Zach and Whitney Bates - part 4

[miss_batson]

I watched last night Facebook live, and Whitney and Zach were there among other couples. And somebody ofcourse asked are they planning to bave more babies. And Whitney answerd really quickly, not evan watching the camera "yes, sometime in the future". Zach didnt evan want to answer.  Their body language was saying they are feeling uncomfortable with that question and "please, leave us alone, why do you care? ".  Like any other "normal" couple when someone asks THAT question. 

Im sure they are not leaving it up to god. 

[Seculardaisy]

Zach and Whitney are becoming very interesting to me. It seems likely that they’re practicing some form of prevention, whether that’s BC or NFP. Sure, it’s possible she just hasn’t gotten pregnant but given how quickly Whit got pregnant after they married and then again after Bradley was born, it’s seems more likely that they’re preventing pregnancy somehow. 

I know in early episodes Zach said he wanted to have a large family but maybe that has changed, or to them large is more like 5-6 kids. Or maybe they’ll still end up popping out 10 kids.

Whit seems to be enjoying her career and I work part time (in a similar field) so I can attest that even working part time with a new baby is very challenging. I’m sure she knows having a newborn will affect her work life to at least some extent. We know Whit formula feeds so at least she won’t have to deal with pumping and working which made my working with a baby life ten times harder. The great thing about formula feeding is that it will give her at least more freedom to work as much as needed without much feeding complication. So that will be a bonus for her as far as working and popping out babies goes. It’s hard keeping up with the supply and demand of a nursing baby while being away at work. I was so thankful when I could be done with that. Of course, that is only ONE way at having kids complicates career plans. It’s a lot of work. (And please nobody think I’m knocking formula feeding or not acknowledging that it’s hard,  I formula fed my first child. Parenting is a challenge in many ways and for many reasons!

The other thing that I wonder is, while I do believe they are very fundie, I suspect they are a little more fundie-light than some of their siblings. They have made some progress in becoming slightly more main-stream (at least blending more easily with other deeply religious families in their area.) So would they still regret kissing before courtship? If they were “courting” now, would they be more open to kissing without feeling bad? Will they still discourage their kids from kissing before marriage?

We know Zach deeply admired Gil’s dad, maybe Zach will want a life more like his Uncle on his dads side, something practical and manageable that his Grandfather won’t scoff at.

I known this was long but I really am interested to see their trajectory over the years. They have made some obvious physical and it seems like mental changes since Season 1 of BUB. When the show premiered it seemed like they were gearing up for a life of constant baby making and extreme fundamentalism. Now it’s much more up in the air.

[LillyP]

I think a lot of the couples, just like Zach and Whitney, all went into marriage with an idea of how it'll go. For example, Zach saying he wanted a big family. But I fully believe kids parrot what they hear/know from their parents and at the time of marriage Zach didn't have enough life experience to know he could do things any other way than how he was raised. While I think we might see them have a couple of more kids in the distant future, I don't think we'll see them "accepting as many as God sees fit". They've gotten a taste of the real world, independence, and making their own decisions. They see that there is a different way to live and I fully believe they are enjoying it. Sure they'll never be super progressive in their thinking but there are plenty of people who are conservative Christians that aren't monsters. 

[HermioneSparrow]

9 hours ago, miss_batson said:

I watched last night Facebook live, and Whitney and Zach were there among other couples. And somebody ofcourse asked are they planning to bave more babies. And Whitney answerd really quickly, not evan watching the camera "yes, sometime in the future". Zach didnt evan want to answer.  Their body language was saying they are feeling uncomfortable with that question and "please, leave us alone, why do you care? ".  Like any other "normal" couple when someone asks THAT question. 

Im sure they are not leaving it up to god. 

Just saw the live. I'm very surprised they answer that but you never know with fundies... The "future" might be tomorrow.

Hopefully they are preventing pregnancy and just have a couple of more kids down the road but I'm not holding my breath.

[Ivycoveredtower]

On 3/8/2018 at 4:42 AM, elliha said:

I think that with Alyssa and Whitney wearing pants even around the parents and Whitney also around the kids they can be said to have made a full statement in this regard. The younger kids know this is an option, even for people they see as living life their way. I think we will see pants-wearing female minors at least in the Bates family at some point. The parents can always make themselves look good by saying that while it is their wish for their girls to wear pants they were guided by god to allow more freedom in this "non-salvation" issue.

or they can just use the excuse they use for the younger's getting away with so much that the older's never would. we are in grandparent mode. 

