Seewalds 48: Homophobia Now Mixed With Hypocrisy

[GiggleOfGirls]

On 8/17/2023 at 10:57 AM, Sullie06 said:

Also the oldest of 3 and I agree with this. I told my hubby we needed to have an even number so it was 2 or 4 for us. We decided on 2. My brother (the youngest) is 8 years younger than me so luckily it was easier for our parents because my sister and I were teenagers when he was in elementary school. But I always felt bad because he said he felt like he grew up like an only child while my sister and I had each other. 

I’m the oldest of 4 and insisted on having an even number of children (ended up being 4). It’s harder now in many ways (ages 10-17) because they’re all going in different directions. When they were tiny it was harder in other ways, but the driving we do now is off the charts. 
 

My oldest two could drive already if COVID hadn’t messed up the waiting times. Even so we should have them driving by the end of the year, but the next few months will be intense. And then the cost of two teens driving is scary to think about too 😬

 

I was on the “have as many babies as we have” bandwagon for a little while, but after the third I was all “just one more to make it even and we are DONE” which was a really good call 😳 None of my siblings want to have kids and my husband is an only child so I figure we replaced our parents and we’re good! 

On 8/17/2023 at 5:36 PM, JermajestyDuggar said:

What I’ve found in more rural areas is that people will often have to live near family because that’s the only way they can get free or cheap childcare. My siblings definitely took advantage of that when their kids were young because they lived in the same small town as my parents. We live in a large city over an hour away so they cannot provide regular childcare for us. It only happens a couple of times a year. While my niece and nephews sometimes went to my parents’ house 5 times a week for free childcare.

When mine were little we absolutely lived near my parents! It was so helpful. I honestly don’t know what we would’ve done otherwise. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

42 minutes ago, GiggleOfGirls said:

When mine were little we absolutely lived near my parents! It was so helpful. I honestly don’t know what we would’ve done otherwise. 

I think for a lot of people in the US, there is literally no other option. Which is just crazy to me. Affordable childcare should have happened in the US decades ago. I feel like we are so behind when it comes to social programs. 

[QuiverFullofBooks]

I just watched the LuLaRoe documentary and it was clear that they were taking advantage of women who wanted desperately to be at home with their kids - because it’s so hard to be a working mom in the US, especially with multiple children - but also really, really needed money (and self-esteem).

[JermajestyDuggar]

16 minutes ago, QuiverFullofBooks said:

I just watched the LuLaRoe documentary and it was clear that they were taking advantage of women who wanted desperately to be at home with their kids - because it’s so hard to be a working mom in the US, especially with multiple children - but also really, really needed money (and self-esteem).

They take advantage of so many groups of women. I know that Lularoe was formed by Mormons, but they also take advantage of Mormons. Utah is completely saturated by MLMs. In Mormonism, women are expected to be stay at home moms. Even if their husband doesn’t make that much money. And Mormons are expected to have 4-6 kids at least. Sometimes more. So if you are a Mormon mom to many snd your husband doesn’t make enough to support the family, of course you’ll want to sell an MLM! You are still staying at home like expected and you are promised easy money by your up line. Every Mormon woman in Utah has either sold an mlm or bought something from an mlm. 
 

Another group they prey on is army wives. Since they move around a lot, it’s hard to have a long term job. So an MLM promises you can work from anywhere. 

[Father Son Holy Goat]

6 hours ago, xenobia said:

I'm always greatful - even though I don't have kids of my own - that I live in a country (Sweden) that has a decent parental leave. Both parents, and other adults who take care of the child, can benefit from the parental leave insurance. It's 480 days per child. 

https://www.thenewbieguide.se/just-arrived/register-for-welfare/parental-leave/

 

So if a mom had twins could she get 960 days? 
 

4 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I think for a lot of people in the US, there is literally no other option. Which is just crazy to me. Affordable childcare should have happened in the US decades ago. I feel like we are so behind when it comes to social programs. 

We’re paying for it now with a lowered birth rate. We’re at the point where capitalism is cannibalizing itself, it needs people to have babies to drive consumption and provide workers but they can’t afford it. 

[xenobia]

1 hour ago, Father Son Holy Goat said:

So if a mom had twins could she get 960 days? 

