Close Encounters of the Fundie Kind

[anniebgood]

I work for a utilities company. One of the guys who emails me the dispatch schedule adds a Bible verse reference (something like John 4:13) to the signature line of his emails. (His announcements re the schedule tend to be douchey and condescending.)

I SO MUCH WANT to start emailing him back with some random and meaningless Biblical verse (like Exodus 29:14).

Pick one, any one:

Parallel Verses

New International Version

But burn the bull's flesh and its hide and its intestines outside the camp. It is a sin offering.

New Living Translation

Then take the rest of the bull, including its hide, meat, and dung, and burn it outside the camp as a sin offering.

English Standard Version

But the flesh of the bull and its skin and its dung you shall burn with fire outside the camp; it is a sin offering.

New American Standard Bible

"But the flesh of the bull and its hide and its refuse, you shall burn with fire outside the camp; it is a sin offering.

King James Bible

But the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung, shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin offering.

Holman Christian Standard Bible

But burn up the bull's flesh, its hide, and its dung outside the camp; it is a sin offering."

International Standard Version

You are to burn the flesh of the bull, its hide, and its refuse with fire outside the camp. It is a sin offering.

NET Bible

But the meat of the bull, its skin, and its dung you are to burn up outside the camp. It is the purification offering.

GOD'S WORD® Translation

But burn the bull's meat, skin, and excrement outside the camp. It is an offering for sin.

Jubilee Bible 2000

But the flesh of the bullock and his skin and his dung shalt thou burn with fire outside the camp; it is sin.

King James 2000 Bible

But the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and its dung, shall you burn with fire outside the camp: it is a sin offering.

American King James Version

But the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung, shall you burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin offering.

American Standard Version

But the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and it dung, shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin-offering.

Douay-Rheims Bible

But the flesh of the calf and the hide and the dung, thou shalt burn abroad, without the camp, because it is for sin.

Darby Bible Translation

And the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and its dung, shalt thou burn with fire outside the camp: it is a sin-offering.

English Revised Version

But the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and its dung, shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin offering.

Webster's Bible Translation

But the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin-offering.

World English Bible

But the flesh of the bull, and its skin, and its dung, you shall burn with fire outside of the camp: it is a sin offering.

Young's Literal Translation

and the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung, thou dost burn with fire at the outside of the camp; it is a sin-offering.

[elsabee]

Pick one, any one:

Parallel Verses

New International Version

But burn the bull's flesh and its hide and its intestines outside the camp. It is a sin offering.

New Living Translation

Then take the rest of the bull, including its hide, meat, and dung, and burn it outside the camp as a sin offering.

English Standard Version

But the flesh of the bull and its skin and its dung you shall burn with fire outside the camp; it is a sin offering.

New American Standard Bible

"But the flesh of the bull and its hide and its refuse, you shall burn with fire outside the camp; it is a sin offering.

King James Bible

But the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung, shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin offering.

Holman Christian Standard Bible

But burn up the bull's flesh, its hide, and its dung outside the camp; it is a sin offering."

International Standard Version

You are to burn the flesh of the bull, its hide, and its refuse with fire outside the camp. It is a sin offering.

NET Bible

But the meat of the bull, its skin, and its dung you are to burn up outside the camp. It is the purification offering.

GOD'S WORD® Translation

But burn the bull's meat, skin, and excrement outside the camp. It is an offering for sin.

Jubilee Bible 2000

But the flesh of the bullock and his skin and his dung shalt thou burn with fire outside the camp; it is sin.

King James 2000 Bible

But the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and its dung, shall you burn with fire outside the camp: it is a sin offering.

American King James Version

But the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung, shall you burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin offering.

American Standard Version

But the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and it dung, shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin-offering.

Douay-Rheims Bible

But the flesh of the calf and the hide and the dung, thou shalt burn abroad, without the camp, because it is for sin.

Darby Bible Translation

And the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and its dung, shalt thou burn with fire outside the camp: it is a sin-offering.

English Revised Version

But the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and its dung, shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin offering.

Webster's Bible Translation

But the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin-offering.

World English Bible

But the flesh of the bull, and its skin, and its dung, you shall burn with fire outside of the camp: it is a sin offering.

Young's Literal Translation

and the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung, thou dost burn with fire at the outside of the camp; it is a sin-offering.

Please do it!!!

[shard1118]

On our journey to deliver my daughter to her new home in Chicago, we drove I-40 from Barstow to Oklahoma and then up 44 towards IL.

