. I don't think the Duggars, or even most fundies, care that 50 people died in Orlando. I also don't think they care about the 9 killed in the church in Charleston. I just don't think they care much about what happens to people outside of their own circle. The Duggars have never done anything to make me think they empathize with anyone not a Duggar. I can't see them being horrified or even giving a fuck that so many families are in mourning right now. They have never shown compassion to anyone. Why would they? They firmly believe that they are perfect Christians and basically everyone else is going to hell. I wouldn't doubt that they think that the people in Orlando deserved it because they are gay. Let's not forget Michelle and her bathroom crusade. I just can't see them suddenly being compassionate for the loss of so many people. 

[Eternalbluepearl]

The Duggars have compassion all right...for themselves. Many a tear was shed by the Duggars when their brother was outted for being the piece of crap person that he is. Tears for others? Maybe for an unborn baby. It stops there. 

[AlwaysExcited]

I am pretty sure that statement goes into "love the sinner, hate the sin" category. 
Possible translation: "We will deny your rights and blame you for all evil, and call for laws that discriminate you, but when a hateful bigot (that we think totally should have legal rights to own a gun) will shoot you, or your friends or your community members, we will post a quote in social media and offer a prayer. Cause we love you, our dear neighbor. Now, repent from your sins, please, we can't stand your sexuality."
Another possible translation: "Just, please, blame Islam and Islam alone."

[C.DarwinDuggar]

I have a problem with their logic.  Of "I'll pray for you, but I will do everything in my power to strip away your rights and create an environment where your physically unsafe". I can't give them a pass. 

I agree with @AlwaysExcited that there is the push of trying to blame " just Islam " and ignoring the fact that  christian fundamentals share the same  view towards the LGBT community- so now they are going to publicly pray for our neighbors 

 

[C.DarwinDuggar]

On the name thing, it must suck not being able to say your kid's name because you think it is stupid 

Side note: when I was younger I use to dislike my name because it couldn't be shorten or derive a nickname from it. Now I like that it is a normal  name and that I am not stuck with a childhood nickname that I have outgrown. 

[mizandry]

Alright... rant starting about the Duggars weighing in on Orlando with their... posts. 

I've had a day to process this, and honestly, I'm just getting even more upset by the fact that the Duggars dared to voice anything about Orlando to begin with -- fake sympathies and all. They really didn't have to weigh in on this, but they chose to, and that alone infuriates me. Like they think anyone believes they just wanted to talk about what happened at an LGBT night club and express their sympathies, and not just use it as a chance to paggro shittalk Muslims during Ramadan? I don't know why they couldn't just post a candle picture with no words or something and then just not post for awhile, if at least to sit with their cognitive dissonance before treating this as some sort of preaching moment. fff...

Prepare for swears and major anger; do skip if you must (unless you're a Diggar or Shitwald, you can sit the fuck down).

Spoiler

Seriously though - who the fuck do these assholes think they are?! WHY do they think LGBT people want to hear a damn thing from them right now, in the wake of a major tragedy at an LGBT nightclub? Do they think we're fucking stupid? Like, yeah, they TOTALLY care about the mass murder of LGBT people in a nightclub. Totally. They're TOTALLY "weeping with us" ... fucking co-optive bastards. That's why they do everything they can to help bar protective legislation and promote abusive rhetoric that helps to *ensure* we 1) have less resources, 2) aren't humanized, 3) are treated as sub-citizens to the ~sanctity~ of their fucking twisted Evangelical bullshit.

It's not comforting to hear from these assholes about Orlando. I'm not comforted. I don't care if they're saying, "Oh we need to WEEP TOO!" with their co-optive tears that don't even remotely understand the depth of this attack and how much it has shaken queer and Latinx and Muslim people. It was rude for them to act like this was their tragedy to weigh in on -- they'd be mum if the guy hadn't declared his allegiance to ISIS. They're trying to find a "common enemy" with racist, islamophobic gay people as if they give a FUCK about those people when they're not trying to team up to be oppressive towards another marginalized demographic in the name of Jesus (which... man, I'd be offended as fuck if people behaved like that in my name).

