John Shrader in Zambia Pt 5: Witnessing, Weeping & Wondering

[Grimalkin]

Just a note, but in my experience teaching a lot of African immigrants from a variety of countries, names like Blessing and Innocent aren't that unusual. I had a Precious last year, and I have a Promise and a Success this year.

John is playing with fire letting that kid come to services without the parents knowing.

I don't know why, maybe I am over tired but naming a child success tickled me. All those names are touching when you think of the parents looking down at their newborn and choosing those names.

FFS I need to stop with the random posts.

[salex]

Wouldn't it be novel idea to...oh...I dunno...let the Zambians play their own instruments in church or at least, sing their types of songs or be encouraged to write their own songs for church? Why do they have to learn John's music, accompanied by John's instruments, to John's rhythm and tempo? Why do they have to the chairs in rows? How about sitting in a circle? Or a square? Why does their have to be a baptismal pool inside? Can't they build one outside?

John is apparently incapable of contextualizing the message he is trying to preach. No, it must be wrapped up and presented in Texas/American tracts, clothing, lingo, rhetoric, music, instrumentation, and even King James language!

(The Gideons (the people who pass out the pocket New Testaments on college campuses) have always passed out KJV. I always ask them, "Why? What about our international students? Wouldn't a modern translation be a whole lot more applicable to the English they speak? [Which is often better than our own!]" I was bowled over last year, when the Gideons brought the ESV (English Standard Version) NTs to our campus.)

He pointed out that the christian songs sung at the funeral he attended were not "real" christian songs, and that most of the christians there sing songs that include bad dogma or evil words.... plus, if they sing their own songs, why did he need to go to Zambia to save them from their bad version of christianity? (oh, right, his mission leans toward being all about John)

[16strong]

Oh, for fuck's sake. This is ridiculous. He's over there doing what? Preying on a small child, taking selfies with the (two!) locals that will stand next to him and pretend they've converted, and holing himself up in his house eating beef jerky and waiting for a keyboard to arrive? Are people seriously paying for this bullshit?

[Ali]

He pointed out that the christian songs sung at the funeral he attended were not "real" christian songs, and that most of the christians there sing songs that include bad dogma or evil words.... plus, if they sing their own songs, why did he need to go to Zambia to save them from their bad version of christianity? (oh, right, his mission leans toward being all about John)

I am really curious about what John considers bad dogma and evil words.

[PrairieGirl]

I am really curious about what John considers bad dogma and evil words.

FFS, I hope he didn't say anything regarding the "evil" songs being sung. Does this man have no shame? Nevermind, I know the answer.

I wish someone would ask him in what fucking universe does he think it is okay to coerce a child into coming to his church w/o the parents' knowledge, and how he would feel if someone was luring one of his children to another church. And the answer "because Jebus" does not suffice.

[slickcat79]

John was complaining about the songs at Mr. Phiri's sister's funeral. He was horrified that they said things like "Whether in God or the devil, you will be comforted" :?

The songs sounded kind of confusing to me, but I don't think they were speaking English. John was counting on Kennedy to translate, so I'm not sure how he even knew what the words were.

[salex]

John was complaining about the songs at Mr. Phiri's sister's funeral. He was horrified that they said things like "Whether in God or the devil, you will be comforted" :?

The songs sounded kind of confusing to me, but I don't think they were speaking English. John was counting on Kennedy to translate, so I'm not sure how he even knew what the words were.

That was what I was referring to. And the dogma basically is anything other than Baptist is wrong and hellbound, and some Baptists are falling away because they are messing up repentance and seeking works for salvation.

Which makes me wonder if one too many people said something about "by their works you shall know them" or referred to his ministry not showing much fruit..... either way, he's very persnickity about what baptists are OK and which one's aren't and just knows if a person isn't the right kind of baptist, they aren't going to make it to heaven...

[guitar_villain]

I am really curious about what John considers bad dogma and evil words.

Airplane? Rea? Thrift?

[quincygal]

[

Because if the need to pay for shipping they can milk their followers for more and more money.

quote]

I work for a multi-national logistics company. Whenever I see stuff like John's prodigal wasting of money on shipping, I mentally rub my hands together & cackle like Mr Burns:)

[Palimpsest]

I just do not understand why any donors are continuing to support him. How stupid can these people be?

Of course, I didn't understand why anyone gave him money in the first place, but his time in Zambia has hardly been "productive" in their terms. To say nothing of the big schism with Rea and the original sending church.

His wants (not needs) are always so extravagant so when will the surviving donors smell a rat? Fools and their money ...

