CA has mandatory vaccination/CA Bans Personal Belief Exemp

[Edhelfin]

Sorry I seem to have made a double post and cannot delete one of them - no idea why.

ItsFunToRun is the one who made disgusting remarks about a member's disabled kid, right?

Anyway, my answer to the rhetorical question 'So does this apply to the disabled too?' is:

No.

Now that Hitler, Holocaust and abortion references are used, is there anything else on the fundie bingo/'refer to when confronted' list? Pedophilia? Marrying dogs?

[happy atheist]

It was from a discussion on, I think, Jim Carey's remarks on the issue.

Ah yes, noted epidemiologist and pet detective Jim Carrey.

[formergothardite]

From what I can tell Jim Carrey didn't say it, she stole it from an online comment section, the havens of reason and knowledge on the internet.

[FundieFarmer]

Ahh shit. Now there's this on the side of my screen:

Feel free to keep any revenue from it, Mods. I ain't mad :lol:

[Snarkylark]

Well, I just wanted to add that based on her views (and response to me and overall self- as she is likely fundie), she would probably be happy if I were to die due to catching something from an unvaccinated kid. Because, you know, gays are awful! And then there's that Hitler quote. My friend's fiancee I mentioned, is Jewish. If you're so callous about making Holocaust comparisons, you're probably anti-Semetic too.

I don't know you or your sexual preference. I wouldn't wish harm on anyone, ever.

[The Duggar's Mohel]

What forum do you think you are on?

Touche

[FundieFarmer]

I don't know you or your sexual preference. I wouldn't wish harm on anyone, ever.

...what about the people who'd be harmed by exposure to unvaccinated individuals? This is a two-sided coin. Protecting one theoretical group means another will be at risk. You can't win.

[The Duggar's Mohel]

Did you read the rest of my post or are you just jumping on something so you can point out that America is backwards and whatever country you are in is soooo much better?

I did read the rest of your post, and having lived in America as well as a lot of other places, America is backwards and the country I live in is soooo much better, that if you cared to just look to the right a little, you'd clearly see where that was. So please, the fact you can't see "Toronto" clearly on my profile, coupled the fact you snidely accuse me of not reading your post and then come off a quite an ass for no reason is laughable.

[EmmieJ]

:ew:

Oh dear God.

I hope she's not really an RN, or at the very least, now retired. Most of all, I hope she's not part of the Kaiser Northern California system, where I am a member and get my health care needs met.

I have several friends who are nurses, and they are truly wonderful, dedicated, hard-working, rational and intelligent people. I don't think they'd get along with Snarkylark as a co-worker.

[EmmieJ]

As to who will pay for the vaccines - my son and I have coverage through Kaiser. His is through what used to be called Healthy Families, but now it's Medi-Cal (due to my income level). All his well checks, annual physical for school, and any vaccinations have zero co-pay. Other visits require a $10 co-pay.

Last year, I got a flu shot. That was also at no charge. I haven't had any vaccines lately, but I think if they are considered recommended at a certain point, I would have no co-pay for those either.

With the passage of Obamacare, most people now have access to affordable health coverage. I believe that regular vaccinations are probably covered at no charge, similar to how my colonoscopy was covered after I turned 50.

[Maggie Mae]

I did read the rest of your post, and having lived in America as well as a lot of other places, America is backwards and the country I live in is soooo much better, that if you cared to just look to the right a little, you'd clearly see where that was. So please, the fact you can't see "Toronto" clearly on my profile, coupled the fact you snidely accuse me of not reading your post and then come off a quite an ass for no reason is laughable.

I rarely look at user names and location because I don't care who says what. I don't play favorites like that. I don't care how long someone has posted here. I'm wondering why you quoted me out of context - I asked the question because I don't know what the State of California does for public health and vaccinations. And then I defended the practice of vaccinations. I'm sorry that SOME people in my country are backwards. It's not like everyone is opposed to public health. I'm just tired of some of the people on this board CONSTANTLY complaining about how backward the US is.

[Firiel]

I googled the exact wording of her borrowed argument, and it didn't turn up any results.

[VodouDoll]

You can choose now to get vaccinated to protect yourself. Did you have chicken pox as a child? If so, you don't need a vaccination because you are protected for life and you won't get CP again (typically.) The pneumo and CP vac are available for adults. Get them if you're concerned about it. They can check your titers to see if immunity has waned and you need boosters.

I find it interesting that you think it's ok to subject a child to potential vaccine injury so YOU won't get sick. Stay out of the public then. Same argument as those you want to force vaccinations on.

That "typically" is a big gamble. My mother had chicken pox as a child and I was unvaxxed for it. I got it when I was seven, gave it to her as a pregnant adult, and it caused her to miscarry. It was one of those bizarre one-in-a-million things.

[Edhelfin]

I googled the exact wording of her borrowed argument, and it didn't turn up any results.

That is because it probably is a made up 'debate' she pretends to refer to - quoting something or someone else would make it easier to say 'look there are other people who think like I am'.

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

The SCOTUS has ruled that women have a CHOICE in what happens to their body. I'm asking for that same CHOICE. When you can tell me that every vaccine is safe for every child all the time and that there haven't been people harmed by vaccines, then you may have a different argument. Until then, why should anyone offer up their child for a medical procedure that could be harmful or life threatening? I don't believe in losing the individual's rights for the society as a whole. And again, we are not talking the majority here. It's a small group, relatively speaking, that doesn't vaccinate. And there's no way to get a medical exemption without first being harmed by a vaccine unless you are immunocompromised or have a condition that would make it dangerous.

