Meet Hellena and Currawong

[OkToBeTakei]

Why she does skateboard, she knit herself a new long board just last week, there was a bit of tension when she was attaching the trucks but she did manage the task quite well.

I have derailed the 'itisnotaboutlifeitisaboutthefuckingfaerisnotethespellingbeatonewithyourumbilicusihavetogonowcrypleaseineedtofeelthat-inmyspecial placeithink'

Mossfart rocks.Nuff said

[rock_girl]

I've been lurking here for a while (found the place while trying to figure out how to tell the Duggar girls apart; when they're all crunchy curled it's difficult to know which is which) and had to join to post about this woman. What really amazed me about her troll post was the omission of the Charlotte Dawson incident. It was all over the media for a few days last week, coinciding neatly with the time of the butthurt posting. A media personality who preferred to out her trolls rather than just ignoring them - I think it was a great strategy and spotlighted the abuse prominent women receive pretty much daily online - was targeted by a few psychos who told her to die, sent her pictures of cadavers, mocked her childfree status, you know the usual arsehole limp dick loser troll stuff. At any rate, she ended up making an attempt on her life (am assuming underlying mental health issues were at play) and took the unfortunate step of publicising it. Instead of referencing this woman's pretty horrific experience Hellena chose to talk about Janet Fraser's 'bullying' by the coroner. How is a coronial inquest in any way bullying? It's standard legal procedure. I'm not sure if she lives in ignorance of what goes on in the outside world or dismissed CD's experience because the woman's chosen not to have children and believes in regular shampooing, but it just seemed very strange to claim persecution and not reference a very high profile and current case of online bullying.

Also, am I the only one who had a laugh at Hellena's making out that her time on irc was somehow groundbreaking? One of the books she mentions was published in '94 and the other in '95 so I assume that, given Australia's woeful access to new release books, films, music and fun generally prior to the golden age of internet shopping, neither of them made it to her bedside table until at least six months to a year after publishing. So if 'in the beginning' refers to her internet experience (at least I hope she's not trying to convince us that the 'net came about in the mid nineties) then she got online at the same time as a lot of people her age. So instead of going out to the pub, getting pissed, eating a kebab and then falling asleep in her own vomit she was on irc. Fair enough. I think we've all gone through a period of social awkwardness. Most of us didn't use it as an excuse to jump into channels, chuck out a bunch of word vomit before being kicked and then pat ourselves on the back because we were doing so in the company of similarly inclined social misfits. Why would anyone want to mention this period in a piece dedicated to their own abuse from trolls? It's basically an admission that her best years were spent hunched over a computer cackling over the latest kick from an irc channel. Isn't that the definition of troll behaviour?

[OkToBeTakei]

I've been lurking here for a while (found the place while trying to figure out how to tell the Duggar girls apart; when they're all crunchy curled it's difficult to know which is which) and had to join to post about this woman. What really amazed me about her troll post was the omission of the Charlotte Dawson incident. It was all over the media for a few days last week, coinciding neatly with the time of the butthurt posting. A media personality who preferred to out her trolls rather than just ignoring them - I think it was a great strategy and spotlighted the abuse prominent women receive pretty much daily online - was targeted by a few psychos who told her to die, sent her pictures of cadavers, mocked her childfree status, you know the usual arsehole limp dick loser troll stuff. At any rate, she ended up making an attempt on her life (am assuming underlying mental health issues were at play) and took the unfortunate step of publicising it. Instead of referencing this woman's pretty horrific experience Hellena chose to talk about Janet Fraser's 'bullying' by the coroner. How is a coronial inquest in any way bullying? It's standard legal procedure. I'm not sure if she lives in ignorance of what goes on in the outside world or dismissed CD's experience because the woman's chosen not to have children and believes in regular shampooing, but it just seemed very strange to claim persecution and not reference a very high profile and current case of online bullying.

