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happy atheist posted a topic in Quiver Full of DuggarsThe Duggars were interviewed by Megyn Kelly twice, JB & Michelle on Wednesday, Jill & Jessa on Friday. They would like for us to believe that Josh was just a confused kid who only "inappropriately touched" his sleeping sisters over their clothes. Except for the times when he touched awake girls. And the times that he touched them under their clothes. But don't worry, that was only for a few seconds. No biggie. And let's not even mention that one of them was only 5 years old. Why is everyone so mad at them about this? It only took them a year to get Josh out of the house! And they sent him away to do remodeling work, and everyone knows that once you hang drywall you never have inappropriate sexual urges again! It's science, duh. But really, it's all just a liberal conspiracy because they're Christians. Discussion of Jessa and Jill's interview: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26255 Discussion of Jim Bob and Michelle's interview: Part 1: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26243 Part 2: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26249 Recap of Jim Bob and Michelle interview: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26250 Recap of Jill and Jessa interview: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26257
Hi all. By popular request, here's my analysis of the truthfulness in the Duggar interview last night. Thanks to BCNN1 for the transcript, which I used as a base before editing to my knowledge of the situation as well as added commentary. If you catch something I didn't, please let me know. I've used the transcripts as uploaded by Happy Atheist, and some general internet research to try to get this sorted out. It appears the Duggar parents have mentally divided the incidents into "serious" and "not serious" based on when they finally decided the molestations were severe enough to warrant removing Josh from the household. My understanding is that initial incidents took place while the girls were sleeping and were over the clothes, a brief period of prayer and supervision took place, and then the molestations became more severe, occurring when the girls were awake and with direct skin-to-skin contact before Josh was ultimately sent away (13 days later after revelation to family and church elders). Surprisingly, it appears that most of the interview was mild enough to be accurate. Some of the tougher questions revealed cracks in the story. The interview is color-coded: green for correct, red for incorrect or questionable. There was a lot of Gothardese, and the interview went in circles in several places, such that it was difficult to figure out what they were talking about when. I've done my best to decipher it, but it was actually tougher than I anticipated. I did what I could to keep my snark out of it and report only the facts. I did add one personal observation as it pertained to discrepancies in the interview text. Obviously feel free to comment if you see anything differently than I did, or have more information to add. _______________MEGYN KELLY, HOST: It is a story that has generated hundreds of thousands of headlines and plenty of criticism. Tonight for the very first time, the family that became famous for their conservative Christian values and their 19 children speak out about a painful secret involving their oldest son and the actions that he now admits were inexcusable. Welcome to â€œThe Kelly File,â€ everyone. Iâ€™m Megyn Kelly. Just hours ago in Arkansas, I sat down with members of the Duggar family, stars of the hit TLC show â€œ19 Kids and Counting.â€ We discussed the serious allegations of inappropriate touching some 12 years ago by then teenaged Josh Duggar. Some of the topics we will discuss tonight are troubling and not intended for young viewers. But first, a look at how we got here. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) MICHELLE DUGGAR, â€œ19 KIDS AND COUNTINGâ€: This is the story of my family. We are the Duggars. KELLY (voice-over): The Duggars, a clean-cut family of 21, 10 boys, nine girls, who from the outside looking in, seemed to live a charmed and sheltered life. The kids, homeschooled. Reliable. Responsible. JOSHâ€™S VOICE: To keep things together with our mega-family, weâ€™re each in charge of certain areas. M. DUGGAR: Joseph takes out the trash. Josiah, he organizes and straightens the pantry. KELLY: Self-sufficient. Extremely well-behaved. The family first rose to prominence in Arkansas where in the late 1990s and early 2000s Jim Bob Duggar served in the stateâ€™s House of Representatives. But it was in 2004 that the Duggars gained national notoriety. JOSHâ€™S VOICE: If you lost count, allow us to help. KELLY: First, with documentaries about their unusually large family. JOSHâ€™S VOICE: We are the Duggar family. KELLY: And later with the hit series on TLC that today is known as â€œ19 Kids and Counting.