Sparkling Adventures in Child Neglect - "Gayby" on Board

[alba]

Goody, now that I've left my job I don't feel so bad talking about zone family.

I was workng the day Elijah was killed. I worked for a certain emergency service. I worked in the area. A friend of mine did the body retrieval.

Let's just say that Lauren at no point gave a shit that her child was dead. Took ages to alert anyone. We all think it was planned. Sins of the father or that kind of nonsense. No crying. Who day was wierd and somewhat surreal.

Their house/backyard was a dump too.

How centrelink and child safety were not involved still astounds me.

Lauren's behaviour as you describe it here surprises me, not because I doubt her ability to not give a shit about her children, but because in the pictures on her blog (like the one in the sidebar) she looks like a woman whose heart has been broken. I'm curious what you make of that.

[chaotic life]

She cannot be gone only 5.5 weeks because she is scheduled to give birth IN Iceland, and the gayby is not due until Elijah's birthday in late November. Given how they used to come back from New Zealand specifically to secure their Centrelink payments, she clearly must understand that she will lose those payments by being gone so long. My personal guess is that the fathers are compensating her for the funding she will lose from Centrelink by being in Europe so long. I also suspect they are paying for her airplane tickets and she has to pay for the sightseeing she and the girls are doing.

The thing is, Lauren's blog posting when Elijah died was completely cold and calculated. Her despondent grief is only seen in those pictures that she continues to keep linked to the side of her blog. That was when she claimed the body at the morgue, completely timed, planned and with a camera turned on her FOR the show to give to her blog.

I have a lot of pictures of my son's final days. He looks dead in some of those pictures, but when he actually died I stopped the picture taking. However, Hospice told me that its common to take a lot of pictures, even post-mortem pictures. What is NOT common is to post those pictures publically. I took pictures to hold onto my memories and those of my children. I am very careful to never share any of those pictures if they meet one of two criteria. If you have to ask yourself whether he is still alive or not, or if the picture of raw grief on any member of the family also in the picture is too evident, then I do NOT share those pictures.

I've known mothers of stillborn and deceased infants to have pictures, sometimes lots of them. There's a US organization that specifically specializes in taking those pictures. I've never known one to not be extremely careful where and with whom they share those pictures. Its always struck me that Lauren shares them specifically to make her grief legitimate because those are the ONLY pictures that exist where she shows real grief, and based upon what has been shared here, she never showed it in real life either.

[docmom]

She wanted to get the other kids so they could watch their baby brother's dead body being pulled out of the water?

Theres some things its better kids don't see...

Maybe it's just Lauren's embellishment but from her description of the day Elijah died it seems like she knew it was going to happen. She carried him all day, walked with her older daughter through a graveyard and talked with her about how death was good because nothing that happened was ever bad and then talked about how a random stranger saved Elijah's life by pointing out his head was lolling back in the carrier. She makes it sound like she had a premonition something was going to happen, but maybe she actually knew... That being said, I simply cannot fathom that idea. It's one thing for a mother to snap and kill her child, another thing entirely for her to allow her "husband" to commit premeditated infanticide.

[treemom]

Lauren really disturbs me

[Coco]

Lauren really disturbs me

me too. She's not fit to be caring for children.

[alba]

She cannot be gone only 5.5 weeks because she is scheduled to give birth IN Iceland, and the gayby is not due until Elijah's birthday in late November. Given how they used to come back from New Zealand specifically to secure their Centrelink payments, she clearly must understand that she will lose those payments by being gone so long. My personal guess is that the fathers are compensating her for the funding she will lose from Centrelink by being in Europe so long. I also suspect they are paying for her airplane tickets and she has to pay for the sightseeing she and the girls are doing.

The thing is, Lauren's blog posting when Elijah died was completely cold and calculated. Her despondent grief is only seen in those pictures that she continues to keep linked to the side of her blog. That was when she claimed the body at the morgue, completely timed, planned and with a camera turned on her FOR the show to give to her blog.