Also, am I the only one who had a laugh at Hellena's making out that her time on irc was somehow groundbreaking? One of the books she mentions was published in '94 and the other in '95 so I assume that, given Australia's woeful access to new release books, films, music and fun generally prior to the golden age of internet shopping, neither of them made it to her bedside table until at least six months to a year after publishing. So if 'in the beginning' refers to her internet experience (at least I hope she's not trying to convince us that the 'net came about in the mid nineties) then she got online at the same time as a lot of people her age. So instead of going out to the pub, getting pissed, eating a kebab and then falling asleep in her own vomit she was on irc. Fair enough. I think we've all gone through a period of social awkwardness. Most of us didn't use it as an excuse to jump into channels, chuck out a bunch of word vomit before being kicked and then pat ourselves on the back because we were doing so in the company of similarly inclined social misfits. Why would anyone want to mention this period in a piece dedicated to their own abuse from trolls? It's basically an admission that her best years were spent hunched over a computer cackling over the latest kick from an irc channel. Isn't that the definition of troll behaviour?

You sound a bit bitter. I suspect you have not had raw umbilical sex. You need to crochet more. Interesting post though.

[rock_girl]

My lady parts tense up just thinking about sex during labour. Possibly I should take to braying at the full moon while wrapped in an overpriced, lice ridden, crocheted mess of failed dreams in order to truly become one with the universe. Only then will I find the poorly groomed manchild of my dreams and engage in the liberation that is raw umbilical sex.

[Arete]

My lady parts tense up just thinking about sex during labour. Possibly I should take to braying at the full moon while wrapped in an overpriced, lice ridden, crocheted mess of failed dreams in order to truly become one with the universe. Only then will I find the poorly groomed manchild of my dreams and engage in the liberation that is raw umbilical sex.

Will you post it on Youtube? Please? Welcome. ;)

[Funky Chicken]

Isn't Currawong bad enough on its own? I don't see any reason to make it worse.

Leaving his name as it is insults the noble bird, who doesn't deserve the existence of such a travesty.

[LadyBlue]

THIS.

My immunized children caught a mild bout of whooping cough this year. Mild. But still horrible and scary and they were obviously suffering for a few weeks, even under a doctors care and with the best of modern medicine. All of which is available to Hellena, we live in the same state, but of course she chooses to see her children's severe illness as a catalyst for family bonding, not the life threatening emergency it must have been for the babies and toddlers.

When I asked the doctor why my kids had contracted an illness they were vaccinated against, she told me that due to families increasingly choosing not to immunize we no longer have complete group immunity to many illnesses, and even immunized children can catch them, although they usually have an easier time of it with less intense symptoms than non vaccinated children.

So I have a personal reason to be mad at non vaccinating lunatic hippies, although she seems to keep her brood away from schools and doctors surgeries, which is a small mercy.

Actually, the CDC has been forced to admit (as of July) that the current outbreaks of whopping cough have NOTHING to do with people not vaccinating. They've realized the vaccine lasts far less time than they thought (a mere 3 years as near as they can determine) and there are now mutated strains, at least in part, possibly entirely, due to the vaccine, which it does not protect against. Vaccination rates for *mandated* vaccines are actually at record high levels. In addition, the vaccine is one which does not, and never has, prevented transmission of the disease (get a hold of the manufacturer's insert and you'll see it right there). They believe it decreases severity, which they believe will decrease transmission by less coughing, but can also increase transmission because people think they just have a cold and go out where they can spread it.

You might also be interested/horrified to learn there is no medical treatment for whooping cough. The antibiotics are to attempt to stop it from spreading, although they are usually given too late to be effective since it takes awhile to realize it isn't a cold, but they do not deal with the effects of the disease. From a 2007 Cochrane review

Although antibiotics were effective in eliminating pertussis,they did not alter the subsequent clinical course of the illness.There is insufficient evidence to determine the benefit of prophylactic treatment of pertussis contacts.

Hellena, if you're reading this, I've had outside the norm births too, but you really, really went off the Cliffs on Insanity with your twins' birth. Seriously. Get some education and get a grip on reality or don't have more kids. You got extraordinarily lucky. It might not happen twice.