[Milly-Molly-Mandy]

I don't understand why anyone supports him when there are so many good causes to support (including Christian ones)

A FJite explained it as all that really mattered to people in his type of church was converting people to their brand of Christianity. Not health care for the 'sweet Africans' or education or gasp clean drinking water. Heavens forbid!

I still think it's crazy anyone supports him but I guess that is why.

[gustava]

Maybe they support him to keep him out of the US and to keep his family in one place, instead of wandering in a camper.

[Palimpsest]

Yes, MMM. I agree. I think the point I was trying to make was that John Shrader is an exceptionally bad "missionary" even among Fundie "conversion-only or conversion-by-tract" types. The worst type in my book.

I've browsed quite a few blogs by IFB missionaries to Africa (sorry I don't have them bookmarked) and they all seem to do more than John and survive with far fewer luxury items. John happy-claps about distributing a few of his tracts and having a handful of converts. I think following Rea now he is in Zambia may demonstrate how little John has done even with all his expensive toys. (BTW, has he found the key to the plane yet?)

John is a greedy, needy, never-ending money pit. He was dropped by his first sending church, which people with more knowledge than I about IFB missionaries say is almost unheard of (they'll correct me if I'm wrong about that.) He has a very low conversion rate for the time he has been there and the taint of "doctrinal difference" should be following him.

I've always said that John has to be quite charismatic in person given his exceptional success at grifting. He left Rea in the dust at that.

IFB missionaries don't all seem to be church planters only. His donors could be sending their dollars to other missionaries and far more worthy causes. There is an IFB family in Zambia who run an orphanage in a renovated motel, for example. So there are alternatives to John's high-faluting church planting, sanctimonious toilet paper littering, starting a "right" kind of Christianity bible school only scam.

I'm really surprised they haven't all figured out that he is a greedy non-productive money pit yet and cut him off.

[Palimpsest]

Maybe they support him to keep him out of the US and to keep his family in one place, instead of wandering in a camper.

Sort of like a remittance man? :)

Yes, perhaps John is so embarrassing to his father and his father's church they are willing to pay him to stay out of the USA. Why do they have to inflict him on Zambia though?

The children are probably enjoying the stability in Zambia. I still hope none of them get sick.

[formergothardite]

Yes, MMM. I agree. I think the point I was trying to make was that John Shrader is an exceptionally bad "missionary" even among Fundie "conversion-only or conversion-by-tract" types. The worst type in my book.

I've browsed quite a few blogs by IFB missionaries to Africa (sorry I don't have them bookmarked) and they all seem to do more than John and survive with far fewer luxury items. John happy-claps about distributing a few of his tracts and having a handful of converts. I think following Rea now he is in Zambia may demonstrate how little John has done even with all his expensive toys. (BTW, has he found the key to the plane yet?)

John is a greedy, needy, never-ending money pit. He was dropped by his first sending church, which people with more knowledge than I about IFB missionaries say is almost unheard of (they'll correct me if I'm wrong about that.) He has a very low conversion rate for the time he has been there and the taint of "doctrinal difference" should be following him.

I've always said that John has to be quite charismatic in person given his exceptional success at grifting. He left Rea in the dust at that.

IFB missionaries don't all seem to be church planters only. His donors could be sending their dollars to other missionaries and far more worthy causes. There is an IFB family in Zambia who run an orphanage in a renovated motel, for example. So there are alternatives to John's high-faluting church planting, sanctimonious toilet paper littering, starting a "right" kind of Christianity bible school only scam.

I'm really surprised they haven't all figured out that he is a greedy non-productive money pit yet and cut him off.

I still have IFB friends on FB and they often link to missionary stories and John really is worthless even for an IFB missionary who is just going to convert folks. It is astounding that anyone is supporting him at this point. All he has done in the last year is accumulate stuff for himself. He is living better in Zambia than he did in America. John must be charismatic in person, but even that will only take him so far. He has lost a lot of financial support, lost his sending church, lost Team Zambia and gotten into a non-ending battle about doctrine. He requested a plane and flying lessons so he could fly to the bush to save souls, but that has fallen through. He requested a new Troupe so that he could drive to the bush to take Bibles, but that has fallen through. His printing ministry doesn't seem to be doing much. He has only "saved" a couple of souls. Even IFB churches are going to realize John is a poor steward of money and supplies.

[Handmaiden of Dog]

He may be a poor steward of money and supplies but more importantly...he is hilarious! I think someone should make a movie about his exploits-- comedy gold.

[FloraKitty35]

He may be a poor steward of money and supplies but more importantly...he is hilarious! I think someone should make a movie about his exploits-- comedy gold.

