Breaking MAXWELL news/Liz cancelled the wedding to Joe

[sparkles]

After Christopher and Sara broke up, Steve went through and deleted a bunch of blog posts and photos of them together

Well, that explains why I had no clue that there was another broken engagement. I only stumbled on their blog a couple of years ago. Revisionist history much?

I don't get why fundies think that dating = orgies, drug and alcohol abuse, Sodom and Gomorrah and downfall of Western civilization or that courtship means no heartbreak. Things are either black or white, not a single hint of gray. You're either chaste and pure or a whore. When will no touching progress to no looking? CONTROL, CONTROL, CONTROL!

I see four possible avenues here. Steve continues doing what he's been doing since his way is god's way and god is never wrong. He loosens the reigns a bit when he realizes there are some flaws in the plan. He becomes even more controlling, to the point that marriages are completely arranged and no one meets until the wedding day. Or the kids bolt and run. I'm hoping for number 4 but betting on number 1.

[mirele]

That is exactly what I predict will happen. Steve will tighten the reins even more and take Joe and the family down to the next level of Maxhell.

Hmmm....MaxHell cult. Led by Steve Maxwell, with Teri and adult children in tow.

Steve: you're running a cult cult cult culty cult. Cult. You're David Miscavige, but on a much smaller scale. You're destroying your family in the name of yourself, not God, not Jesus. Your whole courtship and purity shtick, it's a failure and it stinks terribly. You're not God-honoring at all when you fail to let your children leave and cleave.

I have to wonder if the way Steve clutches his family to him is covering up some real nastiness going on at chez MaxHell.

I hope one of your family members escapes and gets the help s/he needs to live even among other fundies.

ETA: some nice search terms: Steve Maxwell, Titus 2, Managers of Their Homes. You don't wanna be like these people!

[Mela99]

I wonder if they'll keep fixing up the house. I can't imagine Steve letting him move into it, but I wonder if they'll get it ready and wait for a replacement.

[IReallyAmHopewell]

Can you imagine the atmosphere at Maxhell House over the past 3 days?

fa

In a word--NO! I feel for everyone incarcerated with Steve this week! I bet he's on the phone to her dad trying to get a "happy" ending and a trip down the isle. Now TWO sons have had failed ENGAGEMENTS--wow. That should definitely NOT be happening. So defiant! Poor Joe.......he must be padlocked in the family prayer closet for the next year......

[Gothardgrrl]

I had a feeling that this would happen when the Munck's posted about their 2-year-old watching a DVD. I know that fundie families encourage men to start asserting their headship during engagement. I can't imagine that Joseph could've let the DVD post pass without telling Elizabeth about his vision for a DVD-free household. Elizabeth has probably been a junior mother to her sister and knows that a DVD can save your sanity when you're raising toddlers. I imagine she began to have visions of herself raising 10+ children with only the aid of a very dull homeschooling curriculum and a handful of approved toys.

It might seem like a minor issue, but she's had lots of experience with children and I'm sure she knows that as a fundie, her quality of life is dependent on how enjoyable she finds raising kids; doing it the Maxwell way must have seemed very daunting and dreary.

[kpmom]

fa

In a word--NO! I feel for everyone incarcerated with Steve this week! I bet he's on the phone to her dad trying to get a "happy" ending and a trip down the isle. Now TWO sons have had failed ENGAGEMENTS--wow. That should definitely NOT be happening. So defiant! Poor Joe.......he must be padlocked in the family prayer closet for the next year......

I'm just hoping they let poor Joseph have a day off from the nursing home "church" yesterday.

[ChunkyBarbie]

The Bed Bath and Beyond registry is already taken down. I don't know why that interests me, but it does. I think Steve is really going to up the crazy as this was not his decision and out of his control. Elizabeth really dodged a bullet.

[freejoytoo]

So happy for Elizabeth, she dodged a serious bullet. I hope she carries on the trend and doesn't marry another fundie.