Anyway, we drove across the Panhandle of TX and stopped in Amarillo at a nice welcome center to pick up our free map and see what kind of stuff they had to give away. We got a brochure about The Cross at Groom.

http://www.crossministries.net

It's this huge cross that can be seen for miles and around it are the 13 stations of the cross, a representation of the Pieta and St Michael slaying the dragon. There is also an empty tomb with an angel praying as well as a replica of the Shroud of Turin.

It wasn't very busy, but a person there said that the previous Sunday (Easter) it was packed. Most of the people we saw were older but very respectful. I don't know if the fundies would stop since a heathen Catholic built it. My mom was really impressed and it was a topic on our way back to CA.

It's not your usual fundie sighting but it was pretty in your face Catholicism.

Not far from where I live, in Lewiston, NY you can find The National shrine to Our Lady of Fatima. As a child, anytime we visited Niagara Falls we had to stop at the shrine: http://www.fatimashrine.com/ Includes a giant rosary and a Basilica, gift shop etc...

[Hane]

Pick one, any one:

Parallel Verses

New International Version

But burn the bull's flesh and its hide and its intestines outside the camp. It is a sin offering.

New Living Translation

Then take the rest of the bull, including its hide, meat, and dung, and burn it outside the camp as a sin offering.

English Standard Version

But the flesh of the bull and its skin and its dung you shall burn with fire outside the camp; it is a sin offering.

New American Standard Bible

"But the flesh of the bull and its hide and its refuse, you shall burn with fire outside the camp; it is a sin offering.

King James Bible

But the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung, shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin offering.

Holman Christian Standard Bible

But burn up the bull's flesh, its hide, and its dung outside the camp; it is a sin offering."

International Standard Version

You are to burn the flesh of the bull, its hide, and its refuse with fire outside the camp. It is a sin offering.

NET Bible

But the meat of the bull, its skin, and its dung you are to burn up outside the camp. It is the purification offering.

GOD'S WORD® Translation

But burn the bull's meat, skin, and excrement outside the camp. It is an offering for sin.

Jubilee Bible 2000

But the flesh of the bullock and his skin and his dung shalt thou burn with fire outside the camp; it is sin.

King James 2000 Bible

But the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and its dung, shall you burn with fire outside the camp: it is a sin offering.

American King James Version

But the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung, shall you burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin offering.

American Standard Version

But the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and it dung, shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin-offering.

Douay-Rheims Bible

But the flesh of the calf and the hide and the dung, thou shalt burn abroad, without the camp, because it is for sin.

Darby Bible Translation

And the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and its dung, shalt thou burn with fire outside the camp: it is a sin-offering.

English Revised Version

But the flesh of the bullock, and its skin, and its dung, shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin offering.

Webster's Bible Translation

But the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung shalt thou burn with fire without the camp: it is a sin-offering.

World English Bible

But the flesh of the bull, and its skin, and its dung, you shall burn with fire outside of the camp: it is a sin offering.

Young's Literal Translation

and the flesh of the bullock, and his skin, and his dung, thou dost burn with fire at the outside of the camp; it is a sin-offering.

Truth in advertising: I chose Exodus 29:14 because I went into an online Bible site and did a search on the word "dung."

[Rescinded and Mended]

My fundie encounter is a little bit different (and lengthy).

Years ago in high school, there was a Mormon boy who had an interest in me. Sam was good-looking, but I had other things going on in my life and didn't really want a boyfriend at the moment. His family was very devout and conservative. They were heavily involved in the LDS church, and literally didn't do anything on Sundays in the interest of observing the Sabbath. Sometimes Sam would talk about his faith and how he was interested in dating me, but wanted "us" to remain pure for marriage. I think that was what ultimately drove me away - the implication that if we dated, we'd be courting by his standards. I was only 15! I began to distance myself from Sam after that.

I began seeing a different boy named Will. We were never serious (not even fooling around), but he was just fun to hang out with for awhile. He had some mental issues, but I never let them affect me in any way, and we stopped seeing each other when I moved to a different neighborhood.

So not long after all of this, my high school began a peer helper program. It was the sort of thing where you would go over to the middle school and mentor younger kids a couple of days a week, and then the club would do various volunteer activities for the community. I really wanted to get involved with this because a bunch of my friends were already involved and it sounded like a lot of fun. Strangely enough, my mother, who was in the grips of full-blown mental illness at this point in time, was having one of her "clear periods" and agreed to let me join the club. I was ecstatic - it was a great chance to get out of the house and hang out with people my own age.

