Oh yeah, Lina's pregnant...

[onlyorganic]

My snarky mother used to say "I don't get why some people think their genes are just so great they have to have a ton of kids." Lina's on God's mission. Stay at home and light candles, homeschool, and "like" organizations she hasn't fully-researched. In my book, AIDS denialism is as ignorant as racism. AIDS denialism going in the same boat with being pro-breast-feeding and being anti-circumcision is apples and oranges. I honestly believe people read the article thinking "YEAH! No vaccines! Keep your medicines out of my families' tummies." But, to be honest, not doing absolutely everything in your power to ensure that your kid doesn't get a virus is just being a good parent. If you don't let your kid get fluoride at the dentist that is completely small potatoes in comparison with doing everything to make sure they don't get "suspected HIV" from you. Okay, I'm heated... just this picture makes me sick

sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/christine-maggiore-and-eliza-jane-scovill-living-and-dying-with-hivaids-denialism/

You can see the family on the cover of the magazine with the "no AZT" belly.

ETA: Edited because I was just being too mean, ya know? And then I fixed a riffle.

[MonkeyMomma]

MonkeyMomma already answered this, but watch me go on a little rant anyway:

Christine Maggiore. Breastfed her baby while HIV+ despite medical advice (also assuming she didn't take the drugs that reduce HIV transmission to baby during pregnancy and birth.) Kid died of a type of pneumonia that basically only people w. AIDS ever get, but nooooo, it wasn't AIDS! She didn't give her kids AIDS! Then Christine ALSO died of an illness NOBODY in America gets today UNLESS they have AIDS, but again, noooo, it wasn't AIDS you guys, she was just super stressed out by how MEAN the AIDS advocates were being to her!

And on South Africa: I believe it was the TAC http://www.tac.org.za/community/ who said that charges of genocide should have been brought against Mbeki and Tshabalala-Msimang. I'm inclined to agree. Those idiots illegally suppressed the truth against tidal waves of evidence and allowed for so much idiocy that hundreds of thousands of people were misled, and suffered, and died. I have no patience for denialism. The evidence for the most basic facts (HIV exists, it causes AIDS, AIDS compounded by poverty has an entirely different appearance to poverty alone, the antiretrovirals can have side-effects but NOT side-effects that mirror AIDS effects, and people with advanced AIDS improve their condition when put on them, antiretrovirals are generally the best treatment, no, eating garlic won't heal you you fucking idiot) is overwhelming and undeniable.

Rant on! It's unconscionable to me that she would do that, then promote it.

[ilovetchotchkes]

Chiming in to say that I think toilet paper is a wonderful invention, and I bless the person who thought of it. Sorry, but I think family cloth is all kinds of yuck.

We cloth diaper, I have in a moment of desperation and "omg we are out of tp and I just took a shit" used a prefold to wipe.

Not somethin id do every day, but I figured, it was already getting washed with a bunch of shitty diapers...

[Sinister Rouge]

We cloth diaper, I have in a moment of desperation and "omg we are out of tp and I just took a shit" used a prefold to wipe.

Not somethin id do every day, but I figured, it was already getting washed with a bunch of shitty diapers...

Hey, poop is poop. Thing is, you didn't save a bunch in a bucket beside your toilet until you had a big enough load (no pun intended ;) ) to justify a wash.

I tried 'mama cloth' but couldn't stand to save them up to wash them, totally icked me out, and I wasn't going to wash them one at a time with their 'special mama cloth detergent!!' in their 'special mama cloth mesh bag!!' Sea sponge tampons are where it's at, ladies.

[ilovetchotchkes]

Hey, poop is poop. Thing is, you didn't save a bunch in a bucket beside your toilet until you had a big enough load (no pun intended ;) ) to justify a wash.

I tried 'mama cloth' but couldn't stand to save them up to wash them, totally icked me out, and I wasn't going to wash them one at a time with their 'special mama cloth detergent!!' in their 'special mama cloth mesh bag!!' Sea sponge tampons are where it's at, ladies.

See I do mama cloth because I'm allergic to the alternative. I'm looking ino a diva cup though. I wash mine w the cloth diapers that get washed every other day.

[Sinister Rouge]

See I do mama cloth because I'm allergic to the alternative. I'm looking ino a diva cup though. I wash mine w the cloth diapers that get washed every other day.

Yeah, I can see how that works well, and that was my plan, until my daughter started using the potty at 18 months old - about a month after I bought a whole set from GladRags. Go figure, eh? There's nothing wrong with them, I just can't stand to have them sitting around now that I'm not regularly washing dipes any more.

[2xx1xy1JD]

Ok, I might be showing my ignorance here, so sorry if this is a bit of a dumb question. :oops:

I thought that being an Ashkenazi or Sephardic Jew was a cultural or ethnic identity rather than religious. Is this correct? What are the major differences in religious and cultural practice?

