Seewalds 43: Pants may Have Been Worn Or Not

[SassyPants]

4 hours ago, lizzybee said:

I haven’t had a chance to go back and watch again since this conversation started because lately I’m always FJ’ing while I’m trying to get a child to sleep, but it seems like when she did the house tour that Jessa mentioned that Ben’s computer for school and study stuff was there in the boys’ room. Anyone who isn’t currently sitting among should be sleeping toddlers feel like watching that part and listening to how she phrased it? Ben’s been pretty low profile for a while now. He could just still be in school and they’re not talking about it. 

If he is in school, I wonder why they wouldn’t be talking about it? The show hasn’t been shy about talking about Jeremy‘s education, the fact that Austin flips houses or that JD’s a pilot.

[mstee]

I’ve never understood why they are so secretive about what Ben does daily. They share their lives publicly otherwise, so what’s the big deal? If he’s embarrassed that he doesn’t work full time (besides the show) then he should consider getting a job. It’s just weird. 

[Pecansforeveryone]

@SassyPants and @mstee, this always puzzles me. Why not even a mention of classes Ben is taking? Theology 101 and Apologetics 1 and 2. I know the classes themselves are online so there isn't much to film. However, Moody is a very respected Bible institution in conservative Christian circles. It could be used for "testimony" purposes which is a big deal in their circle. They rendered a lot of their actual Christian beliefs mute and bland. 

[xlurker]

My take on the radio silence regarding school, if in fact he is in  school, is HE may want some privacy in his personal life. This just may be the line he has drawn in the sand.

[SassyPants]

37 minutes ago, Pecansforeveryone said:

@SassyPants and @mstee, this always puzzles me. Why not even a mention of classes Ben is taking? Theology 101 and Apologetics 1 and 2. I know the classes themselves are online so there isn't much to film. However, Moody is a very respected Bible institution in conservative Christian circles. It could be used for "testimony" purposes which is a big deal in their circle. They rendered a lot of their actual Christian beliefs mute and bland. 

I’d rather hear about how they are educating or supporting themselves beyond the show, versus another baby, game night or baby shower.

[Idlewild]

Just now, xlurker said:

My take on the radio silence regarding school, if in fact he is in  school, is HE may want some privacy in his personal life. This just may be the line he has drawn in the sand.

That’s a good point - we’re so used to this family over sharing their meagre achievements it doesn’t occur to me that one may want privacy .

I still wonder what the plan is- does he want to be a minister with a church? A teacher? Will the Caldwells be cast aside if Ben starts up a church?

[Pecansforeveryone]

I appreciate what people are saying about Ben are saying wanting some privacy. Am I completely wrong for thinking their privacy standards are piss poor and ass backwards? Ben allows all of his very minor children to be on camera but his precious adult privacy is a treasure to be guarded? I do not get it. 

[Idlewild]

1 minute ago, Pecansforeveryone said:

I appreciate what people are saying about Ben are saying wanting some privacy. Am I completely wrong for thinking their privacy standards are piss poor and ass backwards? Ben allows all of his very minor children to be on camera but his precious adult privacy is a treasure to be guarded? I do not get it. 

Yes- happy to go public on his child’s possible development issue or filling his diaper but don’t ask about his bible study. I hope Henry manages to sort out his issues & is able to one day tell his parents what he thinks of them. 

[SassyPants]

All I can assume in terms of Ben is that JB, the person in control of the money and contract, does not want any additional SILs shown advancing their education. JB is anti-education, likely because his is so limited and he doesn’t want the next generation more informed or skilled than he. 

[Pecansforeveryone]

This aversion to academics, even academic Bible study is extreme even by fundie standards. I get no heathen State U for the Duggards but no Moody Bible College or regional equivalent? What the actual F? (I can't count Crown College. Even by fundie standards, it's a joke.) 

[grandmadugger]

I thought someone found Ben on a local church website as a youth pastor or something similar. It was a few years ago and I am not sure how to search old threads. 

[Jasmar]

13 hours ago, SassyPants said:

If he is in school, I wonder why they wouldn’t be talking about it? The show hasn’t been shy about talking about Jeremy‘s education, the fact that Austin flips houses or that JD’s a pilot.

Wait, JD is a pilot??? How did I not know this? ?

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

On 3/20/2020 at 2:25 PM, DalmatianCat said:

Anyone think it’s odd that all the Duggar son-in-laws but Austin are continuing with higher education (I’m going on the assumption that Ben is) and none of the sons are? I can see how right now it may seem unnecessary to the Duggar boys, but in another ten years it will be interesting to compare them to the SILs.

Are the schools Jeremy & Ben's attend accredited?  

Any degree is worthless if you have no work ethic. I'll take "ignorant" Austin's worth ethic over Jeremy, Ben or even Derricks education.  

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

22 hours ago, Pecansforeveryone said:

This aversion to academics, even academic Bible study is extreme even by fundie standards. I get no heathen State U for the Duggards but no Moody Bible College or regional equivalent? What the actual F? (I can't count Crown College. Even by fundie standards, it's a joke.) 