I have a lot of pictures of my son's final days. He looks dead in some of those pictures, but when he actually died I stopped the picture taking. However, Hospice told me that its common to take a lot of pictures, even post-mortem pictures. What is NOT common is to post those pictures publically. I took pictures to hold onto my memories and those of my children. I am very careful to never share any of those pictures if they meet one of two criteria. If you have to ask yourself whether he is still alive or not, or if the picture of raw grief on any member of the family also in the picture is too evident, then I do NOT share those pictures.

I've known mothers of stillborn and deceased infants to have pictures, sometimes lots of them. There's a US organization that specifically specializes in taking those pictures. I've never known one to not be extremely careful where and with whom they share those pictures. Its always struck me that Lauren shares them specifically to make her grief legitimate because those are the ONLY pictures that exist where she shows real grief, and based upon what has been shared here, she never showed it in real life either.

Oh, I didn't think about that. Yeah, the very fact that those pictures are on the blog suggests that she felt the need to show people she was grieving.

[shrewlu]

Maybe it's just Lauren's embellishment but from her description of the day Elijah died it seems like she knew it was going to happen. She carried him all day, walked with her older daughter through a graveyard and talked with her about how death was good because nothing that happened was ever bad and then talked about how a random stranger saved Elijah's life by pointing out his head was lolling back in the carrier. She makes it sound like she had a premonition something was going to happen, but maybe she actually knew... That being said, I simply cannot fathom that idea. It's one thing for a mother to snap and kill her child, another thing entirely for her to allow her "husband" to commit premeditated infanticide.

I agree that there is something really weird about that post about the day Elijah died. Perhaps she did just embellish it in a way to give the whole situation some coherence or order, but it reads as really morbid. And, if you read it with a cynical eye, it reads as really fishy. I have long thought that Lauren knows more about Elijah's death than she let on and perhaps goaded David into it somehow. I have no proof for that, of course. But there is just something so weird about her behavior going back to that time that just makes me wonder.

[Gherkin]

I'll do some asking around. See what I can find out.

[So Many Lies]

I agree that there is something really weird about that post about the day Elijah died. Perhaps she did just embellish it in a way to give the whole situation some coherence or order, but it reads as really morbid. And, if you read it with a cynical eye, it reads as really fishy. I have long thought that Lauren knows more about Elijah's death than she let on and perhaps goaded David into it somehow. I have no proof for that, of course. But there is just something so weird about her behavior going back to that time that just makes me wonder.

It's very weird, though she had spoken about death in a few different posts. she and David took a rather religious fatalistic approach to death. I wondered for a long time what her role in the baby's death was. At first I thought "impromptu baptism gone wrong" then I was all, "they've given their firstborn to God" or something. But now she's given all that righteous stuff away, doesn't seem religious at all. Gee she doesn't even have a secular moral code now.

I don't like her pictures of grief and I don't like her musings on grief. they seem phony and are just there for crowd pleasing and ministry. seems wrong to snark on grief i know but something's wrong.

I agree with all posters about her unfitNess to be a parent. she scares me.

[So Many Lies]

me too. She's not fit to be caring for children.

something is very wrong about all this. something about her fatalistic attitude.

[So Many Lies]

And it occurs to me from time to time that this forum is a great resource for her learn to be a better phony. She can see what areas might need further work.

[Mango]

I cannot believe I'm defending her but well...

I've always read those posts on her blog as after-the-fact storytelling to fit what happened into her sort of blog narrative life. I don't think she's rational, and I think she and her kids need HELP- and they're not getting it or likely to any time soon. :( Not knowing them, she totally COULD know more- but I could also see her telling those stories to the internet- and believing them herself regardless of their objective truth- to try and make it fit into place in her head.

[August]

I cannot believe I'm defending her but well...