No, but the parental leave is extended with another 180 days if you have twins, so the parents (or other adults) get a total of 660 days for twins. But at least 90 days must be taken by the parent who doesn't get the bulk of the days, usually but not always the father. If not, they are cancelled. (Unless you have sole custody of the child, then you get all of the 480 days). 

Last year about 30% of the total parental leave was taken by fathers, and the numbers are going up. A lot of my friends let the mum take the first 9-12 months, and then the father takes 3-6 months after that. You also have a legal right to keep your job during this time. 

[nvmbr02]

On 8/16/2023 at 6:40 PM, CanadianMamam said:

I have 3 and I feel in some ways the world has changed to be more accommodating towards 3? We drive a comfortable mini van, food courts are the only place we ever struggle with seating adn even then, we can usually make it work. We tend to travel to kid friendly hotels and many of them come with extra beds, either a pull-out couch or when we went to Great Wold Lodge, we had 4 beds (Queen and 3 singles) and we are looking at going south in the winter and again, lots of places that accommodate the larger family. 
 

My best friend was one of 3 in the 80s and she remembers it being a lot more awkward, so I do think that there have just been subtle changes that make it easier. 
 

It is not without challenges of course and I often feel there is an odd man out (though who ir is changes) but I also like having 3 adn I think they balance each other well and I haven’t run into many outside world obstacles. 

I don't know. My husband and I were both the oldest of 3 and neither of us remember it being awkward growing up.  We are happy with the 3 kids we have. We have traveled a ton and have never found it that difficult to find room or make it work. With 3 we were able to drive a mid sized SUV and have room for each of the kids to bring a friend along for day trips when they were younger. Now that they are adults and teens our numbers vary because of significant others, etc.   My sister insisted on an even number of kids and she ended up with her niece living with them for a few years and then when the niece moved out her oldest son's girlfriend moved in. I do thing some things, like family packs, etc.. are made for a family of 4. But that is inconvenient for anyone that doesn't have 2 kids. 

Edited August 22, 2023 by nvmbr02

[GutenbergGirl]

When I had my kids, we were dirt poor, even with both of us working.  I had my 1st child, and was back at work when he was a week old.  I was blessed that my Grandma had a home daycare and could take him while I worked.  

I had an emergency C-section with my second, who was a 32 week preemie.  I went back to work when she was 3 weeks old.  She was still in the NICU when I went back to work.  I was very fortunate that I worked with my mom, who was the Director of Nursing at the nursing home where we worked.  I was able to stagger my shifts with hers, so one of the other of us was off to take care of the baby until she was 6 months old.  She was on an apnea/heart monitor, and my Grandma was scared of it.  

With my 3rd, I went back to my same job when he was two weeks old.  I had pre-eclampsia with him that turned toxic.  They induced me, but my blood pressure stayed high, and I had swelling so bad, my feet were like balls on the end of my legs.  They were still swollen when I went back to work, so I wore house shoes for another week or two.  

I'm in the US, btw.  I could have taken the twelve week FMLA.  But, it was unpaid, and we just couldn't afford it.  My then husband took off the day each baby was born, but that was it.  

I hope it's got better since then, because it was HARD to go back so soon!!  This was in the 1990s.  

[lumpentheologie]

12 hours ago, Father Son Holy Goat said:

We’re paying for it now with a lowered birth rate. We’re at the point where capitalism is cannibalizing itself, it needs people to have babies to drive consumption and provide workers but they can’t afford it. 

Exactly. In my age group we graduated from college during the financial crisis, saddled with tons of debt. After 15 or so years of work some of us have achieved a precarious middle class like existence, but that would vanish if we had kids. So we don’t have kids. 

[nokidsmom]

19 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

They take advantage of so many groups of women. I know that Lularoe was formed by Mormons, but they also take advantage of Mormons. Utah is completely saturated by MLMs. In Mormonism, women are expected to be stay at home moms. Even if their husband doesn’t make that much money. And Mormons are expected to have 4-6 kids at least. Sometimes more. So if you are a Mormon mom to many snd your husband doesn’t make enough to support the family, of course you’ll want to sell an MLM! You are still staying at home like expected and you are promised easy money by your up line. Every Mormon woman in Utah has either sold an mlm or bought something from an mlm. 

Sister (non Mormon btw) lives in Utah and can attest to this.   A lot of couples get married young, have kids right away and really struggle.  So yeah the MLM model seems to be the perfect answer to the inevitable financial problems.   My sister has bought some things from friends / coworkers involved in MLMs but she absolutely refuses to get involved in them for herself. 

