Sparkling Adventures in Child Neglect: Vive La France

[salex]

I don't think we really want to know, but I am somewhat surprised that they didn't post pictures of whatever it was.[/

[formergothardite]

This is hardly the first time that screenshots have been posted of blogs that have gone private/deleted.

FundieFanBoy, does your username mean you are a fundie who is a fan boy of something or are you a fan boy of fundies or something else?

[OkToBeTakei]

This is hardly the first time that screenshots have been posted of blogs that have gone private/deleted.

FundieFanBoy, does your username mean you are a fundie who is a fan boy of something or are you a fan boy of fundies or something else?

Not to mention the fact blogs like the Maxwells which are archived on the way back. I think the point is if we were now to post her recent stuff. Fundie fanboy you may want to check out the Hellena and Curradong thread I think you may find that horse bolted a long time ago. I regularly take the piss out of modern art at the Tate Modern. What's your point? We actually take the piss out of our own err creations on this board. Formergothardite has a spectacular embroidery hehe!!

[formergothardite]

Not to mention the fact blogs like the Maxwells which are archived on the way back. I think the point is if we were now to post her recent stuff. Fundie fanboy you may want to check out the Hellena and Curradong thread I think you may find that horse bolted a long time ago. I regularly take the piss out of modern art at the Tate Modern. What's your point? We actually take the piss out of our own err creations on this board. Formergothardite has a spectacular embroidery hehe!!

That poor embroidery fears me attempting to fix it so much that it has apparently ran away. Poor Santa ornament, I might be able to butcher it some more before Christmas if I found it.

I think Hellena and Currawong's children are going to survive their authentic upbringing much better than Lauren's kids. Some of them might change their names when they grow up, though.

[ladyaudley]

Can't you just see Currawong casually moving the cord out of the way like "no big whoop" as he prepares to chow down? That's not eating at the Y, it's eating at the "WHYYYYYYYY?!!!"

the cord which we all know was trying to pump blood so furiously it took serious effort to keep clamped!

:ew:

[August]

Wouldn't the fact the cord hadn't shrivelled mean there was a single or connected placenta? Which would mean it could have been compromised by the birth? Or be a route for infection?

This is hardly the first time that screenshots have been posted of blogs that have gone private/deleted.

FundieFanBoy, does your username mean you are a fundie who is a fan boy of something or are you a fan boy of fundies or something else?

A personal attack doesn't lend credibility to your argument. Which, by the way, is very weak. Just because something has been done before doesn't make it right.

I think this info isn't private. She posted it publicly intentionally. It wasn't made public by a facebook error or taken from a private source. That she has since changed her mind is irrelevant, I think.

[Stephanie66]

For those late to the story, google Lisa Barrett (the midwife who assisted Hellena). She is from my home town and has been banned from practicing as a midwife due to several preventable baby deaths under her care. She is a dangerous, delusional person to say the least. The coroner was damning of her. It makes for heart breaking reading.

Did I read it right that she claimed the babies that died weren't people?

I loved this sentence from this article: http://www.skepticalob.com/2011/10/lisa ... ifery.html

To understand just how much someone like Lisa Barrett betrays the heritage of midwifery, it helps to imagine how an African-American midwife of the 1920′s, or a European midwife of the 1500′s or even an aboriginal midwife of the Neolithic period would have greeted the notion that her job was to facilitate self-actualization through birth

So with the homebirther of the twins...they were identical and shared the placenta? Guess it was good she just left it in there, then...

[Lissa1481]

I kind of like the stuff she has made. I wouldn't wear it though. Not my style. The van cracked me up. We have those seats that get super hot so I bet a cover would help. I don't crochet though, so no covers for me.

[flubber]

For instance, in the Amish and Mennonite communities, all that is required to call yourself a midwife is that you are second at exactly five births. You can then hang your own shingle and are never required to be further trained.

That's nuts ... in the land of 'all things law suit' how is that legal? (Although I guess the Armish don't sue)

[Blahblah]

Did I read it right that she claimed the babies that died weren't people?.

Yes she did try to claim this in order to avoid legal action against her. If the babies had not been born with signs of life then their legal status is different under our local law. So, no electrical impulse, no heart activity etc would have meant that no Coroner's inquest could have legally been held. She was trying for a loophole to wriggle through. As it was there were paramedics present who took readings of electrical activity in the baby who was most questionable and the coroner was able to include that death in his enquiry.