â€ The show would focus on the Duggarsâ€™ ever expanding family, their devout faith, traditional values and strict courting that includes chaperones, no kissing before marriage and no hand holding before an engagement. M. DUGGAR: We think itâ€™s a great plan to be pure, wait, you know, for the one that God has for you, and on your wedding day, you get to enjoy all the physical aspects of that relationship. KELLY: The program was an enormous hit, drawing millions of devoted viewers. But with celebrity came controversy. Criticism of what some view as their more controversial opinions from their views on abortion â€” M. DUGGAR: Thereâ€™s a baby holocaust taking place where doctors and nurses are being paid to take the lives of innocent, unborn children. KELLY: To those on gay marriage. JOSH DUGGAR, â€œ19 KIDS AND COUNTINGâ€: Whatâ€™s really at stake here is the American family. Marriage is central to the family and every single child deserves a mother and father. KELLY: Or emphasis that women should submit to their husbands. Their detractors even starting a petition, demanding that their show be canceled, accusing the family of gay fear mongering.Despite it all, the shows rating continued to soar. The 2014 wedding of daughter Jill Duggar drawing more than 4.4 million viewers, the networkâ€™s biggest telecast in four years. And then a bombshell. May 19, 2015. In Touch Weekly reports the Duggarsâ€™ 27-year-old son Josh had been named in a prior sexual abuse investigation. Two days later on May 21st, the magazine reprints what turned out to be an illegally released police report. It reveals that Josh while 14 or 15 years old forcibly touched at least five girls in 2002 and 2003. The report makes clear the victims include Joshâ€™s younger sisters. The police report was not actually illegally released. Under the FOIA act, it can be requested since no charges were pressed. The local police department released a statement to attest to this. The Duggars consulted church elders. They sent Josh to a kind of rehab program and reported him to a state trooper who was an acquaintance of the family. However, no formal investigation was launched until police received an anonymous tip in 2006. By that time, the statute of limitations had run, and no charges were filed. The day of the second In Touch report, Josh Duggar issues an apology, writing in part, â€œ12 years ago as a young teenager, I acted inexcusably for which I am extremely sorry and deeply regret. I hurt others including my family and close friends.â€ His parents and wife of six years also issue statements. Wife Anna saying Josh told her about his past before they got engaged, that she was shocked but that he had gotten help, humbled himself before God and changed the direction of his life. The media pounced. [VARIOUS MEDIA QUOTES] KELLY: So why would a family with such a painful secret launch a reality TV show and was it hypocritical to preach family values knowing of their own sonâ€™s repeated sins? I ask them that and much more in our Duggar family interview right now. (on camera): Take us back to 2002. How did you first learn that this was a problem with Josh? JIM BOB DUGGAR, â€œ19 KIDS AND COUNTINGâ€: Well, 12 years ago, we went through one of the most darkest times that our family have ever gone through, and our son Josh came to us on his own, and he was crying. And he had just turned 14, and he said that he had actually improperly touched some of our daughters. And it was â€” MICHELLE DUGGAR, â€œ19 KIDS AND COUNTINGâ€: We were shocked. I mean, we were just devastated. I donâ€™t think any parent is prepared for a trauma like that. And I think we had one way of hope and that Josh had a tender conscience, and he was the one that came and shared on his own even though the others really didnâ€™t know anything of his wrongdoing. KELLY: This is a young boy who has come to you with shocking information. What did he say? I mean, how did you respond to him? What was that like, that exchange? M. DUGGAR: There was so much grief in our hearts. I think as parents we felt, weâ€™re failures. You know, here we tried to raise our kids to do whatâ€™s right, to know whatâ€™s right. And yet one of our children made some really bad choices, and I think as a parent, we were just â€” we were devastated. KELLY: Did he explain why? I mean, was that a question that you asked? J. B. DUGGAR: He said