Bates Family: Babies Galore! Part 12

[formergothardite]

40 minutes ago, Diana said:

I think we all agree that both families have really fucked up beliefs, but that is also the reason why we follow them and other fundies in here, what makes them interesting.

I personally cant bring myself to follow the Duggars after knowing what Josh did to the girls, its too morbid for me, but i get how it may even add interest to some people.

But look at what Gil has done. Every time I see a happy, shiny Bates picture I think if Gil trying to manipulate a victim into meeting alone with her abuser last year. I think of all the abuse he has helped cover up and I think of how it felt for the victims when he and the rest of the board announced they were all liars, even though they knew that the women were telling the truth. Gil is a monster. He is evil and it makes me furious that he is able to make people think his family isn't as corrupt as the Duggar family. 

[ClaraOswin]

2 hours ago, jas said:

I don't think it is necessarily shallow. The objection is not just about a style preference, it is what the giant head flowers represent that is so annoying. The fear that people might think the tiny baby was a boy or not know which narrowly-defined gender box to put the kid in.

I know that's the main reason the Duggars do the bows. Wasn't sure if it was the same thing for the Bates family. So annoying.

2 hours ago, SilverBeach said:

Yeah I didn't understand that downvote. Even with all his marvelous qualities, Chad's children will be raised with hideous beliefs. 

The downvote was a strange one. My mention of it was also downvoted. I bet this will get the same. Oh well.

[QuiverDance]

36 minutes ago, CorruptionInc. said:

 

I LOVE smocking - however is it wrong of me to think it's rather "old school"? I don't have kids so I don't really know about children's fashions.

1

So, the best way I can explain this is that monograms and smocking on kids clothes is what SEC sorority girls get into when they graduate, get married, and start having babies.    

My goddaughter is 10, and I don't think she has owned a single dress without her initials embroidered on it in her entire life.  LOL.  My daughter was born to a rebel, however, and most of her clothes are from Gap Kids and JCrew and Old Navy.

18 minutes ago, ClaraOswin said:

The downvote was a strange one. My mention of it was also downvoted. I bet this will get the same. Oh well.

 

Oh well is right.  People often take offense to really innocuous statements on the internet.

[Diana]

50 minutes ago, SilverBeach said:

Doesn't make them interesting at all to me. It makes me intensely dislike them. I don't "follow" them per SE, but aim to miss no opportunity to call attention to those fucked up beliefs that are in place no matter how cute the babies are. And how can Josh molesting his sisters make the Duggar's more interesting? If anything it makes Josh more repulsive and their beliefs and upbringing more noxious.

I find The Walking Dead interesting.

I also find the Walking dead interesting, but i dont understand what that has to do with anything. 

I also dont get how exactly are you calling atention to their beliefs comenting on this forum on the internet, a forum you have to search on purpose being already interested in them to find. 

[Diana]

45 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

But look at what Gil has done. Every time I see a happy, shiny Bates picture I think if Gil trying to manipulate a victim into meeting alone with her abuser last year. I think of all the abuse he has helped cover up and I think of how it felt for the victims when he and the rest of the board announced they were all liars, even though they knew that the women were telling the truth. Gil is a monster. He is evil and it makes me furious that he is able to make people think his family isn't as corrupt as the Duggar family. 

He is corrupt and knowing what he did to those girls makes you really see how fucked up those people and their beliefs are (all those fundie dudes seem creepy as hell to me so doesnt change much) but those girls arent on their  reality show saying how much they love their abuser, thats what its morbid to me. 

[Snarkle]

54 minutes ago, QuiverDance said:

So, the best way I can explain this is that monograms and smocking on kids clothes is what SEC sorority girls get into when they graduate, get married, and start having babies.    

My goddaughter is 10, and I don't think she has owned a single dress without her initials embroidered on it in her entire life.  LOL.  My daughter was born to a rebel, however, and most of her clothes are from Gap Kids and JCrew and Old Navy.

Oh well is right.  People often take offense to really innocuous statements on the internet.