She wouldn't have avoided the inquests for the obvious live births but one of the most damning things against her was the number of deaths involved, so excluding even one from the inquest would have been seen as a "victory" by her.

So much for self-awareness, empowerment, responsibility etc and other such sparkly concepts. As soon as things got legally tricky for her she ran for the lawyers and tried everything to weasel out of any consequences.

[chaotic life]

That's nuts ... in the land of 'all things law suit' how is that legal? (Although I guess the Armish don't sue)

The Amish and Mennonites don't sue. However, it's not uncommon for these lay midwives to expand beyond those communities without getting better training after they get a few of those births under their belt. It's NOT legal. In states where direct entry midwifery is legal and regulated, they can easily weed these women out. The problem is in states where direct entry midwifery is not legal, these lay midwives are no more illegal than trained, educated CPMs and since the entire home birthing community goes underground, there is little able to be done to weed out these scarily unqualified lay midwives alone.

[Eater of Worlds]

Unfortunately, it's the "educated" CPMs in states like Oregon where homebirth is popular that are raising the death rate of newborns sky high at homebirths.

[flubber]

The Amish and Mennonites don't sue. However, it's not uncommon for these lay midwives to expand beyond those communities without getting better training after they get a few of those births under their belt. It's NOT legal. In states where direct entry midwifery is legal and regulated, they can easily weed these women out. The problem is in states where direct entry midwifery is not legal, these lay midwives are no more illegal than trained, educated CPMs and since the entire home birthing community goes underground, there is little able to be done to weed out these scarily unqualified lay midwives alone.

Thanks for explaining it.

"How can we foster a society where we reject the notion that we must be forced to learn, be made to work and enforced to be good?How can we foster a society where we reject the notion that we must be forced to learn, be made to work and enforced to be good?"

This is a quote from Sparkles twitter. Maybe she needs to be linked to the Death Camp. That's what happens when you don't 'force' your kids to learn, work, behave, integrate to some degree with society.

For me its not about forcing my kids, it's about leading them, encouraging them and setting a GOOD EXAMPLE ..hard work, a desire to CONTRIBUTE to society not just freeload off it, a desire to support yourself, a desire to learn, to be decent.

Eater of Worlds ... but they aren't University Educated are they, so not real midwives? Well not my definition of a real midwife anyway.

[Lissa1481]

So in related news, Alice wrote on Facebook she is "going underground." Can't handle the questioning about her lifestyle I guess. It was related to the blog she was interviewed for. Read the comments.

raisingmiro.com/2013/10/14/life-learning-on-the-road-inspired-by-a-gypsy-traveling-single-mom/

[Lissa1481]

Oh, and Marcus was in nimbin too, according to his Facebook, so while he was not mentioned by sparkles, he must have been with her.

[August]

linda said:

Sorry Alice, but Apple and Microsoft won’t teach your son the things he will need to function in the real world.

Vinny

Reply:

October 15th, 2013 at 4:34 pm

Great interview Lainie!

@linda …Actually, Linda, some of the greatest and revered minds of history were raised outside of the mainstream edcation system. Schools, whilst they have their place, are a byproduct of the industrial revolution… So no, Alice’s little boy possibly won’t learn to “make do†or be happy scrubbing toilets for a living. Maybe he will aspire to different things than you personally hold as worthy. I understand your fear induced need for sweeping statements, but perhaps research your opinions before negatively putting it in a public place for us all to endure. Satria is six years old and absorbing so much of the “real world†that he has experiences above and beyond many adults (how beautifully illustrated by yourself)…furthermore, having met him, I can tell you that he is a bright and focused an individual that will make a strong impression on the “real worldâ€, not least because he already does and hasn’t been asked to wait until he is 18 to step out of a contrived setting INTO the real world.

linda

Reply:

October 16th, 2013 at 11:28 pm

Vinny, some of the greatest and revered minds of history were indeed raised outside of the mainstream education system. However, I think you’ll find most of them were quite intensively educated in maths, literacy and logic at home by their parents. An example I heard about recently was Blaise Pascal, the great scientist and mathematician.

The fundamentals can be consolidated and expanded upon by use of technology when a child is older, but the technology can’t provide the fundamentals to a 6-year-old. Sorry if that’s an inconvenient fact.

Alice, I have no problem with home/unschooling. I have a problem with the notion that a child doesn’t need to learn foundational things, such as literacy and numeracy, in some kind of formal way, because they can learn it from an ipad. Do you have any evidence for this?