[lilith]

Actually, the CDC has been forced to admit (as of July) that the current outbreaks of whopping cough have NOTHING to do with people not vaccinating. They've realized the vaccine lasts far less time than they thought (a mere 3 years as near as they can determine) and there are now mutated strains, at least in part, possibly entirely, due to the vaccine, which it does not protect against. Vaccination rates for *mandated* vaccines are actually at record high levels. In addition, the vaccine is one which does not, and never has, prevented transmission of the disease (get a hold of the manufacturer's insert and you'll see it right there). They believe it decreases severity, which they believe will decrease transmission by less coughing, but can also increase transmission because people think they just have a cold and go out where they can spread it.

You might also be interested/horrified to learn there is no medical treatment for whooping cough. The antibiotics are to attempt to stop it from spreading, although they are usually given too late to be effective since it takes awhile to realize it isn't a cold, but they do not deal with the effects of the disease. From a 2007 Cochrane review

Hellena, if you're reading this, I've had outside the norm births too, but you really, really went off the Cliffs on Insanity with your twins' birth. Seriously. Get some education and get a grip on reality or don't have more kids. You got extraordinarily lucky. It might not happen twice.

I'm not knowledgable enough about vaccines to address the issues you have raised. I am simply going off what my doctor has told me.

As far as treatment goes - the antibiotics may be of limited use, and I really wasn't keen on giving them to my kids, but their school insisted they have a course before they could go back to school.

Medicines such as rycodeine for their coughs and nurofen for their aches and fevers, however, did a lot to help them stay comfortable while they were ill. I can't imagine how horrible children would feel without any treatment of symptoms. For generations women have watched their children suffer and wished for a way to relieve that suffering. We now have ways to do so, and parents such as Hellena choose not to utilise them and simply allow their children to suffer. I find that incomprehensible, as I'm sure the generations of parents who didn't have the options of medical care we do would.

[eeemkaaayy]

I feel like I'm derailing here, but how on earth do people like Hellena and Currawong and other unschoolers not get their kids taken away by social services? I know if I was there neighbor I would have reported them until something was done.

[terranova]

I feel like I'm derailing here, but how on earth do people like Hellena and Currawong and other unschoolers not get their kids taken away by social services? I know if I was there neighbor I would have reported them until something was done.

Unschooling is a pretty broad term. I unschooled from age 11 and my life was nothing like theirs. I wish 2 things would happen - People like H&C would stop giving unschoolers a bad name, and that people would realise that not all unschoolers are automatically abusing their children.

[Chavymishmacoy]

Wow apparently dear, dear Sweet gentle Hellena has inspired and touched the lives of others and inspired them to breed more feral children and even homeschool, with her blog that drips with authentic wisdom!

[Guest Anonymous]

Wow apparently dear, dear Sweet gentle Hellena has inspired and touched the lives of others and inspired them to breed more feral children and even homeschool, with her blog that drips with authentic wisdom!

It's dripping with something ... far more likely to be raw umbilical cord sex leavings than wisdom, though.

[eeemkaaayy]

Unschooling is a pretty broad term. I unschooled from age 11 and my life was nothing like theirs. I wish 2 things would happen - People like H&C would stop giving unschoolers a bad name, and that people would realise that not all unschoolers are automatically abusing their children.

Ah, okay. My bad. Care to share what unschooled is supposed to be about vs the unschooling that we all here about?

[Witsec7]

Ah, okay. My bad. Care to share what unschooled is supposed to be about vs the unschooling that we all here about?

It's the same shit public school parents do when their kids are out of school except structured unschoolers do have some kind of a plan. For instance let's say you have a DIY project of tiling the bathroom floor, turn it into a geometry and algebra lesson with the kiddettes in attendance, or you're doing a projected budget for expenses, savings and income. Same shit. Naturally for Hellitrix and Curradong their lives don't include a DYI project besides where should we hang mom's linty mammalian fiber art or dad needs to stretch a new drum head for his djembe where can we lift some dental floss? Or more likely what is dental floss?

