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Joy & Austin 34: Baby Three


Coconut Flan

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Next YouTube is up. Joy says "my sister will be in town". Who do we think it is? Evie was throwing teases right back at Austin; that was funny.  And Gideon thinking for himself about if he wants his loose tooth pulled or let it come out natural......It's quite nice, actually.

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Log time lurker. I don’t know why, but Austin letting Joy use a hair remover on him as an ad on Insta is cracking me up. So far from what I would have imagined years ago. 

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4 hours ago, PraiseRufus said:

Log time lurker. I don’t know why, but Austin letting Joy use a hair remover on him as an ad on Insta is cracking me up. So far from what I would have imagined years ago. 

It’s weird isn’t it? So self righteous about their modesty standards, but there’s money to be made so let’s shave our legs and video it for Instagram! Joy shaving her own legs is a long way from Michelle having her knees blurred out on TV.

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What makes me snicker is imagining JB and Michelle reacting to this. All of the girls have ,quite rightly, stopped caring about people seeing their knees, shoulders etc. Joy is the opposite of what was upheld as the feminine ideal; she works along side Austin, is not hair and makeup obsessed and is open about not wanting a billion kids. She and Jill must be making the parents twitchy. 

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On 3/26/2023 at 2:16 PM, Expectopatronus said:

What makes me snicker is imagining JB and Michelle reacting to this. All of the girls have ,quite rightly, stopped caring about people seeing their knees, shoulders etc. Joy is the opposite of what was upheld as the feminine ideal; she works along side Austin, is not hair and makeup obsessed and is open about not wanting a billion kids. She and Jill must be making the parents twitchy. 

At least Joy prays about pants whereas her slutty sisters just wear *gasp* ripped jeans!

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15 hours ago, LancetteShing99 said:

At least Joy prays about pants whereas her slutty sisters just wear *gasp* ripped jeans!

Herein is one of the problems I have with people who profess beliefs in the power of prayer. You got Joy praying fervently about wearing a particular style of clothing when so many other serious issues in life abound around her. I hear about Christians praying to get a parking spot, I see women on Say Yes To Da Dress gather in a prayer circle to pray that the wedding gown Sally wants is in stock and in her size, and then, seriously, they do the same thing for the dress Sally wanna wear to the reception. Imo, there’s so much trivialization going on with the kinds of prayers offered up to the guy in the sky. I find it annoying.
 

My other gripe is how none of them have embraced the adoption route. Within my extended family, we have so many members who are adopted. It’s something that sort of seems to happen and we all go with it. So many Duggar siblings, but still all of them and their offspring originate from the seed of Chucky JB. 

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@Cam Jessa has often talked about her ‘heart to adopt’, but it’s just talk so far. I don’t know what the rules are where they live, but some places don’t let couples with very young children adopt. I would also think that as for many years they had a relative who admitted molestation of younger siblings and still participated in family get togethers, adoption agencies would give them a wide berth.

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Honestly, adoption requires home studies, money etc and sexy times are free. I think that's a big part of it. (Also, adoptable babies are rare and they may not be up to coping with older, traumatized kids.)

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33 minutes ago, PlentyOfJesusFishInTheSea said:

Honestly, adoption requires home studies, money etc and sexy times are free. I think that's a big part of it. (Also, adoptable babies are rare and they may not be up to coping with older, traumatized kids.)

Fundies don't understand trauma and all adoption involves trauma. I'm glad that, with the exception of gaining guardianship of Tyler, none of the Duggars have actually adopted.

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3 hours ago, EmiSue said:

Fundies don't understand trauma and all adoption involves trauma. I'm glad that, with the exception of gaining guardianship of Tyler, none of the Duggars have actually adopted.

Agreed - I'd hate to think they were going to tell the kiddo how LUCKY the kiddo is to be adopted into such grace and godliness and how shameful their entrance into the world is. 

 

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22 hours ago, PlentyOfJesusFishInTheSea said:

Honestly, adoption requires home studies, money etc and sexy times are free. I think that's a big part of it. (Also, adoptable babies are rare and they may not be up to coping with older, traumatized kids.)

 

I feel like the Duggar women want to have the pregnancy spotlight. You don’t get that with adoption. Not as much bragging rights. What about infertile IBLP couples? Do they adopt? 

Edited by Cam
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17 minutes ago, Cam said:

 

I feel like the Duggar women want to have the pregnancy spotlight. You don’t get that with adoption. Not as much bragging rights. What about infertile IBLP couples? Do they adopt? 

I don't know wether this teaching is still around, but I believe back in the day Gothard taught that adopted children 'carry the sins of their parents' or some crap like that. Don't know if people in those circles still follow that, but I always had a feeling that this might be the reason Michaela Bates Keilen and her husband haven't adopted yet, despite their infertility.