Wow.  My son had smocking on his baptismal outfit (whales on a white cotton romper), but that was the only thing he ever had like that.  I myself lived in the south in junior high and did have a sweatshirt and a sweater with my monogram on it, but once I returned north, I didn't see things like that again (other than bath towels).  As for your goddaughter, I like to pass clothes on to younger kids, so I would imagine with all of that monogramming, unless she has a daughter of her own with the same initials, they're one-child-only clothing?

[Alachantal]

On 3/16/2016 at 5:06 AM, NotAnIncubator said:

Same here. Blue eyed father, brown eyed mother. No green eyes in any of my 30+ cousins either. Its all brown, grey or blue. 

Kind of like mine... Brown eyed mother & father. Brother has (very dark) hazel eyes. Mine are a blue-green. Must be from my mums side though because all aunts and uncles and cousins on fathers side have brown eyes. Just my great-great aunt on my mothers side (and her siblings) had light eyes, literally everyone else is brown or hazel. I'm not complaining, though it kind of puts me off having kids lol

[PennySycamore]

@CorruptionInc., I don't know if smocking is old-school or not, but I do know hand-smocking was big for little girls' dresses in the 80s.  I think I've seen my oldest granddaughter wear some dresses that were hand-smocked by her other grandmother who is an exquisite seamstress.  (This woman has mad skillz!)  I think I've also seen HRH Prince George in some smocked playsuits when he was a bit younger.

[BirthingGodsWarriors]

2 hours ago, ClaraOswin said:

I know that's the main reason the Duggars do the bows. Wasn't sure if it was the same thing for the Bates family. So annoying.

The downvote was a strange one. My mention of it was also downvoted. I bet this will get the same. Oh well.

I guess some folks just aren't fans of the Doctor. 

Never you mind, just follow in the words of your namesake:

"Just because my pretty face has turned your head do not assume I am so easily distracted."

 

 

[Snarkle]

2 minutes ago, PennySycamore said:

@CorruptionInc., I don't know if smocking is old-school or not, but I do know hand-smocking was big for little girls' dresses in the 80s.  I think I've seen my oldest granddaughter wear some dresses that were hand-smocked by her other grandmother who is an exquisite seamstress.  (This woman has mad skillz!)  I think I've also seen HRH Prince George in some smocked playsuits when he was a bit younger.

Oh the royal children wear a lot of smocked and other traditional clothing.  At Princess Charlotte's christening people remarked on how Prince George always looks so formal and traditional - he wears knee socks and tailored shorts and smocked shirts and shoes with straps, and that Princess Catherine is doing a wonderful job honoring tradition in her children's clothing choices.  However recently I read an article that said that Kate is not only smart to honor tradition, she is also shrewd because she dresses her kids that way for formal occasions and portraits so they have a certain appearance people come to expect.  When they are out in public on a daily basis, though, they're in more informal, everyday outfits and won't stand out around other children.  She's crafting a public look for them so they might enjoy a bit of privacy when they go to the park or on outings.

[ClaraOswin]

20 minutes ago, BirthingGodsWarriors said:

I guess some folks just aren't fans of the Doctor. 

Never you mind, just follow in the words of your namesake:

"Just because my pretty face has turned your head do not assume I am so easily distracted."

 

 

Yep. I just take it all with a grain of salt.

[calimojo]

3 hours ago, formergothardite said:

But look at what Gil has done. Every time I see a happy, shiny Bates picture I think if Gil trying to manipulate a victim into meeting alone with her abuser last year. I think of all the abuse he has helped cover up and I think of how it felt for the victims when he and the rest of the board announced they were all liars, even though they knew that the women were telling the truth. Gil is a monster. He is evil and it makes me furious that he is able to make people think his family isn't as corrupt as the Duggar family. 

I have to confess to not knowing too much about Gil Bates other than what I see on the show.

 

Can you or someone explain the bit about him manipulating victims into meeting alone with their abuser?  And did the IBLP board really state the girls were lying?  I thought they acknowledged it was true and that was why he stepped down. 

 

[withaj]

58 minutes ago, ClaraOswin said:

Yep. I just take it all with a grain of salt.

I can't like this enough.

[ophelia]

12 hours ago, Georgiana said:

But if someone told me I could get a husband like Chad Paine and all I had to do was sign up for a crazy cult and give away basically all of my hopes, dreams, and personhood....there were times in my life where I was low enough that I might have seriously considered that.  