I've always read those posts on her blog as after-the-fact storytelling to fit what happened into her sort of blog narrative life. I don't think she's rational, and I think she and her kids need HELP- and they're not getting it or likely to any time soon. :( Not knowing them, she totally COULD know more- but I could also see her telling those stories to the internet- and believing them herself regardless of their objective truth- to try and make it fit into place in her head.

Yeah, and I'm uncomfortable with judging someone guilty because they don't have hysterics. There is so much about Lauren that is legitimately horrifying that we should make sure don't stray into bitch eating crackers territory.

Chaotic, regarding photos, you knew your son was dying. If one of our children died today we might not have taken any pictures for weeks beforehand. Taking pictures isn't so bizarre.

Displaying the pictures so we can see how sad she was until she was so much all better one year later that she could get pregnant with another son and hand him off to strangers forever. Now, THAT is mentally ill. Like the sacrificial jesus pic in the magazine story. Or wanting to get her children to come and see the body retrieval.

[chaotic life]

I said there is nothing uncommon about TAKING the pictures. Taking them and possessing them is common for grieving parents. Displaying them her blog, and they were put up the day they were taken, is something I have never seen another grieving parent do.

For most grieving parents, those pictures are precious and cherished. But even amongst those of us who have them, it is rare to display them and when done is usually very careful and controlled. Lauren has them as a public sidebar on her blog and it's one of the first things any new person to her blog sees. That is the bizarre behavior, the one that makes it hard to excuse under the "everyone grieves differently" mantra.

[jafrmano]

I said there is nothing uncommon about TAKING the pictures. Taking them and possessing them is common for grieving parents. Displaying them her blog, and they were put up the day they were taken, is something I have never seen another grieving parent do.

For most grieving parents, those pictures are precious and cherished. But even amongst those of us who have them, it is rare to display them and when done is usually very careful and controlled. Lauren has them as a public sidebar on her blog and it's one of the first things any new person to her blog sees. That is the bizarre behavior, the one that makes it hard to excuse under the "everyone grieves differently" mantra.

I agree so much with this. I had a still born baby boy a few years ago. I had several pictures taken of him at the hospital. These picture show my grief and show him in ways I needed to remember, BUT, these are very, very private. Only my closest family have seen these pictures. I have one displayed in my bedroom only that just show his feet. These or things I would never put out there for others. I talk about my experience openly but those photos are not for others.

[Black Aliss]

I agree that there is something really weird about that post about the day Elijah died. Perhaps she did just embellish it in a way to give the whole situation some coherence or order, but it reads as really morbid. And, if you read it with a cynical eye, it reads as really fishy. I have long thought that Lauren knows more about Elijah's death than she let on and perhaps goaded David into it somehow. I have no proof for that, of course. But there is just something so weird about her behavior going back to that time that just makes me wonder.

Same here. I assume the coroner was able to fix the time of Elijah's death fairly precisely and determine that he had in fact drowned in the river, but initially I couldn't shake the idea that David had returned home to discover that Lauren had drowned Elijah in the bath, so he took Elijah to the river and tried to fake an accidental drowning/suicide attempt. I could see him thinking that 1)the girls needed Lauren more than they needed him, and 2) perhaps he'd not be charged with Elijah's death by reason of insanity.

[Annasopinion]

Lauren would love a teen pregnancy. Just another child to go on adventures with. I know this seems very judgmental of me, but I went back and watched Elijah's birth. They were set up at this little camp and the girls are just hanging out, it seemed so odd. Like they enjoy being homeless versus a more secure, regular life. It's the opposite of what most people want and I can't figure it out. Doesn't she ever worry she will run into the wrong group of people and put her girls and herself in danger? How secure is her van? They could easily be robbed. It just gives me an uneasy feeling. How does she sleep at night? I guess I'm just a worrier.

I was genuinely distressed when her daughter camped overnight with a man in the woods (sorry guys, don't have time to trawl for the links). I do wonder also if she will take the line, as I have heard some Rainbow people express, that a woman's ideal time for childbirth is mid teens to early 20's and that waiting any longer is a societal construct to suit our economy, not our bodies.

