Duggars on Megyn Kelly, Friday Night Edition

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

Makes you wonder, doesn't it? Maybe the weddings and all the attention the girls got was a trigger for someone.

Honestly, I think it wasn't anything more than the fact that this is the first time the Duggar family has drawn more than a week or two's worth of attention to themselves at one time. I think that this would have been avoided if they didn't do as much as they did to pimp out two weddings and two pregnancies.

Also, I don't think it helps that they spent the ENTIRE time talking about how godly they are and how godless everyone else is. People don't like being spoken down to, and it drives people to figure out what kind of "dirt" they can get on you.

If the Duggars had played the system like the Bateses did with their 3 weddings, 3 babies, and one other engagement in the same time frame, they would still have a show and we'd still be arguing about the validity of the claims. But they decided to put themselves out there as much as they could and as high on the godly totem pole as possible, which was the perfect breeding ground for people to take them down.

Edited for readability

[isarhenne]

If I am remembering it correctly there was either a Ben video or wedding speech that talked about her being really sinful as child around the age of 8 and how she later talked to her parents and accepted Christ into her life at 14. I wonder did she think that she was really sinful because their learning material told her that her sins were what made her brother do this to her. I also wonder if that material by Gothard made her feel more sinful than her sisters because she was awake and it was under her clothes.

I'm worried about Jinger a lot!!She seems very fragile and was probably the one who got the most abused (was awake, was alone with josh in a room!!!, and she was 8 at the time :-(

there is a thread about Josh might be harming himself. eff that, we should really be worried about Jinger!!!

[chelleinchicago]

Honestly, I think it wasn't anything more than the fact that this is the first time the Duggar family has drawn more than a week or two's worth of attention to themselves at one time. I think that this would have been avoided if they didn't do as much as they did to pimp out two weddings and two pregnancies.

Also, I don't think it helps that they spent the ENTIRE time talking about how godly they are and how godless everyone else is. People don't like being spoken down to, and it drives people to figure out what kind of "dirt" they can get on you.

If the Duggars had played the system like the Bateses did with their 3 weddings, 3 babies, and one other engagement in the same time frame, they would still have a show and we'd still be arguing about the validity of the claims. But they decided to put themselves out there as much as they could and as high on the godly totem pole as possible, which was the perfect breeding ground for people to take them down.

Edited for readability

I agree. This is all down to them; those things they chose to hide and those they chose to exploit.

It would be easy to think someone went snooping because the robocall, etc. got on their last nerve, and I know the Duggars want people to believe this was all politically motivated because that's so much more palatable and even welcomed among their faithful. Easy out. But I still have to wonder if someone who knew about this all along just reached their limit. Someone who knows the parents for what they really are reached a tipping point and said 'no more'. If it was a victim.....bravo. Well, bravo either way but, especially if it was a victim.

[notreality]

I wonder where the Fox generated outrage about identifying victims was when Honey Boo Boo's older sister was outed as the victim of her mother's boyfriend? Why no advocating for her privacy? I wonder if Fox covered that story.

[Arrowoftruth]

Honestly, I think it wasn't anything more than the fact that this is the first time the Duggar family has drawn more than a week or two's worth of attention to themselves at one time. I think that this would have been avoided if they didn't do as much as they did to pimp out two weddings and two pregnancies.

Also, I don't think it helps that they spent the ENTIRE time talking about how godly they are and how godless everyone else is. People don't like being spoken down to, and it drives people to figure out what kind of "dirt" they can get on you.

If the Duggars had played the system like the Bateses did with their 3 weddings, 3 babies, and one other engagement in the same time frame, they would still have a show and we'd still be arguing about the validity of the claims. But they decided to put themselves out there as much as they could and as high on the godly totem pole as possible, which was the perfect breeding ground for people to take them down.

Edited for readability

Oh the note of their godliness, I found this on tumblr.

mothamelanin:

I wonder why women believe that all they have to do is give their man unlimited sex, head and food and their relationship will last forever.

There’s a lot more you have to bring to the table. Human beings are much more than hungry and sexual.

