Duggars by the Dozen - General Discussion - Part 9

[FloraDoraDolly]

The Duggar kids who are interested in learning about filmmaking are already learning from the pros at TLC. Technically, they have access to the real deal at an age where other kids with similar ambitions might get to take a class at school that teaches them how to work at the local public access cable station (at least that's what my school district offers). But mainstream kids get to watch a wider variety of movies and TV shows, and so they have an advantage in that respect.

I see a lot of wasted potential in Josiah. Instead of going away to college where he belongs, he got shipped off to ALERT boot camp. Does anyone know if he's still there?

[RabbitKM]

I am not saying that this post is inaccurate, but I think it shows how much even we the snarkers buy into their brand.

I know Jinger has been "saying" that she is interested in photography for years now, but until I see a portfolio, I remain unconvinced. Now, has Jessa ever even tried to cut someone's hair? It's different than doing Duggar curls to every set of J'slave hair.

The only person I have seen on the show with any talent is Jill, with her midwifery. Too bad she can't complete her degree (even though I am pretty sure her version of it is the lay version, not the actual nursing midwife). I am sure the others would have cultivated some talent or ambition, but they were never given the chance to read books or even go online.

[FJismyheadship]

Bravo Grandmadugger! Bravo!

[AndyActually]

There's been pics of Jessa cutting a couple of guy's hair. Granted they're friends of the family, but she still has done it. And Jinger has photographed some friend's events.

The problem is that they aren't allowed to go out of the realm of their inner circle. That limits them.

[Becket70]

Bravo Grandmadugger! Bravo!

Add an huzzah from me. You have done excellent work...hope you maintained your blood pressure, though. Those fans can be so aggravating. I love the "back in the day" argument. Back in the day farms were family owned...now they are giant conglomerates which treat their workers and livestock like crap. Two things really bother me. The first is that the rest of us are drug-taking, promiscuous slackers while the Duggar children are pillars of morality. I dare say that most kids in the US are just fine. They go to school, they work, they have fun, they get married, they live their lives. They are not second class citizens compared to the Duggar children. Second is their inability to accept that societies change. Societies never remain stagnant so we are not going back to their perception of a better time. The US is not the country is was fifty years ago nor will be it the same fifty years from now. Only a totalitarian government can effectively keep a society stagnant and we are not there yet. Though, in Mississippi there may be an initiative on the ballot (if they can get enough signatures) in 2016 which will declare Mississippi to be a Christian state....stay tuned fans of totalitarianism.

[Feberin]

I don't think the interest in film making is being wasted. Like a previous poster said the Duggars actually have more resources then your average person to explore that interest.

I'm not sure about Jinger and her photography if she's actually being held back. I remember back when Josh and Anna got engaged it was Jessa who was interested in photography so I wonder if that's one of the few approved interests versus an actual interest Jinger would have regardless of her upbringing. I was into photography when I was around her age but never to the point that I took classes on it or saw it as a possible future career (of course I had a lot more options as far as careers). I also didn't have nearly as nice of a camera as the one Jinger uses. I also have friends who do photography for extra money and many of them despite taking classes on it and having really nice cameras still only make enough that it's a little extra money not a career that could support them on their own.

I don't know about the cosmetology and Jessa. I feel like again she picked it from a small pool of options. I actually think the Duggar who had dreams that were definitely crushed was Josh who wanted to be a lawyer. He even looked into an online law school.

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

Many of Jinger's pictures are used by the production company and show up in episodes. Also, she's the one who did Jill's engagement photos.

That said, an interest in photography doesn't necessarily mean she has interest in doing it professionally. I love photography, but I'm very much okay with my passion staying a hobby. I'm the same way with many of my hobbies. People tell me all the time that I should try to make money off of these passions; but I feel like if I did that, I would lose the joy amongst all the stress. It's very possible that Jinger could feel the same way.