I am concerned that her daughters may not get boundaries with men or teenagers as they enter puberty and that this might have repercussions for them - namely that they won't be in a position of CHOICE.

Judging on her attitude, I'm sure she'd be totally zen with 'mature minded' people 'exploring' their sexuality. I mean, she's not allowed to say no to anything is she.

[Annasopinion]

Same here. I assume the coroner was able to fix the time of Elijah's death fairly precisely and determine that he had in fact drowned in the river, but initially I couldn't shake the idea that David had returned home to discover that Lauren had drowned Elijah in the bath, so he took Elijah to the river and tried to fake an accidental drowning/suicide attempt. I could see him thinking that 1)the girls needed Lauren more than they needed him, and 2) perhaps he'd not be charged with Elijah's death by reason of insanity.

WHAT?! Are you serious?!

Lauren did not drown Elijah in the bath and then have David come to her rescue. If you had followed Lauren and her blog you would have realised that David and Lauren were both clearly functioning under principles of extreme thinking in many areas of their life which was further compounded by the way they choose to express and live out their own faith doctrine. David jumped into the river with Elijah for reasons we can only speculate - mental collapse, psychosis, religious fervour - we just don't know because we weren't there. I have always suspected that it was a combination of psychosis merged with baptism renewal elements...but I don't know and either do you. But I am pretty confident that David would not 'save' anyone, least of all, Lauren.

As for thoughts on goading - I agree, they were playing mental games with each other. Actually many people do this, all the time, I really dislike the idea that anyone would twist the imbalance of their behaviour - which is evident from their blog posts at the time - into a death wish for their children. When you live in a reality of extreme thinking - there's very little room to for any other kind of thinking, which is why it usually ends on crisis or breakdown. Lauren and David were not psychotic baby makers hell bent on death and destruction, they just exacerbated already existing elements of extreme thinking in each other - which went unchecked, and culminated in crisis.

We all snark a lot about what Lauren does here, but I think even saying stuff, like that she may have drowned Elijah, is uncalled for and unnecessarily unkind.

[Annasopinion]

And it occurs to me from time to time that this forum is a great resource for her learn to be a better phony. She can see what areas might need further work.

We are definitely enablers, I have often thought this. Many of her posts have been responses to threads on this forum. Of course her 'followers' don't know this, but it's obvious and we're a block for her to sharpen her crazy on.

[Annasopinion]

Goody, now that I've left my job I don't feel so bad talking about zone family.

I was workng the day Elijah was killed. I worked for a certain emergency service. I worked in the area. A friend of mine did the body retrieval.

Let's just say that Lauren at no point gave a shit that her child was dead. Took ages to alert anyone. We all think it was planned. Sins of the father or that kind of nonsense. No crying. Who day was wierd and somewhat surreal.

Their house/backyard was a dump too.

How centrelink and child safety were not involved still astounds me.

I think Lauren and David are a whole heap of batshit crazy. But what you've said here is really scandalous. Ambulance workers aren't trained in psychiatric diagnosis. Child services were involved and she was investigated. Just because your friend thinks she was acting weird, means nothing. SHE IS WEIRD. That doesn't make her a murderer. You all think it was 'planned', but of course you have no proof. And now I'll tell you why you have no proof - because people instinctively hate difference and its the difference that makes you so uncomfortable that you have to create a narrative that works for you. If you knew anything about the religious doctrine they followed you'd know that 'sins of the father' is a line from a movie, not a reflection of any Christian's reality governing punishment. It's attitudes like yours that saw Lindy Chamberlain put away - ignorance, 'gut feelings' and wild assumptions.

If you know something, report it. If you don't have any evidence - and I'm certain you don't, then don't fabricate 'your friends' experience into meaning something when it means nothing.

I've had direct experience with ambulance workers at a crisis scene and I can tell you, they don't know shit. They're just the workers that collect the bodies. That's why we have CORONERS. And the coroner is satisfied with the events of that day, so any talk about possible murder plots should be BACKED UP by evidence or simply stopped.