They are so full of shit and I'm insulted they'd even try to pretend they care. Their "caring" wreaks of Religious Conversion vibes and that is ALL SORTS of disrespectful right now. Fuck them for using the shooting at Pulse to promote this fucked up, anti-LGBT pastor and their disgusting, pathetic excuse of a cult. Fuck them. They can't even issue a "nice" statement without making sure it still comes from someone who MEANS HARM to LGBT people. Again: do they think we're fucking stupid, or are they?! Fuck them. And I love how we're "neighbors," not "brothers and sisters" or any of the other faux-unity bullshit they normally refer to strangers they don't give a fuck about with. UGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGH.

I feel patronized and condescended to - I can fucking SMELL the conversion therapy in their weak, hollow, ABSOLUTELY conditional "sympathies" and I'd rather they just shut up and clown car themselves back into the prayer closet for the rest of the week. *THAT* would be the respectful thing to do: to shut up and pray about their own disgusting, Godless behavior towards LGBT people. Their condolences mean shit when they do everything in their power to make sure we are unsafe - whether it's in the bathroom, at a club, or in a fucking church. I don't need the Duggars to guide me through this tragedy, and Ben? YOU ESPECIALLY NEED TO SHUT YOUR KNOW-IT-ALL-KNOW-NOTHING ASS UP. GO "BABYSIT" YOUR SON - AT LEAST HE ACTUALLY NEEDS YOU. YOU ARE NOT HELPING. 
 

 

[actuallyjessica]

I took Ben and Jessa's post as a "weep with the fellow white, religious, straight people that weep".

[CoveredInBees]

I read something online yesterday (inquisitor maybe?) that said that the quotes they had used/tweeted were from preachers who had preached against gay marriage in the past. Which, even if you don't put the blame for that at their door, it shows you that world that they live in/the voices that they listen to. Definitely "love the sinner, hate the sin" territory.

 

Whilst I'm not drawing any comparisons, the "love the sinner, hate the sin" thing has reminded me of a local preacher from a few years back (he was attached to what I would class as an evangelical church in our town and would 'preach' in the market place with a megaphone on a weekly basis). There was an accident one Easter Sunday in a very touristy area near here, I won't go into the details but a family died. That hateful preacher stood in the market place the next week and stated that if that family had been in church, as they should have been, they would still be alive. Horrid, horrid thing to say.

(Completely irrelevant to the thread, I know, but it popped up in my head)  

 

 

[HeadshipRegent]

13 minutes ago, CoveredInBees said:

I read something online yesterday (inquisitor maybe?) that said that the quotes they had used/tweeted were from preachers who had preached against gay marriage in the past. Which, even if you don't put the blame for that at their door, it shows you that world that they live in/the voices that they listen to. Definitely "love the sinner, hate the sin" territory.

 

Whilst I'm not drawing any comparisons, the "love the sinner, hate the sin" thing has reminded me of a local preacher from a few years back (he was attached to what I would class as an evangelical church in our town and would 'preach' in the market place with a megaphone on a weekly basis). There was an accident one Easter Sunday in a very touristy area near here, I won't go into the details but a family died. That hateful preacher stood in the market place the next week and stated that if that family had been in church, as they should have been, they would still be alive. Horrid, horrid thing to say.

(Completely irrelevant to the thread, I know, but it popped up in my head)  

 

 

Holy. What a vile thing to say.

[twinmama]

On 6/11/2016 at 8:14 PM, BabyBottlePop said:

I feel bad saying this because it is very shady and really not fair, but I can't help but feel a bit of schadenfreude at how Ben and Jessa are doing because their smugness pre marriage, "Like, what we're doing is better than everyone else cause we courted." I want to say now, "What did you expect?"

I don't even feel bad saying. I watch/follow for the trainwreck aspect. The more shitty, the better. The Josh molestation stuff is a completely different story. Josh and the Ashley Madison stuff though, delicious.

If they don't want people watching hoping they'll fail spectacularly, they can just keep their private lives private. heh.