Years ago, a coworker asked me to meet with her, in the workplace, to what I thought was a work related discussion.  It involved her plugging the MLM she was doing on the side, trying to create another up line.   My answer to that was "nope, nope, nope"

[Bassett Lady]

22 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

They take advantage of so many groups of women. I know that Lularoe was formed by Mormons, but they also take advantage of Mormons

I just finished watching the LuLaRoe documentary. I feel so frustrated and conflicted. I had no idea that these were an MLM.

The first dress we got for our daughter was a hand-me-down and she loved it so much. 
 

I looked them on ThredUP (the online resale shop) and found lots of cute patterned dresses in cuts and SIZES that actually fit her! They make an XXS and she finally has dresses that are fitted and not hanging off of her. 
 

Since I’ve never purchased these new I haven’t been directly supporting the company, but we often buy these dresses “New With Tags” and I have paid anywhere from $4-$8.  I now wonder if those dresses were being sold by their mistreated frontline sales force. 
 

We own about 20 of these dresses and she wears them all the time. They are soft, the seams don’t bother her, and they are machine washable (because she does her own laundry).

[JermajestyDuggar]

7 minutes ago, Bassett Lady said:

I just finished watching the LuLaRoe documentary. I feel so frustrated and conflicted. I had no idea that these were an MLM.

The first dress we got for our daughter was a hand-me-down and she loved it so much. 
 

I looked them on ThredUP (the online resale shop) and found lots of cute patterned dresses in cuts and SIZES that actually fit her! They make an XXS and she finally has dresses that are fitted and not hanging off of her. 
 

Since I’ve never purchased these new I haven’t been directly supporting the company, but we often buy these dresses “New With Tags” and I have paid anywhere from $4-$8.  I now wonder if those dresses were being sold by their mistreated frontline sales force. 
 

We own about 20 of these dresses and she wears them all the time. They are soft, the seams don’t bother her, and they are machine washable (because she does her own laundry).

Don’t feel bad! Buying them used is so much better than buying them directly from an MLM Hun. Plus you had no idea. The thing that sucks is that there are MLMs with products I like. I was gifted a Thirty One bag and I still use it. I really like it. I just don’t buy directly from sellers. But if someone buys me a gift that’s from an MLM, I will still accept it. 

[nokidsmom]

2 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Don’t feel bad! Buying them used is so much better than buying them directly from an MLM Hun. Plus you had no idea. The thing that sucks is that there are MLMs with products I like. I was gifted a Thirty One bag and I still use it. I really like it. I just don’t buy directly from sellers. But if someone buys me a gift that’s from an MLM, I will still accept it. 

Coworker was wearing their tunics/dresses and leggings.   They were quite cute and I was tempted but looking online I could see it was an MLM (when your local "seller location" is someone's house, yep, that could be a hint) and noped out.   If I found some at a thrift shop I would be OK but I was not supporting an MLM directly no matter how much I liked the stuff. 

I haven't watched the documentary but think I will do that soon.

[JermajestyDuggar]

10 minutes ago, nokidsmom said:

Coworker was wearing their tunics/dresses and leggings.   They were quite cute and I was tempted but looking online I could see it was an MLM (when your local "seller location" is someone's house, yep, that could be a hint) and noped out.   If I found some at a thrift shop I would be OK but I was not supporting an MLM directly no matter how much I liked the stuff. 

I haven't watched the documentary but think I will do that soon.

It’s a very entertaining documentary. It’s partly why it’s so popular in my opinion. 

[libgirl2]

30 minutes ago, nokidsmom said:

Coworker was wearing their tunics/dresses and leggings.   They were quite cute and I was tempted but looking online I could see it was an MLM (when your local "seller location" is someone's house, yep, that could be a hint) and noped out.   If I found some at a thrift shop I would be OK but I was not supporting an MLM directly no matter how much I liked the stuff. 

I haven't watched the documentary but think I will do that soon.

I would like to watch it but not sure how I can access it for free. 

[ifosterkittens]

10 minutes ago, libgirl2 said:

I would like to watch it but not sure how I can access it for free. 

It is on Amazon Prime. If you don't have Amazon Prime you can do a free trial, but you'll have to enter a credit card or your venmo account to create the account and set a reminder to cancel it before the free trial ends- ask me how I know! 