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Nancy Campbell pushed overseas adoption hard way back in the 2000s. And a lot of fundies followed her advice with horrible results. Many think they can save kids from heathen countries and make them behave by teaching them the Bible and strict discipline. It’s a way of saving souls in other countries without going to that country. It’s tucked up and none of them seemed to be prepared at all. 

Edited by JermajestyDuggar
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On 3/30/2023 at 6:43 AM, Idlewild said:

@Cam Jessa has often talked about her ‘heart to adopt’, but it’s just talk so far. I don’t know what the rules are where they live, but some places don’t let couples with very young children adopt. I would also think that as for many years they had a relative who admitted molestation of younger siblings and still participated in family get togethers, adoption agencies would give them a wide berth.

Agreed. I would be shocked if they made it past the first home study. Depending on the social worker, homeschooling could be a problem, employment would also be a major concern, and the abuse that the girls survived would be a major problem since none of them got counselling. My SW was angry that my parents spanked my sister and me because even though I said I don’t plan to spank, she felt that there was an increased risk that I might spank since I had been raised that way. I needed references, had to submit a medical report, employment history, bank records for 12 months, driving records, etc. My friend has to be fingerprinted every year because she is still waiting to adopt. It’s pricey, frustrating and all privacy is gone. 

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2 hours ago, Expectopatronus said:

Agreed. I would be shocked if they made it past the first home study. Depending on the social worker, homeschooling could be a problem, employment would also be a major concern, and the abuse that the girls survived would be a major problem since none of them got counselling. My SW was angry that my parents spanked my sister and me because even though I said I don’t plan to spank, she felt that there was an increased risk that I might spank since I had been raised that way. I needed references, had to submit a medical report, employment history, bank records for 12 months, driving records, etc. My friend has to be fingerprinted every year because she is still waiting to adopt. It’s pricey, frustrating and all privacy is gone. 

This is why I hope they never adopt. They’d find an agency that doesn’t follow the rules. 

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On 3/30/2023 at 6:14 AM, LancetteShing99 said:

At least Joy prays about pants whereas her slutty sisters just wear *gasp* ripped jeans!

A friend of mine who grew up in an Australian conservative Christian (fundie) homeschool family has been sharing on her Facebook recently about her upbringing and the lingering trauma and other consequences. The most recent post was about clothing (the usual - ankle length skirts and dresses, blouses that were not form fitting and had high necklines, second hand or homemade) and this section lines up with a lot of what we’ve seen over recent years in the dwindling skirts-only movement (sorry I don’t know how to add a quote box on my phone):

 

When I was about twenty, my mum came to the conclusion that it was actually ok for us to wear jeans after all.  This coincided, give or take a couple of years, with similar decisions from other homeschool families we knew.  Perhaps the change in our parents’ viewpoints was gradual, but for me and for many of my homeschool peers, it felt abrupt, confronting, and slightly arbitrary.  For years, our parents had been unyielding in their clothing standards, to the point of unwittingly warping our self-image and over-sensitising our consciences.  Now, the standards we’d grown up with were swept away as if they’d never really mattered, while our lingering guilt and confusion were generally never acknowledged.

The first memory I have of wearing jeans: I was twenty-one, halfway through uni, exhausted from mental illness.  My mum had taken me clothes shopping in the hope that it would lift my mood.  I had just tried on the first pair of jeans I’d worn since I was a toddler.  I remember staring, stunned, at my reflection in the Target change room, exclaiming in awe—“I look like everyone else now.”

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Joy posted a new video on YT. The Vuolos were visiting Arkansas and stayed with the Forsyths. This kind of surprised me but wondering if they have the most space to host them. Joy didn’t do a great job in this video with hiding faces. I spotted Felicity, Israel, and Samuel, as well as Josiah. She also commented at one point how she couldn’t show Evy Vuolo’s face and panned away. Abby seemed not the most comfortable on camera, but I was glad to see Jill included (as long as she was happy to be there of course). 

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10 hours ago, front hugs > duggs said:

Joy posted a new video on YT. The Vuolos were visiting Arkansas and stayed with the Forsyths. This kind of surprised me but wondering if they have the most space to host them. Joy didn’t do a great job in this video with hiding faces. I spotted Felicity, Israel, and Samuel, as well as Josiah. She also commented at one point how she couldn’t show Evy Vuolo’s face and panned away. Abby seemed not the most comfortable on camera, but I was glad to see Jill included (as long as she was happy to be there of course). 

The housing arrangement is interesting! Do you think the Vuolos stayed with the Forsyths because their kids have fun playing together? Or more hospitable accommodations? I guess there’s really no convenient sleeping arrangements at the TTH house for a couple with two kids. Or is it that Jeremy cannot stomach JB and Michelle for too long and doesn’t want to abide under JB’s authority in his house, even for a few days?