[nokidsmom]

fa

In a word--NO! I feel for everyone incarcerated with Steve this week! I bet he's on the phone to her dad trying to get a "happy" ending and a trip down the isle.

Would not be surprised if Steve tried to get the wedding back on because, you know, it's supposed to happen! Courtships are supposed to be foolproof. Not to mention, this is Engagement Fail Round 2.

One the other hand, he might consider any woman rejecting his son would be so unworthly of joining his family / cult that he might not bother to make that effort. In a way I hope that was the case, so that Elizabeth didn't have to endure that any attempts to get the wedding back on; that would make things even more wrenching emotionally.

[punkiepie]

There is a large part of me that wonders if Elizabeth, or her mom or dad stumbled across FJ, read some of the Info here about the Maxwells, and freaked out a little bit. The other part of me wonders if maybe it was the house being built that set off some warning bells. I mean, it would upset me if my fiancé was building a house for us to live in and I had no say in it. Obviously, that house is being crafted to Maxwell Family specifications. It's clear that she reads a lot, can you imagine of he asked for some built ins?!

I do feel a little sad for Joe, because he can't help his family and util he gets married, there is no way to escape. Maye he wanted to marry a girl who was fundie-lite so that he could break away. You know? One thing is clear, Steve-O is fucking up his kids' lives big time!

Ps- who was the first girl chris maxwell was courting? Was she full on fundie or fundie-lite?

Edited for grammar

[gardenvarietycitizen]

I am still suspicious about what went down to bring about such a rushed engagement in the first place. Elizabeth was a free woman before all this started, with access to the internets and her own blog. And Joseph is an IT trainer, and probably the most knowledgeable person within the compound about how to have a clandestine online relationship and keep it from his father's knowledge until it was too late.

I suspect that Elizabeth really did like Joe, and knew him (probably only in the non-carnal sense) for a while before Steve found out and marched them into courtship. Getting to know the whole family was most likely the dealbreaker...

Speaking o' which... it's only fairly recently that the Munck sisters were made to shut down their own blog and only blog as part of the family. Surely that was partly due to Steve-O's influence, though before this I'd thought it was just the "natural" progression of the Munck family getting more and more into Maxwellia, including the whole "we do everything as a family, no individual expressions" thing.

But now I wonder, did that date of them shutting off the sisters' blog coincide with the courtship starting? June 9, 2012 was their last post:

Today will be the last day we will be posting on the Munck Sisters Blog. We are happy to announce we will be writing on our Family Blog!

"By this My Father is glorified, that you bear much fruit; so you will be My disciples. "As the Father loved Me, I also loved you; abide in My love. John 15:8-9

Elizabeth, Amanda, & Rebekah

I wonder if that "big weekend" the Munck's posted about a couple of weeks ago was a visit to the Maxwell homestead. They said it was something "important". They never came back and posted about the w/end. I wonder if Ma & Pa visited. I don't think Liz went 'cause Steve did say a couple of times that Liz had never seen her new "home" in person...

Ooh. Makes me wonder too! At the very least I was thinking that with all this upheaval I'd never get to find out what it was, such a teaser!

Bat Out Of Maxhell 2012 Tour

LOL :lol: That's just begging for a photoshop.

I'll bet Steve is just PISSED. This is a huge demerit on his head, another failed engagement (remember, Christopher wasn't just courting, he was engaged to Sara Smith). I thought the whole point of courtship was that you don't move on to engagement unless you are absolutely sure. In my mind, a broken engagement is a much darker mark on Stevie and his clan than any broken courtship would be.

Heck yeah. I can't help but admit I'd love to be a fly on the wall over there for a bit... I bet you can cut the tension in the air with a KNIFE.

Ps- who was the first girl chris maxwell was courting? Was she full on fundie or fundie-lite?

It was another girl named Sara. Others can link you to her blog and all - she was pretty fundie, but WAYYYY more out there in the world than the Maxwells. After the breakup she's gone on to be a missionary in foreign countries even, and she dresses fashionably, blogs ALONE, all of it. No way she would make a replacement for the eventual wife Anna.