John Shrader is the Virgil Starkwell of missionaries. John's biopic would be the "Take the Money & Run" of missionary stories.

[Growelly]

He shared a (probably fake) story about an elderly couple.

It's introduced by mourning the state of divorce and infidelity these days... :whistle:

[SPHASH]

He shared a (probably fake) story about an elderly couple.

It's introduced by mourning the state of divorce and infidelity these days... :whistle:

I guess that's his response to Josh/Anna. BTW People Mag reported that Anna and Esther's sister Rebekah is divorcing. Did Pa Keller pick out her husband too?

[anjulibai]

He did, but they went mainstream pretty quickly after they got married. The divorce could just be from them growing apart, and not the guy being a douche. He showed up on TWOP once (I think it was TWOP) to give his account of what happened at Josh and Anna's wedding.

[Palimpsest]

He did, but they went mainstream pretty quickly after they got married. The divorce could just be from them growing apart, and not the guy being a douche. He showed up on TWOP once (I think it was TWOP) to give his account of what happened at Josh and Anna's wedding.

That would be Josh McD(onald). He did post on TWoP, and has been critical of IBLP elsewhere - on Recovering Grace, I think. On TWoP he was furious with TLC, wanted everyone to know that Josh and Anna were really in love although he didn't like the Duggar wedding circus, and thought Dad Keller was greatly misunderstood by snarkers. He identified as Conservative Christian and didn't come over as a douche.

If People has its facts right and Josh McD and Rebekka are divorcing, I'm sorry. Perhaps it is the right thing to do, but the failure of a marriage is always sad and they have several children, IIRC.

Josh McD always seemed the best of the bunch when it came to Pa Keller's picks for his daughters. Mind you, Pa Keller sets the bar low.

[enigmata]

My Mum grew up kind of Fundie-Lite but turned more mainstream when she met and married Dad (that did NOT go down well with her family).

I'm an avid reader and ended up reading all of her childhood books - loads were about missionaries in Africa. At the age of about 10 I really wanted to be a missionary - I thought it sounded very important and exotic.

Amazingly, in the thirty odd years since, I have grown up. I have realised that God is actually calling me to serve him by working a normal job and being a 'prophet' in my own community. Paying my own way and witnessing through the way I live and interact with others.

John seems to have a very weird idea of what it means to be a missionary. Even as a Christian I think that what he is doing is pointless and a waste of money (a very big waste of money).

BTW - I'm about 100 miles from the Scottish border. I think it's hilarious that we are being sent missionaries who need 'care packages' :lol: I mean, we don't have shops or anything like that ;) So funny.

So, God Bless from the very 'unsunny' nearly Scotland :D

[anjulibai]

That would be Josh McD(onald). He did post on TWoP, and has been critical of IBLP elsewhere - on Recovering Grace, I think. On TWoP he was furious with TLC, wanted everyone to know that Josh and Anna were really in love although he didn't like the Duggar wedding circus, and thought Dad Keller was greatly misunderstood by snarkers. He identified as Conservative Christian and didn't come over as a douche.

If People has its facts right and Josh McD and Rebekka are divorcing, I'm sorry. Perhaps it is the right thing to do, but the failure of a marriage is always sad and they have several children, IIRC.

Josh McD always seemed the best of the bunch when it came to Pa Keller's picks for his daughters. Mind you, Pa Keller sets the bar low.

Yes, I agree on both counts. He did seem interested in protecting his family from the media circus, which is, in hind sight, a really good thing.

But who knows what he was really like. I hope their divorce is relatively easy on both them and their daughters.

[salex]

John is giving a joyous face book update, because a family friend has donated $5000 to his church building fund--without anyone telling the friend they needed money 8-) This on top of the money donated after

my beloved only sister passed from this earthly life earlier this year, my father established a memorial fund in her name as she had always desired to be a part of our missionary endeavors.

(What was her name again? Oh, he remembered it later in the post)

And this is super important because, as we all know John has been

starting from nothing here in Kafue where there are no Biblical missionaries

.

And they building they have been using as a church, well they have to move into that as their home because, regarding the house they have been living in

the landlord may very well be demon possessed!

:nenner:

So, his congregation of the church he has planted is very excited, a they got a deal on the land and everything, and the baptistery was built first (right after that donation box)

[heagleca]

My thinking is John still has support because his father's church is his sending church and it is my assumption only, but I imagine his dad could be as big a grifter/deceiver as John is and his congregation is a flock of really naive people. I don't know why, but I sort of doubt they are keeping him on as a way for his family to be housed and fed instead of in a camper.