And how can Lina and TT "choose" to be Sephardic?

I recently found out I have Russian Ashkenazi ancestors so I'm especially interested...

It's a great question!

In Judaism, there was a geographical split between the Ashkenazi and Sephardic communities, broadly speaking. There were also smaller geographical groups and sub-groups.

Now, Judaism is a religion with a big emphasis on laws and rules for daily living. Over time, these laws get interpreted in decisions by rabbis, much like American court develop law as they hand down decisions. Eventually, due to the geographic split, you would have Ashkenazi Jews following one decision, while Sephardic Jews would follow another. For example, there are different rules on the fine details of separating milk and meat. There is also the idea that some customs ("minhagim") can become so strong and established that they become religiously binding. Again, geographic split meant that different customs would arise in different communities. My favorite example is that Ashkenazi Jews will be very precise in cutting the challah bread on Friday nights, while Mizrachi Jews will just tear off chunks by hand and throw it at dinner guests - I think we've shocked some guests with what looks like a food fight! You would also have rabbinic degrees that would be made in one community, that wouldn't affect another. Polygamy, for example, was only banned for Ashkenazi Jews (although the State of Israel doesn't allow it for any Jew, so the practice is effectively dead).

While I may be a proud feminist, I happily followed the guidelines that says that a wife should follow the ways of her husband's community, since Iraqi Jews have MUCH easier rules for Passover (like being allowed to eat rice, beans, mustard, corn and canola oil).

[emmiedahl]

Iraq? Is that Mizrachi or Sephardi?

My family is Mizrachi and I have never met another Mizrachi Jew outside of my own family. I am told there are areas where we are more common. Unfortunately, most Mizrachi Jews historically have lived in areas where it is open hunting season on them, so we have not grown in population as fast as other Jewish populations.

[2xx1xy1JD]

Oh my:

Unfortunately, that's only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to the blood on Mbeki's hands. Thanks to extreme denial of the HIV/AIDS link, lack of treatment and lack of any effective programs for prevention, AIDS exploded in South Africa to the extent that over 10% of the total population over age 2 is HIV positive (and around 30% of women seen for prenatal care are HIV+). South Africa has experienced MILLIONS of preventable deaths from AIDS, and MILLIONS of children have been orphaned.

http://www.economist.com/node/999045

If you want to cry at ways that patriarchy and sexism have made women particularly vulnerable to HIV/AIDS in South Africa, read this:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2443629/

In short, the research shows that women in South Africa aren't any more promiscuous than their counterparts in more developed countries. They are just far more powerless to stop men from engaging in unsafe practices and then infecting them. Everything about it is truly horrific.

[MrsKay]

I take and leave what parts of MDC are useful or not. I've gotten some great stuff on there, and some stuff that was just "WTF???". I do have to say I love cloth pads. However, I still feel guilty when I pull out the stroller, because my sciatic nerve, amongst other things, make carrying or wearing my baby less of a joy and more like shrieking agony. Even if you don't drink the Kool-Aid, it rubs off on you in some places.

As far as the AIDS and pregnancy and breastfeeding thing goes, there's only one instance where I'd advise a mom who has HIV/AIDS to BF, and that's if she was in a developing country or had absolutely no way to rely on getting formula. The gut flora of an exclusively BF baby is different from the gut of a FF baby, and the lining of the gut is so delicate in the first several months of life. From what I've read, FF can cause tiny holes/tearing in the gut - nothing life-threatening, for most, and I agree that FF babies can and do grow up totally normal and healthy, so please don't think I'm picking on them (all of mine have been formula fed to some degree), I'm just repeating facts.

So, let's take a mom in Africa, who gets free formula for a bit. This is where formula companies really are shits for advertising and handing out freebies - the culture there is far more friendly towards BF than here, and there are few cases where formula is really needed. Anyhow, the moms who want to FF and can afford it, do so, and only use formula. Fine; obviously, if she's HIV+, it's the safest thing. The moms who can't afford it often BF as well, besides doing things like watering down formula to make it last longer. So that's putting milk that might carry HIV, into a gut that might have microscopic tears from formula. A baby who gets HIV in this case, may never have gotten it at all if it was exclusively BF. KWIM? There are a lot of studies out there, I apologize for being too lazy to find them at this hour.

Anyhow, yeah - that's the only reason I can think of that would ever make me think it's okay to advise an HIV+ mother to BF. The whole denial thing... that's just fucked up.

[lovefromgirl]

I get where you're going, MrsKay. There's also the problem of diarrheal diseases, so you'd have to boil any water put into any formula, even the gentlest on the gut. Diarrhea still accounts for plenty of deaths where sanitation isn't up to snuff.