[MarieMarie88]

Maybe the reality of how difficult raising children and keeping a house can be set in.  I don’t think Whit lived with a larger family until her well into her teen years and since Zach was a boy he likely got out of most of the house and child rearing work unlike Erin, Michaella and Alyssa who got stuck with sister mom duties and likely got used to the constant cycle of cooking, cleaning and caring for young children. Plus Whit is only 24 and she ended up pregnant with Kaci less than a year after Bradley was born so hopefully they woke up, pulled their heads out of their rears and realized that if they didn’t slow down they could actually end up with 15+ kids. 

[albireo]

Didn't Alyssa say something to the tune of "we're happy with the two we have right now" right before she got pregnant with Zoey? I think Whitney's more likely to be hedging her bets or obfuscating to throw the spotlight off of herself, than admitting she's preventing.

[Ivycoveredtower]

5 minutes ago, albireo said:

Didn't Alyssa say something to the tune of "we're happy with the two we have right now" right before she got pregnant with Zoey? I think Whitney's more likely to be hedging her bets or obfuscating to throw the spotlight off of herself, than admitting she's preventing.

I could see her being pregnant but waiting until BUB gives her the green light to announce. she does seem to love her job though so hopefully she doesn't end up pregnant till at least after Kaci's birthday. 

[Seculardaisy]

2 hours ago, albireo said:

Didn't Alyssa say something to the tune of "we're happy with the two we have right now" right before she got pregnant with Zoey? I think Whitney's more likely to be hedging her bets or obfuscating to throw the spotlight off of herself, than admitting she's preventing.

It’s not that I don’t think they could very well end up having baby #3 within a year, I’m just saying she hasn’t gotten pregnant yet, unlike Erin and Alyssa. We know she has a track record of being a very fertile woman so I do think that there is a possibility they are using some form of prevention. They could still very well end up with a larger family size but the fact that they haven’t announced a pregnancy since Kaci’s birth is surprising. It’s not much but it counts for something.

I distrust Alyssa when she says “we aren’t having more kids right now” because she is about to have three kids under 3. Alyssa and Erin are consistently pregnant. 

[Kangaroo]

I could also see Alyssa saying "We're happy with what we have right now" because of Michael's infertility or just to keep people from asking constantly. 

For all we know Alyssa and John plan to have 20 kids, but because it's all "up to God" and God hasn't blessed Michael and Brandon and she knows everything quick and easy pregnancy accounces hurts her. I'd also day it's uncomfortable when you've got a newborn and people are already asking if your pregnant with the next one yet. I fully expect Alyssa and John will keep going until they get a couple of boys.

That or they could be just really bad at NFP.

[Ivycoveredtower]

24 minutes ago, Kangaroo said:

I could also see Alyssa saying "We're happy with what we have right now" because of Michael's infertility or just to keep people from asking constantly. 

For all we know Alyssa and John plan to have 20 kids, but because it's all "up to God" and God hasn't blessed Michael and Brandon and she knows everything quick and easy pregnancy accounces hurts her. I'd also day it's uncomfortable when you've got a newborn and people are already asking if your pregnant with the next one yet. I fully expect Alyssa and John will keep going until they get a couple of boys.

That or they could be just really bad at NFP.

that does make sense Alyssa seems very close to Micheal. where as if it was Erin in MIcheal's place I don't think she'd care that much her and Erin just do not seem close and every time they are on screen together it just seems awkward. I can not remember if it was ever said if Alyssa told Erin about her pregnancy with Allie before hand or not. I would hope so. if she just showed up at the house in that bun in the oven shirt well Erin was having miscarriage after miscarriage that would be cruel. 

[MarieMarie88]

36 minutes ago, Kangaroo said:

 

That or they could be just really bad at NFP.

Seeing how it’s highly unlikely that either of them know *anything* about sexual education or even basic female anatomy I would actually be willing to bet that this is probably pretty likely. 

[TatiFish9]

7 minutes ago, MarieMarie88 said:

Seeing how it’s highly unlikely that either of them know *anything* about sexual education or even basic female anatomy I would actually be willing to bet that this is probably pretty likely. 

Michael read the encyclopedia to learn about sex education. Maybe the other ladies Googled birth control. Women have been practicing natural preventive measures for ages. 

I think we don't give these women enough credit. 

 

[RainbowSky]

7 hours ago, MarieMarie88 said:

Seeing how it’s highly unlikely that either of them know *anything* about sexual education or even basic female anatomy I would actually be willing to bet that this is probably pretty likely. 

Well the Duggars definitely understand fertility charts. I'd assume a Bates girl would too. 