The club met once a week to discuss its activities. As part of the agenda for that week, new members were taken into consideration. What I didn't know was that Sam was a member of the club. When my name came up for consideration, he told everyone I shouldn't be allowed to join because I'd been hanging around Will. He claimed that Will was a worthless character, and so was I by association. My name was crossed off the list, and I wasn't allowed to join the peer helpers club. I don't know to this day why any of my "friends" didn't stick up for me.

Not long after that, I ran into Sam. He was walking to class with a friend of his, and I just talked to the friend and pretended like he didn't even exist. Right before I walked away, I looked directly at him and shot him a glare so filled with loathing and hatred that he instantly understood that I knew what he'd done. The shocked look on his face said it all. After that, anytime I saw Sam, he always had this hangdog look on his face whenever I was in the room. He never apologized.

To this day, I don't know if he did it because of some fundie sense of male entitlement, or if he did it simply because sometimes kids do assholish things to each other. But I never forgave him for succeeding in cutting me off from something that would have done wonders for my self-esteem during a point in my life when I was so vulnerable and unhappy.

Thanks for letting me vent.

[Whoregasboard]

I work for a utilities company. One of the guys who emails me the dispatch schedule adds a Bible verse reference (something like John 4:13) to the signature line of his emails. (His announcements re the schedule tend to be douchey and condescending.)

I SO MUCH WANT to start emailing him back with some random and meaningless Biblical verse (like Exodus 29:14).

Ezekiel 23:19-20 is pretty much my favorite verse to add to things for people to look up later.

[Grimalkin]

I was speaking to a girl recently who grew up in what sounds like some kind of fundy/cult.

She sais there are believers all over the world and they have conferences ect but the church has no name! Anybody familiar with such a thing? This is what I learned.

1. Kids generally are public schooled.

2. Women wear long skirts and hair.

3. They don't celebrate Easter or Christmas

4. No t.v.

5. The preachers travel to homes and stay with families. Did not think to ask if they married or had homes of thier own.

6. Thier services are in homes.

7. They are the only ones that go to heavan.

8. Not sure I understood this bit when you die your soul does not go to heavan until the second coming, but not sure I am clear on that.

Anyone familiar with this?

"Hi, I'm new by the way"

[Rebelwife]

Ezekiel 23:19-20 is pretty much my favorite verse to add to things for people to look up later.

I'm partial to Genesis 9:21 myself. One day I'd love to put it on a posterboard and take it to a football game, just to compete with all the John 3:16 people who insist on doing that.

[Antimony]

I'm partial to Genesis 9:21 myself. One day I'd love to put it on a posterboard and take it to a football game, just to compete with all the John 3:16 people who insist on doing that.

Looked these up -- DYING. :lol: My friend was taking an old testament class and we would get drunk on wine in the evenings and he would read me passages very much like these.

---

My first really really fundie encounter was kind of strange. They were out next door neighbors when we moved to our new place (I was like 12). All three girls (no boys) were home schooled and they said they all had brittle bone disease but I, now, think that was an excuse by the mother to cover up some serious child abuse. They had a trampoline in their backyard. I just can't see allowing three girls under 12 all with brittle bone disease to have a trampoline. I saw them run and jump and tumble all the time, even saw one fall down a flight of stairs with no ill effects, but they were always hurt anyway and their father was terrifying. The wife swore he was a reborn follower of Christ who had cured his anger and temper and alcoholism problems through Jesus and all that. I was 12 then, but now it just seems fishy.

I got in a lot of trouble hanging out with them because I was being raised by atheists and my best friend's family was a group of practicing Wiccans and I wasn't really quiet about any of this. When their oldest daughter, T, would come hang out with me she would often run home and then my mom would get calls from hers about me being involved in the occult/goth/whatever. Of course, all their children were home schooled and they had no Cable and they could only read/watch pre-approved stuff. Harry Potter was a big no-no (glorified witchcraft) and they mostly liked Little House on the Prairie (I don't recall them talking about anything else). T once told me that I was going to hell because my parents were divorced and the mother's sin is passed through generations.

T eventually rebelled in a very violenty, scary way. She screamed a lot -- we could hear it. She also developed anorexia and started cutting. It was all very sad. Her parents sent her to a religious rehab thing for girls in Texas, and then later shipped her off to Isreal for a while. She eventually did go to college but I don't know what happened to her since then.