[Rachel333]

I worked in a clinic for a while in an African country with a very high HIV rate. This particular country has excellent programs in place that make it very easy to get treatment, and they've seen the maternal transmission rate go way down. Treatment is free, there are free condoms all over the place (well, there should be; they don't always fill the dispensers often enough, but you can always go get free ones at a clinic), and there are lots of safe-sex campaigns. Cultural factors are still a huge problem, though. I blame the patriarchy, basically. Men are reluctant to use condoms and women aren't really empowered enough to demand that they do. They also tend to have huge sexual networks and rape is way too common.

Anyway, regarding the breastfeeding issue, there's a big problem with babies getting HIV through breast milk. As long as a woman who is HIV+ goes in for treatment (which is basically free) during pregnancy, there is nearly a 0% chance that the baby will get HIV, and indeed the rates are almost 0 now, a dramatic decrease from 15 or so years ago.

The problem is that in their culture everyone breastfeeds, and it's very family-centered so the grandmother and aunts usually help out with the baby for the first few months. Sounds good, but the pressure to breastfeed is huge and if a woman is seen using formula people assume she has HIV. Because of the fear of being stigmatized, women sometimes end up breastfeeding even though they know they shouldn't, and the baby ends up with HIV.

Anyway, this was long, but having seen what HIV/AIDS can do I just cannot fathom the AIDS denialism. Some of these theories I just think are really stupid, but this one is incredibly dangerous as well. You can lead a pretty normal life with HIV if you get treatment, but if you don't you'll usually die. I only recently learned about this and it's just sickening. They're ignoring scientific fact and trying to make an already horrible disease worse.

[MrsKay]

Yeah, sterile water for formula is also a huge issue. I HAVE to use formula for my babies - I have no choice, I've had life-saving surgeries that leave me unable to produce enough milk. So again, when reading my posts, I really hope no one feels offended, if they happen to use/have used formula! I totally believe we all need to decide what's right for us and our babies. However, the whole "Boycott Nestle" thing started with babies starving to death b/c formula was pushed at the mothers; moms didn't breastfeed, or did so only partially, and they starved b/c of not enough formula and loss of maternal milk supply, or they died of water-borne illnesses from the formula. So in these cases, the issue of formula makes me feel kinda stabby, more so than usual.

The problem is that in their culture everyone breastfeeds, and it's very family-centered so the grandmother and aunts usually help out with the baby for the first few months. Sounds good, but the pressure to breastfeed is huge and if a woman is seen using formula people assume she has HIV. Because of the fear of being stigmatized, women sometimes end up breastfeeding even though they know they shouldn't, and the baby ends up with HIV.

That's so sad. Unfortunately, while in most cases some breast milk is better than none, with HIV in the picture, people really do need to understand that it's all or nothing, and why. In other cultures, women starve their babies with watered-down formula b/c breastfeeding is seen as something only ignorant people do. This shows that we need so much more education for the sake of all of these babies. It also shows that it seems like as women, we can't win no matter where we freakin' live.

[Wolfie]

I tried 'mama cloth' but couldn't stand to save them up to wash them, totally icked me out, and I wasn't going to wash them one at a time with their 'special mama cloth detergent!!' in their 'special mama cloth mesh bag!!' Sea sponge tampons are where it's at, ladies.

Uh, what special detergent???

I throw them in the washer to soak for an hour, spin them out, then run them through a cycle with tide and vinegar for fabric softener. Other than the soaking, no special treatment.

Not too fond of the term "Mama Cloth" I'm not a mama myself, just an auntie. I refer to them as cloth pads.

[Beeks]

Iraq? Is that Mizrachi or Sephardi?

My family is Mizrachi and I have never met another Mizrachi Jew outside of my own family. I am told there are areas where we are more common. Unfortunately, most Mizrachi Jews historically have lived in areas where it is open hunting season on them, so we have not grown in population as fast as other Jewish populations.

Iraqi = Sephardic as far as I know. My sis-in-law's grandma is Iraqi and they follow sephardic customs (they all live in Israel now and have since Israel existed though, so I'm not entirely sure if the sephardic customs were brought with them from Iraq or adopted later. I will ask!).

I knew one Mizrachi Jew about 15 years ago.....other than that, never met another!

[Sola]

Uh, what special detergent???

I throw them in the washer to soak for an hour, spin them out, then run them through a cycle with tide and vinegar for fabric softener. Other than the soaking, no special treatment.

Not to fond of the term "Mama Cloth" I'm not a mama myself, just an auntie. I refer to them as cloth pads.

I used cloth pads for years, made my own too (crunchy enough for y'all :lol:), as I couldn't use tampons or any internal protection and store bought pads made me sore. I never ever messed around using special washes for them. I would rinse them out and get all the icky stuff out then throw them in the washing machine with whatever towels needed washing. You could guarantee that there was always some towels that needed washing. I don't use fabric softener, like you I use vinegar and quite often I make my own detergent anyway (yup, I'm crunchy :D) but they always came out clean and soft. I never called them Mama cloth either! I find it a silly name, they were just cloth pads. I found them much more absorbent than any store bought ones too.