[WonderingInWA]

There is a large part of me that wonders if Elizabeth, or her mom or dad stumbled across FJ, read some of the Info here about the Maxwells, and freaked out a little bit. The other part of me wonders if maybe it was the house being built that set off some warning bells. I mean, it would upset me if my fiancé was building a house for us to live in and I had no say in it. Obviously, that house is being crafted to Maxwell Family specifications. It's clear that she reads a lot, can you imagine of he asked for some built ins?!

I do feel a little sad for Joe, because he can't help his family and util he gets married, there is no way to escape. Maye he wanted to marry a girl who was fundie-lite so that he could break away. You know? One thing is clear, Steve-O is fucking up his kids' lives big time!

Ps- who was the first girl chris maxwell was courting? Was she full on fundie or fundie-lite?

Edited for grammar

Her name is Sara Smith. I would call her fundie-lite only because I follow her blog and she's mentioned traveling overseas alone and going to the gym and working out. BUT, she works for Bill Gothard, so that's so NOT fundie-lite. She's hard to categorize, and I think she is probably a pretty fun person and of course, there was no way she was going to fit in at Chez Maxwell. She really dodged that bullet. They were to be married in October of the year they were engaged and then the blog fell silent about her for a long time and then they finally had to announce they had broken up. Christopher married NR-Anna two years later in October, IIRC.

[ILoveJellybeans]

The Maxwell house sounds very creepy and anti fun, Im guessing anyone with a semblance of normality would run the other way, even a lot of other fundies.

Maybe this is the reason why their sons are having no luck with the ladies, they see the family and realise how little freedom they will have and run the other way.

[Sola]

Can someone give the story of Christopher and Sara?

edit: Never mind, somebody already has.

[LucySnowe]

I can't imagine any possibility of Steve trying to get this wedding back on track or, indeed, ever having anything to do with the Muncks again. They have, in effect, publicly humiliated him and his way of life. Not only is the Courtship Tour '12 scuppered, but he'll pretty much have to marry off the entire crop of reversal kids in order to gain enough credibility to make up for two broken courtships/engagements. (I assume Poor Sarah is the sacrifice for their old age.)

I could see Joseph marrying quickly on the rebound. Some other Maxwell wanna-be family with a passel of kids might well be happy to hand over a spare daughter (and she, as mentioned elsewhere, might be thrilled to have her only-sharing-with-one-other-person bathroom and SEX). I'll start the pool: it happens by the end of 2012.

Based on what Elizabeth wrote, I can envision her going into meltdown and everything pouring out in a torrent. And thank goodness her parents were willing to listen to her, and not force her into the Maxwell box. I am really not sure I would have expected them to break off the engagement, based on how much they were chugging the Kool-Aid.

[kunoichi66]

After reading all the posts that reference cult leaders like Jim Jones and David Muscavige, can I make a suggestion? Why don't we launch a campaign like we did for Doug Philips (is a tool), except this time make it Steve Maxwell is a cult leader?

[WonderingInWA]

Can you imagine all the phone calls the Muncks are having to make to tell all the invited guests? Since the Maxwells don't have any friends, they won't have too many phone calls to make, but I'm guessing the Muncks have some. So many things to cancel and money to be lost and gifts to return. But no price is too high to pay to stay out of that drudgery Liz was about to marry into.

And I DO wonder if the Muncks hadn't discovered us and started to worry a little. It is just a bit satisfying to hope we made a difference.

[moreorlessnu]

Pretty sure that Steve would have tried left, right and sideways to postpone the wedding before putting up the post that the wedding was cancelled. That means there is no way either party would reconsider. If there was any hope whatsoever, we would see a cheerful post about Elizabeth needing more time to hand sew the beads on her peau de soie wedding gown, and how everything is on the Lord's schedule and not their own (peau de soie notwithstanding).