[grandmadugger]

Add an huzzah from me. You have done excellent work...hope you maintained your blood pressure, though. Those fans can be so aggravating. I love the "back in the day" argument. Back in the day farms were family owned...now they are giant conglomerates which treat their workers and livestock like crap. Two things really bother me. The first is that the rest of us are drug-taking, promiscuous slackers while the Duggar children are pillars of morality. I dare say that most kids in the US are just fine. They go to school, they work, they have fun, they get married, they live their lives. They are not second class citizens compared to the Duggar children. Second is their inability to accept that societies change. Societies never remain stagnant so we are not going back to their perception of a better time. The US is not the country is was fifty years ago nor will be it the same fifty years from now. Only a totalitarian government can effectively keep a society stagnant and we are not there yet. Though, in Mississippi there may be an initiative on the ballot (if they can get enough signatures) in 2016 which will declare Mississippi to be a Christian state....stay tuned fans of totalitarianism.

Thanks both of you. I'm a Christian but I don't want the government in my faith. That's the whole reason the pilgrims came over, to get the government out of the church. What don't these people understand about that?

[FJismyheadship]

Wanna tackle another one? lol

[grandmadugger]

Wanna tackle another one? lol

Sure!

[Phoenix]

I agree with this completely. That is why I do not believe in people being doomed to an eternity of suffering.

This, absolutely! I got into a really painful argument with my late mothers best friend years ago when Mom lay dying in a hospital. I made the mistake of letting it be known I thought Mom was going to die. (There were a LOT of logical, medical and observational reasons to believe this.) I got torn a new asshole for "my crisis of faith" for not believing God could heal her if he so choose. The best friend got it wrong. There was nothing wrong with my faith, I could simply see no matter how many prayers I stormed heaven with, my mother was going to die. God isn't any less all-powerful just because the answer to our prayers is sometimes no. Mom died three days after the argument. (Yes I was majorly pissed off at God about it and still am. Oh well, I figure he/she/it can handle it!)

So yeah, I am also going with the shit happens reason. It is totally unsatisfactory but it covers all the bases. I am not sure our human minds are capable of comprehending the really big picture needed to answer the endless, agonizing questions of why do bad things happen to good people. I do know following a formula of beliefs is zero protection.

[LongDogMom]

Clearly Radar Online loves the Free Jinger site because they continue to bring FJ up in articles and use comments from the site! I saw this today when I checked Radar - a slideshow of reasons why the Duggar girls should flee the family homestead and then re-hashes old comments about Jinger and why she should run (ie: wants to live in a city etc.):

Campaign Launches To Convince Duggar Daughters To Flee

"Jessa and Jill Duggar have finally left the Duggar home to start families of their own. But as Jana and the other Duggar daughters remain under the family’s very large group, RadarOnline.com has learned that a group of critics has joined together online in the hopes of convincing spitfire daughter Jinger to leave too — without a wedding ring on her finger! Take a look inside the “Free Jinger†movement."

http://radaronline.com/photos/free-jing ... to/815049/

Boy, they must be desperate to fill the article quota these days! Otoh, I hope it brings more people to FJ and educates more people who don't know about the cult of Gothard, what's really going on with the Duggars!

[LongDogMom]

I keep hearing Duggar fans talking about how the Duggars live debt-free and don't rely on taxpayers, but I can't help but think that if TLC hadn't come along, the Duggars would have had a lot more problems, including staying debt-free. Just Josie's medical issues alone would have meant enormous medical bills and there's been C-sections and other health issues with Michelle. Medical procedures aren't cheap. Now maybe JB has free health care from having been in politics, I don't know how that works, but would it cover everything Josie went through? (and don't even get me started on the hypocrisy of relying on modern medical care and science to save her life instead of "leaving it in God's hands"). You know if everyone lived like the Duggars, there would be no doctors or scientists out there to have saved Josie's life because everyone would be working in used car lots of as midwives (no higher education allowed).

