Maxwell 50: Maxhell Has Frozen Over. Anna and Mary Are Off to College and Sarah Moves Out!

[NancyDrewFan1989]

On 9/11/2021 at 8:12 AM, nelliebelle1197 said:

Why would Sarah need help setting up Instagram? She has been marketing herself and her family her whole life. I am pretty sure she could manage all that on her own.

She may not know what Instagram really is. She knows it is social media, but not an app on your phone. I know some people whom are older found out about Instagram who asked for help setting up. None of the Maxwells, I think, had active social media profiles outside of the blog. So, social media sites and apps like Instagram may be something completely new for Sarah. So, while she may know how to set it up, she may not know about certain things like privacy settings and how to create a separate profile for business from personal. Steve cut off almost all forms of social media from his family I can see Sarah's head exploding once she learns how to use social media sites like Instagram and Facebook. So, Sarah may not know how to set up a social media site as Steve almost ensured she wouldn't know how to do any form of marketing outside of the family blog. 

[sparkles]

15 hours ago, Red Hair, Black Dress said:

Steve is 70;  he's been gone from Boeing more than 20 years. I think he was allowed to resign rather than be flat out fired for cause.  Resigned would not come with a union buyout. if his position was actually  eliminated maybe -- although I really can't see Steve belonging to a union.

He might have had stock options, but I think Steve would see the stock market as gambling.

I have always assumed Steve only allows 2 spoons of beans on a burrito because he's beyond cheap. -- not because you can't tell the difference between beans and meat. 

If I’m remembering correctly, the posts or Corners (I think it was the Corners) made it sound like there was some kind of negotiation going on before Steve was given the option of “resigning.” Since his issue appeared to be that he would no longer work with women for religious reasons, I can see him pulling the religious persecution card and threatening legal action so the company might have thought a payout just made more sense, from a “let’s get rid of the nuisance” perspective.

It’s definitely the end of an era. The Maxes were my real gateway fundies. I used to read the Duggar thread on TWOP, for reasons I have yet to figure out since I’ve never seen their shows or paid attention to anything else that featured them. (I think I got interested after reading Michelle Goldberg’s “Kingdom Coming: The Rise of Christian Nationalism” but I’ve never been one for “reality” television so I skipped the show). I remember seeing the Maxes mentioned a few times so I googled them and that led me here. I was fascinated by their rigidity, total black-and-white thinking, their missing humor bone, their lack of trust in their own beliefs and so on. And I do think they have some admirable qualities, mainly their work ethic and their frugality (not cheapness because they’re willing to spend on quality). But even among fundies, they stood out like a sore thumb. (I follow the Rods as well, but it’s just not the same, although you couldn’t make up a person like Jill if you tried.)

We’ll never really know what went on behind the carefully curated image they showed us, but I’m glad it at least appears that they—or rather Steve—have modified some of their more extreme beliefs and are giving the girls an opportunity to live their own lives. I’ll miss them, possibly in the same way you’d miss an infected tooth, but still…

ETA: I think Steve and Teri will keep the house. Mary and Anna will still be coming back home for summers and holiday breaks (unless they’re always going to be on a mission somwhere) and aside from Joseph, who isn’t exactly central to the majority of the extended family, theirs is the only home large enough to host a full family gathering. 

Edited September 12, 2021 by sparkles

[SassyPants]

Did I read that right, the blog is going, but T and S’s advice columns are going to remain active? Steve…no need for those to continue either. You And the Mrs are no longer actively parenting, and if you are, YOU  need to be soliciting advice, not dispensing it.

Does anyone know what a missionary degree program entails? Psychology? Sociology? Cultural heritage, communication courses, history, language and business courses? It’s not just Jesus, right? Is this school fully accredited?

[Giraffe]

I’m thrilled they’re attending an accredited school! It won’t surprise me at all if they change majors once they’re there. Even if they don’t though the fact it has real accreditation is huge! 

[Fun-Dee]

10 hours ago, church_of_dog said:

What I'm enjoying thinking about is -- Sarah had reasons to move out.

I mean, she didn't move out like most of us did, "just because that's what you do", or she would have moved out twenty years ago.

No, some thing or things about living at home were not acceptable or agreeable to her, so she moved out in order to address those things.

I think that's pretty significant -- A & M moved away because they were going TO something, namely, Bible college.

But Sarah moved OUT not to go TOWARD something, at least not that we know about.  She moved out to get AWAY from whichever aspects of the Stevehovah household she didn't want to play along with anymore.  I think that's exciting and a big deal in terms of her possibilities for the future.

 

I think once A & M moved out, Sarah didn't want to be the spinster daughter living at home.  Before that, they were all in the same boat and at least had each other.  They were probably pretty content, not knowing any different.  