I remembered Michelles stupid quote about how any woman can make your man a sandwhich but only you can give him that intimateness he desires in the bedroom. Like what? You think Men cheat for sandwhiches?

[DaysAgo]

Obviously the Jessa and Jill interview was just a PR stunt do TLC can gauge viewer interest in a potential spin-off with those two.

I am not interested in such a show.

[Handmaiden of Dog]

I know they don't teach these children any critical thinking skills but surely the Duggar kids must be perplexed at times about the way they were raised and what they've been told. I wish I could sit down with Jill-- the one who declared that 2/3 of all families experience this and she plans to use Michelle's "safeguards" when she raises her own family-- and talk to her. For one thing I would love to ask her about viewing all males as incapable of controlling their sexual urges to the point of needing to feel up their sisters. Why are Fathers not considered a risk? Is it because they are deemed to be having regular sex? What happens when they are unable to have sex with the mother, for example after childbirth, are the fathers then a danger to their daughters?

As others have pointed out, why is holding hands-- or kissing!-- someone you don't end up marrying described as giving away pieces of your heart yet having your private parts groped is not a problem. Did Josh give away pieces of heart when he did that and does that mean his marriage to Anna is less valid or secure? Come to think of it I'm not sure what "giving away pieces of your heart" means exactly and what kind of consequences result.

Why does your father need to look away from grown women, such as the waitress at the Olive Garden? He has regular sex with your mother doesn't that mean he now has no sexual urges? If he does get sexual urges for other women but does not act on them can't the boys also be taught not to act on their sexual urges?

What about masturbation? Is the sin of groping a sister on the same level as masturbation? Is it not better for the boys to act out their sexual urges on themselves rather than on others?

Are any of the sisters sad about what happened? Are they indifferent or are they mad? Do they ever direct their anger at Josh or their parents? What about God? Where was he and why did he allow this to happen to them? Do the Duggars as a whole think God allowed them to be found out and why? Is He testing them? Does He have a plan?

Questions, I have questions!

[ILoveJellybeans]

Jinger just makes me so sad :( She always seemed like a bit of a rebel, now she just seems so emotionally fragile.

[Librul]

I know they don't teach these children any critical thinking skills but surely the Duggar kids must be perplexed at times about the way they were raised and what they've been told. I wish I could sit down with Jill-- the one who declared that 2/3 of all families experience this and she plans to use Michelle's "safeguards" when she raises her own family-- and talk to her. For one thing I would love to ask her about viewing all males as incapable of controlling their sexual urges to the point of needing to feel up their sisters. Why are Fathers not considered a risk? Is it because they are deemed to be having regular sex? What happens when they are unable to have sex with the mother, for example after childbirth, are the fathers then a danger to their daughters?

As others have pointed out, why is holding hands-- or kissing!-- someone you don't end up marrying described as giving away pieces of your heart yet having your private parts groped is not a problem. Did Josh give away pieces of heart when he did that and does that mean his marriage to Anna is less valid or secure? Come to think of it I'm not sure what "giving away pieces of your heart" means exactly and what kind of consequences result.

Why does your father need to look away from grown women, such as the waitress at the Olive Garden? He has regular sex with your mother doesn't that mean he now has no sexual urges? If he does get sexual urges for other women but does not act on them can't the boys also be taught not to act on their sexual urges?

What about masturbation? Is the sin of groping a sister on the same level as masturbation? Is it not better for the boys to act out their sexual urges on themselves rather than on others?

Are any of the sisters sad about what happened? Are they indifferent or are they mad? Do they ever direct their anger at Josh or their parents? What about God? Where was he and why did he allow this to happen to them? Do the Duggars as a whole think God allowed them to be found out and why? Is He testing them? Does He have a plan?

Questions, I have questions!

Sorry, but Jilly Bean is too ignorant and lacks the self-awareness and maturity to engage in such a conversation. I doubt she will ever have have that ability, due to her sub par education at the SOTDRT and her total embrace of the cult, as well as her desire to be in the limelight as a Fundie princess.