[Hisey]

7 hours ago, TatiFish9 said:

Michael read the encyclopedia to learn about sex education. Maybe the other ladies Googled birth control. Women have been practicing natural preventive measures for ages. 

I think we don't give these women enough credit. 

 

Agreed. They have smart phones. Of course they are curious. why wouldn't they know?

[Melissa1977]

8 hours ago, MarieMarie88 said:

Seeing how it’s highly unlikely that either of them know *anything* about sexual education or even basic female anatomy I would actually be willing to bet that this is probably pretty likely. 

They are isolated no more. They have met lots of Christian families with few kids and probably some of them are open about BC. They watch TV, use social networks, etc.

I bet most Bates kids won't be quiverful at all. It doesn't make them less fundie, but at least will live better.

[Kangaroo]

On 12/03/2018 at 9:22 AM, TatiFish9 said:

Michael read the encyclopedia to learn about sex education. Maybe the other ladies Googled birth control. Women have been practicing natural preventive measures for ages. 

I think we don't give these women enough credit. 

 

That's true. I'm sure the married ones in particular have easy access to look up a wealth or information or even ask their health care providers.

That being said, after looking up different methods of birth control they might decide they find them too sinful or against God's will. 

If they only think not having sex around ovulation is the only non sinful option they have (and even then I'm sure some fundie believe they need to be available for their husbands at any time and refusing sex because of ovulation would be sinful in itself somehow), it's going to be tough to keep the numbers down.

They might also be getting bad advice/old wives tales etc. If they look to other fundie or "Christian" birth control methods. That's not great if you've got super fertility like your mum.

[Seculardaisy]

17 hours ago, Hisey said:

Agreed. They have smart phones. Of course they are curious. why wouldn't they know?

I agree. They make apps that tell you point blank when you’re most likely fertile and when your period is expected.

[QuiverDance]

Being born into a large family definitely does not mean you'll have one.  I'm sure some of these kids will have large families, but there is no chance they all will, in my opinion.  

My dad is the oldest of 10, and out of all of his brothers and sisters, only two have four kids.  The rest have two or fewer.  Two are childless.  My maternal grandparents came from families of 12 and 11, and they had only 2 children.  Most of their siblings only had 2 children.  And that was pre-1960's, so I imagine there was some natural family planning going on because there was no hormonal birth control.  ONE of my grandmother's brothers and his wife had 17 kids. (CRAZY)  Even in our culture accustomed to large families, that was a bit nuts. He died young, otherwise there would have been more.  

[crazysnark]

Actually Whitney said "Yes, maybe in the future"and Zach chimed in with "WE HOPE" and sounded kind of annoyed. I still think Zach wants a gaggle of kids but Whitney wants to buy nice things, stay fit, and have her real estate outlet. Right now it might be fine with Zach but I can see it being a problem in the mariage later on. I also sense the other girls like Erin distancing herself from Whitney a little. 

[PurpleCats]

If you didn’t grow up in the culture (and even if you did), I’m sure the constant questioning of the state of your uterus gets irritating.  Maybe she wants more, maybe she doesn’t but the question always seems intrusive to me because it’s a veiled questioning of your sexual activity as well. 

[Ivycoveredtower]

7 hours ago, PurpleCats said:

If you didn’t grow up in the culture (and even if you did), I’m sure the constant questioning of the state of your uterus gets irritating.  Maybe she wants more, maybe she doesn’t but the question always seems intrusive to me because it’s a veiled questioning of your sexual activity as well. 

I don't feel bad for Whitney or any Bates/Duggar's for getting asked that question it's the whole  reason they are on Tv

[HarleyQuinn]

I get the feeling from reading that maybe Whitney feels comfortable enough in her position to where she can drop the fundiness a bit? Her beliefs still suck but not having eleventy kids and working outside of the home. She also strikes me as the person who would hide birth control from Zach if she wanted it. (That's not a bad thing, its her right)

[Ivycoveredtower]

3 hours ago, HarleyQuinn said:

I get the feeling from reading that maybe Whitney feels comfortable enough in her position to where she can drop the fundiness a bit? Her beliefs still suck but not having eleventy kids and working outside of the home. She also strikes me as the person who would hide birth control from Zach if she wanted it. (That's not a bad thing, its her right)

I don't know I think if you're lying to your husband about birth control or lack there of you shouldn't be married to that person. 

[HarleyQuinn]

34 minutes ago, Ivycoveredtower said:

I don't know I think if you're lying to your husband about birth control or lack there of you shouldn't be married to that person. 

Oh, I agree, but I'm trying to look at it in the perspective of a non fundy girl who ended up marrying a fundy. I guess it just wouldn't surprise me.