Plus I think without TLC assistance, their house would look a whole lot different. TLC not only helped finish building it, but completely decorated it for them. Prior to TLC they lived in such a tiny house and relied on church friends for hand-me-down clothing and help. It bugs me that they and their fans, hold their lifestyle and belief system out as if that alone got them to where they are and is allowing them to live the life depicted, but that is so false. How many Quiverfull families could possibly afford to do all the things that TLC has allowed the Duggars to do? How many end up with medical issues or even deaths due to not receiving medical care they need but can't afford because they have no medical insurance?

Plus is family closeness really true when it's because you keep your children isolated, brainwashed and don't allow them any exposure to anything that might challenge what you want them to believe? Is that as true as regular people who allow their kids to go out into the real world and trust their kids to make good choices and stay close to the family because they really love their family and want to be there (as opposed to being completely dependant on them). It would be interesting to see if they let all those kids out into the world to be exposed to regular stuff...how many of them would choose to continue with the lifestyle the Duggars are promoting? How many would choose higher education if they knew they could? How many would choose the extreme courting rules or staying at home until marriage?

The Duggars make out like they are one big happy and loving family and the kids are choosing all these things, but the kids have no other choice and frankly...I would not be surprised to hear later on that JB and M could be quite abusive and mean behind the scenes. They are so all about having to be right that I don't think they would allow anything that might look like the kids don't agree and love everything Jim Bob and Michelle say and do.

[BeaSnarky]

I keep hearing Duggar fans talking about how the Duggars live debt-free and don't rely on taxpayers, but I can't help but think that if TLC hadn't come along, the Duggars would have had a lot more problems, including staying debt-free. Just Josie's medical issues alone would have meant enormous medical bills and there's been C-sections and other health issues with Michelle. Medical procedures aren't cheap. Now maybe JB has free health care from having been in politics, I don't know how that works, but would it cover everything Josie went through? (and don't even get me started on the hypocrisy of relying on modern medical care and science to save her life instead of "leaving it in God's hands"). You know if everyone lived like the Duggars, there would be no doctors or scientists out there to have saved Josie's life because everyone would be working in used car lots of as midwives (no higher education allowed).

Plus I think without TLC assistance, their house would look a whole lot different. TLC not only helped finish building it, but completely decorated it for them. Prior to TLC they lived in such a tiny house and relied on church friends for hand-me-down clothing and help. It bugs me that they and their fans, hold their lifestyle and belief system out as if that alone got them to where they are and is allowing them to live the life depicted, but that is so false. How many Quiverfull families could possibly afford to do all the things that TLC has allowed the Duggars to do? How many end up with medical issues or even deaths due to not receiving medical care they need but can't afford because they have no medical insurance?

Plus is family closeness really true when it's because you keep your children isolated, brainwashed and don't allow them any exposure to anything that might challenge what you want them to believe? Is that as true as regular people who allow their kids to go out into the real world and trust their kids to make good choices and stay close to the family because they really love their family and want to be there (as opposed to being completely dependant on them). It would be interesting to see if they let all those kids out into the world to be exposed to regular stuff...how many of them would choose to continue with the lifestyle the Duggars are promoting? How many would choose higher education if they knew they could? How many would choose the extreme courting rules or staying at home until marriage?

The Duggars make out like they are one big happy and loving family and the kids are choosing all these things, but the kids have no other choice and frankly...I would not be surprised to hear later on that JB and M could be quite abusive and mean behind the scenes. They are so all about having to be right that I don't think they would allow anything that might look like the kids don't agree and love everything Jim Bob and Michelle say and do.

I think they would have remained debt free because they are champions at grifting. I have acquaintances who are right up there with the Duggars in their beliefts. They are grifters too. They have adopted two little girls from China with significant medical needs - one of which required extensive and complicated heart surgery. Hubs has a job with a bank, so has insurance, but it doesn't cover the huge expense of little's surgery, including paying for Momma to stay in Boston with her during the surgery and recovery. They grift. T-shirt sales (Even Superman was adopted), Thirty One Parties, Go Fund Me accounts. JimBob and Michelle are grifting champions and I would not be surprised if the majority of Josie's care was taken care of by "generous gifts" etc.