# 17 October 2013 at 1:44 am

The bolded is so typical of bad unschoolers. They think it's either unparenting or worksheets. They are not clever enough to think of how to teach things to their kids so they don't even try.

[lilith]

Satria has been unschooled for less than a year. He learnt his foundational literacy and numeracy in a community school in Byron Bay, surrounded by his peers and taught in a structured environment by a tertiary qualified teacher.

[August]

Satria has been unschooled for less than a year. He learnt his foundational literacy and numeracy in a community school in Byron Bay, surrounded by his peers and taught in a structured environment by a tertiary qualified teacher.

How inauthentic.

[thoughtful]

The feel of the replies is not the energy that I want to attract into our lives… So I’m not feeling to respond to any of the above replies any further.

:roll:

[Arete]

... but they aren't University Educated are they, so not real midwives? Well not my definition of a real midwife anyway

Most CPMs are indeed university educated, but they do not have nursing degrees, and that is the crucial component. A CNM is a university degreed nurse with further extensive training in midwifery. CPMs don't have the nursing degree (with all the clinical hours that come with it), and they don't have consistent training or licensing across states.

[Blahblah]

That's the authentic version of sticking your fingers in your ears and chanting "I can't hear you".

[Black Aliss]

For those late to the story, google Lisa Barrett (the midwife who assisted Hellena). She is from my home town and has been banned from practicing as a midwife due to several preventable baby deaths under her care. She is a dangerous, delusional person to say the least. The coroner was damning of her. It makes for heart breaking reading.

Apparently she cites her research that she claims to have done during Hellena and Currydong's twins births that were what, 2 days apart? for the "average time between births for twins being 47 days, when this includes every twin that is miscarried, and the second twin goes to full term. So two other second twins had to die because this woman has no critical thinking skills whatsoever!

ObDisclaimer:I gave birth at home with a Certified Nurse Midwife in attendance. I think it's not only safe but in some cases safer than a hospital birth, but only for uncomplicated labors in healthy well-prepared mothers. These woo-woo home births, including breech, twins, vbac, and other complications, frequently in unsanitary surroundings are something else again.

[So Many Lies]

That's the authentic version of sticking your fingers in your ears and chanting "I can't hear you".

Totally. Oh man, Alice really is a weak woman. I mean if she really believes in all this she surely has

a thorough underpinning ethos that she would be happy to talk about at length. If she had genuine, passionate beliefs she would! She's hopeless really. She's just very "anyway the wind blows". And furthermore the way she went on and on about what an imposition it was to take on Lauren's kids just made me think she isn't a nice per person. I mean far out, we all do things that end up being hard work but do you then later get all bent out of shape and resentful about how your freedom was impinged upon after the fact? No. You secretly vow never to mind said kids again. You do not blog cryptic passive agressive messages about your "friend". These people are so selfish in everything they do.

[August]

Totally. Oh man, Alice really is a weak woman. I mean if she really believes in all this she surely has

a thorough underpinning ethos that she would be happy to talk about at length. If she had genuine, passionate beliefs she would! She's hopeless really. She's just very "anyway the wind blows". And furthermore the way she went on and on about what an imposition it was to take on Lauren's kids just made me think she isn't a nice per person. I mean far out, we all do things that end up being hard work but do you then later get all bent out of shape and resentful about how your freedom was impinged upon after the fact? No. You secretly vow never to mind said kids again. You do not blog cryptic passive agressive messages about your "friend". These people are so selfish in everything they do.

If you spend your life devoted to being utterly free and unhindered by anyone or anything including your children, then yes, yes you do bitch and moan when someone steals your freedom.

I bet lots of these people are libertarians.

[So Many Lies]

Whatever Hellenna is, she is Hellenna, and genuinely authentic and likeable in a way Lauren never will be.

I may not agree with many of Hellenna's decisions, but I don't believe that she makes those decisions selfishly like Lauren does. She obviously loves her family and is raising her kids with love and thought - differently to how I would choose to raise mine, certainly, but not just neglecting them like Lauren does hers.

Hellena is a genuine free spirit. Dare I say....authentic. I think she's pretty interesting. And I like her art for sure. She's nothing like Lauren at all. I don't think everything she does is advisable but at the least, she is open and honest. Alice and sparkle claim to be honest but they are far from it.