[eeemkaaayy]

It's the same shit public school parents do when their kids are out of school except structured unschoolers do have some kind of a plan. For instance let's say you have a DIY project of tiling the bathroom floor, turn it into a geometry and algebra lesson with the kiddettes in attendance, or you're doing a projected budget for expenses, savings and income. Same shit. Naturally for Hellitrix and Curradong their lives don't include a DYI project besides where should we hang mom's linty mammalian fiber art or dad needs to stretch a new drum head for his djembe where can we lift some dental floss? Or more likely what is dental floss?

So it's exactly the type of stuff that I hated as a kid (still do). Man, H and C make unschooling look really bad. They're just so...ugh. I thought we were supposed to be an intelligent race. :lol:

[Wolfie]

Actually, the CDC has been forced to admit (as of July) that the current outbreaks of whopping cough have NOTHING to do with people not vaccinating. They've realized the vaccine lasts far less time than they thought (a mere 3 years as near as they can determine) and there are now mutated strains, at least in part, possibly entirely, due to the vaccine, which it does not protect against. Vaccination rates for *mandated* vaccines are actually at record high levels. In addition, the vaccine is one which does not, and never has, prevented transmission of the disease (get a hold of the manufacturer's insert and you'll see it right there). They believe it decreases severity, which they believe will decrease transmission by less coughing, but can also increase transmission because people think they just have a cold and go out where they can spread it.

Can you give us some documentation about this, as I live in a county with a very high rate of whooping cough and record low levels of immunization.

[Wolfie]

As I was driving home from my parents' tonight and watching the traffic going the other way, I saw lots of vehicles coming back from Burning Man. What struck me as interesting is that it is a hippie festival, yet the type of hippie that tends to go there are the kind that come home to jobs after their week on the playa. They aren't messing up their kids, or living off the government. Types like Hellena and Currawong, and Lauren could learn from them.

I know several people who do go, or have gone to Burning Man, they range from contstruction, food industry, professionals and even a trapeze artist. The thing that they have is that they have goals and fulfillment. I don't understand how you can get fullfillment from being lazy and doing whatever, while the government pays your way.

[Witsec7]

As I was driving home from my parents' tonight and watching the traffic going the other way, I saw lots of vehicles coming back from Burning Man. What struck me as interesting is that it is a hippie festival, yet the type of hippie that tends to go there are the kind that come home to jobs after their week on the playa. They aren't messing up their kids, or living off the government. Types like Hellena and Currawong, and Lauren could learn from them.

I know several people who do go, or have gone to Burning Man, they range from contstruction, food industry, professionals and even a trapeze artist. The thing that they have is that they have goals and fulfillment. I don't understand how you can get fullfillment from being lazy and doing whatever, while the government pays your way.

I used my vacation or leave time when we wanted to hop in the bus and go on GD tour. We'd make enough peddling baubles and oranges to hippies to cover our expenses and always do a couple of days at a nice resort hotel on our dime.

riffle

[terranova]

Ah, okay. My bad. Care to share what unschooled is supposed to be about vs the unschooling that we all here about?

Not a problem :) There are many misconceptions out there about unschoolers.

Like experienedd said, it's about taking your daily life and using it to give your child an education. It's also a lot about listening to your child and finding out what drives them and helping them to learn what they want to learn. We travelled a lot as kids, spent 7 months in an rv in the US. If we were in the southwest we learned about the Mexican/Spanish history of the area, learned some Spanish, studied geology in the mountains, learned about the atomic programe in New Mexico and on. In the PacNW it was foresty, Native American tribes, Lewis and Clarke, Sacijawea (sp?), volcanos, flora and fauna in the state Parks, in the south it was civil rights, the civil war, hurricanes, we stayed with friends on the bayou in LA and ate local food and on and on. Each day we calculate milage, distance, cost of fuel, we learned why different products cost different prices in different areas, we met people from many different cultures and back grounds.