[viii]

Technically Pampered Chef and Tupperware are MLM but I sure love their products. 

[Bassett Lady]

I like the idea of an “in home” shop. I didn’t grow up in the US and many stores were business in the front, kitchen in the back, bedrooms and parlor/living room upstairs. 
 

Are there any companies that allow small entrepreneurs to sell their products without the multi level, up line, down line, pyramid scheme model? 
 

The LuLaRue product is good. It is decent quality and fits a niche for us that no other local retailer provides. I wouldn’t mind buying from a local “mom and pop” dealer, but I won’t support the abusive and predatory MLM scheme 

Edited August 23, 2023 by Bassett Lady

[HeartsAFundie]

I admit to having a decent-sized collection of Lularoe tunic and swing tops.  All purchased new with tags from Ebay or ThredUp.  I have gotten some of them for as little as $3-$4.  I think the most I paid for one top was $10.  

A long Lularoe top, a pair of solid color leggings and comfortable (Toms) shoes is my go-to travel uniform.  Easy to pack and doesn't take up a lot of room.  You can dress the outfit up or down depending on the occasion. And it's loose and comfortable!

  

Edited August 23, 2023 by HeartsAFundie

[Father Son Holy Goat]

6 hours ago, viii said:

Technically Pampered Chef and Tupperware are MLM but I sure love their products. 

My mom went to high school with Doris Christopher, the founder of Pampered Chef. 

[AnywhereButHere]

Oh god, Pampered Chef...

a friend of my sister-in-law is a seller for them and had SIL do a Facebook party for her. I bought something from that party, and next thing I know, friend is calling me trying to get me to host a party. We were in the middle of a house reno, so I thought GREAT! Built in excuse! Nope, can't do a party. Too busy with reno. So sorry. Of course, she asked if she could keep me in mind for some other time and me, being the gutless wonder that I was, said sure figuring she'd forget about me. Nope. Those reps have steel trap minds. Damned if she didn't call me back, almost a year to the day later, asking me to host again. I tried waffling again, but she insisted that I had committed to this and MUST follow through. She was getting belligerent with it too! Like holy shit lady. No, you cannot force me to host a party. Really. I finally ended it by stating directly (which I should have done to start) that I did not have friends (that I would be subjecting to this shit anyway), and in no way would I be hosting anything. Ever. She hung up on me. Twelve years on, I still get texts and emails from her about new products. No more requests for hosting though... 😂

What really kills me - I love that stoneware pan I bought. It makes awesomely crispy chicken. 

[QuiverFullofBooks]

25 minutes ago, AnywhereButHere said:

What really kills me - I love that stoneware pan I bought. It makes awesomely crispy chicken. 

It is a great pan, isn’t it? Luckily I changed my name, email, and location when I got married, so they didn’t hound me to buy the full set forever.

[libgirl2]

I bought once from Pampered Chef-- I think it was like 4 items. I only use one. The device to take leaves off herb stems is useless and the little silicon grabby things to take hot plates or bowls out of the microwave felt slippery so much that I could barely hold the bowl. I also got some kind of a microwave plastic sauce pan that warped after one use. Tossed that out or gave it to Goodwill.  I like the ground meat separator and use it almost every week. 

Edited August 23, 2023 by libgirl2

[HeartsAFundie]

I have a few things from Pampered Chef.  The microwave bowls, the rubber bowl grabbers and a child's serrated knife that I bought my son when he was a toddler so he could cut his own food.  He loved that little knife.  Still have it here.    I bought the bowls in the 90s and only had to replace one.   

[libgirl2]

34 minutes ago, HeartsAFundie said:

I have a few things from Pampered Chef.  The microwave bowls, the rubber bowl grabbers and a child's serrated knife that I bought my son when he was a toddler so he could cut his own food.  He loved that little knife.  Still have it here.    I bought the bowls in the 90s and only had to replace one.   

 

35 minutes ago, HeartsAFundie said:

I have a few things from Pampered Chef.  The microwave bowls, the rubber bowl grabbers and a child's serrated knife that I bought my son when he was a toddler so he could cut his own food.  He loved that little knife.  Still have it here.    I bought the bowls in the 90s and only had to replace one.   

That is what I have, the rubber bowl grabbers. I found them so hard to use.