[MrsKay]

My cloth pads go into their own load, but they don't get teh speshul detergent that costs as much as the damn pads themselves - they get a presoak and then plain old Sunlight laundry detergent unless I make my own detergent. I've made my own, too - not out of "crunchiness", but out of cheapness. I have seriously sensitive skin and I'm prone to UTIs and other issues below the belt, and cloth pads help. And they're not "Mama cloth" here, either, unless I'm chasing a thieving toddler and trying to stake my claim. They're freakin' PADS.

I've seen some women bring up baby socks as the alternative of tampons; you're supposed to just roll up a newborn sock or two and shove it up there. I have to draw the line at that one.

[Sunnichick31]

Ok I know this is a bit TMI, but I just got a divacup a couple days ago and for once, I can't wait to get my period so I can try it out! i really wanna try making cloth pads too. :) Anyone know a good pattern?

[Lillian]

I've seen some women bring up baby socks as the alternative of tampons; you're supposed to just roll up a newborn sock or two and shove it up there. I have to draw the line at that one.

:shock: :shock: :shock:

[bionicmlle]

I've seen some women bring up baby socks as the alternative of tampons; you're supposed to just roll up a newborn sock or two and shove it up there. I have to draw the line at that one.

I don't have kids. I don't have tampon problems... EXCEPT that tampons can be pricey (for the job they do, anyway) and I wear a thong. Every day. so I'd have to sew some speshul faux-mama cloth if I wanted to go this direction. Baby socks? BRILLIANT!

I bought a box of Instead cups about 6-7 months ago from Drugstore.com and still am finishing them up. I find them rather... uh... large.

ETA: GAH! Every time I click this thread I think someone has some new Lina info. :::grumble:::

[Cannelle]

Ok I know this is a bit TMI, but I just got a divacup a couple days ago and for once, I can't wait to get my period so I can try it out! i really wanna try making cloth pads too. :) Anyone know a good pattern?

No patterns, but just know that there's a learning curve with the Divacup. It took me three months to be really comfortable with it.

First month was okay, was getting used to it.

Second month was, literally, a bloody mess. I couldn't get ANYTHING right that second month and ended up needing pads for backup. :roll:

Third month went swimmingly, and I haven't looked back! I think I've had my DivaCup for...almost five years now, and I love it. Will never go back. You really do need to be comfortable with your body to deal with it- I swear there have been times I've felt like I've been elbow-deep trying to loosen the suction to pull it out or making sure that it spins and is in a comfortable position after insertion. But seriously, it's the greatest thing ever invented for periods. Empty it in the morning, wash it out, put it back in, and you don't have to think about it again until night time. Empty it, wash it out, put it back in, go to bed. Hassle free, and once you have it down, you don't need to worry about leaks, supplies, finding a bathroom to change things, it's amazing. LOVE mine!

[Jessica]

Here's a whole page with links to patterns. http://clothpads.wikidot.com/patterns

I love cloth pads. They are so comfy... And pretty! :)

[CanadianHippie]

Uh, what special detergent???

I throw them in the washer to soak for an hour, spin them out, then run them through a cycle with tide and vinegar for fabric softener. Other than the soaking, no special treatment.

Not to fond of the term "Mama Cloth" I'm not a mama myself, just an auntie. I refer to them as cloth pads.

I just throw them in the washer on hot. And I call them cloth pads too, because I am not a mama either.

[Wolfie]

I used cloth pads for years, made my own too (crunchy enough for y'all :lol:), as I couldn't use tampons or any internal protection and store bought pads made me sore. I never ever messed around using special washes for them. I would rinse them out and get all the icky stuff out then throw them in the washing machine with whatever towels needed washing. You could guarantee that there was always some towels that needed washing. I don't use fabric softener, like you I use vinegar and quite often I make my own detergent anyway (yup, I'm crunchy :D) but they always came out clean and soft. I never called them Mama cloth either! I find it a silly name, they were just cloth pads. I found them much more absorbent than any store bought ones too.

Yep, I'm crunchy enough that I made my own too. (but I have to say that I'm a decent seamstress overall, so it just made more sense to make them myself. I've made some diapers for my siblings' kids too.) I throw whatever towels are around in the load too, usually. I am not crunchy enough to make my own detergent, but I'm very happy with Tide and since it's just me, I don't go through tons anyway.

On the Diva Cup question. I have never found it comfortable to insert or remove, but it is wonderful for those overnights when you are really heavy. No waking up in a puddle.

[masagoroll]

ETA: GAH! Every time I click this thread I think someone has some new Lina info. :::grumble:::

I know! Me, too!