Same here, Georgiana. I might go back to that point of lowness very soon again, considering my non-existing love life at the moment.

[LawsonBatesEgo]

13 hours ago, justmy2cents said:

Why is Chad so great @ClaraOswin?  In my opinion it's because he's soft spoken and comes off as very nice and considerate.  Always ready to lend a hand.  He's a jack of all trades and it looks like he does pretty much everything well.  He cuts her brothers hair, acts as photographer for family occasions and restores furniture. Erin has even said that he does most of the laundry.  He seems to really love and value Erin, and not only as a missile for his arrows.  He's proud of her every accomplishment.  If not for the ass backwards beliefs he would be a great catch for anyone.  As is, he's a great catch for a fundie.

That's the thing with The Chad. If you take away the ATI/devout Christianity in general (I'm not religious), I'd want to marry him for myself. None of the other fundie husbands bring out the same OMG CAN I CLONE YOU PLEASE!? feelings that Chad does. 

He seems like a genuinely great guy....who was sadly raised and bathed in the KoolAid by his parents. But he gives me a little hope. He seems like a gentle soul which gives me hope Carson and Brooklyn won't be blanket trained. He seems to value Erin as a person more than as a broodmare (he looks terrified in their pregnancy announcement, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if it was an accidental pregnancy). He doesn't come off as a raging douche (Bin) or a serial cheater and overall pathological liar and molester who shouldn't be allowed around kids (Joshley). Rome wasn't built in a day, but his support of Erin gives me hope Brooklyn's dreams will be encouraged. They're not going to become atheists whogo to pro life marches, but maybe they'll take a few steps away from the extreme crazy they were raised in. 

[Granwych]

8 hours ago, PennySycamore said:

@CorruptionInc., I don't know if smocking is old-school or not, but I do know hand-smocking was big for little girls' dresses in the 80s.  I think I've seen my oldest granddaughter wear some dresses that were hand-smocked by her other grandmother who is an exquisite seamstress.  (This woman has mad skillz!)  I think I've also seen HRH Prince George in some smocked playsuits when he was a bit younger.

When I was a toddler back in the early 50's my mother had a picture taken of me in a smocked dress.  In the early 80's I found a Simplicity pattern very much like the dress I had worn--I made it up and entered it in a county fair and won a blue ribbon.  My daughter wore it for a portrait in the late 80's and I still have it for any future granddaughters.  When the children's clothing manufacturer Polly Flinders went out of business it was a sad time for all of us who loved the smocked dresses and little overalls that company featured.

[formergothardite]

7 hours ago, calimojo said:

I have to confess to not knowing too much about Gil Bates other than what I see on the show.

 

Can you or someone explain the bit about him manipulating victims into meeting alone with their abuser?  And did the IBLP board really state the girls were lying?  I thought they acknowledged it was true and that was why he stepped down. 

 

One of the latest victims to join the lawsuit was raped as a child, sent to Gothard as a teen for counseling and then abused by him. When the board announced they would be investigating abuse allegations the woman contacted them to share her story. Instead of listening to it, every time she would speak of abuse that happened, she was corrected and told that abuse didn't happen. Her "corrected" story was used to show that the victims were all lying.  She was then sent a letter by the Gil and the rest of the board trying to manipulate her to meet alone and in private with her abuser. 

There is a lot of confusion about what happened and the reason is because Gothard and people like the BoD are very good at wording things to make people think they are saying one thing, when actually they mean something else. This is why I trust absolutely nothing put up by the Bates family on their show, blogs or social media. Unlike the Duggars, the whole family seems to have this skill. 

Anyway, the BoD never asked Bill to resign. They did a sham investigation and announced that the abuse allegations were false and the victims were lying. Bill resigned voluntarily because that is pretty much exactly what he did back in the 80's when a scandal happened. He fully expected to get his job back in no time. His resignation letter would lead you to think he was admitting he did all these things. but he now claims that isn't what he meant. When Gothard resigned, the BoD(who knew all about the abuse because they had helped cover it up), realized that they had a chance to rid themselves of a liability, so they refused to allow him to come back. Their main goal at this moment seems to be trying to protect the remaining IBLP fortune. They have shown not an ounce of regret about helping protect an abuser or concern for any of the victims. 