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55 minutes ago, Cam said:

The housing arrangement is interesting! Do you think the Vuolos stayed with the Forsyths because their kids have fun playing together? Or more hospitable accommodations? I guess there’s really no convenient sleeping arrangements at the TTH house for a couple with two kids. Or is it that Jeremy cannot stomach JB and Michelle for too long and doesn’t want to abide under JB’s authority in his house, even for a few days?

The Forsyth family visited the Vuolos in LA not too long ago, so they might have made the practical arrangements for this visit while they were there. I also think that the Vuolos wouldn't want to stay in the messy TTH with JB watching over them. I would love to know what the older sisters and their families are talking about off camera.

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Since I don't seem to have anything better to do, I looked at the vlog. Different people show up during different activities. I think I can see the following people - with the reservation that I could mix them up, and that some might not be on camera even if they are there. Btw, I didn't see Jill, but I could have missed here. There are lots of people.... 

Joy and Jinger go to lunch, thrift shopping and coffee, aka "girl time". People that show up: Michelle + the lost girls, Jana, Jessa, Katey and Abbit. (Plus lots of kids). We also see Josiah hanging out, so I assume that Lauren was there. 

Next stop: Taco dinner. All the Forsyths, Vuolos, Jana, John&Abbie + kids. 

After that: Visit the Seewald house. Same as the Taco crew + Josiah and a kid, James and Elijah. 

Next day: People hang out at the Forsyth house. Perhaps the most interesting. Besides Vuolos and Forsyths, there's JB and Michelle + lost girls and J'Tyler, Josiah and Jana. So JB is in the same house as Jeremy. 

 

In other news: Joy videos Austin who has fallen asleep on the floor while putting Evy down for a nap. He wears pink(ish) pants. 

 

9007B402-7DB6-4F36-98AD-D90DE23A869D_1_201_a.jpeg

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On 3/31/2023 at 2:10 PM, Giraffe said:

This is why I hope they never adopt. They’d find an agency that doesn’t follow the rules. 

This is why I’ve assumed Michael Bates Keilen might decide to “adopt” an embryo instead. There are more available than ever, they could spin it as “saving” a soul/baby, and the biggest agency in the country is super Christian and based in Nashville. No home studies, no privacy invasion. She still gets to be pregnant. Checks all the fundie boxes. I’m actually kind of shocked they haven’t gone this route yet. Maybe bc she confirmed that she lost a pregnancy and is still hoping to conceive again?

I don’t think Jessa would ever choose this, but I can imagine it being a perfect fit for fundies dealing with infertility. 

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12 minutes ago, Johannah said:

This is why I’ve assumed Michael Bates Keilen might decide to “adopt” an embryo instead. There are more available than ever, they could spin it as “saving” a soul/baby, and the biggest agency in the country is super Christian and based in Nashville. No home studies, no privacy invasion. She still gets to be pregnant. Checks all the fundie boxes. I’m actually kind of shocked they haven’t gone this route yet. Maybe bc she confirmed that she lost a pregnancy and is still hoping to conceive again?

I don’t think Jessa would ever choose this, but I can imagine it being a perfect fit for fundies dealing with infertility. 

I’ve thought of that too and my guess is whatever* causes her to not be a candidate for IVF may prevent her from being a candidate for embryo “adoption,” too. 
 

* medically. If they have non-medical reasons against embryo adoption or ivf then it’s a different matter. 

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On 3/31/2023 at 8:02 AM, ophelia said:

I don't know wether this teaching is still around, but I believe back in the day Gothard taught that adopted children 'carry the sins of their parents' or some crap like that. Don't know if people in those circles still follow that, but I always had a feeling that this might be the reason Michaela Bates Keilen and her husband haven't adopted yet, despite their infertility.

Yes, Gothard was heavily critical of adoption. Wasn't Michael Pearl, also? Something about kids (even toddlers) coming with the "dark arts" (witchcraft/voodoo) already in their souls? Adoption can be a wonderful thing, but only if the adoptive parents (a) acknowledge the inherent trauma and the fact that all the love and hugs in the world won't make it go away, and (b) treat the adopted child the same as they would treat any bio children they have. I have a friend who has one adopted son and some bio kids and she literally forgets that he is adopted. Some of these fundie families would probably act like the adopted child was a second-class citizen and then criticize the child for not being grateful every day to their parents for deigning to adopt them. 

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Was there any specific reason for the Vuolos to visit Jinger’s family in Arkansas, some kind of event or something? Or was it a randomly planned trip?

I wonder how people from her hometown interact with Jinger now that her Free Indeed book’s been published. Surely enough of them read it/know about it. Whenever someone from where I live makes a big splash like that: gets a book published, stars on Broadway, gets even a small role on some tv or movie production, the local newspaper does a story on them. Do you think Jinger received any kind of local coverage for her book? 

 

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