Lori Alexander 25: A Wife Is a Good *Thing*

[polecat]

Also on Topamax. Wish I could say it worked wonders for me. It did take me from near-daily migraine days to about 15 pain days a month. So cutting them almost by half is a success. I just wish I could say it ended them entirely. But it's not been without side effects. I can no longer speak clearly -- words come out jumbled and tend to tumble over each other, and I forget common words. I also struggle to spell common words (I'm a writer, so this is a legitimate, serious problem) and style rules. 

I can live with the numbness, tingling and other stuff. But my terminal case of the stupids really gets to me at times.

[Hane]

Re food-as-placebo ( @polecat and the fries):  In my family, we had a piece of folk wisdom saying that if you really craved something unusual when you were feeling "off," it meant that it contained some substance or other your body needed.  When my grandfather was a child (circa 1900), he was sick and desperately wanted a kosher dill pickle, which no one would give him. They lived upstairs from a deli in New York City, so when no one was looking, he got out of bed, climbed down the storm drain pipe on the outside of the building, and swiped a pickle from the barrel. Somehow, he got better right away after eating it.

[Loveday]

Today's example of Flawless Printing By Lori is yet another diatribe on submission. In the comments we have this pair of gems by the same guy, Zach:

"I am a firm supporter of the rule of thumb."

"Drastic times call for drastic measures."

In other words, he apparently believes in beating a non-submissive wife until she submits, with an instrument no larger in circumference than his own thumb, which is precisely what 'the rule of thumb' means. Someone PLEASE tell me I'm misunderstanding him. 

[Emilycharlotte]

So, in response to Mykal's rambling about  how to get "good behavior" from your wife, some guy named Zach posts, "I am a firm believer in the rule of thumb."  I thought he might be joking, but after looking at his Facebook page, I'm pretty sure he isn't.

Do you think Lori knows this is a reference to the old law that said a man could beat his wife as long as he used a rod no wider than his thumb? If so, does she mind that someone is posting on her page in support of wife spanking?

Her page sure is attracting some  lovely followers. 

16 minutes ago, Loveday said:

In other words, he apparently believes in beating a non-submissive wife until she submits, with an instrument no larger in circumference than his own thumb, which is precisely what 'the rule of thumb' means. Someone PLEASE tell me I'm misunderstanding him. 

Sorry, I didn't mean to basically post the same thing as you. And I don't think you are misunderstanding---his FB page was scary.

(Editing to say that this was a separate post but for some reason it merged together--sorry to be confusing. Too much Transformed Wife has apparently melted my brain.)

[Hane]

Curmudgeon here:  The "rule of thumb"="beating a wife with a rod no thicker than your thumb" thing is a persistent urban myth. "Rule of thumb" basically means eyeballing a situation and making an approximate measure. There are more details, credible and of historic nature, in Wikipedia.

(Thanks go to my grad-level research professor, who drummed into me a deep suspicion of facile anecdotes.)

[Loveday]

9 minutes ago, Hane said:

Curmudgeon here:  The "rule of thumb"="beating a wife with a rod no thicker than your thumb" thing is a persistent urban myth. "Rule of thumb" basically means eyeballing a situation and making an approximate measure. There are more details, credible and of historic nature, in Wikipedia.

(Thanks go to my grad-level research professor, who drummed into me a deep suspicion of facile anecdotes.)

I'm relieved to know that. I had always heard it defined in terms of beating a wife. But I do wonder, though...does Zach know it's just an urban myth? 

@Emilycharlotte no worries!  And his page IS a bit off-putting, isn't it? 

[Hane]

@Loveday, I bet you my next paycheck that Zach fully believes the stick-as-thick-as-a-thumb thing.

[Loveday]

Just now, Hane said:

@Loveday, I bet you my next paycheck that Zach fully believes the stick-as-thick-as-a-thumb thing.

I won't even take that bet, you're a shoo-in to win. 

[Emilycharlotte]

Hane, thank you for the information!

However, I do fear Zach was referring to the urban myth. 

If you scroll far enough on his page, you will find that same John Wayne wife-spanking clip that Lori once posted.  (You will also learn that using pharmacies will condemn you to eternal damnation. So that's not good.)

 

[TeddyBonkers]

OH SNAP, someone quoted Lori's words and Ken does the backpedal!!  (Under the Notebook Doodle of a man asking for a foot massage-sorry, I still haven't figured out screenshots on my computer.)