Sorry, but your wrong. The Supreme Court has said on the matter of personal rights and mandatory vaccinations (from Jacobson v Massachusetts, 1905):

"The liberty secured by the Constitution of the United States does not import an absolute right in each person to be at all times, and in all circumstances, wholly freed from restraint, nor is it an element in such liberty that one person, or a minority of persons residing in any community and enjoying the benefits of its local government, should have power to dominate the majority when supported in their action by the authority of the State.

"It is within the police power of a State to enact a compulsory vaccination law, and it is for the legislature, and not for the courts, to determine in the first instance whether vaccination is or is not the best mode for the prevention of smallpox and the protection of the public health.

"There being obvious reasons for such exception, the fact that children, under certain circumstances, are excepted from the operation of the law does not deny the equal protection of the laws to adults if the statute is applicable equally to all adults in like condition."

[The Duggar's Mohel]

I rarely look at user names and location because I don't care who says what. I don't play favorites like that. I don't care how long someone has posted here. I'm wondering why you quoted me out of context - I asked the question because I don't know what the State of California does for public health and vaccinations. And then I defended the practice of vaccinations. I'm sorry that SOME people in my country are backwards. It's not like everyone is opposed to public health. I'm just tired of some of the people on this board CONSTANTLY complaining about how backward the US is.

I apologize for reacting as strongly as I did. My post wasn't to say you're against public medicine or to state you are against the vaccinations. It was simply an observation that the USA is the ONLY place in the first world where this is even a question.

I appreciate you might be tired of hearing the USA is backwards, but please know the flip side to that is people in other great places having to hear the bravado and rhetoric that the USA is by far the best country in the world.

Again, I like the USA, I love visiting the family i have that live in the US, but the fact remains, there are things that are brought up in the US and only in the US it's an observation and I was merely pointing it out.

[Snarkylark]

:ew:

I hope she's not really an RN, or at the very least, now retired. Most of all, I hope she's not part of the Kaiser Northern California system, where I am a member and get my health care needs met.

I have several friends who are nurses, and they are truly wonderful, dedicated, hard-working, rational and intelligent people. I don't think they'd get along with Snarkylark as a co-worker.

Yes, I am an RN, and not retired. When does having an opinion on an issue make one a bad caregiver? I don't talk my patients out of vaccines. If they want one, I'll be happy to give it. The fact that you are trying to insult my character says more about you than it does me.

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

As to who will pay for the vaccines - my son and I have coverage through Kaiser. His is through what used to be called Healthy Families, but now it's Medi-Cal (due to my income level). All his well checks, annual physical for school, and any vaccinations have zero co-pay. Other visits require a $10 co-pay.

Last year, I got a flu shot. That was also at no charge. I haven't had any vaccines lately, but I think if they are considered recommended at a certain point, I would have no co-pay for those either.

With the passage of Obamacare, most people now have access to affordable health coverage. I believe that regular vaccinations are probably covered at no charge, similar to how my colonoscopy was covered after I turned 50.

I have Kaiser, too, or at least I will until I age out of coverage in September, at which point I'll have to find new coverage; and I'll probably be stuck with a stupid high deductible plan because I currently live in CT where I can't find any co-pay plans that aren't also deductible plans. Anyways, they're awesome. Like you, all my shots are free. And, my xrays were free. MRIs and CTscans are $10. All diagnostic tests are free. Genetic medication is $10, everything else is $30. If I'm admitted to the hospital, its $100. Urgent care is the same price as my regular doctor ($30). Maternity is $250. Everything from prenatal to 2 years post birth is free if I was to get pregnant. Specialist doctors (which does not include injury related doctors) are $50. And, after $1000, I no longer pay for anything out of pocket.

I send letters to them every few months asking them to reopen their branches in the northeast because I dread the day I have to switch to the mess of options I have here.

[happy atheist]

Sorry, but your wrong. The Supreme Court has said on the matter of personal rights and mandatory vaccinations (from Jacobson v Massachusetts, 1905):

"The liberty secured by the Constitution of the United States does not import an absolute right in each person to be at all times, and in all circumstances, wholly freed from restraint, nor is it an element in such liberty that one person, or a minority of persons residing in any community and enjoying the benefits of its local government, should have power to dominate the majority when supported in their action by the authority of the State.

"It is within the police power of a State to enact a compulsory vaccination law, and it is for the legislature, and not for the courts, to determine in the first instance whether vaccination is or is not the best mode for the prevention of smallpox and the protection of the public health.

"There being obvious reasons for such exception, the fact that children, under certain circumstances, are excepted from the operation of the law does not deny the equal protection of the laws to adults if the statute is applicable equally to all adults in like condition."

Why are you quoting the Supreme Court when you could be quoting the discussion thread from a Jim Carrey rant? Don't you know how the internet works? :penguin-no:

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

Yes, I am an RN, and not retired. When does having an opinion on an issue make one a bad caregiver? I don't talk my patients out of vaccines. If they want one, I'll be happy to give it. The fact that you are trying to insult my character says more about you than it does me.

She's not insulting your character. That said, I feel bad for your patients. I wouldn't want a nurse like you.

[Snarkylark]

I googled the exact wording of her borrowed argument, and it didn't turn up any results.

It was on FB

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

Why are you quoting the Supreme Court when you could be quoting the discussion thread from a Jim Carrey rant? Don't you know how the internet works? :penguin-no:

Haha my bad. Is this better:

[Snarkylark]

She's not insulting your character. That said, I feel bad for your patients. I wouldn't want a nurse like you.

Yes, she did. And so are you. How can say insult my nursing practice when you don't even know me? Have I personally insulted anyone here? Ever? I think it's sad that having an opinion that is contrary to yours makes me a bad nurse in your mind.

[16strong]

When I replied, this thread was a page long. Now it is 9. I think peanut butter has got some competition. :popcorn2:

[nelliebelle1197]

It was on FB

Must be true then