--

An earlier life encounter I had, well, I'm not sure they were fundies. I think they were just run of the mill Baptists. R was my best friend in elementary school and her mother didn't believe in birth control -- in fact, even kept having children after having a very, very, very scary stroke. They were really religious but tolerant (and actually meant it) and our families got along just fine for years. They moved to Japan for a military placement and we didn't see much of them but when R and I were both 15, R got pregnant with the child of a high school freshman soccer player. Her mother was so unsupportive and gave her so much religious crap about it that she got so stressed out she couldn't eat and ended up miscarrying because of it. Before the miscarriage, they moved the family from Illinois to Texas to assure that R could never see the father of her child again (they were in a young-and-in-love-type thing).

Unsurprisingly, this kind of extremism can end pretty sadly.

[ShadowyOne]

I was speaking to a girl recently who grew up in what sounds like some kind of fundy/cult.

She sais there are believers all over the world and they have conferences ect but the church has no name! Anybody familiar with such a thing? This is what I learned.

1. Kids generally are public schooled.

2. Women wear long skirts and hair.

3. They don't celebrate Easter or Christmas

4. No t.v.

5. The preachers travel to homes and stay with families. Did not think to ask if they married or had homes of thier own.

6. Thier services are in homes.

7. They are the only ones that go to heavan.

8. Not sure I understood this bit when you die your soul does not go to heavan until the second coming, but not sure I am clear on that.

Anyone familiar with this?

"Hi, I'm new by the way"

Welcome! From the no-name thing, and the itinerant preachers holding meetings in homes, it sounds like Two by Twos:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_by_Twos

I don't know a whole lot about their doctrine, though. There is a member here, I think called ex2x2 or something like that, you could ask her. I will edit if I can confirm her name.

ETA: This is what Ex 2x2 said in an AMA thread started by Angri-la about Two by Twos:

Ok so quick summary of the group...they are a church that meets in homes. They technically have no name. They NEVER refer to themselves as 2x2's. That's a name outsiders have given them. They refer to each other only as "the friends." Preachers are called "workers." The women are "Sister workers." (Yes, women in ministry! kinda surprising for a fundy group.) They are only wear dresses, don't cut their hair, no make up, no tv's, no radio, no movies. No marrying outsiders. They do send their kids to public schools though. To them, churches (of any kind) are worse than not going at all. (Because they have it all so wrong)

Angri-la's been gone awhile, but Ex 2x2 is still pretty active, I think. Hope that helps.

[for_the_Kitties]

I'm partial to Genesis 9:21 myself. One day I'd love to put it on a posterboard and take it to a football game, just to compete with all the John 3:16 people who insist on doing that.

These are awesome. I will have to remember them for the next time I meet a craycrayevangelicalfundie.

We should start a thread for the "best worst bible verses."

[Mitz_]

I have seen pictures of Bill Gothard and I always thought he looked so familiar but I could never think of who he looked like. Well , today I realised that there is a Gothard training center in my own town! I live in a small town near Guadalajara. I have read a few references to the Gothard training center in Guadalajara...but it is NOT in Guadalajara it is in San Juan Cosala, Jalisco, Mexico ... a huge mansion on a large lakefront property. Wow! Is it still being used by Gothard, I wonder? I am positive I have met him. This is a pretty small town and there are quite a few foreigners but I am sure I have met him.

I dont know much aboutt him or what he does except that the Duggars follow him. I guess I will start getting familiar with the FJ search function and see what I can find out. I see him mentioned a lot but i dont think I have seen any threads about his foreign missions.

[Grimalkin]

Shadowy one I believe you're correct! The woman I met left in her early twenties made lots of bad decisions, and moved back to her parents at age 24. She was trying to get her act together so we rented our condo to her for a crazy cheap rate. Sadly, she nosedived after about 6 months stopped paying rent, trashed the place and left without saying a word.

I still think about her. I know her parents care about her safety. They never shunned her so I think she has a chance.

[mockingbird]

OMG WHAT. My fundy FB friend IS APPLYING TO COLLEGE. Like, a REAL, accredited, public college. Seriously I think this is the end. I have known this girl for years on another board, and met her and her family IRL. They were very nice but seemed to disapprove of the fact that I said I was studying pre-med in college (the horrors!). We talked about religion a few times and just based on her blog/FB too they are/were pretty fundy light. She was one of a few teen girls on that board who were all planning to be SAHDs and maybe do something small like work as a volunteer EMT ala the Duggar kids. So far she's been doing part-time work at home since she graduated HS, but maybe she got tired of that. There have been a few other small changes like wearing pants more often buuuuuut dannngggg. I know they were aware of the Doug Phillips scandal, so maybe that set something off... anyway I'm excited for her and I think it's great that she is able to do this without having to break it off with her family.