Quote

Ken Alexander Funny, but if a wife said this to a husband, most would not think twice about it and do it. And for those wondering... I don't like foot massages as they hurt my feet, but my wife likes them :). I am just glad my wife loves to serve me in other ways without being asked.

Facebook Commentor "P" According to you and your wife, most men would do it, but most women would not because women are selfish and lazy? Hmmm.

Ken Alexander  Certainly not lazy. Selfish would be perhaps too strong a word. It is a matter of expectations by far too many wives where they are not afraid to ask their husbands to help with this or that, but feel put out when a husband asks them to do something. It is certainly not all women, but the point of the post is to get those whose knee jerk reaction to serving their husband is "no way." "I'm too busy, you don't help me enough, that's not my job..."

Facebook Commentor "P" "selfish & lazy" were the words written. Thank you for not affirming those words.

Ken Alexander They don't see it as selfish, but anything that places self over the one we say we love the most in this world is a lack of focus and clarity that Lori is trying to bring to wives; and is quite successful at doing so for those who have ears to hear above being offended.

Facebook Commentor "P"  "Words are a main tool for relating. They build, connect and heal. They can also humiliate, manipulate and destroy. A call to truth is always to be done with gentleness, humility and dignity, for we are calling to one made in God's image."
~ Diane Langberg

Ken Alexander Yes, and in an evil age when many Christians are walking away from God's clear truth and demands on their lives, there are some who God calls to boldly call out sin. It is the gentleness of today's church that is allowing many to comfortably avoid the tough subjects that Lori addresses well. She won't always write it perfectly, but her intent is pure, and the fruit of her ministry excellent. Jesus gave many rebukes for sin and was a lot tougher in his language when he calls out his... "Evil and perverse generation."

Facebook Commentor "P" Thank you for your replies. Diane Langberg has been called by God. She is a world-renowned trauma recovery expert who has counseled abuse victims for decades. I quoted her in an effort to communicate something important. I'll leave you with a few words from Dr. Langberg: "Any power that you and I hold is God’s and has been given to us by Him. It has been given for the sole purpose of glorifying Him ~ Whenever power is used in a way that wounds the vulnerable, that exploits trust, abuse has occurred ~ Using our position in the home or the church to get our own way, serve our own ends, crush others, silence them and frighten them, is an ungodly use of power."

 

[EowynW]

Reading through the comments in the latest few shitdoodles. Why do the leghumpers think that a woman having to work two means the couple is living extravagantly or aren't making something of themselves?

 

fundies are so stupid.  I just got into a similar argument with fundie BIL & a fundie male cousin. Both ganged up on me online.  Both insisting that nearly all people forced to work in low pay poor work environments were just selfish, lazy people who refused to better themselves, and clung to such "wasteful things" such as cellphone, a pet, etc etc. 

then right after that my inlaws pounced on us and rudely brought up the "when will you be giving us grandkids" and"why aren't you trusting God about providing for them" bullshit  

mr ew & I are pretty well convinced that we will only be having two kids. Part of me is sad, feeling like we will be selfish failures of parents by limiting ourselves (remember we are recovering/escaped undies) but part of me is so relieved, because I don't want Mr EW to have to work 3 jobs just to scrape by. 

[So-Virgin-It-Hurts]

3 hours ago, polecat said:

Also on Topamax. Wish I could say it worked wonders for me. It did take me from near-daily migraine days to about 15 pain days a month. So cutting them almost by half is a success. I just wish I could say it ended them entirely. But it's not been without side effects. I can no longer speak clearly -- words come out jumbled and tend to tumble over each other, and I forget common words. I also struggle to spell common words (I'm a writer, so this is a legitimate, serious problem) and style rules. 

I can live with the numbness, tingling and other stuff. But my terminal case of the stupids really gets to me at times.

I'm glad, @polecat .  I take about the strongest dose possible but (thankfully) my side effects aren't as pronounced as yours and what @usmcmom experienced.  Even after all these years I still have some word-finding issues which I address by trying to 'talk around' it (circumlocution).  I nearly always get there eventually.  My spelling and writing grammar has deteriorated SEVERELY.  Thank god for spell check but I really feel it when I need to write a quick hand written note.  I'm astounded at what I miss on the first edit, even little things on FJ.  My writing use to be so tight!  Unfortunately my job involves a great deal of speaking / explaining things to others and report writing.  But that's it for side effects others than the kidney stones which are addressed.  Hang in there fellow migrainers!  You're my people!

[BlackSheep]

4 hours ago, Loveday said:

I'm relieved to know that. I had always heard it defined in terms of beating a wife. But I do wonder, though...does Zach know it's just an urban myth? 

@Emilycharlotte no worries!  And his page IS a bit off-putting, isn't it? 

It was very off-putting. And downright scary.

He'll change his tune about the evils of modern medicine if he ever needs it to stay alive and well.

[Imrlgoddess]

12 hours ago, EowynW said:

Reading through the comments in the latest few shitdoodles. Why do the leghumpers think that a woman having to work two means the couple is living extravagantly or aren't making something of themselves?

 

fundies are so stupid.  I just got into a similar argument with fundie BIL & a fundie male cousin. Both ganged up on me online.  Both insisting that nearly all people forced to work in low pay poor work environments were just selfish, lazy people who refused to better themselves, and clung to such "wasteful things" such as cellphone, a pet, etc etc. 

then right after that my inlaws pounced on us and rudely brought up the "when will you be giving us grandkids" and"why aren't you trusting God about providing for them" bullshit  

mr ew & I are pretty well convinced that we will only be having two kids. Part of me is sad, feeling like we will be selfish failures of parents by limiting ourselves (remember we are recovering/escaped undies) but part of me is so relieved, because I don't want Mr EW to have to work 3 jobs just to scrape by. 

I have wondered that exact same thing!  All I can speak for is my own household and those around me:  my own family and others I know of aren't extravagant in any sense of the word.  Up until this year my husband was still using the old giant rear projection TV that his grandfather bought in 1995.  Yes we have cell phones, but we don't use a house phone and use them as our work "on call" devices as well.  So I guess I'm extravagant because I want to drive my own vehicle particularly when he's out of town, therefore have my own note (only one year left woohoo!)  Or maybe my friend is because she has 5 children, her husband's income is capped out, and they like to eat more than rice, eggs, and ground meat from time to time!  

Honestly, could my husband and I make our house work on just his income?  Possibly.  But I would never see him.   He'd be at work roughly 12 hours, 5 days a week.  Minimum.  I really don't think Lori and those like her understand what extravagant is.  Yes, I do know a couple in which the wife works and makes good money because she likes nice things.  But they are one couple out of dozens that I know who are able to make that distinction.  Most around here need that dual income.  Lori would shit herself if her husband ever came home early from work and said, "There's a shut down, they'll call us when we can go back to work.  No, i don't get paid if I'm not working."  It's not extravagance, it's survival.  

 

Also:  don't be so hard on yourself hon.  Savor your time with your husband, children will happen when they happen, ready or not.  Give yourself those intended two, you both may decided way later that another is possible or not.  You've got plenty of time to sort those details out.  When your parents start in on you, tell them God will give you a baby when he knows it's time and not a moment before.  

[Red Hair, Black Dress]

Here are some random thoughts and questions based on Lori's latest shitdoodles -   thanks for that description  @EowynW

1)  Lori believes that feminism is evil and women should never, ever work -- married women of course, but all women. Parents are supposed to support non-working SAHD.  Lori said she didn't care that women could have bank accounts because her dad supported her completely before she married Ken.
A)  Would Lori's father have/ still be supporting Lori if she was single?   B) If she was a SAHD does she believe her BILs  would take over after dad's passing?   C) If her daughters were SAHDs would Ken be supporting both and willing to do so forever?  D)  Would she expect her sons to support their SAHD sisters after Ken's passing?  E) Does she expect her sons to support her (Lori) after Ken's passing? ( Based on Lori's spending habits, I don't believe that Ken has put all that much aside nor do I think he plans to retire ever.)

2) Ken's side of the story described Lori's parents' marriage as 2 islands -- Dad worked 60 hours a week, mom took care of the home, they didn't interact much.   Yet somehow this was a good marriage.  A) Why would anyone think that? (Sounds like pretty miserable marriage to me.)  He also said that at the time Lori became submissive he was looking for greater deeper emotional intimacy in his marriage. So 5 minutes and some lube, 2-3 times week equals greater deeper emotional intimacy?  Damn how bad was it before?

3)  I cannot wrap my head around the Lori/  fundie belief that a husband working 3 jobs to support the family is a good thing.  This is a man who will spend very little time at home with his wife and children.  This is man who will be physically and mentally stressed and stretched to make ends meet.  This is consider an ideal and a goal? Why? (It's nuts I tell you, nuts).

4)  Does Lori realize that without the evil feminism and credit laws changing, that all her credit would die with Ken because she would have nothing in her own name?  That Ken would specifically have to will her the house because she could not be on the title deed as an owner. That she would not be able to have a bank account in her own name to pay her bills or to draw out cash to spend.  

Obviously being raised evil un-christian Catholic by a SAHM who was also a feminist as well as by a father who was a feminist, believed his children could do and achieve anything regardless of our gender, and pushed. pushed, pushed higher ed ( incl grad school) as worthwhile  .......  Well it's obvious that I was warped at an early age because all this fundie nonsense is just beyond my understanding,  Says the woman who was raised in the rural South surrounded by pentecostals and hard shell Baptists, 

 

[smittykins]

As someone living on disability(under $1000/month--gee, where have we heard that before?), I admit that sometimes I feel guilty about having such "wasteful items" as cable/internet and a smartphone, even though the phone was paid for with birthday money and I'm on Verizon's cheapest prepaid plan(I actually qualify for a low-income phone, but I couldn't activate it because I couldn't get any reception).  Not to mention Spectrum jacked up my bill $20 when they bought out Time Warner.

And I'm not going to even discuss giving up my cat. 

[EowynW]

39 minutes ago, smittykins said:

As someone living on disability(under $1000/month--gee, where have we heard that before?), I admit that sometimes I feel guilty about having such "wasteful items" as cable/internet and a smartphone, even though the phone was paid for with birthday money and I'm on Verizon's cheapest prepaid plan(I actually qualify for a low-income phone, but I couldn't activate it because I couldn't get any reception).  Not to mention Spectrum jacked up my bill $20 when they bought out Time Warner.

And I'm not going to even discuss giving up my cat. 

My fundie BIL makes an awesome $25 an hour (a fact he's loudly very proud about online) and still will not let my sister have even a cat because they "can't afford a pet right now." We make way less than that but would never give up our 2 dogs and crazy kat. 

 

@Imrlgoddess thank you! We are still hoping to wait another year or two, even though I am 30. My health is weak and we just walk way too tight of a line financially right now. We've been talking a lot lately and we feel that both of us so strongly wanting to wait must mean that we are intended to put it off awhile longer. Much to the horror of both of our fundie families.  

[Red Hair, Black Dress]

@EowynW is this your fundie BIL who's something of a jerk to your sister -- and to you and Mr. EW?

Maybe a cat could "accidentally" follow your sister home or just show up there.   That's what we did growing up -- animals were always following us home. My parents were very soft hearted about pets . We had a continuous string of multiple simultaneous cats and dogs as well as an old pony who was just a pet.

Or would your BIL make her get rid of the cat or do it himself?  At $25/hour he's pulling in more than enough for a bag of cat chow and some litter.

 

[Koala]

Lori and Ken have both asserted that children are the best retirement plan. 

They have been on vacation since the end of June (Lori posted the pic of her suitcase on the 24th), so 6 weeks this Saturday.  Last year they stayed 7.   

She spends money like she's printing it in her basement.  Literally hundreds of dollars worth of face cream, oils, vitamins, sprays, clothes, and shoes.  There is absolutely no telling what she spends on all of the magic medicine she's always finding online.  Her little Instagram photo of her "first aid kit"?  That's nearly $200 worth.  Hell, we just keep band-aids and Neosporin in ours. 

Then of course there's the kitchen remodel.  It was planned for five years from now, but Lori "accidentally" sabotaged her counter tops, and oops, now they need to remodel the entire kitchen.

I guarantee you they are counting on their sons to bankroll their retirement.

[EowynW]

2 minutes ago, Red Hair, Black Dress said:

@EowynW is this your fundie BIL who's something of a jerk to your sister -- and to you and Mr. EW?

Maybe a cat could "accidentally" follow your sister home or just show up there.   That's what we did growing up -- animals were always following us home. My parents were very soft hearted about pets . We had a continuous string of multiple simultaneous cats and dogs as well as an old pony who was just a pet.

Or would your BIL make her get rid of the cat or do it himself?  At $25/hour he's pulling in more than enough for a bag of cat chow and some litter.

 

Yep the same one. Only BIL I have on my side. I told her she should go get something since she's in a new state and is only. But she won't since he doesn't like cats. Hopefully one day. 

Mr  EW wasn't a big cat fan but when I rescued the tiny screeching ball now known as Skittles (he named her) he quickly fell in love and she naps with him now. 

 

yea $25 an hour plus he bought a house so honestly they're pretty sweetly set up. He thinks it's because he's so mature and way more hardworking than most of society. But he lucked out and got in with just the right (rich) guy who put him on a fasttrack, tbh. 

@Koala that seems like such a selfish reason to have children. Children don't even ask to be brought into this world. 

[usmcmom]

My daughter wanted a cat so badly when they moved to a new city. Her husband kept telling her it was not in the budget but he surprised her with a kitten last Christmas!  I wanted to drive six hours and hug him forever for that. 

I can see a huge decline in her stress with that kitten. She's a night shift nurse and he has been so good for her. Our son-in-law is a big puddle of goo over him too.  He freely admits it was worth the pet deposit for the apartment and all the other expenses.  He is constantly sending my daughter pictures at work and typing "OMG! He is so cute!"  

@EowynWI really hope your sister can get her cat. Pets work wonders for our overall health. It seems like she could really use some extra love in her life. 

[louisa05]

We probably bring in less than $25 an hour over the course of a year together (hard to say as my income is not predictable--it is $0 in July and August and ranged from to $250 to $1400 a month take home pay last school year and his varies due to overtime--spring is heavy overtime--like 10 hours a week or more while winter might only be 4 hours a week--it's never zero, though). And we have a rabbit. The expenses are not that bad for him and having a pet is definitely worth every extra penny. 

I apologize in advance for this as it seems a horrible thing to say, but here it is: 

I assume Ken is fervently hoping Lori dies first so he will be free. 

[SuperNova]

13 hours ago, EowynW said:

Reading through the comments in the latest few shitdoodles. Why do the leghumpers think that a woman having to work two means the couple is living extravagantly or aren't making something of themselves?

 

fundies are so stupid.  I just got into a similar argument with fundie BIL & a fundie male cousin. Both ganged up on me online.  Both insisting that nearly all people forced to work in low pay poor work environments were just selfish, lazy people who refused to better themselves, and clung to such "wasteful things" such as cellphone, a pet, etc etc. 

then right after that my inlaws pounced on us and rudely brought up the "when will you be giving us grandkids" and"why aren't you trusting God about providing for them" bullshit  

mr ew & I are pretty well convinced that we will only be having two kids. Part of me is sad, feeling like we will be selfish failures of parents by limiting ourselves (remember we are recovering/escaped undies) but part of me is so relieved, because I don't want Mr EW to have to work 3 jobs just to scrape by. 

I'm sorry that your family isn't more supportive of you. Your comments are always thoughtful and you and your hubby seem like genuine caring people. Please remember that you don't have to feel bad about YOUR life choices.

Mr. Nova and I had to make the very difficult decision to cut family members out of our lives for the same reasons you're facing. I found that whenever I was around my family I would be defending myself for my life choices. When I left moms house I would feel angry and guilty for days afterward, not understanding why they couldn't see the good in my life. I finally decided to take a break from my family. They didn't take a break from me and Mr Nova, though. It got worse before it got better and when things calmed down I began reconnecting on my terms. When someone crossed a boundary, I stepped back again and again until my family understood that I wouldn't be bullied anymore. 

You deserve love and respect from your family and shouldn't need to chase it. If you and Mr E feel good about your life choices that's all that matters. It ok to make the decisions that feel right to you.  

[Red Hair, Black Dress]

@EowynW Don't agonize about having children.. If the 2 of you absolutely know that a child will be a huge stress on your budget, you have a very sound reason to wait.  Contrary to fundie thinking, babies are not free.

30 is not old in the real world. Lots of women have children at 30 or beyond.  Back in the day (I'm older than you) my parents had children after 8 years of marriage.  My mother was 30 when I was born, then my sister 3 years later and then my brother when she was just shy of 38.  My sister had her first at 32 (by choice), after 11 years of marriage, her second at 36.  it all worked out fine for everyone.

Remember -- when  (or even if) to have children is up to you and Mr. EW ... and only you two.  Do. Not. let your parents and in-laws push you into "giving us grandchildren".  Tell them if they want grandchildren so badly they can adopt some and raise them.

Or you could just tell them to back off, that it's none of their business, and to never bring it up again.  My brother calls this the 'don't ask me one more m-effing time' speech.  He's been known to use the m-effing word too.

[AlwaysDiscerning]

Jeni's second response was deleted.