[fuscia]

I can't either. Jinger has always seemed like she was the most emotional out of the sisters. She mentions crying quite a bit (though jokingly) but I have a feeling that everything Jill and Jessa were saying probably would make her very uncomfortable. She was very much aware of the situation she was in.

My first post. I'm a long time lurker. So, I watched the interview, and I was very upset. By Jill, Ms. waterworks, and Jessa saying that they were asleep at the time, it put it out there that Jinger was the one who was in the laundry room. Way to victimize her further. I also was horrified that Jill views her baby as a potential molester. :angry-banghead: That really shows that they NEVER got the proper counseling and still have issues.

I find it sick that Josh is still hiding behind his family. IF he really got it, he would have issued a statement and immediately gone into deep therapy and acknowledged that he now knows that it was not handled in the right way. I really fear for his daughter.

[delilahdog11]

I had almost repressed most of the teachings from my time in a Christian cult, but James Robert saying that: forgiveness is a choice, one needs to say God I choose to forgive this person, brought some of my memories back. I had forgotten the choosing to forgive another person & to show that person the same mercy that God granted you in forgiving your sins by sacrificing his only son on the cross. Shows everyone how godly you truly are, so the family forgiving josh of his sins shows that they are in tight with God. Now you can't go around forgiving everyone. Only those that have been saved b the blood of lamb. True believers in the redeeming power of Jesus Christ. Okay so maybe I remember more than I originally thought.

Fuck the Duggars and their fucking victim shaming agenda. Fuck you with a big black dick. Can we submit that to cards against humanity? I fucked the Duggar family with a big, black, gay, lesbian, food stamp using, drag queen, transsexual from Transylvania dick (agenda).

[Jdawg]

Let's not forget how this plays into their cult's tenant of J.O.Y. (Jesus is first, then others, and lastly yourself). Jesus forgiving Josh is most important and their forgiveness of Josh is second. The last thing that matters is themselves and their feelings. What's good for the group is more important than any individual feelings of hurt or resentment they may have.

[lillybeth]

I'm realllly sorry for this huge wall of text, but I hate throwing stats around without some sort of reference to published data. Please note: I am not an expert in behavioural psychology or criminology, I just have access to the literature. I am also not familiar with this greater field, so I have no way to interpret whether or not these groups of researchers are reputable. They have, however, published in reputable journals, and are both fairly recent (2013) articles

Christiansen, A. K. and Vincent, J. P. (2013), Characterization and Prediction of Sexual and Nonsexual Recidivism Among Adjudicated Juvenile Sex Offenders. Behav. Sci. Law, 31: 506–529. doi:10.1002/bsl.2070

… available research suggests that juvenile sex offenders actually sexually reoffend at far lower rates than adult sex offenders (Boyd, Hagaan, & Cho, 2000; Caldwell, 2002, 2007, 2010), with best estimates of juvenile sexual recidivism rates ranging between 8 and 14 percent, with one study finding recidivism rates up to 37 percent after a nine-year follow-up. Estimates of adult sexual reoffending range from 4 to 10 percent for incestual offenders, 7 to 35 percent for rapists, 13 to 40 percent for child molesters, and 41 to 71 percent for exhibitionists (Marshall & Barbaree, 1990).

However, interestingly:

.. Also consistent with previous research, juvenile sex offenders in this sample reoffended nonsexually at much higher rates, with nonsexual reoffense rates of 40.96 percent, which is similar to the nonsexual reoffending rate for purely nonsexual offenders of 50.23 percent. These data are consistent with the hypothesis that most juvenile sexual offenders do not specialize in sexual offenses, and are more likely to reoffend nonsexually than sexually.

And from

Andrew Spice, Jodi L. Viljoen, Natasha E. Latzman, Mario J. Scalora, and Daniel Ullman (2013). Risk and Protective Factors for Recidivism Among Juveniles Who Have Offended Sexually. Sex Abuse, 25: 347-369. doi:10.1177/1079063212459086

In regard to sexual reoffending, our findings indicated that (a) only opportunities to reoffend was associated with sexual recidivism and that (b) no protective factors examined were associated with sexual recidivism.