[Black Aliss]

WHAT?! Are you serious?!

Lauren did not drown Elijah in the bath and then have David come to her rescue. If you had followed Lauren and her blog you would have realised that David and Lauren were both clearly functioning under principles of extreme thinking in many areas of their life which was further compounded by the way they choose to express and live out their own faith doctrine. David jumped into the river with Elijah for reasons we can only speculate - mental collapse, psychosis, religious fervour - we just don't know because we weren't there. I have always suspected that it was a combination of psychosis merged with baptism renewal elements...but I don't know and either do you. But I am pretty confident that David would not 'save' anyone, least of all, Lauren.

As for thoughts on goading - I agree, they were playing mental games with each other. Actually many people do this, all the time, I really dislike the idea that anyone would twist the imbalance of their behaviour - which is evident from their blog posts at the time - into a death wish for their children. When you live in a reality of extreme thinking - there's very little room to for any other kind of thinking, which is why it usually ends on crisis or breakdown. Lauren and David were not psychotic baby makers hell bent on death and destruction, they just exacerbated already existing elements of extreme thinking in each other - which went unchecked, and culminated in crisis.

We all snark a lot about what Lauren does here, but I think even saying stuff, like that she may have drowned Elijah, is uncalled for and unnecessarily unkind.

calm down. I said that was what I thought initially. I believe that the findings of the coroner are correct.

Moreover you don't know their individual states of mind or their collective state of mind any better than I do. You don't know whether they were just playing head games with each other orthat one of the other was psychotic. It seemed to me from Lauren's posts that she was suffering from postpartum depression, which can easily morph into postpartum psychosis, without her having an actual death wish for her child. Likewise, David came across as being really messed up. But I wasn't there. You weren't there. How people come across on the internet can be either better or worse than they really are.

[ViolaSebastian]

If a child is suspected of being dead before a "drowning", the medical examiner can take the liquid that's in the lungs and test it for bacteria and other organisms that live in pond water--obviously water from a bathtub will come up looking different under the microscope compared to water from a body of water. (I know this because an unfortunate case happened near me where the child was drowned in a bathtub, then later the parents faked a drowning in a nearby lake).

[Vex]

If a child is suspected of being dead before a "drowning", the medical examiner can take the liquid that's in the lungs and test it for bacteria and other organisms that live in pond water--obviously water from a bathtub will come up looking different under the microscope compared to water from a body of water. (I know this because an unfortunate case happened near me where the child was drowned in a bathtub, then later the parents faked a drowning in a nearby lake).

This is exactly right. Additionally, they would be able to tell if the injuries to Elijah's body (and there would have been injuries with a fall from that height) are pre- or postmortem, as well as looking for things like finger/nail marks, petechial hemorrhaging, bites to the tongue/inside of the mouth and other injuries that commonly occur when a person is forcefully drowned or suffocated.

But she wasn't saying that Lauren did drown Elijah, only that she initially suspected it. Anna, you really need to calm down. Ambulance workers are actually extremely skilled people (not in the area of psychiatry, nobody claimed that) and it's a pretty huge insult to say they're just employed to move bodies. I've had my life saved by them before.

Incidentally, nobody here is claiming they knew Lauren's state of mind, or that they're right. It's speculation. Gherkin was just reporting what their colleague said, they weren't claiming it was the gospel truth or that they had special insight. Just chill.

[August]

She is right, though, that Lindy Chamberlain was judged and framed as guilty because she didn't react the way people wanted her to.

[skankbiscuit]

I'm still at a loss at why these dads would want such a whack-job donating her DNA and giving birth to their kid. I mean, I'm sure she comes off as charming when she wants to, and I actually think she's gorgeous, but her blog is a public testament to how insane she is.

Is it just a looks thing? They thought she was pretty and redheaded and not fat and that's all that mattered?