(Trying not to get too detailed in case she were to find this and be creeped out, lol.)

[courtlylove]

I just saw the 'Gifted Gypsy' - the travelling home of the Sparkling One and her four daughters! It was in Mt Evelyn, Victoria (Australia) and if I hadn't been a) travelling in the opposite direction and b) heading to another work appointment, I would have followed it.

Edited because I can't count!

[for_the_Kitties]

I just saw the 'Gifted Gypsy' - the travelling home of the Sparkling One and her four daughters! It was in Mt Evelyn, Victoria (Australia) and if I hadn't been a) travelling in the opposite direction and b) heading to another work appointment, I would have followed it.

Edited because I can't count!

If only you followed them and provided us with tons of snark information! Think of the stories this could have led to!?!?!!!!11!!1!

I do worry ever so much for those kids... At least they are allowed to read and wear what they want.

[Luvmyskinnyjeanz]

These are awesome. I will have to remember them for the next time I meet a craycrayevangelicalfundie.

We should start a thread for the "best worst bible verses."

Matthew 25:41 or find a satanist to give you quotes and verses and add a note that if he is going to exercise his religious freedoms then so are you. Lol

[Coco]

Matthew 25:41 or find a satanist to give you quotes and verses and add a note that if he is going to exercise his religious freedoms then so are you. Lol

John 16:3 :lol:

[Coco]

I had a close encounter with someone that I guess goes to our local NFCIC home-church the other day... after struggling to put the kids in the car i got behind the wheel to notice a big passenger van parked right across from me with a lady in a frumper loading groceries. I don't know why, but it looked like her dress was hanging from a hula hoop for a belt lol Not to be mean, it just seemed like 5 yards of skirt. (I've sewn myself dresses like that myself so i can laugh about it. And tailoring is a rather difficult skill). I stared for a while trying to get up the nerve to go talk to her then noticed her really burly husband behind the wheel of their van glaring at ME! Freak out moment :lol: I got out of there... but the weirdest part was that she had a kind of self-conscious smile while she was loading bags. Just made me realize that all the time I thought I was being a shining light by looking different from everyone, I was just fooling myself and making other people feel sorry for me. Sad. Also, that people who looked "normal" like I do now aren't all bad... (I know that she was probably from the NCFIC because I've seen photos of their group online, just don't want to post it here to respect their privacy.)

ETA: The photo was a snapshot from a pot-providence meal in someone's house, so it seemed too invasive to post it, and i saw it like a year ago too on a library computer, probably can't find it again anyway. lol

[Flossie]

...after struggling to put the kids in the car i got behind the wheel to notice a big passenger van parked right across from me with a lady in a frumper loading groceries. I don't know why, but it looked like her dress was hanging from a hula hoop for a belt lol Not to be mean, it just seemed like 5 yards of skirt. (I've sewn myself dresses like that myself so i can laugh about it. And tailoring is a rather difficult skill). I stared for a while trying to get up the nerve to go talk to her then noticed her really burly husband behind the wheel of their van glaring at ME! Freak out moment :lol: I got out of there... but the weirdest part was that she had a kind of self-conscious smile while she was loading bags. Just made me realize that all the time I thought I was being a shining light by looking different from everyone, I was just fooling myself and making other people feel sorry for me. Sad. Also, that people who looked "normal" like I do now aren't all bad...

Regarding the bolded, I'm not sure what you mean. Are you saying that the lady in question was large, or that she was just wearing a shapeless dress? Because that statement could be taken in a couple of ways.

Regarding the italicized, while it's nice that the husband objected to your obvious interest in his wife, I wonder why he wasn't out there helping her load the groceries.

[Coco]

Sorry :) she wasn't large, i just meant it was shapeless. (Sewing without using a zipper is really difficult to make look good, i have lots of experience with making baggy clothes.) And i assumed the hubby would help her at home. They didn't seem grouchy, it just reminded me of when i was a fundie and thinking that i was being a witness for Christ but really just looking like a brainwashed cult member... really sad.

[lagenialester]

This weekend we went to the local Brat Fest as a family as a way to get out and enjoy some rides and the nice day, and I had more of a fundie...experience, than anything. We sat down to eat our picnic lunch in front of one of the many concert stages, just looking for a place that would be easy to park the stroller. We're eating for maybe thirty seconds when I look at my husband and say "...this is Jesus music".