I'm pretty sure the kids from Jinger on down have, AT BEST, a 6th grade education. I think if  Jill, Josiah & Joy had been allowed to they would have gone to community college, and this was by design. JB wants complete control over his cult and keeping the kids as ignorant and unemployable as possible keeps them under his thumb.  So far I think only Jill is completely self sufficient. Joy, aside from the ramshackle house she was given that they had to gut and remodel, for selling her childhood, her and Austin are pretty self sufficient.   But with a looming recession, the probably closing of Ft Rock, and the slowing of home sales and remodeling, they are going to be more reliant on JB especially having a high risk pregnancy right now, and the possibly of another c/section that won't be cheap, unless they have some sort of insurance, and even then it won't be cheap.  

Edited March 22, 2020 by allthegoodnamesrgone

[Pecansforeveryone]

Ben has an associates from I believe a community college so I would say his associates is accredited. Jeremy's school has had lots of issues with accreditation. Plus it's a cult of personality to John MacArthur so I have my doubts about quality of education with him. 

[DalmatianCat]

2 hours ago, Pecansforeveryone said:

Ben has an associates from I believe a community college so I would say his associates is accredited. Jeremy's school has had lots of issues with accreditation. Plus it's a cult of personality to John MacArthur so I have my doubts about quality of education with him. 

What is Jeremy’s undergrad degree in? Something like business or sports management? 

[FluffySnowball]

On 3/21/2020 at 10:40 AM, SassyPants said:

The show hasn’t been shy about talking about Jeremy‘s education, the fact that Austin flips houses or that JD’s a pilot.

JD, a pilot? Surely you jest! ?

[Pecansforeveryone]

@DalmatianCat, I believe it's something like that. It was a secular institution in New York if I remember correctly. 

[DalmatianCat]

On 3/21/2020 at 12:19 PM, Pecansforeveryone said:

This aversion to academics, even academic Bible study is extreme even by fundie standards. I get no heathen State U for the Duggards but no Moody Bible College or regional equivalent? What the actual F? (I can't count Crown College. Even by fundie standards, it's a joke.) 

I’ve always thought it was interesting that none of them ended up at any one of a multitude of Christian colleges (Pensacola Christian or Patrick Henry both seem like good candidates for several of the kids). I grew up in ATI and not only did all my siblings and I go to college and get degrees but many of the other ATI kids we grew up with did as well. Some of them took longer than others to decide on college, but eventually the majority did.

I think part of it is not so much being “anti-education” but with two parents who also didn’t go to college (and no guidance counselors to help) I’m wondering if the logistics just seemed too complicated and overwhelming. I can see Josiah interested in pursuing higher education in the next few years, if for no other than reason than I can see Lauren encouraging it. Her family seemed to value at least getting an associates degree.

[just_ordinary]

18 hours ago, Jasmar said:

Wait, JD is a pilot??? How did I not know this? ?

Ahhhh, will this ever be not funny? It puts a smile on my face every time. 

[mpheels]

3 hours ago, Pecansforeveryone said:

@DalmatianCat, I believe it's something like that. It was a secular institution in New York if I remember correctly. 

Jeremy went to Hartwick, which is a small liberal arts in New York. It’s more or less secular from what I can see, but does have religious roots. He graduated from Hartwick, then went to Syracuse for one year as a grad student (and to play out his final year of eligibility for NCAA soccer). (Thanks Wikipedia!)

[neuroticcat]

I agree that some of the educational philosophy stems from JB and Michelle marrying super young, not pursuing higher ed, and starting their own businesses. 
 

The anti-worldly-college mindset fits in neatly with that, but they also seem really invested in practical life skills. I wonder if any of their kids truly secretly desired further educations were not permitted or if it was a sort of assumption that college is irrelevant...

[baldricks_turnip]

I would imagine many of them would struggle with the structure of university, even a non-accredited bible school. They have to get up at a certain time, attend classes on a schedule and work to a syllabus. They have been raised on Duggar Time.

[HideousGreenShirt]

4 hours ago, neuroticcat said:

The anti-worldly-college mindset fits in neatly with that, but they also seem really invested in practical life skills. I wonder if any of their kids truly secretly desired further educations were not permitted or if it was a sort of assumption that college is irrelevant...

Re: bold above, at minimum we know of the following:

Jill pursued every opportunity she was able to create and attend with an accountability buddy (midwifery, fire department, ems). 

Josh mentioned studying law. 

JD (a pilot, FYI) appears to have worked in construction (assuming licenced for heavy machinery) and for the local police force and fire dept (volunteer roles). Who knows what success he would have achieved if allowed/motivated to attend community college or trade school. 

Joe is the only Duggar spawn to have actually attempted college. In the unaired season of 19kac he was shown being prayed over before he went to TN to attend Clown, no doubt under the watchful eyes of the Bates. 

Before her teen marriage, Joy was shown to be interested in getting her pilot licence. 

I think there are enough examples of the Duggar kids at minimum expressing an interest in learning things that were not accessible to them. 

It's sad forcing all of their kids into the same pitiful education-work for JB-get married and breed path. For every motivated child like Jill, there's a Jessa and a Jinger who have no interest in further education and are content to toe the line. 

[Giraffe]

12 minutes ago, HideousGreenShirt said:

 

I think there are enough examples of the Duggar kids at minimum expressing an interest in learning things that were not accessible to them.  

That’s a sad and impressive list of “what could’ve been.”  I hope Jill goes back to school when her younger goes to school. If she goes back I hope that will give the others the courage to get an accredited education, too.