That being said, I'm sad that the blog is most likely ending.  I liked getting updates on the family.  I may have to break down and actually buy a Moody book.  I read the first one for free, and feel like anything written in the books must have actually happened.  

[Suz8710]

Nice post @sparkles! End of an era. And I agree @Fun-Dee, based on the timing it really seems like that was a big factor to Sarah leaving. I wonder if she harbors some resentment that A & M get to do this when Sarah seemingly did not have options for college, moving out, etc. when she was their ages. 

I have been intrigued by the Maxwells, I learned about them somewhat late, but started following because they were in this interesting fundie “in between” - not flashy like the Duggar/Bates and not on the other end ala Rods or Nauglers etc. I’m in between Anna and Sarah’s ages, and their lives seemed so stagnant for so very long it became depressing to read. I think the pandemic made an impact on many of these fundies, I know it has with people I know. Some thoughts/questions:

If Jesse was still at home looking for a bride, would this have changed things for the girls?

I’m thinking by the end of their program, Anna and/or Mary will come away with a courtship, at minimum. I think they are genuinely interested in missionary work, which is great. The school is pretty small (Wikipedia lists250 students vs Pensacola Christian as an example, which says 4,800+ students) so their choices would be limited but at least it’s a different network of people they’ve never been exposed to before. 

Are there any families left like the Maxwells with older SAHDs that haven’t made moves like Sarah, Anna and Mary just did? 

Edited September 12, 2021 by Suz8710

[onekidanddone]

Didn’t Zsu take her daughters to hear Anna or Sarah. She seemed to approve of them.  She also made sure her sons were there to protect Miram and her sisters. Zsu will never let any of her girls to do anything by themselves 

[Black Aliss]

1 hour ago, Giraffe said:

I’m thrilled they’re attending an accredited school! It won’t surprise me at all if they change majors once they’re there. Even if they don’t though the fact it has real accreditation is huge! 

I hate to be a Debbie Downer, but there are several different accrediting organizations in the US and not all are accepted as legitimate by the US Department of Education. I know someone who wanted to apply to NOAA Corps and they could not because their college degree came from an accredited university that did not show up on the DoE's list of accredited universities. Turned out the school was just too new to qualify for accreditation status by the acceptable organizations.

ETA: I have no idea whether the DoE considers ABC to be legitimately accredited and I'm too lazy to check. I just wanted to point out that there's accreditation and there's accreditation. Sort of like Sen. Rand Paul being board-certified as an opthamologist by a  board that he created for himself.

Edited September 12, 2021 by Black Aliss

[JermajestyDuggar]

57 minutes ago, onekidanddone said:

Didn’t Zsu take her daughters to hear Anna or Sarah. She seemed to approve of them.  She also made sure her sons were there to protect Miram and her sisters. Zsu will never let any of her girls to do anything by themselves 

Yeah that was some years ago. Miriam was really young. I would say that was maybe 9 years ago? I could be wrong though. 

[molecule]

23 minutes ago, Black Aliss said:

I hate to be a Debbie Downer, but there are several different accrediting organizations in the US and not all are accepted as legitimate by the US Department of Education

ABC is accredited by the a Higher Learning Comission, which is the real deal.

[Maggie Mae]

3 hours ago, NancyDrewFan1989 said:

I know some people whom are older found out about Instagram who asked for help setting up. 

She's 39/40, not 70. Instagram has been around for 11 years and doesn't at least one of her sister in laws have one? Let's not ship her off to the retirement community just yet. 

[theologygeek]

9 hours ago, IsmeWeatherwax said:

@theologygeek yes if its a public pic or post I believe its ok to post on here

Okay thanks. I found Anna and Mary's facebooks.  Anna has a picture that she made public.  She is in a plane and took a picture of the land below.  It was taken Aug 28.  Just thought I'd bring it up because someone asked how they got to school.  I'm assuming from this picture that the girls took a plane.  

Edited to add:  Mary looks beautiful in her profile pic.  Full on makeup and everything.  

Edited September 12, 2021 by theologygeek

[Maggie Mae]

3 hours ago, sparkles said:

I used to read the Duggar thread on TWOP, for reasons I have yet to figure out since I’ve never seen their shows or paid attention to anything else that featured them. 

Same. Well, I know I first looked at their thread because it was constantly locked and I was curious as to why. It was usually locked because people wanted to talk about the Maxwells.  I have since seen a few episodes of counting on that I seeked out and part of the first special (on youtube, which I don't think even existed when I was reading that thread on TWOP.) 