[BabyBottlePop]

Yeah... And you have to wonder how much of the counting on episodes' ratings were from hate/snark watching versus leghumpers. 

What's weird is before the scandal they were a lot more open. Not with the real issues like Ashley Madison or the relationship dynamics behind the scenes... But you have the kids getting sick or hurt for ratings and Michelle, Anna, and the Duggar daughters giving birth. I find it very surprising that they filmed those births. Yes the whole brand is from their fertility but you gotta think the make cameramen saw a lot more than what I would assume a Duggar finds modest. 

What we need is a hidden camera show. What happened when the cameras weren't there. That would be much more interesting to watch.

[karen77]

On 6/11/2016 at 7:35 PM, VelociRapture said:

To answer your questions -

As far as I know, the Seewalds were not an IBLP family. I believe they were involved with Vision Forum, but I'm not completely certain about that. They are homeschooled, but I'm not sure what sort of curriculum they use or how good it may be.

His sister, Jessica isn't underage. I believe she turned 19 this year. As such, there's not much anyone could do about her wearing bikinis or living with her boyfriend. I'm not sure how strict they are in regards to dating, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were more relaxed than the Duggars.

I'm assuming the two married men had some choice in whether to have children - they could have faked a headache during their wives' fertile window or something. It's not like JB stood at the foot of the bed and forced them to have some sweet fellowshipping until the pregnancy test came back positive. No one "made them" have unprotected sex with their wives. 

Hope that helps a bit!

I highly doubt that Ben knew or even knows know, what the fertile time is!! Hell, i didn't until I was trying for a kid and read up on it in my early thirties!!

[artdecades]

You cannot "love the sinner, hate the sin" and want to deny people rights. I know this is pointless to say to the Duggars because they are Christian Dominionists and believe that this country should be Christian and use their version of Christianity's rules as law. But its not. If you actually cared about the LGBT community and their deaths, you would not try and limit their rights even if you disagreed with them (which you shouldn't anyway because they don't affect you). "Love the sinner, hate the sin" is not only offensive (gay people aren't sinners for existing), but it is a big lie. You cannot claim to love people and try to hurt them at the same time.

On 6/12/2016 at 7:28 AM, LawsonBatesEgo said:

I do think they are more likely to suck it up if they are indeed miserable, especially Jessa. The poor kids will pick up on the vibes as well and probably have miserable childhoods living in the middle of an unhappy marriage, but I suspect this happens a bit in fundie circles to people who marry because they mistook 'horny' for 'love'. 

But at the end of the day, if Bin decides God has ~spoken to him~ and told him it's OK to divorce Jessa and his parents are on board, Kim Jong Boob is powerless to stop it. It will mean Bin needs to go and get a real job, but if he is willing to do that, Boob has got nothing. And with the Duggars massive fall from grace, I wonder how much gravy is actually left in the train......especially when he needs to marry off 7 more daughters and get salaries and 'jobs' for multiple howler monkeys in the next fifteen years or so. 

Don't they have a covenant marriage like the Dullards? If Ben wants a divorce, its not so easy. Not only do they have to have counseling, but if one party doesn't want a divorce, the person requesting the divorce must prove there are grounds for divorce. According to this site, http://www.arlegalservices.org/files/FSCovenantMarriage.pdf, the only grounds for the dissolution of a covenant marriage are: 

• Adultery

• Felony or serious crime

• Physical or sexual abuse of one of your children

• Living separate and apart from you for at least 2 years

• Living separate and apart from you for at least 2 years and 6 months, if you have a child

• Living separate and apart from you for at least 1 year, if you have a child and your spouse abused you or the child

 

So if Bin wants a divorce, he first needs to live separately from Jessa for 2 years and 6 months unless he claims there is abuse or adultery.