he was just curious about girls, and he had gone in and just basically touched them over their clothes while they were sleeping. They didnâ€™t even know he had done it. And so we went, and the first thing was to protect the girls. And so we went in â€” This is accurate regarding the first incidents in the girlsâ€™ room in March 2002, and again for the babysitter on the couch in July of 2002. KELLY: The girls all slept together? M. DUGGAR: Hm-mm. J. B. DUGGAR: Yes. The girls had two bedrooms at the time. This took place at the familyâ€™s Johnson Road residence. KELLY: How many girls are we talking about? J. B. DUGGAR: We had five girls at the time. KELLY: OK. J. B. DUGGAR: So, anyway, he went in and said he had done this, and so we, first off, of course, really talked to him and then we went and talked to all the girls, the children. M. DUGGAR: It was so important for us as parents to talk to our girls and make sure that nothing else had happened. KELLY: So, what did they say? M. DUGGAR: One by one, as we talked with them, none of them were aware of Joshâ€™s wrongdoings. Regarding only the first incidents in the girls' bedroom, this is most likely accurate. KELLY: So they learned about it from you. M. DUGGAR: Yes. J. B. DUGGAR: Yes. Yes. KELLY: At that point, he had said that he had done this to how many of the girls? J. B. DUGGAR: That was to two. KELLY: OK. But neither one had any recollection of it. J. B. DUGGAR: They did not know. KELLY: And what was their reaction when they learned it from you? J. B. DUGGAR: They didnâ€™t â€” they really didnâ€™t know. Actually, what happened was we asked them at first if anything happened. And then it was after some other things happened that we actually shared with them, and we actually â€” but we took a lot of steps. And first we tried to deal with this in-house as parents. We were in shock and we were trying to figure out what was the next step. But really, looking back, we did the best we could under the circumstances. KELLY: Youâ€™re saying, what am I going to do? Youâ€™re saying, he says heâ€™s touched two of the daughters, and you donâ€™t know what to do, right? J. B. DUGGAR: Didnâ€™t know. Because at that point now nobody knew about it besides Michelle and I and Josh. And so we thought, what do we do with this information? And the girls, we talked to them, and they didnâ€™t know that anything had happened because they were asleep. And so we talked to him, we put all kinds of punishments on him, we watched him, like, all the time. I took him to work with me, and he just â€” I mean, we just poured our life into it. KELLY: Like when you went to bed at night during that time frame, were you scared? Were you worried? You know, heâ€™s 14, heâ€™s having this problem. Whatâ€™s going to happen when we go to sleep? J. B. DUGGAR: Right. Nothing ever happened like that again in the girlsâ€™ bedrooms after that. KELLY: OK. J. B. DUGGAR: OK. So, we had safeguards that protected them from that. But there was another incident where â€” two different incidents where the girls were, like, laying on the couch, and it was â€” he had touched, like, over the couch and actually touched their breast while they were asleep. And so â€“ M. DUGGAR: Over their clothes. This is accurate only for the first set of incidents. J. B. DUGGAR: â€” over their clothes. And so it was a very difficult situation. But as we talked to other parents and different ones since then, a lot of families have said that theyâ€™ve had similar things happen in their families. And so â€” I mean, this is, for us, of course, this is public shame that our son did this back 12, 13 years ago. KELLY: When you heard that the behavior had resumed, describe what that was like for you. J. B. DUGGAR: We thought, you know, at first that Josh, you know, was on the road to mend at first, but he was still a kid, you know, and he was still a juvenile. He wasnâ€™t an adult. And so there was a couple more times that he came and told us what he had done, and we were just devastated. All of these â€” again, this was not rape or anything like that, this was like touching somebody over their clothes. There were a couple incidents where he touched them under their clothes, but it was like a few seconds and then he came to us and was crying and told us what happened, and it was after that third time he came to us is where we really felt like, you know what? We have done everything we can as parents to handle this in-house. We need to get help. That is accurate. See incidents mentioned above; Josh is reported to have called his parents almost immediately afterward. And thatâ€™s actually when we went to outside folks and we asked some very close friends