3 hours ago, sparkles said:

We’ll never really know what went on behind the carefully curated image they showed us, but I’m glad it at least appears that they—or rather Steve—have modified some of their more extreme beliefs 

I wouldn't be surprised if, behind the curated blog posts, the entire family struggled spiritually and emotionally the past couple of years.  Steve has heart disease, Sarah got seriously injured while working out in the basement, Anna's cancer, the early arrival of Madeline, and the world outside the Maxwells has been changing as well.  Obviously the main stuff that we all know, but also the Maxwells were sort of friends with the Duggars. I know they don't read the news but they probably still saw Josh's mugshot on magazine covers. Mary once wrote a long, glowing review of one of the Duggar books and clearly looked up to them as a perfect family. The Duggars were testers for the MOTH system as well. It's weird when someone you sort of but not really know, yet look up to, is suddenly everywhere as a bad dude. And the Maxwells are so sheltered that it might have been a big deal for them to realize that people aren't who they pretend to be. It wouldn't be a huge leap to ask why, if anna marie did everything "right" by their standards, why she's the one who got cancer. 

The grandkids are getting older, as in old enough to ask when the Aunties are getting married, which puts the thought into everyone's head, probably constantly.  It's a lot of stress. Maybe they mentioned something to their new pastor. Maybe Steve made the change because he got scared when he had chest pains. There's so much we don't know and it seems like there was probably a lot of different factors all at once. 

 

 

[hoipolloi]

19 minutes ago, theologygeek said:

Anna has a picture that she made public.  She is in a plane and took a picture of the land below.

Reporting something like this is fine, even if the FB page or post in question is private. Per FJ Rules, here's how to handle such information:

Quote

Paraphrasing is allowed. If you are facebook friends with a fundie, you can say “I saw so and so is pregnant.” You cannot share pictures and a birth story.  Describing an in-person meeting you had with a person we follow is fine. It is a first person narrative of your own experience. A member posting Facebook conversation with a Fundie in which they are peppering the fundie with questions is not the same. There is no way of knowing if the person answering on the other end is even really the fundie, for example. It is not the same type of experience.

Re: Sarah & higher education. Sarah could pursue classes, a degree or even a career through a local community college or something similar -- if that is what she wants to do. You're never too old to learn or go to school, if that's what you want to do.

The key here is that moving out of the fathership allows her agency and choices. 

[Bethy]

57 minutes ago, Maggie Mae said:

I wouldn't be surprised if, behind the curated blog posts, the entire family struggled spiritually and emotionally the past couple of years.  Steve has heart disease, Sarah got seriously injured while working out in the basement, Anna's cancer, the early arrival of Madeline, and the world outside the Maxwells has been changing as well.  Obviously the main stuff that we all know, but also the Maxwells were sort of friends with the Duggars. I know they don't read the news but they probably still saw Josh's mugshot on magazine covers. Mary once wrote a long, glowing review of one of the Duggar books and clearly looked up to them as a perfect family. The Duggars were testers for the MOTH system as well. It's weird when someone you sort of but not really know, yet look up to, is suddenly everywhere as a bad dude. And the Maxwells are so sheltered that it might have been a big deal for them to realize that people aren't who they pretend to be. It wouldn't be a huge leap to ask why, if anna marie did everything "right" by their standards, why she's the one who got cancer. 

The grandkids are getting older, as in old enough to ask when the Aunties are getting married, which puts the thought into everyone's head, probably constantly.  It's a lot of stress. Maybe they mentioned something to their new pastor. Maybe Steve made the change because he got scared when he had chest pains. There's so much we don't know and it seems like there was probably a lot of different factors all at once. 

 

 

Don't forget the loss of their nursing home church. It sounds like they were easing into regular-church life on Sunday nights, but the fact remains that for years and years, they'd been running a nursing home church, and hanging something like that up is going to be an emotional thing even if you were tired of it and ready to move on.

And yes, they were chummy with the Duggars in the old days of the blog, and had at least a couple of documented visits to the TTH, so seeing Josh on the cover of People Magazine when they're buying their lettuce and dried beans must have been a shock even if they didn't hear about it from anyone else.

I hadn't really thought about it like you stated, but I can see how Anna Marie's cancer could've really tripped people out in that family and their close circles. I stated when Madeline was born that I hoped the fathership wouldn't pass judgment on Chelsy and say it was her fault for wearing pants or makeup or watching movies or whatever, and I still stand by that, but when Anna Marie, the fundiest of the fundies, got cancer, what on earth could they blame? That the flowers on her frumpers were sometimes too colorful? That her Rod and Staff curriculum was too worldly and she should've just had the kids copy Bible verses all day for school? That her thrifty Instant Pot dried bean dinners were too lazy? That she took the "easy way out" by spending hours combing the daughters' long hair when they had lice? I do have to wonder if the girls struggled with that. Fundies make so many promises, especially to girls - "pursue courtship instead of dating, save your first kiss for the altar, and God will bless your marriage with a beautiful relationship and great sex and obedient children" - and those promises don't all get fulfilled. Kinda like "wait at home and your prince will come and sweep you away to bear a large army of babies for the Lord" which rings pretty hollow when you're racing toward 40 with no prospects in sight.