Also, fyi

…although a history of sexual abuse is commonly perceived to be a risk factor (e.g., Mallie, Viljoen, Mordell, Spice, & Roesch, 2011), it was not significantly related to sexual recidivism

As for how many families are affected:

RAINN (Rape, Abuse & Incest National Network) reports an average of 293,066 victims (over the age of 12) every year. The 2010 US census estimates there are 116.7 million households (available here), which I am calling families (note, this is my interpretation, and I could be totally off here).

So : 293,066 victims/116.7 million households = ~1/398 households are affected by sexual abuse and/or rape each year.

edit- riffles, and wrong quote

[pinksparkles]

This is my first post. I have been a lurker... :)

I have a lot to say. Haha!

1. They say they are "victims" but minimize it. They think they're victims of the media and now "real" victims will not come forward because of confidentiality. I disagree. I think because people see how Jim Boob, Mullet and the girls shrugged this off, other victims will feel their situation is "not that bad" or doesn't constitute a crime or incest or assault or abuse. "It happened to those girls and it wasn't a big deal"

2. Why havent they said the report that was leaked is a lie? It clearly contradicts their madefortv story.

3. Jessa and Jill are fame whores. At least I think they are after watching them play for the camera.

4. Josh wont speak because he cant be a man and handle the questions. And maybe he will slip and admit to more.

5. Mullet is passive-aggressive.

6. If they think this is nothing, are they seriously telling the world that if this situation happens in another family or by a stranger, or while someone is on meds to sleep, or drugged or given something and NOT giving permission to be touched, that that is NOT a violation? A crime that carries consequences other than locks on doors and no sitting on laps?

7. I also feel that Boob and Mullet got legal counsel by someone when Creeper was 15. Why did they WAIT for the law to be involved? They were wasting time. They KNEW he would be taken out of their home and their facade would be broken.

8. Didn't the Elder or whatever you call it, just resign due to sex allegations?

9. I dont believe the girls heard Boob and Mullet being "praised" by DHS. I call BS on that. BS. They are saying that because Mommy and Daddy said it so it must be true.

[TenderloinTrash]

I know they don't teach these children any critical thinking skills but surely the Duggar kids must be perplexed at times about the way they were raised and what they've been told. I wish I could sit down with Jill-- the one who declared that 2/3 of all families experience this and she plans to use Michelle's "safeguards" when she raises her own family-- and talk to her. For one thing I would love to ask her about viewing all males as incapable of controlling their sexual urges to the point of needing to feel up their sisters. Why are Fathers not considered a risk? Is it because they are deemed to be having regular sex? What happens when they are unable to have sex with the mother, for example after childbirth, are the fathers then a danger to their daughters?

The Duggars are surrounded by families who think and act the same way as they do though. It's easy to just ignore the questions if everyone around you is telling you that what you're doing is right and godly. The hive mentality is strong with them. The more this mess unfolds, the more I've realized how much they live in a bubble. They really don't realize just how different they have been raised compared to the rest of the world. I think if anyone does (out of the girls), it's Jana since she's the oldest girl. Joy Anna or Jinger could possibly be in the boat as well. Everyone else seems to be drinking the kool aid, especially Jill. She seems to really have bought into everything.

[lilwriter85]

The more I think about this whole mess, the less I am convinced they WEREN'T prepared for this. There is NO WAY the Duggars were not aware of the "rumors." Maybe they felt safe that the report wouldn't leak, but it doesn't always take a legal document for the truth to come out.

Most of us make our way through life slowly moving up a career ladder through a lifetime of hard work and education. When you have EARNED your lifestyle, you can use your skills and experience to rebuild when you hit a major setback. But everything Josh has is by a freak stroke of luck. He has no education, no skills...he was hired solely, 100% because there are people who are happy to pay him just to borrow his name. Now, his name is a liability.

I just get more and more convinced that he'll do a Jon Gosselin. I bet he will be totally unrecognizable (and divorced) before long.