if they could come over, and some of my best friends came over. We talked about it, and so at that point we pulled Josh out of the home, and we knew of a man who mentors young men, and he really helped young men who had made unwise choices in their lives to get straightened out, and he was running a little training center in Little Rock, Arkansas. And under the roof of that training center, he had Little Rock Police Department on one side, then you had a prison minister on the other. And he said Josh could come down there and actually do some construction work with him and he would counsel him and work with him and hopefully get him straightened out. This center was run by Harold Walker, and is called the Basic Life Principles Training Center. No search results of that training center come up in Google for a search customized for articles or posts printed before 1 May 2015, and first appear 22 May 2015. A search of Mr. Walker turns up a comment that he doesnâ€™t remember why Josh was sent to the center, and a comment on RecoveringGrace reads as follows: â€œThat's a lot of bull that they did not know what the program was called. The Little Rock "Training Center" at that point was just a large empty shell with one wing of one floor of staff rooms. Everyone knew that the Police Department was a separate entity, period. The door between the facilities was locked. For them to pretend the "program" was legitimized by the proximity to a PD is pure smokescreen. Harold Walker lived in a home on the grounds of the property. He had small children at the time. I wonder if he even knew why Josh was being sent. Apparently he was a little clueless about the whole thing, from some other articles I've readâ€¦â€ KELLY: Some people have said, why did they wait? Why didnâ€™t they go to the authorities or go for the counseling at the very first time he came to you? J. B. DUGGAR: You know, I talked to somebody that worked at one of those juvenile youth sex offender facilities, and he described how they actually take care of these situations down there, and the success rate is not very good. And so we felt like that going from a perspective of really reaching his heart first would be important, and so thatâ€™s the reason we sent him down to Little Rock to work with this man. KELLY: Did legal ever pop into your mind? Like we may have legal obligations? J. B. DUGGAR: You know, what? As parents youâ€™re not mandatory reporters. The law allows for parents to do what they think is best for their child. And so we got him out of the home, and we sent him down to this place, and that was really probably the best decision we made through this whole process, because it was at that place â€” this was the first time Josh has been out of the home. Several articles have pointed out that while parents may not be mandatory reporters, it is not a free pass to keep situations like this under wraps. Doing so could have resulted in criminal charges, according to several sources. KELLY: He was 15 at this point. J. B. DUGGAR: He had just turned 15. And it was that the point that he came into himself, and God really worked in his life. As a matter of fact, he broke. And he went and asked God to forgive him. He went back and asked those who he had offended to forgive him. But we felt like the last jurisdiction of who to make things right with was the law. KELLY: And weâ€™ll going to get to that in one second. The subsequent incidents after the first one involved daughters who were awake, at least a couple of them? J. B. DUGGAR: There was a couple, yes. And they didnâ€™t really understand, though, what happened. The daughter from the book incident clearly stated to the police that it felt weird. Also, report page 23 says that one daughter cried before stating she remembers something with the washing machine. Another daughter was fully conscious and awake when Josh put his hands up her shirt in the laundry room. KELLY: Yes. What â€” M. DUGGAR: It was more his heart, his intent. He knew that it was wrong. But in theirs they werenâ€™t even aware. They were like, you know, it wasnâ€™t â€” to them they didnâ€™t probably even understand that it was an improper touch. KELLY: I know that the ultimate one before you really got help involved a very young daughter, and Iâ€™ll avoid the age because I donâ€™t want to identify anyone specifically, but a single digit. I mean, what was that like for you to hear? You know, one, you must have thought for some time this is a pubescent boy, I donâ€™t know what heâ€™s going through, but heâ€™s testing. But when it moves to a young daughter â€” J. B. DUGGAR: Right. At that point, thatâ€™s when we pulled him out of the house and we