Family Living on Purpose (FLOP) : Erika Shupe Pt 11

[meee]

Do they really still care about homeschooling and green smoothies when Erika doesn't do that anymore? And Erika herself used birth control! Is this just a classic case of "Do as I say, not as I do" or are they completely deluded?

[elliha]

2 hours ago, meee said:

Do they really still care about homeschooling and green smoothies when Erika doesn't do that anymore? And Erika herself used birth control! Is this just a classic case of "Do as I say, not as I do" or are they completely deluded?

Probably not but I am guessing that Bob expected to be able to interrogate the future boyfriend but that girl Karen went out and decided who to marry herself, probably much like Bob and Erika themselves did once upon a time. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

Karen had more freedom before she moved out but if I remember correctly, it was only last summer. It might seem like longer because before she moved out, she wore mainstream clothing, had a job at a gym, and wasn't stuck at home taking care of her siblings since they were in school during the day. 

[ActualReality]

9 hours ago, Hisey said:

Was it just last summer? I thought it was longer. Then she has really dealt with a lot in the last 7-8 months.

I think that "governing the process" means that the young man approaches Bob asking for permission to "court" Karen. Bob asks the boy questions about his intentions, views on birth control, homeschooling, theology, etc. If the kid recites the correct answers, Bob lets him date Karen with all sorts of rules and guidelines in place, and perhaps even chaperones. After a while, the kid approaches Bob for permission to marry his daughter, and if Bob (and Erika, I presume) gives it a green light, the kid asks Karen. I'm sure Bob and Erika would love it if they were present at the proposal, like with the Bates family. That's what governing the process means in the fundie world, more or less.

Instead, it appears Karen and her boyfriend met and decided to date on their own. Bob and Erika have no idea what his views on homeschooling, birth control or submission are. Perhaps they don't even know if he is a Christian or not! They do not know if he drinks green smoothies in the morning, or if he reads fiction for 2.5 hours a day. He could be a gamer or celebrate Halloween or any number of evil things. Bob and Erika are out of the picture, and nobody cares what their opinion is. Karen and her boyfriend seem to feel they are perfectly capable of managing their own relationship.

This is that I thought was meant by "govern the process" as well.

I get that he/they feel like it's their job to look after their daughter and protect her interests but its strange to me that they won't even meet the guy now that the couple has made a decision.  It seems punitive and legalistic.  I get the feeling that he's the kind of guy who'd rather be "right" than kind (or happy).  Too bad for him.  He risks losing his daughter.  

[mango_fandango]

Karen’s posted a picture on FB, of the freckles on her face. She looks so pretty! And I think it looks like she’s removed her nose piercing (I remember we were wondering whether it was real or stuck on); it definitely looks like a piercing hole. 

[cara]

More holiday photos up. Erika has left some lovely, encouraging comments on them. I don't know what the story is with Bob, but I'm genuinely happy for Erika and the kids in how they've managed this shift and are maintaining a positive relationship 

[lilah]

On 3/15/2018 at 4:51 PM, JermajestyDuggar said:

I don't think Erika's parents are fundie. Or are they? I guess I just figured they were your typical conservative Christian. Didn't Erika go to public school? 

I remember she vague blogged about bring semi estranged from her parents due to them not following her wishes when it came to caring for Karen and Melanie

[Hisey]

4 minutes ago, lilah said:

I remember she vague blogged about bring semi estranged from her parents due to them not following her wishes when it came to caring for Karen and Melanie

I think it was Bob's family that they are estranged from. She didn't like their views about how to care for baby Karen and Melanie. 

[mango_fandango]

Yes it was definitely Bob’s parents. There have been photos of the family with Erika’s side before, and that’s Erika’s parents who have taken Karen and Melanie to Hawaii; Erika and her mom look so alike. 

Glad to see Karen is having fun. 

[YoshiCat]

On 3/19/2018 at 10:26 AM, ActualReality said:

This is that I thought was meant by "govern the process" as well.

I get that he/they feel like it's their job to look after their daughter and protect her interests but its strange to me that they won't even meet the guy now that the couple has made a decision.  It seems punitive and legalistic.  I get the feeling that he's the kind of guy who'd rather be "right" than kind (or happy).  Too bad for him.  He risks losing his daughter.  