If there's anything Josh has learned from his dad, it's to always find a way to squeeze a dollar out of any situation life throws at you. I would not be surprised if he was the one to write a tell-all book. His family probably already hates his guts and will resent him forever for putting an end to their "comfortable lifestyle."

That's what I'm thinking in regards to the rumors. They had to have known about the Alice comment and other sites including FJ that discussed the rumors which have now been confirmed as true.

I first heard about the rumors back in 2010. I used to post on the IMDB boards for the Duggars' show. Someone posted a thread there saying that there was a rumor that Josh molested a younger sibling and that Jim Bob used his former politician status to cover it up. People back then on IMDB didn't believe the rumors. Around the time that thread was put on IMDB, there was a poster under the name ConserveAmerica, who claimed he had met the Duggars several times before and was in email contact with Jim Bob. That poster eventually stopped posting on IMDB, looking back if that poster was indeed in contact with Jim Bob, he could have mentioned the rumors.

I agree, the Duggars might have thought the police report would never come out and that people who did read or hear about Josh molesting siblings wouldn't believe it and would think it was rumors. Many people before the police report, thought that the molestation stuff was rumors.

I agree, Josh is now a major liability, but he and his family still have people defending them. That idiot Bart Hester, the Arkansas state senator was defending on CNN, a couple nights ago. Then there is idiot Mike Huckabee and Sarah Palin. Even those defenders might not help Josh's reputation in the long run. But others that were associated with the family aren't defending them or haven't released a statement. Santorum said he was sickened by them. Ministers like Dr. Charles Stanley and the Kendrick brothers haven't released statements on the Duggars. Dr. Charles Stanley visited the Duggars and was featured on the show. Some of the Duggars including Josh were in the Kendrick brothers/SBC's movie Courageous. Now, I know that Stanley and the Kendrick brothers weren't close associates of the Duggars, but all three seemed to like the Duggars quite bit. Years ago, the Kendrick brothers were posting Duggar related news on their official FB page. A part of the him thinks that Stanley and the Kendricks are disgusted with the Duggars and possibly felt bamboozled by the family, especially the Kendricks.

Career wise, Josh will be hurting for awhile. He really did luck with the FRC job and I wouldn't be surprised if some people at FRC are happy that he is gone. Josh was also making money in other ways because of his name, but that stuff is gone now. He and/or Anna will never be asked for speaking gigs at events.

I kind of wouldn't be surprised if Josh and Anna eventually divorce due to the long run issues of the revelations about Josh and financial issues.

[JessaBlessa]

I wonder what the people in the Duggar's local DHS and CPS, not to mention police dept. are saying privately to each other.

[pinksparkles]

Also, I noticed how NOT ONE of them was like "my sisters", "our babysitter", etc. It was always "the other ones" (parents said that) and "the victims". We clearly know it was YOUR DAUGHTERS and YOUR SISTERS. It's almost like they dehumanize the girls. Only Creeper has a "tender heart". No one reached over and touched the other one when they were (fake) crying. There is NO comforting at all. It's very clear that they don't show affection. Very sad to me.

[Janus]

Fuck the Duggars and their fucking victim shaming agenda. Fuck you with a big black dick. Can we submit that to cards against humanity? I fucked the Duggar family with a big, black, gay, lesbian, food stamp using, drag queen, transsexual from Transylvania dick (agenda).

Is this an American thing? Why do you have to say 'big black dick'? I can understand why, in frustration, you'd make fun of the Duggar's stances on thing's the've actually talked about or talked down about (like government assistance, LGBT etc..) but as far as I'm aware, they haven't been racist or anti-black/pro-white.

So why did you say twice "big black dick"? Is this the 'lowest form of degradation" in your eyes, or is this some American in-joke or stereotype that I'm not aware of?

I'm Australian, so I'm not aware of all your culture and customs and such, but to me, that just comes off as being racist.

[GotCaughtDancing]

Thank you Buzzard for your recaps. They were a lot less painful than watching this circus live.

These two came off as arrogant, smug, know-it-alls. Like Duggars do.