Turns out the local Christian radio station had reserved the stage for "Life Fest" (really? That was the best name they could come up with?) and were hosting Christian musicians (there was some sort of family worship band going on) and giving out balloons to the kids that said "Life" on them. We quickly scarfed down our food and packed the kiddo back up before anyone noticed the man in the kippah.

So then I'm waiting for the hubs to come back from the bathroom and I've got the kid parked in the stroller. (I dress pretty typically for a MO Jew. Long dress, covered arms, don't cover my hair though) This guy comes up to me from a random vendor booth and asks if I'd like to enter a sweepstakes to win a home remodeling. After he presses me for a third time I politely say maybe my husband will when he comes back. (I'm a jerk with diversionary tactics...haha) So he starts telling me that my baby is adorable and "such a blessing". My fundie radar pings. I was on high alert after accidentally attending "Life Fest" anyway. Then I say "Oh yeah, she was my birthday present! Born on my birthday!" and he goes "Lord Jesus bless that day! What a blessed event. We are gracious in Him".

It was the biggest load of fundie speak I had ever heard. Thankfully my headship came back quickly after that, the guy saw his kippah and decided he would let us go on our way. (I was a little nervous that he would be MORE interested in us when he figured out we're Jews).

So I guess this festival has been leaning more toward the right over the past few years, but this year it sparked some controversy. Luckily for us, the only thing we paid for were a couple of rides and a donation to the Marines. I don't think we'll be back next year, we don't go for the food anyway. Such a weird thing to happen in such a liberal town.

[jerichojones]

I JUST HAD A FUNDIE ENCOUNTER!

I don't have too many here in Australia, but I got one! I was waiting for my bus to go to uni and a LDS guy came up to me and was trying to have a chat. I got really annoyed at first and then I realised yay fundie encounter and we ended up having a great conversation. He's on his mission from Idaho and we had a chat about that and his plans with the rest of his life (he doesn't want to court someone, but wants to date) and I think he was homeschooled because of the way he was talking about his education.

[Coconut Flan]

I went to do my monthly or thereabouts shopping trip at the store near a mosque. I must have picked the right day - chadors galore. Plus about double that number with hijab and full length tops and skirts. Then I needed to make a stop at a store near the fundie church. All the ankle length denim one could want and long sleeved sweaters as the we neared 80 degrees outside.

[MamaJunebug]

A close encounter .... with family.

I can't give many details because it would be fairly easy for those in the community to identify this person.

Suffice it to say I was heartbroken. "Should homosexuals live a life of celibacy? Yes. Will it be difficult? Yes. Is it what God wants? Yes."

Stupid, I wanted to growl, it's "chastity," not "celibacy." Celibacy means living alone. Chastity means living without sexual intercourse.

"God hates divorce! God doesn't hate many things, but He hates divorce!"

All that said in the presence of someone we both dearly love, who is now married but that's after, yes ma'am, a divorce. Shut up, I wanted to say very clearly.

And since my relative insisted on giving the pre-meal prayer, a half-minute extravaganza complete with several reps of "Father, we just ...." and "Bless us here in Your covenantal goodness....." before we left, I offered to say an ending prayer. And in 8 seconds or less (not that I was timing it then, but I just did), I said, "In gratefulness for your Son, our Savior, and for bringing us together tonight, we pray, o give thanks unto the Lord, for He is good, and His mercy endureth forever, Amen." The tried-&-true Lutheran table prayer, usually said after we'd consumed mass quantities and before we all got up and cleared away the dishes.

That wasn't enough for my relative. "Ah yes!" said in a nice, loud, hear-it-at-the-next-table voice. "And I know the melody to that, too! A fine song. Straight from the Bible."

Because, you know, I'm not ordained, so it wasn't really enough that mere me spoke a blessingI And it wasn't "from my heart," which is much to be preferred as prayers go, because, y'know, to just repeat something from the Bible is, well, not from your heart.

The Lord's Prayer notwithstanding.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I comfort myself that this person is now extreme, it's coupled with living a sane and sober life ... along with being ... extreme.

Also that we all won't be getting together for another year, unless somebody dies. And as I'm the oldest, it's most likely to be my memorial, and if so, I won't be there, will I?!!!!! :shifty:

And le sigh. Also, ETA, not to be tacky, but this relative isn't Lutheran and never was. I just gotta protect the rep of the ole home team. :whistle: