Jana Duggar: Courting or hype?

[Jucifer]

On March 25, 2016 at 0:30 PM, twinmama said:

Holy shit, Joy looks like an ad for joining ISIS.

Kinda reminds me of those pictures of Patty Hearst. 

[twinmama]

1 hour ago, Jucifer said:

Kinda reminds me of those pictures of Patty Hearst. 

Or Lee Harvey Oswald with the gun and newspaper.

[socalrules]

15 minutes ago, twinmama said:

Or Lee Harvey Oswald with the gun and newspaper.

Five bucks to the first fundy kidadult who knows why Patty Hearst or Lee Harvey Oswald are famous.

[twinmama]

1 hour ago, socalrules said:

Five bucks to the first fundy kidadult who knows why Patty Hearst or Lee Harvey Oswald are famous.

Quite the depressing thought...

[VixenToast]

Where the hell are her shoes!? That's what I'm wondering...

[Mothership]

On March 25, 2016 at 11:45 PM, OrchidBlossom said:

I thought so too but I tried to skim around the episode and look for the quote I'm referring to and I didn't find it. Maybe I'll look again, I just so don't want to have to watch that whole puke worthy wedding over again.

Digger girls talk courtship   This is the episode where they go to that poor girls birthday party.  

Jinger city quote   This is the snip from the bedroom discussion.

I'm not sure if either of them is the episode you're looking for.  The birthday party conversation is cringe-worthy.

[OrchidBlossom]

9 minutes ago, Mothership said:

Digger girls talk courtship   This is the episode where they go to that poor girls birthday party.  

Jinger city quote   This is the snip from the bedroom discussion.

I'm not sure if either of them is the episode you're looking for.  The birthday party conversation is cringe-worthy.

Neither of them is what I was looking for but both are incredibly awful in their own right! Thank you for your dilligence in trying to help haha

[Tim-Tom Biblethumper]

2 hours ago, Mothership said:

Digger girls talk courtship   This is the episode where they go to that poor girls birthday party.  

I vaguely remember seeing this episode, and it's conjured up questions I had at the time.  
Is the birthday-girl a friend of the Duggars?  I get the impression they're virtual strangers from this clip.
Did this poor girl's parents hire the Duggar girls to come speak at their daughter's birthday?    I'm afraid my parents would have to sleep with one eye open if they pulled that on me. 

[Larry]

On 24/03/2016 at 4:33 AM, OrchidBlossom said:

2 hours ago, OrchidBlossom said:

Neither of them is what I was looking for but both are incredibly awful in their own right! Thank you for your dilligence in trying to help haha

Isn't there an episode where the 5 oldest girls are sitting up in the bedroom and I think Jill says a girl pursuing a guy turns the guy off, and I think it was Jana or maybe Jinger who tried to say maybe sometimes it could work, and Jill just talked over them? Does anyone remember the episode I'm referring to? I tried looking at episode descriptions but nothing seemed to jog my memory.

I think it's 'Duggars, dates and Dan' that you're refering to. For some reason I own this episode on Amazon and I just watched the bit your talking about quickly. Basically they're talking about how superior their courtship method is and for some reason Jana looks close to tears while Jessa blathers on. But Jana always looks close to tears anyway. Then the producer asks if any of them would initiate something. Jill actually says 'You never know' and laughs, then Jana says 'I can say, that does not work' and Jinger says a girl trying to get a guy would turn the guy off. Also at the end they are asked who they think will be the first to marry and they all look at Jana. How times change...

[OrchidBlossom]

14 minutes ago, Larry said:

I think it's 'Duggars, dates and Dan' that you're refering to. For some reason I own this episode on Amazon and I just watched the bit your talking about quickly. Basically they're talking about how superior their courtship method is and for some reason Jana looks close to tears while Jessa blathers on. But Jana always looks close to tears anyway. Then the producer asks if any of them would initiate something. Jill actually says 'You never know' and laughs, then Jana says 'I can say, that does not work' and Jinger says a girl trying to get a guy would turn the guy off. Also at the end they are asked who they think will be the first to marry and they all look at Jana. How times change...

Well aren't you just a great big blessing. Yes, thank you, that is EXACTLY the episode I meant. I knew there was something off when I watched it but it didn't really click with me til I saw people above speculating that Jana had some kind of illicit romance. She said "I can say, that does not work" and even at the time I remember being like, literally how would you know? But maybe she did early in her youth talk to a guy and sort of hide it from her parents (though I doubt it got very far). It would explain how she got shipped off to JTTH so often, why her parents often accused her of being prideful, why she seems so reluctant to court and why her parents seem so unreluctant to let her. Combine that with the "Satan coming for your firstborn" nonsense and you have a recipe for Cinder Jana. Totally ISB, but plausible.

[2manyKidzzz]

Where would CinerJana have been able to do that....the Sandy place in Texas, is it? She probably TALKEDTOAGUY. Now, that is outrageous. I didn't notice they called her prideful.

Well, whatever that terrible sin, I would say they have beaten it out of her. Makes me sad. 

[infooverload]

Didn't she volunteer with the local fire department. She could have become friends with a guy and her parents considered it inappropriate. Just speculating on one possible scenario.

[OrchidBlossom]

46 minutes ago, 2manyKidzzz said:

Where would CinerJana have been able to do that....the Sandy place in Texas, is it? She probably TALKEDTOAGUY. Now, that is outrageous. I didn't notice they called her prideful.

Well, whatever that terrible sin, I would say they have beaten it out of her. Makes me sad. 

The Duggars primarily homechurch, but have been known to visit churches they vaguely approve of. Alternatively, could have been at JTTH, a conference, or through her brothers.

40 minutes ago, infooverload said:

Didn't she volunteer with the local fire department. She could have become friends with a guy and her parents considered it inappropriate. Just speculating on one possible scenario.

This is also possible. It would certainly explain why they spent like 3 episodes hyper focusing on Jill and Jana trying to volunteer and sew skirts and then suddenly poof no more volunteering? It was a long time ago, but didn't that storyline just sort of fall off with no explanation?

[AnnaRuk09]

3 hours ago, OrchidBlossom said:

Well aren't you just a great big blessing. Yes, thank you, that is EXACTLY the episode I meant. I knew there was something off when I watched it but it didn't really click with me til I saw people above speculating that Jana had some kind of illicit romance. She said "I can say, that does not work" and even at the time I remember being like, literally how would you know? But maybe she did early in her youth talk to a guy and sort of hide it from her parents (though I doubt it got very far). It would explain how she got shipped off to JTTH so often, why her parents often accused her of being prideful, why she seems so reluctant to court and why her parents seem so unreluctant to let her. Combine that with the "Satan coming for your firstborn" nonsense and you have a recipe for Cinder Jana. Totally ISB, but plausible.

 

1 hour ago, 2manyKidzzz said:

Where would CinerJana have been able to do that....the Sandy place in Texas, is it? She probably TALKEDTOAGUY. Now, that is outrageous. I didn't notice they called her prideful.

Well, whatever that terrible sin, I would say they have beaten it out of her. Makes me sad. 

As much as many FJs would like to see a Duggar girl (or guy for that matter) act in such a way, being realistic (solely IMO) that would never happen. To me, it seems that the Duggars used to be really really strict, even more than now (probably because many of the kids were in the process of getting trained and learning). I mean they used to shout out 'nike' in public when they saw something naughty so it would let the guys know to look down. If the Duggar children have been trained all their life that even looking at someone causes them to sin or to defraud themselves, for a Duggar girl to actually go after someone would without a doubt prompt JB to either beat them or kill them. And just as someone mentioned, they are taught that a girl is never to just go up to a guy and initiate a conversation. That's just my opinion. They are all, especially Jana (and Jill), too loyal to their beliefs.

2 hours ago, OrchidBlossom said:

The Duggars primarily homechurch, but have been known to visit churches they vaguely approve of. Alternatively, could have been at JTTH, a conference, or through her brothers.

Is JTTH a girls only event?

[eclairaupistache]

Idk, but am I the only one who can't imagine Jana in a relationship at all? I can't think of a man who would really be a good fit for her (based on what they show on camera) and I always thought of her as the typical bachelorette (this is not a bad thing! For some people it's good to stay single, it's just how they prefer it). But in their world it may not be an acceptable choice.

I mean, I can see JD courting, or Jinger (she probably already is in a courtship), or even Josiah, but not Jana for some reason.

Plus: her comment: "I want a man with some dirt under his fingernails" sounds so much like Jimbob like nothing before. Come on, this sounds like a man who is butt hurt because he doesn't have a college degree, not like a young women looking for a husband.

[ksgranola1]

We were grandchild visiting last week & I missed the Duggars b/c NO CABLE!! *what kind of way is that to raise a child.* Happened to catch it last night. Jana looked absolutely pained when they asked her what she saw herself doing in 5 years. I think y'all are right about her feeling stuck & doesn't want to marry & just breed. I even wonder if they might wake up one morning & find her gone. She seems to know there's more out there than she & the other Duggs are able to access. And now that she's seen the Joshfuckery & him being welcomed back, she just might do it.

[OrchidBlossom]

18 hours ago, AnnaRuk09 said:

 

As much as many FJs would like to see a Duggar girl (or guy for that matter) act in such a way, being realistic (solely IMO) that would never happen. To me, it seems that the Duggars used to be really really strict, even more than now (probably because many of the kids were in the process of getting trained and learning). I mean they used to shout out 'nike' in public when they saw something naughty so it would let the guys know to look down. If the Duggar children have been trained all their life that even looking at someone causes them to sin or to defraud themselves, for a Duggar girl to actually go after someone would without a doubt prompt JB to either beat them or kill them. And just as someone mentioned, they are taught that a girl is never to just go up to a guy and initiate a conversation. That's just my opinion. They are all, especially Jana (and Jill), too loyal to their beliefs.

Is JTTH a girls only event?

I don't think Jana "went after" a guy in the sense that she was throwing herself at him. I agree there's no way it could even approach what one would call a normally risque interaction. But I would believe that Jana, the oldest daughter and therefore one with no "example" of girlish purity to follow, may have spoken to a guy too much for her parents' liking or struck up a friendship they decided, for whatever arbitrary reason, was inappropriate. And I 100% believe that Jimchelle would use her blossoming friendship or even slight, bare, tiny flirtation with a human male to shame her for years to come, making her believe she was going against God's plan by pursuing a guy (even if she was just friends with him, I'm sure they gaslight their kids so she may now believe she was pursuing him), by stirring up desires that could not be righteously fulfilled, by being unpure. I think Jana may have done something which WAS perfectly normal and which, without an older sister to be testing the waters, she probably believed was within the bounds of purity, and that her parents used it against her. Especially since aren't they the sort of fundie who believes that the eldest daughter is especially corruptible by Satan? I think they probably could have used some pretense of an interaction with a guy to stamp the life out of her and make an example to the others. Again, this is all totally ISB, I just think it is possible and could line up with some of her statements and the family's statements and some events.

 

JTTH has journeys for men and for women. My understanding is that the attendees don't mix much, if at all, with the opposite gender but that some of the JTTH leaders do interact with each other sometimes. Jana was a leader for a while, I believe.

[AnnaRuk09]

43 minutes ago, OrchidBlossom said:

Again, this is all totally ISB, I just think it is possible and could line up with some of her statements and the family's statements and some events..

You are just fueling my curiosity! What are some 'turning point' events and statements?

[OrchidBlossom]

19 minutes ago, AnnaRuk09 said:

You are just fueling my curiosity! What are some 'turning point' events and statements?

Well, obviously there is the statement that "I can say, that doesn't work" about chasing after a guy, which I always thought was weird. She and Jill had a multi-episode story arc where they were going to volunteer with the fire department, and then that just disappeared and was almost never mentioned again (too close to men, maybe, or even possibly this is where she made some kind of "inappropriate" friendship?), almost as if the Duggars suddenly decided it was inappropriate. She and her parents have both stated multiple times how prideful she is, which I always thought was a shaming mechanism, like how they constantly tell Jinger on national television to work on her "contentment". Except with Jana I always wondered what they meant, because Jinger was obviously as close to a rebel as that family got for a while so I understood why they kept trying to shame her, but we never saw any prideful behavior from Jana. But if she took it on herself to "pursue" (or you know, do literally anything the family could construe as pursuing) a guy, that would be seen as prideful because it would be seen as taking God's timing/plan into your own hands. Jana has been sent to JTTH like 9(?) times, way more than her siblings, maybe because they felt she had transgressed more than her siblings, and we all know transgression in ATI usually means "even remotely noticing an attractive human being in any capacity". It would definitely explain the weird shift in her personality between the specials/early episodes and the later show. She was always quiet but at some point she got positively downtrodden. They all sort of did, but Jana more than the others, I've always thought. And it would also explain her unwillingness to court (either out of fear of being unpure again or because she feels wrong about showing interest in anyone) and her parents unwillingness to let her court (beyond wanting to keep their main J'slave in the home). In the "Duggars, Dates, and Dan" episode, the cameraman asks about the process to court and says "well the way we would like it to go about, right--" and she stares at and motions to Jana and Jana has to finish the sentence in a way that is a little odd, as if testing her or prompting her to say the right thing.

Again, it's all just ISB, but once I saw someone above speculating that she had pursued someone or had talked to an interested guy who didn't go through the JB approved channels, well those things sort of clicked with me as kind of making a weird amount of sense with that idea. 

ETA: And since she is the oldest girl, I could see Jimchelle making an "example" out of her because of the Satan coming for your firstborn stuff, and I could also see her more easily falling into behavior you and I would call normal but that Jimchelle would use to guilt trip her, because she wouldn't really have seen an older sister go through the trials of puberty and learned what Jimchelle would freak out about or wouldn't.

[AnnaRuk09]

Whoa, I missed her family accusing her of being prideful. I do remember watching and hearing that she had certain feeling about some of her family members. With the firefighting theory, what makes it difficult is that Jill the tattle tale was there and if something like that happened, Jill would have probably slayed Jana. In the "Duggars, Dates, and Dan" episode, it is very interesting how she says "I can say, that does not work." Of course this could mean two things: 1.) either she said that because she was found guilty by her family of the things you stated, or 2.) she says "I can say, that does not work" to mean something along the lines of "In my opinion, I know that that doesn't work because...(she goes on to state something that JimChelle taught her" and it ended up sounding really weird.

Another thing is that, after watching the clip, she says that in a very confident way; she even raises her hand and speaks. If something that was deemed 'sinful' by her parents did happen, it's hard to imagine her just tossing that out all willy nilly with her raising her hand and saying "I know that doesn't work because I have given into that" because that would, in the eyes of her family, make her look like some whore. What's stupid is that after the scene when Jana says that, Jana starts talking again but is then muted out as the scene goes to another one, so we never get to here Jana explaining what she said by "I know that...". And then there is of course the point you brought up about her being the oldest Duggar girl without having entered into a courtship. Of course everyone speculates about this one but what makes it difficult is that in the many years past, she has always said that she is "waiting for God's timing..." and she also stated the same reason on the most recent Boring On episode. Good speculating!

P.S.

I wonder how many suitors Jinger and the older girls get (or the guys)? The family always says many ask about the girls and I think JD (joked?) about receiving tons of 'applications.'

[OrchidBlossom]

12 minutes ago, AnnaRuk09 said:

Whoa, I missed her family accusing her of being prideful. I do remember watching and hearing that she had certain feeling about some of her family members. With the firefighting theory, what makes it difficult is that Jill the tattle tale was there and if something like that happened, Jill would have probably slayed Jana. In the "Duggars, Dates, and Dan" episode, it is very interesting how she says "I can say, that does not work." Of course this could mean two things: 1.) either she said that because she was found guilty by her family of the things you stated, or 2.) she says "I can say, that does not work" to mean something along the lines of "In my opinion, I know that that doesn't work because...(she goes on to state something that JimChelle taught her" and it ended up sounding really weird.

Another thing is that, after watching the clip, she says that in a very confident way; she even raises her hand and speaks. If something that was deemed 'sinful' by her parents did happen, it's hard to imagine her just tossing that out all willy nilly with her raising her hand and saying "I know that doesn't work because I have given into that" because that would, in the eyes of her family, make her look like some whore. What's stupid is that after the scene when Jana says that, Jana starts talking again but is then muted out as the scene goes to another one, so we never get to here Jana explaining what she said by "I know that...". And then there is of course the point you brought up about her being the oldest Duggar girl without having entered into a courtship. Of course everyone speculates about this one but what makes it difficult is that in the many years past, she has always said that she is "waiting for God's timing..." and she also stated the same reason on the most recent Boring On episode. Good speculating!

1. I actually think the fact that she was with Jill makes it more likely. Like, can't you just picture Jana asking some dude how his morning was or some innocuous thing and Jill harping on her all morning to be modest, so Jana gets self-conscious, so then when dude tells her to have a good evening on her way out Jana blushes or something and Jill goes straight to Jimchelle about her immodesty and then they ask her how her thought life is and whether she is slipping back into old habits just for interacting with some nonfundie?

2.  They're supposed to admit their past "sins" and use them as testimony for how the Lord worked for good in them though. Like how Jill said somewhere that she wasn't always content to wait on the Lord's timing and was a little preoccupied with boys, or even in the "Duggars Down the Aisle" episode where Jinger is like laughing about her need to work on her contentment. I also think that kind of cheerfulness can be a defense mechanism, like if someone has harped on you for years about some mistake or character flaw, you kind of embrace it. You make light of it or try to own up to it in the hopes that the moment of scrutiny will pass quicker. I have a friend who is always late and she used to agonize over it but now she just tells people "I am late because of who I am as a person" and she sort of embraces it and owns up to it. It could be a more extreme version of that. Like, combine their beliefs in accountability (never keep your thoughts or feelings hidden because of temptation) with their belief that you must always have a cheerful countenance (and shame isn't cheerful is it?) and add in a dash of trying to avoid more hand-wringing and shaming on the matter with just a pinch of trying to make your mistake a testimony about what not to do, and you have a recipe for that kind of weirdly cheerful attitude. I mean look at how J'chelle talks about her past "immodesty", you can tell talking about it makes her uncomfortable but she laughs the whole time.

ETA: I have no real stake in this theory but it sure is fascinating to discuss! Way more interesting than the actual show.

[Kelsey]

At one point, Jana was getting to know somebody. She said in one of the episodes (I don't remember which) that "it didn't work out." Also, the girl who runs the Duggars Tumblr had posted a pic of Jana with a guy and chaperones and was contacted and asked to take it down- which she did. 

[AnnaRuk09]

3 minutes ago, Kelsey said:

At one point, Jana was getting to know somebody. She said in one of the episodes (I don't remember which) that "it didn't work out." Also, the girl who runs the Duggars Tumblr had posted a pic of Jana with a guy and chaperones and was contacted and asked to take it down- which she did. 

Do you know when this happened? I'm sure someone saved the picture if they saw a Duggar girl getting to know someone.

[Kelsey]

Just now, AnnaRuk09 said:

Do you know when this happened? I'm sure someone saved the picture if they saw a Duggar girl getting to know someone.

I wanna say it was shortly after Jessa started courting Bin. I'm pretty sure the girl from Tumblr saved the pic since that's what she does  I really wish I could remember the episode.

[OrchidBlossom]

Who wants to bite the bullet and watch every episode since Bin and Blessa started courting then?