One thing that gets me is that they use the word victim to describe themselves and at the same time basically say they are not victims because they never knew. :angry-banghead: I don't believe for one second they didn't know it happened. Let's face it, if they didn't know it happened then why wasn't that said to the police? The Duggars lie so much even Gretchen Wieners hair would be impressed.

And I'm sorry, but your parents did not do a good job of raising you. You have no education, limited vocabulary and are ignorant to the world around you. Sorry that you let TLC trick you into thinking that America thinks your brilliant and amazing. By not doing a damn thing when Josh went crying to them for help (because he was touching his sisters & others) they enabled him to continue and he did. No accident or mistake there in his intentional action's.

FU Josh, Mullet, and JBoob

These people are now using this as a 'feel sorry for me so we can keep our show' media event. Not surprising in the least. This family wants its cake and to eat it too.

ETA: I don't know if this was posted while I was trying to submit this post originally, but it's pretty funny deadstate.org/dr-keith-ablow-dismantles-christian-pastor-josh-duggar-fits-the-profile-of-a-pedophile/

[MichellesCrunchyHair]

Is this an American thing? Why do you have to say 'big black dick'? I can understand why, in frustration, you'd make fun of the Duggar's stances on thing's the've actually talked about or talked down about (like government assistance, LGBT etc..) but as far as I'm aware, they haven't been racist or anti-black/pro-white.

So why did you say twice "big black dick"? Is this the 'lowest form of degradation" in your eyes, or is this some American in-joke or stereotype that I'm not aware of?

I'm Australian, so I'm not aware of all your culture and customs and such, but to me, that just comes off as being racist.

American here, and it's not an in-joke or stereotype that I know of. Not quite sure where the poster was going with that.

HOWEVER, another extremely large family, the Bates, have some interesting wall art in their home. In their patriotic room, they have a portrait of a Confederate General and another Confederate Lieutenant General who later was a member of the KKK. Maybe take that with a grain of salt as I read it on an LJ post-

ohnotheydidnt.livejournal.com/70224233.html

Perhaps the assumption is that the Duggars are racist as well? I hadn't ever heard anything about that, but sadly, it wouldn't surprise me.

[SassyPants]

Obviously the Jessa and Jill interview was just a PR stunt do TLC can gauge viewer interest in a potential spin-off with those two.

I am not interested in such a show.

There is no viable show based on 2 young families.

NONE-

[zygote373]

Thanks for looking up those stats, lillybeth. I find it interesting that the research supports juvenile sex offenses being more about predatory behavior than sex. It supports a lot of what experts have said about Josh's grooming behavior and his increase in boldness.

Somewhat related, I think that might be some of the reason Jessa and Jill were the ones to do the interview. Not only are they the married victims, but they are also the first ones touched, when his behavior was more cautious. They were older and (mostly) asleep. Jinger and Joy were both awake and therefore might be more affected by what Josh did.

[Dandruff]

How's life for the kids in the Duggar home? There are six sons - ranging from teenager to pre-teen, and four younger daughters - ranging from pre-teen to small child. Are the girls wary of their older brothers? Are the boys afraid of a potential accusation?

Poor Israel. Six months old and his mother is already planning how to protect his younger siblings. I hope Derick, and maybe his mom, can help moderate things.

I'll be very surprised if the show, in any form, continues. I wasn't too interested in a Duggar daughter spin-off before. After last night's interview, no way. Waiting to find out what TLC thinks...

[Arrowoftruth]

American here, and it's not an in-joke or stereotype that I know of. Not quite sure where the poster was going with that.

HOWEVER, another extremely large family, the Bates, have some interesting wall art in their home. In their patriotic room, they have a portrait of a Confederate General and another Confederate Lieutenant General who later was a member of the KKK. Maybe take that with a grain of salt as I read it on an LJ post-

ohnotheydidnt.livejournal.com/70224233.html

Perhaps the assumption is that the Duggars are racist as well? I hadn't ever heard anything about that, but sadly, it wouldn't surprise me.

What she's doing is oversexualizing and promoting the stigma that Black men are inherently violently. By saying f*ck them with a big black dick is saying that Black men are endowed enough to cause physical harm which is what she wishes on the Duggars