They were debt free prior to the show, and I honestly think they would have stayed that way. BUT, I don't think they would be as "comfortable" as they are now - they certainly would not have been able to travel the world (on TLC's dime), or travel all over 'Murica with their hate tour. Sadly, I feel TLC has enabled them to spread their brand of Christianity like a virus - by giving them a big name and a "Brand." Same thing with the Bateseseses.

Because honestly, THE only reason the Duggars are famous is truly because they are champion breeders. If they had three kids, TLC wouldn't have looked at them twice.

And sadly, folks like us, here on the big snark sites that are being picked up by radar online and the like, we are just feeding their celebrity, so they will never "go away." If they movement goes through to cancel their show, UP will pick it up, or some other Christian Network, or they will be martyred. It's disgusting.

I believe in God, and I have a strong Faith. I choose NOT to radiate God's love by preaching hate or throwing Bibles at people. I chose to radiate God's love by helping my community, by assisting those who can not help themselves, and by loving my neighbors. But people like the Duggars make that whole "not judging" thing really hard for me. Because I can't help but judge them as Royal Assholes.

[Rainytown]

IIRC, Josie's care was paid for by the US Government via Medicaid. "Debt-free", hm? That doesn't come close to any definition of "debt free" I'm aware of. They soaked the taxpayers because they refused to carry adequate health insurance. I also remember reading that Jim Boob and family are "self-insured", so I'm wondering how much of J-Chelle's delivery costs were written off by the hospital.

The leg humpers continue to howl that the Duggars are ever so financially responsible, but everything in this family's life is paid for by someone (or something) else. They were in a three-bedroom house with fourteen kids pre-TLC, surviving on donations from their church. TLC has underwritten the family financially for the past ten years, up to and including finishing the construction on the house they live in. There's product placement in the current episodes; I'm wondering how much of that money makes it into their pockets since Jim Boob has an "executive producer" credit. Both daughters' weddings were profit centers including the labor of hundreds of volunteers. They're not "debt free" because they manage money well. They're "debt free" because they make everyone else pay for everything!

Considering the fact they've been handsomely financially rewarded for J-chelle's popping out nineteen surviving children, I continue to be amazed at their inability to share their financial blessings. Then again, if you're an anti-gay, anti-choice political candidate, they're all about the check writing.

"Debt-free", my ass. Their Karmic debt must be crushing. It'll be interesting to see what happens when the bill comes due.

[LongDogMom]

And sadly, folks like us, here on the big snark sites that are being picked up by radar online and the like, we are just feeding their celebrity, so they will never "go away." If they movement goes through to cancel their show, UP will pick it up, or some other Christian Network, or they will be martyred. It's disgusting.

I see it differently. I don't mind Radar and other sites picking up stuff from FJ because it exposes aspects of the Duggar lifestyle that their fans may not be aware of. For instance, I doubt that the Duggars like that the media has been doing all these stories about Jana and how she has to do all the childcare and other chores, etc. They have responded (and had Jana respond) with how she's happy to do it, but it raises the awareness of how JB and M use their older daughters instead of parenting their own kids. Same as keeping the soundbite about Jinger wanting to live in a city in the public eye. It shines a light on how the Duggars kill their kids dreams rather than encouraging them. It shows them in a poor light and I'll bet they hate those articles.

But I think it's good because in spite of their fans rushing to their defence, there are also a lot of people commenting about Gothard and how they are a cult and how wrong it is how they use their kids and don't allow them higher education or to pursue individual dreams that might not jibe with their fundie views. A lot of their fans think they are just an old-fashioned, strict family and don't really see what is, imo, essentially child abuse (because not preparing your kids to live in the world today by limiting their knowledge, education and exposure to the world in such a radical way does them a disservice in a big way. Most parents want to offer their children every opportunity to learn and try to help them achieve their dreams, but the Duggars don't even allow their kids to dream because their roles for the future are already set in stone, and for the girls it means get married and have lots and lots of babies.