[Hane]

@sparkles, I completely agree: I’d bet my next Social Security check that Boeing found an “amicable” way to nudge Stevehovah out the door because he was a PITA they were sick of dealing with. At my last job, HR had my boss in for a little chat about some bigoted comments she had made (I know because I was brought in privately to confirm them), and shortly thereafter, *poof*—early retirement. (To be fair, a bunch of others retired around the same time, but she was the youngest, IIRC.)

[Bethy]

16 hours ago, Dru said:

It's actually super common for even apartments to allow dogs, especially if you are on the first floor. I see no world where Sarah leaves Ellie behind.

It's possible that this varies by area. I lived with an elderly relative years ago, and I had a small dog. When I could no longer stay there, I started looking for apartments, but there were NONE advertised in my area that would allow pets at all, not even cats.

[IReallyAmHopewell]

22 hours ago, Black Aliss said:

At the time he left Boeing the company was doing pretty well financially. If he sold off his stock then and reinvested in something more stable he'd be pretty well set financially. And didn't he leave because he objected to having to work with, or for, a woman? I've always assumed he was let go and given a handsome buyout because his union had a really strong contract. A buyout is even more likely if he was over 50, because that would have given him protected status.

Not having any debt lets anyone live on very little. Think of it. You only pay property taxes, electric, water/sewer, gas, trash (whatever they have) plus upkeep on house and cars. Now the downside is likely have to be self-insured, but with that little needing to go out in "bills" they can afford that.

[Bethy]

22 minutes ago, IReallyAmHopewell said:

Not having any debt lets anyone live on very little. Think of it. You only pay property taxes, electric, water/sewer, gas, trash (whatever they have) plus upkeep on house and cars. Now the downside is likely have to be self-insured, but with that little needing to go out in "bills" they can afford that.

Yes, plus they homeschooled and likely passed down materials from kid to kid, no school tuition to pay. Work out in the basement, no need for gym memberships. Even though sewing clothes isn't generally cheaper than buying them, the matching frumpers WERE cheaper than buying retail (I've discussed this before.) SAHM needs no paid childcare - that's a HUGE financial hemorrhage for a lot of families. Designate a couple photographers and buy some decent cameras and nobody ever needs to pay for portraits. I think they lucked out as it appears only Mary needed braces. And they built the current house and did all the work on Uriah themselves. They were definitely hardworking and self-taught, and for them, it worked really well.

[Foudeb]

Only just saw the news.

My head  exploded. 

[Howl]

29 minutes ago, Foudeb said:

Only just saw the news.  My head  exploded. 

I know! It is a literally mind blowing event in the history of Maxhell! 

Edited September 12, 2021 by Howl

[Giraffe]

26 minutes ago, Howl said:

I know! It is a literally mind blowing event in the history of Maxhell! 

I’d pretty much stopped checking on the Max’s because they’d gotten so boring. Couldn’t think of why the thread was hot and was shocked!

[VVV]

2 hours ago, Howl said:

I know! It is a literally mind blowing event in the history of Maxhell! 

It is a mind blowing event in the history of FJ!

[Mela99]

Okay thanks. I found Anna and Mary's facebooks.  Anna has a picture that she made public.  She is in a plane and took a picture of the land below.  It was taken Aug 28.  Just thought I'd bring it up because someone asked how they got to school.  I'm assuming from this picture that the girls took a plane.  
Edited to add:  Mary looks beautiful in her profile pic.  Full on makeup and everything.  

My jaw is on the ground.

[Captain Obvious]

19 hours ago, church_of_dog said:

What I'm enjoying thinking about is -- Sarah had reasons to move out.

I wonder if the food has something to do with it? Steve and Teri are both on a restrictive diet, and have said that one of their daughters can't tolerate that diet so the girls were cooking their own meals separately. 

If she's working full time that means she's going to have to work her meals around Teri cooking for herself and Steve, which is going to be a bit annoying. 

Maybe (gasps!) with working full time she just wanted to be able to set her own schedule for meals and anything else she wanted to do. 

I also wonder if it's about a housing purchase decision. Like the aim was for the girls to inherit the big house, but Sarah looked the most likely to be the one who was living there on her own in the future, and decided she wanted something different/smaller/an apartment instead of a house. So maybe she has been able to purchase something (or Steve has and she's renting to him with the intention that it will eventually become fully hers) and there are some other family plans for the other houses (possibly including downsizing for Steve and Teri).

Edited September 13, 2021 by Captain Obvious