I grew up with controlling parents (Erica often reminds me of my mom) and they were always shocked and furious when I made decisions of my own. And refusing to meet a fiance sounds exactly like what they would do. The absolute worst thing I did was date and have boyfriends (this started when I was in college, I wasn't allowed to date in high school). 

They would never think "our adult daughter is living her own life, we'd better accept that or we'll lose her." Their thinking was more along the lines of punishing me for showing independence and trying to get me to back in their control. Meeting the fiance would mean accepting that she's living her own life and making her own decisions. 

Controlling people do not willingly or easily give up control. My parents were just beside themselves with anger and despair when they could not regain control of me.  They really had no idea what to do when I wouldn't give in and return to being under their control. I was a horrible person who didn't respect her parents, didn't appreciate all they had done for me, etc.

I used to wonder if they somehow never realized that I would become an adult. They really seemed to think that they would always be completely in control of me and my life. 

Fundie parents obviously think this way. Their offspring are children under their control, even when they're adults, until they get married. And then they'd excpected to live exactly as their parents decided they should live. 

[December]

8 hours ago, YoshiCat said:

They would never think "our adult daughter is living her own life, we'd better accept that or we'll lose her."

I went through some similar experiences with my (non-fundie) parents as a young adult. I was lucky because after I gained the confidence to start to push back on their behavior and explain my frustrations with them, they eventually came around. Specifically, they realized that having a relationship with me was more important than always seeing me make the decisions they wanted. And now I get to have a relationship with them where I feel more comfortable being honest/open about what's happening in my life.

People need to respect their children, especially their individuality as adults. Whether parents acknowledge it or not, their adult child is in charge of their own life and who's in it. The child may not live their life exactly as their parents hoped/expected but the parents probably didn't either!

[LovelyLuna]

Erika reminds me of my mother.  The control and expectations were different, but in essence they are the same.  I went public school and did as much extra-circular as I could possibly fit in.  I was incredibly lucky to grow up in a city similar to San Francisco with a huge LGBT+ population.  Ive had openly gay teaches and coaches/ peers from 6 years old.  In spite of, or consequently I identify as Pan.  I don’t really know how to wrap this up other then to say; I hate Erika.  I am so happy for Karen because I know her struggle.  I was lucky and I give her a pass, for now.  

[ActualReality]

On 3/24/2018 at 3:43 AM, YoshiCat said:

I grew up with controlling parents (Erica often reminds me of my mom) and they were always shocked and furious when I made decisions of my own. And refusing to meet a fiance sounds exactly like what they would do. The absolute worst thing I did was date and have boyfriends (this started when I was in college, I wasn't allowed to date in high school). 

They would never think "our adult daughter is living her own life, we'd better accept that or we'll lose her." Their thinking was more along the lines of punishing me for showing independence and trying to get me to back in their control. Meeting the fiance would mean accepting that she's living her own life and making her own decisions. 

Controlling people do not willingly or easily give up control. My parents were just beside themselves with anger and despair when they could not regain control of me.  They really had no idea what to do when I wouldn't give in and return to being under their control. I was a horrible person who didn't respect her parents, didn't appreciate all they had done for me, etc.

I used to wonder if they somehow never realized that I would become an adult. They really seemed to think that they would always be completely in control of me and my life. 

Fundie parents obviously think this way. Their offspring are children under their control, even when they're adults, until they get married. And then they'd excpected to live exactly as their parents decided they should live. 

Your post described my mom EXACTLY!  She said that her controlling ways came from the fact that she married poorly.  She was going to chose partners for my sister and I and we'd have "perfect" lives full of children (grandkids for her) and no divorce.  I broke away in college and it TOTALLY freaked her out.  She spent YEARS getting back at me for being the "bad/ungrateful" daughter.

I moved far away and refused to speak to her most of the time.  When I got pregnant out of wedlock she thought i'd move back home and she'd have her way.  She wanted my kid to call her "mommy".  Um, no!

I hooked up  with a guy and had 2 more kids.  She was positively apoplectic!  After 8 years together I married my kids father.  We've now been together 3x longer than she was ever married.  We are an open minded/humanistic family.  For the life of her she can't figure out how it all worked out since she wasn't controlling it all.  I honestly can't roll my eyes hard enough at her thinking! 

[LovelyLuna]

On 3/26/2018 at 1:34 PM, ActualReality said:

For the life of her she can't figure out how it all worked out since she wasn't controlling it all.  I honestly can't roll my eyes hard enough at her thinking! 