said, he canâ€™t be here. And so, we pulled him out and then, he went through working with that man â€” KELLY: Yes. He goes through counseling. J. B. DUGGAR: Yes. KELLY: And then when he was done with the counseling, this is not like a licensed therapist, itâ€™s somebody, a Christian-based â€” Accurate. This therapist/counseling program was not licensed, as seen above it is simply a ministry connected with IBLP. Note that JB/M skirt this statement. J. B. DUGGAR: Christian based. But Iâ€™ll tell you why. KELLY: Treatment facility. J. B. DUGGAR: It really had a huge impact on his life. And it really, that was the turning point in his life. And this man really reached his heart. KELLY: And before Josh went away, you know, in the period where the girls knew, and he knew and you knew when youâ€™re living in the house together, what was that like? I mean, what was the dinner table like? J. B. DUGGAR: Well, we tried to make things as normal as we can, but also, you know, Michelle and I both were keeping an eye on Josh, you know, all the time and watching his behaviors, watching his attitudes. KELLY: And prior to him leaving, were you concerned for the safety of your daughters? M. DUGGAR: Well, we definitely put safeguards in our home. J. B. DUGGAR: Yes, and we also talked to our daughters and reminded them about wrong and right touch and about if anybody ever touched you in a wrong way for you to come and tell your mom immediately. Personal note but without evidence: I find this contradictory to their statements above where they mention the daughters didnâ€™t know it was wrong. If they were "reminded", then they should've already been taught, which would indicate that they either did know it was wrong to begin with, or JB/M never imparted the lesson in the first place. M. DUGGAR: Immediately. And we tell them that you have a safe place to share your heart. And so we were trying to protect and watch and make sure that their hearts were safe, they had a safe place to talk, and at the same time putting boundaries and safeguards up in our home. J. B. DUGGAR: Yes. We werenâ€™t going to give up on Josh. (END OF FACTUAL JB/M INTERVEIW, REST IS CONVERSATION RE: TLC AND GIRLS' PREVIEW)
Recaps by Buzzard to follow. Watch online: http://www.foxnewsgo.com (this only works for live, I have no idea if the full interview will be here or not) Part 1: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26255&start=100#p962673 Part 2: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26255&start=160#p962751 Part 3: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26255&start=220#p962799 Part 4: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26255&p=962812#p962821 Part 5: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26255&start=240#p962842
happy atheist posted a topic in Quiver Full of DuggarsSo many excuses, so little time. Part 1: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26243
The Duggar Girls Demonstrate That Stockholm Syndrome is Real - Part 1 Megyn - for the very first time two of the young women inappropriately touched speak out... Jill and Jessa are J'kids... the show is a hit... tonight they reveal themselves as victims to set the record straight. Its been an "intense few days" - recaps the wednesday interview in all of Boob's grammatical glory. Gives a good glossy sugar coating on how the Duggars handled this mess, including Boob's ridiculous statement that the success rate at real programs sucks. They had nothing to hide... Media reaction was swift and strong. Shots of other media railing against them ( I mean, persecuting, of course). There is another story, one we havent heard... Jill and Jessa. It had beenthe happiest of times - Izzy... the wedding was "wildly popular"... Jessa is prego and their wedding was a success. As girls they were subject of unwanted touching and today, a media circus. Megyn introduces them and gets their ages. How old were you when Josh touched you Jill - 12 Jessa - 9 or 10 Megyn - you are on the record as a victim, does it feel strange to use that word? Jill - This wasnt our first choice, we saw the headlines and what people are saying and as victims we had to come out.. .we chose to do it... its lies, not true. For truth's sake we wanted to do this. Megyn - do you feel like the victim of a molestation? Jessa - I think in the case of what josh did, it was wrong. I'm not going to justify or say it was ok. I want to speak in his defense to people who are callling him a child molester or pedophile or rapist. It is SO overboard. A lie, really. People will get mad at me for saying it. I can say it because I was one of the victims. In Josh's case he was a young boy in puberty, a little