When we came home my sister was interested in gardening, animals, the Japanese culture and drawing, so my mother got her a Japanese tutor, she learned caligraphy, planted a garden, worked at the SPCA and took art classes. From her interest in animals and gardening, she went on to study natural nutrition and graduated top of her class. She is now studying to be a massage therapist in Australia and is also currently top of her class.

My interests lay more in books and reading the outdoors and nannying. I worked at the local library, wrote, took creative writing classes, worked at a daycare (and decided it wasn't for me), went on lots of tramps, planted trees, did conservation work with the government, and eventually, 20 years later, am working in an indie bookshop and raising a child. :) My parents helped facilitate my learning and gave me an amazing education.

Do you see the difference between unschoolers and H&C?

Unschoolers generally don't follow a curriculum like homeschoolers do, but still believe strongly in getting the best education for their children. From what I've seen of H&C, they're just lazy parents. Nothing like the unschooling parents I know.

[Miss T]

Hello,

I'm de-lurking to share this: janetfraser.id.au/blog/2012/09/04/guest-post-birth-sex-and-death-hellena-post/ (I hope I've deactivated the link properly). Apparently my love of sunglasses and handbags means that I actually want to replace my placenta with some other precious object attached to me on a string.

I have been a bemused and concerned reader of Hellena for a while via various birth blogs. I'm really glad if she has been led to do some honest self-analysis using external opinions and critique.

[rock_girl]

No one can engage in self-analysis when they're such far gone narcissists. Here's a woman lacking in just about every social grace and advantage the middle classes embrace, for no reason other than that's how she's chosen to exist. Hellena's convinced herself that birth is more than it is in a desperate attempt to bring meaning to what is an otherwise dull, useless life. Without birth and its ~*~magic~*~ (and really, why wouldn't her children attach significance to birthing and their gestations when their mother no doubt prattles on about it at every opportunity) she's just another filthy, helpless leech counting down the days until the next round of FTB bonuses.

That essay is a mishmash of incorrect musings about culture and anthropology. If Hellena was a first year student she'd be failed and directed to appropriate support, both academic and psychological. Of course she'll never be a first year even though education is available free of upfront charges here. Even though you can take a relatively easy test and be guaranteed entry to several universities with minimal standards. Even though more and more universities are making it possible to do courses entirely online. Even though all unis have departments dedicated to ensuring mature and disadvantaged students are both helped to apply and supported once in study. God forbid Hellena admit her ignorance and try to better herself and her family's future by studying these subjects in which she claims a great and scholarly interest.

And Janet Fraser is hosting that homage to ignorance and mediocrity. Nothing says reasonable and balanced support like aligning yourself with a woman who promotes dangerous birth practice and preferred to see her child die than admit that labour wasn't progressing well.

[Miss T]

No one can engage in self-analysis when they're such far gone narcissists. Here's a woman lacking in just about every social grace and advantage the middle classes embrace, for no reason other than that's how she's chosen to exist. Hellena's convinced herself that birth is more than it is in a desperate attempt to bring meaning to what is an otherwise dull, useless life. Without birth and its ~*~magic~*~ (and really, why wouldn't her children attach significance to birthing and their gestations when their mother no doubt prattles on about it at every opportunity) she's just another filthy, helpless leech counting down the days until the next round of FTB bonuses.

That essay is a mishmash of incorrect musings about culture and anthropology. If Hellena was a first year student she'd be failed and directed to appropriate support, both academic and psychological. Of course she'll never be a first year even though education is available free of upfront charges here. Even though you can take a relatively easy test and be guaranteed entry to several universities with minimal standards. Even though more and more universities are making it possible to do courses entirely online. Even though all unis have departments dedicated to ensuring mature and disadvantaged students are both helped to apply and supported once in study. God forbid Hellena admit her ignorance and try to better herself and her family's future by studying these subjects in which she claims a great and scholarly interest.