[nst]

28 minutes ago, artdecades said:

You cannot "love the sinner, hate the sin" and want to deny people rights. I know this is pointless to say to the Duggars because they are Christian Dominionists and believe that this country should be Christian and use their version of Christianity's rules as law. But its not. If you actually cared about the LGBT community and their deaths, you would not try and limit their rights even if you disagreed with them (which you shouldn't anyway because they don't affect you). "Love the sinner, hate the sin" is not only offensive (gay people aren't sinners for existing), but it is a big lie. You cannot claim to love people and try to hurt them at the same time.

Don't they have a covenant marriage like the Dullards? If Ben wants a divorce, its not so easy. Not only do they have to have counseling, but if one party doesn't want a divorce, the person requesting the divorce must prove there are grounds for divorce. According to this site, http://www.arlegalservices.org/files/FSCovenantMarriage.pdf, the only grounds for the dissolution of a covenant marriage are: 

• Adultery

• Felony or serious crime

• Physical or sexual abuse of one of your children

• Living separate and apart from you for at least 2 years

• Living separate and apart from you for at least 2 years and 6 months, if you have a child

• Living separate and apart from you for at least 1 year, if you have a child and your spouse abused you or the child

 

So if Bin wants a divorce, he first needs to live separately from Jessa for 2 years and 6 months unless he claims there is abuse or adultery.

maybe he feels abused because she wants to adopt children and he doesn't and that's all she nags at him about 

[artdecades]

6 minutes ago, nst said:

maybe he feels abused because she wants to adopt children and he doesn't and that's all she nags at him about 

then he still will need to live separately from her for 1 year and attend counseling before he could get a divorce

[nst]

Just now, artdecades said:

then he still will need to live separately from her for 1 year and attend counseling before he could get a divorce

that leaves with all the children alone 

how will she cope with her hair issues and taking care of 2 kids under the age of 3 

wait = she has sisters 

 

[SassyPants]

I had never heard that the Seewalds had a covenant marriage. I thought only the Dillards and Josh/Anna. Looks like Anna has legit grounds to get out-

[LawsonBatesEgo]

51 minutes ago, artdecades said:

You cannot "love the sinner, hate the sin" and want to deny people rights. I know this is pointless to say to the Duggars because they are Christian Dominionists and believe that this country should be Christian and use their version of Christianity's rules as law. But its not. If you actually cared about the LGBT community and their deaths, you would not try and limit their rights even if you disagreed with them (which you shouldn't anyway because they don't affect you). "Love the sinner, hate the sin" is not only offensive (gay people aren't sinners for existing), but it is a big lie. You cannot claim to love people and try to hurt them at the same time.

Don't they have a covenant marriage like the Dullards? If Ben wants a divorce, its not so easy. Not only do they have to have counseling, but if one party doesn't want a divorce, the person requesting the divorce must prove there are grounds for divorce. According to this site, http://www.arlegalservices.org/files/FSCovenantMarriage.pdf, the only grounds for the dissolution of a covenant marriage are: 

• Adultery

• Felony or serious crime

• Physical or sexual abuse of one of your children

• Living separate and apart from you for at least 2 years

• Living separate and apart from you for at least 2 years and 6 months, if you have a child

• Living separate and apart from you for at least 1 year, if you have a child and your spouse abused you or the child

 

So if Bin wants a divorce, he first needs to live separately from Jessa for 2 years and 6 months unless he claims there is abuse or adultery.

I thought all you had to do to avoid the covenant marriage divorce rules was file for divorce in another state. 

[artdecades]

9 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

I had never heard that the Seewalds had a covenant marriage. I thought only the Dillards and Josh/Anna. Looks like Anna has legit grounds to get out-

Josh and Anna married in Florida, which does not have covenant marriages.

[BabyBottlePop]

I remember reading a article that Jill and Derick have a covenant marriage. No idea about Bin and Jessa.

[Jinder Roles]

25 minutes ago, artdecades said:

Josh and Anna married in Florida, which does not have covenant marriages.

I thought they changed it to a covenant marriage upon returning to Arkansas 

[Fundie Bunny]

1 minute ago, Jinder Roles said:

I thought they changed it to a covenant marriage upon returning to Arkansas 

I don't think it's possi ble to change the type of marriage you have without getting a divorce first