Furious about being stabbed in the back by people he viewed as minions Gothard goes to the victims' lawyer and gives him evidence that the BoD knew that there was abuse and that the investigation was a sham. He also started a new ministry. And all this is why it really isn't that huge of a deal when the Bates say that they aren't supporting Gothard or his ministry. They most likely are talking about his new ministry and there is some bad blood between them Gothard now. 

So basically, there is no reason to think that Gil and Kelly would have handled a Josh situation any differently than the Duggars did. They have already shown that covering up lots of abuse is not a problem for them. And yes, Gil has caused a great deal more harm to more people than Jim Bob did. The only thing this family is better at when compared to the Duggars is lying and manipulating their public image. 

[elliha]

Has anyone heard anything more about the claims that Chad and Erin stopped associating with ATI? 

[Tim-Tom Biblethumper]

50 minutes ago, Granwych said:

When the children's clothing manufacturer Polly Flinders went out of business it was a sad time for all of us who loved the smocked dresses and little overalls that company featured.

Just had to say "Hey".  I haven't heard those words "Polly Flinders" in decades!  I was dressed in smocking too (early 60's), and I remember my Aunt coming down from GA just to buy tons of dresses for her granddaughters when PF was going out of business.  

[formergothardite]

33 minutes ago, elliha said:

Has anyone heard anything more about the claims that Chad and Erin stopped associating with ATI? 

You have to realize that ATI is the homeschooling section of IBLP, so as a married couple with a baby, Chad and Erin were never associated with it to begin with. That was a very carefully worded reply by Erin that could end up meaning a lot of things. 

[freethemall]

It'd be fun to calculate how many pages of this thread we get to when the regular "are the Bates are just as bad as the Duggars" argument inevitably comes back up. Would the formula include the number of posts crushing on Chad, or how cute the grandkids are? These thoughts are not mutually exclusive to knowing there's a lot messed up about the family. Alas, every now and then, here we go again...

[Palimpsest]

17 hours ago, Kak said:

"Better than the Duggars" is not a compliment.

True.  

However, I think the point people are trying to make is that the Bates family are more dangerous than the Duggars.

Stealth missiles rather than dysfunctional disorganized water pistols, if you will.

Perhaps instead of squeeing over Alyssa's sleeveless dresses people could take a look at her father-in-law's voting record and the way the families are positioning themselves politically.

Bottom line: both the Websters and the Bateses are IBLP to the hilt and far more influential in the greater scheme of things than the Duggars.  They just appear more personable.

[Kak]

6 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

True.  

However, I think the point people are trying to make is that the Bates family are more dangerous than the Duggars.

Stealth missiles rather than dysfunctional disorganized water pistols, if you will.

Perhaps instead of squeeing over Alyssa's sleeveless dresses people could take a look at her father-in-law's voting record and the way the families are positioning themselves politically.

Bottom line: both the Websters and the Bateses are IBLP to the hilt and far more influential in the greater scheme of things than the Duggars.  They just appear more personable.

Yes, I agree with all that. I've not said anything any different. 

[Palimpsest]

5 minutes ago, Kak said:

Yes, I agree with all that. I've not said anything any different. 

I meant nothing personal, sorry. I just bounced off your quote to make a point.

10 hours ago, PennySycamore said:

@CorruptionInc., I don't know if smocking is old-school or not, but I do know hand-smocking was big for little girls' dresses in the 80s.  I think I've seen my oldest granddaughter wear some dresses that were hand-smocked by her other grandmother who is an exquisite seamstress.  (This woman has mad skillz!)  I think I've also seen HRH Prince George in some smocked playsuits when he was a bit younger.

You are correct.  Prince George wore one of his Dad's 1980s smocked outfits to his sister's christening.  I really don't know how I recognized it but apparently the RF believes in recycling!  

[elliha]

59 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

You have to realize that ATI is the homeschooling section of IBLP, so as a married couple with a baby, Chad and Erin were never associated with it to begin with. That was a very carefully worded reply by Erin that could end up meaning a lot of things. 

Yes, I understand what you are saying and did when I wrote my initial comment. My question was if anyone had heard anything more about this, not a need to have ATI explained to me.