Mothers, ugg.  I know that some people have lovely Mums, but for those who don’t, internet fist bump.  I strongly feel that being related by blood doesn’t automatically mean family.  You have to earn that privilege.  Bravo on you for your amazing sounding family.

[Kilo whiskey]

On 1/24/2018 at 9:06 PM, LovelyLuna said:

I’m late to the party, but I have taken a few breaks recently.  I am gobsmacked.  Erika, my most hated fundie mother, sent her kids to school! and pants! and Karens’s freedom!  I severely want to know what happened, but I am so damn happy for the kids.  Go Karen! This makes me so much happier after reading about the Turpins for the last 3 days.  

I appreciate the encouragement I saw here concerning my move out. Very nice little gems among the other comments. 

-Karen 

On 3/23/2018 at 7:40 PM, mango_fandango said:

Yes it was definitely Bob’s parents. There have been photos of the family with Erika’s side before, and that’s Erika’s parents who have taken Karen and Melanie to Hawaii; Erika and her mom look so alike. 

Glad to see Karen is having fun. 

I don’t need to hit up Hawaii to have fun

On 3/19/2018 at 3:12 AM, elliha said:

Probably not but I am guessing that Bob expected to be able to interrogate the future boyfriend but that girl Karen went out and decided who to marry herself, probably much like Bob and Erika themselves did once upon a time. 

Truth. 

On 3/19/2018 at 5:35 AM, JermajestyDuggar said:

Karen had more freedom before she moved out but if I remember correctly, it was only last summer. It might seem like longer because before she moved out, she wore mainstream clothing, had a job at a gym, and wasn't stuck at home taking care of her siblings since they were in school during the day. 

I moved out in July of 2017, and am happily sucessful, when my parents expected failure from my efforts. They told me to leave, before I was ready, but with the expectation tha I would come back, repentant and submitting, prodigal child style.  

On 3/19/2018 at 11:13 PM, mango_fandango said:

Karen’s posted a picture on FB, of the freckles on her face. She looks so pretty! And I think it looks like she’s removed her nose piercing (I remember we were wondering whether it was real or stuck on); it definitely looks like a piercing hole. 

It was real. 

I can’t tell you how fun it is to discover freejinger and to find there are people like me, who disagree with my mom. I feel reassured, when I didnt even know I needed it. 

[Season of life...]

@Kilo whiskey

Karen, hearing about your success has made my day! Thanks so much for posting.

[FunFunFundie]

13 minutes ago, Kilo whiskey said:

I appreciate the encouragement I saw here concerning my move out. Very nice little gems among the other comments. 

-Karen 

I don’t need to hit up Hawaii to have fun

Truth. 

I moved out in July of 2017, and am happily sucessful, when my parents expected failure from my efforts. They told me to leave, before I was ready, but with the expectation tha I would come back, repentant and submitting, prodigal child style.  

It was real. 

I can’t tell you how fun it is to discover freejinger and to find there are people like me, who disagree with my mom. I feel reassured, when I didnt even know I needed it. 

Oh, Karen. We've all been so, so rooting for you. Best of luck in everything.

[Georgiana]

@Kilo whiskey, WELCOME!   I have so much respect for your ability to grow into such a strong individual despite the best efforts of your parents to force you to give up and submit.  I can't imagine how much strength that must have taken, and how hard it must have been to have parents who wanted to sabotage your efforts to grow instead of supporting them.  

You're incredible!  Don't ever forget that!

[JermajestyDuggar]

Hi Karen! Great to hear from you! Hoping for the best for you and your future endeavors! 

[LovelyLuna]

@Kilo whiskey, I'm so glad you stopped by! Welcome to one of my favorite places on the internet.  This is an amazing community.  I am sorry your parents underestimated your ability to make it, but kudos to you for proving them wrong.  I wish you all the best in all of your dreams and adventures. <3

[Hisey]

Karen! Welcome! I think you must be an amazingly strong person. I'm so glad you are happy and successful. 

[daisyjane1234]

Karen.

Count me among the people cheering for you.   Thanks for your post.  

Clapping in Canada!!!

 

[Foudeb]

Rooting for you @Kilo whiskey. Congratulations on your hard won independence. 

[cara]

Welcome Karen. You seem incredibly strong and brave. We've enjoyed seeing the positive changes you made in your life. I hope your siblings are doing well too 

[smittykins]

Welcome aboard, Karen!