Maybe a lot of fans of the show thought it was charming when the kids were all little and it was okay, even wise, to protect them from the world. But now they are growing up and people are starting to see the they aren't going with their kids to look at college campuses or discussing how this child wants to be a doctor or this one want's to be an artist...instead they just see these grown women (and Josh) parroting everything JB and M say and it's not so charming anymore. They aren't just a good Christian family with strong values, like many of their fans believed originally, but rather they are starting to look more and more like the cult they are and people are becoming more aware of it because of articles like Radar and other sites. That's good. Let people see how they really are and how dismal Jana's life must be while she waits for her "Prince" to arrive instead of pursuing her own dreams at a university somewhere and experiencing some attention and romance herself. No, she's stuck at home babysitting and homeschooling a zillion siblings.

[LongDogMom]

I can't speak for others on this thread, but I have made it clear that I believe god works through his people. Therefore, he does do things when it makes him mad. Millions of christians and other people in the world help people every day. They work on preventing sex trafficking and help rehabilitate those who have left the industry. They become foster parents to children who were abused. They adopt children whose parents were killed. They found non profit organizations to help lift people out of poverty. They give money to the homeless. I could go on and on.

God does a lot, imo.

But I know lots of people who do not believe in God but do all those same things because they are kind and generous souls who believe in helping others because it's the right thing to do. Some of those doing such kind and amazing things are even gay! I guess I don't see why people need religion to do those things. Kindness is my religion. Look and see how you can help make the world a better place and do it because it's right to do.

Also, since lots of athiests and gay people (whom many Christians say are abominations) are doing good things in the world, being kind and caring and generous...that isn't God doing it, the people doing it. Not because of rules in a book or because fears of what might happen after death, but because they are just kind and empathetic people trying to help others and animals and take care of the earth, etc.

[pega127]

All's very quiet on any of the Duggar's instagrams. What's going on?

[gustava]

Now maybe JB has free health care from having been in politics, I don't know how that works, but would it cover everything Josie went through?

No health care from his short term in state politics.

:dead-horse:

[grandmadugger]

Anyone notice that we have a few threads merged into this thread?

[MoonFace]

from my FB feed

http://www.answers.com/article/1247702/ ... 51#slide=1

[straygoldfish]

The girl in Footloose (Ariel). Her eyes before she kisses Ren for the first time. That pleading look... Jessa just needs to be free.

(Kindly ignore how craptacular my TV is.)

[FJismyheadship]

Was reading the babycenter megathread. Someone compared the differences between Ben's and Derick's churches mission statements (someone wanna help me on if I did that grammatically correct?)

"The sacredness of human personality is evident in that God created man in His own image, and in that Christ died for man; therefore, every person of every race possesses full dignity and is worthy of respect and Christian love."

Thus it is in the case of one who has been renewed by the Spirit: his eyes have been opened to see the awful filth which lurks in every corner of his heart.

But in the case of the unregenerate, though they have occasional twinges of conscience when they act wrongfully, they are very largely ignorant of the awful fact that they are a complete mass of corruption in the pure eyes of the thrice holy God.

Abraham acknowledged,"I am dust and ashes!" Genesis 18:27

Job said of himself, "I am vile!" Job 40:4

David admitted, "I am a worm!" Psalm 22:6

Isaiah confessed, "Woe is me! I am ruined!" Isaiah6:5

Peter affirmed, "I am a sinful man, O Lord!" Luke5:8

Paul considered himself,"The chief of sinners!" 1 Timothy 1:15

[singsingsing]

Yeah, that's classic Calvinism. What a beautiful worldview, eh? Sounds like something a loving and all merciful God would invent.

[LongDogMom]

Was reading the babycenter megathread. Someone compared the differences between Ben's and Derick's churches mission statements (someone wanna help me on if I did that grammatically correct?)

I think Derick's Church's Mission Statement is quite nice. Ben's otoh.... not so much!