Like the poster above, I also wonder if they stumbled their way onto FJ, and realized the significance of making Pepsi an idol. Hopefully, Elizabeth is kicking back and enjoying a cold one right about now.

It looks like Elizabeth's parents have a love match. You have to wonder if her mother had something to do with the cancellation. Mrs. Munck would have a better idea of what truly being in love looks like and how miserable/scared her daughter may have appeared to be as D-Day got closer.

Any significance that the Maxwells made a point of blogging that they only spend $22 (or something like that) at a 2nd hand store on decorations for the rehearsal dinner? Could there have been problems already between the 2 families?

If Joseph "flips" the house and makes a profit, might this be a blessing in disguise for him as a new career is launched? This is a viable career that even the sisters could participate in (as they already have).

[TMS]

This is a blog post by Christopher's former fiance, Sara, and she talks about the engagement: simplysanctified.wordpress.com/2009/03/07/jesus-what-a-friend-and-lover/

If Joseph flips the house and makes a profit, I sure hope he gives some of his money to his sisters, since they worked so hard to help him. In that Kansas heat with no a/c, wearing layers of frumpers and t-shirts, at that.

[xReems]

They can try to mask this by throwing in "God" into the mix, but the reality of it all is that both Joseph and Elizabeth gave a piece of their heart away. It's stupid how whenever a broken courtship or engagement occurs, it's okay to them because "God chose to end it" and not the person in the relationship. No, God did not end it-you did, just like when "normal dating couples" break up.

I can only imagine the stuff Elizabeth is feeling right now. Her post just sounds so dreary and depressing that it makes me wonder if Steve-o threw in his 2 cents after she called it off. I can't even imagine how that phone call conversation started.

[WonderingInWA]

I can't even imagine how that phone call conversation started.

Exactly.

And I'm sure Stevie gave someone an earful, probably Elizabeth's father, and certainly he vented to Teri. I'm sure Teri is pissed, too. It's definitely a slap in the face for the Maxwells.

[thoughtful]

If these were more "mainstream" people I'd be wondering if the bride has found out she's not pregnant after all, so she doesn't have to marry the guy now. The timing would fit with "premature fellowship". But maybe I have a nasty suspicious mind.

I had this thought, as well.

[Just_Jane]

She couldn't handle the beige. It wasn't ironic hipster beige. It is bland, dry, dull as dishwater beige. a beige house, a beige life, and beige husband. That would be hugely depressing for her I'd think. She seems like the kind of girl that needs some color and happiness in her world. I wonder if she feels bad because of the disease to please. Even secular people tend to suffer from the need to please but it must be something terrible in the fundy world where you are told to keep sweet. Plus I think Steve threw a big old God filled guilt trip on her.

[TMS]

OH my gosh, I am just reading through Sara's (Christopher's ex-fiance) post about their engagement and it is heartbreaking! Apparently, 6 weeks before the wedding date, Steve, Teri & Christopher met with Sara & her parents, to postpone the wedding. Then....

When my fiance left, I was in utter grief and dismay and became very angry. Upon arriving home, he telephoned my dad and called off the wedding. I was heart-broken and in utter grief, more than I had ever been in my life. I couldn’t wrap my mind around the thought that I was going to live without him—after all, he became my purpose in life, my existence in living.

My entire heart and soul was given to him and now I had been rejected and my heart was shattered in a billion pieces. Even after it ended, I did all I could to restore the relationship, but I was turned down and told to leave him and their family alone.

I really wonder what happened on the Maxwell end, why they cancelled the wedding and told Sara to leave them alone. That sounds so cold. I'm sure Sara is happy today not to be a part of that family, but how sad the way things went.

[sparkles]

Holy crap. I just read Sara's blog post and I don't even know what to say. So many, many things are wrong there--especially about the Maxwells. Does she actually blame herself for causing the broken engagement because she loved her intended too much? Seriously? That's some fucked up thinking.