And Janet Fraser is hosting that homage to ignorance and mediocrity. Nothing says reasonable and balanced support like aligning yourself with a woman who promotes dangerous birth practice and preferred to see her child die than admit that labour wasn't progressing well.

I think my original comment wasn't clear. I didn't mean that the piece on the Janet Fraser site was demonstrating any self-analysis at all; I was referring (and should have been more explicit) to a comment made some pages back by a FB friend of Hellena's who said that Hellena had posted something to the effect that some of the attention she was receiving highlighted things she had doubts about deep down. I would certainly never think that any of her written work reflected anything but a complete lack of academic discipline (and I say this having recently re-read my own, long-ago first year Arts student essay drivel!)!

[rock_girl]

I think my original comment wasn't clear. I didn't mean that the piece on the Janet Fraser site was demonstrating any self-analysis at all; I was referring (and should have been more explicit) to a comment made some pages back by a FB friend of Hellena's who said that Hellena had posted something to the effect that some of the attention she was receiving highlighted things she had doubts about deep down. I would certainly never think that any of her written work reflected anything but a complete lack of academic discipline (and I say this having recently re-read my own, long-ago first year Arts student essay drivel!)!

Lol, no problem. I think I was just having a good old rant at some Hellena-like relatives (complete with Janet Fraser worship). It would be nice to think that Hellena really is willing to examine her own issues but I'm sceptical; people like her seem completely incapable of acknowledging and learning from their mistakes.

[Miss T]

Lol, no problem. I think I was just having a good old rant at some Hellena-like relatives (complete with Janet Fraser worship). It would be nice to think that Hellena really is willing to examine her own issues but I'm sceptical; people like her seem completely incapable of acknowledging and learning from their mistakes.

I know the feeling!

But, y'know, I'm going to be giving birth* for the first time in a little while, so once my magick earth-vagina-sex-death-goddess power is revealed to me, I'll know that she was so right all along.

*have already broached the raw sex possibilities with my co-procreator. He's up for it.

[eeemkaaayy]

Not a problem :) There are many misconceptions out there about unschoolers.

Like experienedd said, it's about taking your daily life and using it to give your child an education. It's also a lot about listening to your child and finding out what drives them and helping them to learn what they want to learn. We travelled a lot as kids, spent 7 months in an rv in the US. If we were in the southwest we learned about the Mexican/Spanish history of the area, learned some Spanish, studied geology in the mountains, learned about the atomic programe in New Mexico and on. In the PacNW it was foresty, Native American tribes, Lewis and Clarke, Sacijawea (sp?), volcanos, flora and fauna in the state Parks, in the south it was civil rights, the civil war, hurricanes, we stayed with friends on the bayou in LA and ate local food and on and on. Each day we calculate milage, distance, cost of fuel, we learned why different products cost different prices in different areas, we met people from many different cultures and back grounds.

When we came home my sister was interested in gardening, animals, the Japanese culture and drawing, so my mother got her a Japanese tutor, she learned caligraphy, planted a garden, worked at the SPCA and took art classes. From her interest in animals and gardening, she went on to study natural nutrition and graduated top of her class. She is now studying to be a massage therapist in Australia and is also currently top of her class.

My interests lay more in books and reading the outdoors and nannying. I worked at the local library, wrote, took creative writing classes, worked at a daycare (and decided it wasn't for me), went on lots of tramps, planted trees, did conservation work with the government, and eventually, 20 years later, am working in an indie bookshop and raising a child. :) My parents helped facilitate my learning and gave me an amazing education.

Do you see the difference between unschoolers and H&C?

Unschoolers generally don't follow a curriculum like homeschoolers do, but still believe strongly in getting the best education for their children. From what I've seen of H&C, they're just lazy parents. Nothing like the unschooling parents I know.

Wow, that's nothing like what H and C are doing. I can see why you would enjoy that, it's so much better sounding than the 7 to 3 school days we have. I'd much rather do that or go to one of those specialized schools instead of normal high school.