too curious about girls and that got him into some trouble and he made some bad choices but really the extent of it was mild inappropriate touching on fully clothed victims whil... Jill - We didnt evern know about it until he confessed it to my parents Jessa - none of the victims were aware of what happened until joshua confessed Jill - it wasnt like we were keeping a secret afraid or something, it wwas we didnt know until josh explained to our parents what his thought process was Megyn - How did you learn about it? Jessa - they took us aside indiividually... you were shocked. Megyn - your parents told you that you were molested? What was your reaction to that? Jessa - I was shocked (laughs), It was strange, I was like ... I didnt know, I didnt understand this is what happend until they told me. Jill - you never think this will happen to me. it was very mild compared to what happens to others so when my parents told me I'm sad and shocked, Ok... I'm sad because this is my older brother who I love a lot and so its conflicting... I was angry at first, how could this happen. My parents expalined what happened and jOsh asked individually to forgive him. I mad ethat choice, wasnt forced. You have to make that decision for yourself. Megyn - Lets go back in time. Youre 12, 10... your parents sit you down and tell you this happened. Do you remember the year? So did josh go away right after that? Jessa - He did pretty soon after. I remember at the time I was young so it seems like a whirlwind. Megyn - Was there time when you were in the house with josh knowing this prior to him going away? Jessa - Not really. I think that whenever it was brought to my attention it wasnt very long. Megyn - do you remember a dynamic in the house like "this is my brother" what am I supposed to do with this? Jill - we were sad when he was sent away. He's your brother but at the same time it was burned in our memory josh made some bad decisions and he's going to suffer the consequences of those decisions. Megyn - did you get the chance to express that anger to him, did you fight? Jessa - No, I think we're different than most girls in that he was subtle = he knew in his mind his actions are wrong but he was very sly. The girls didnt catch on. If you catch them sleeping its like a quick feel or like you know if youre just not really aware. They werent awake and not aware. It was very subtle (Jessa repeatedly looks up and to the left and smiles as she's talking). We realize this is seriuos but it wasnt a horror story or this terrible thing where we're like OM goodness... its ridiculous... I think my parents acted. I can see looking back as an adult, they handled this very well . They set up safety guards in our house and they sent josh away and get help. When he came back he was a totally different person. Megyn - how did that manifest itself? Jessa - you could just tell. He was repentant. When he came back I could see he made life changes and he'll never go down that path again. Megyn - did yo ufeel scared he might resume? Jill - When this happened my dad and mom sat down with us and josh asked us for forgiveness we had to make that choice (this is clearly her pattern line), that I think everyone has to make and my dad explained there is a difference between forgiveness and trust.. you forgive and then you have boundaries. Trust comes later. Josh destroyed that trust at the beginning and so he had to rebuild that. When he came back that was his point... when he asked us to forgive that was the beginning Megyn - what were the safeguards just to make sure? Jill - not being alone. No hide and seek where two people go off to hide together (verbatim from michelle), Jessa - not babysitting girls Jill - locks on the doors, everybody's in bed - girls in the girls room, boys in the boys (LIE!) and so ... as a mother, now. I look back and think my parents did such an amazing job for me. Even when we went through the DHS investigation they complimented my parents on what an amazing job they did... not only taking the legal actions, going the extra mile, as a mom I hope I can set up the same safeguards in my family (HOLY CRAP WHAT???!?!?) and reaching the heart of their children. Not only taking care of josh but us girls. Megyn - For the records, did you ever have any trouble with other family members Girls - no Megyn - This is about Josh and prior to counseling... Jessa - My parents did talk to us, they sat down with all of us kids every age and said if anyone touches you come and tell us. You have a voice Megyn - did you ever think of youself as a victim? Jill _ I dont believe so Jessa - in our situation we werent aware that was going on Megyn - did you go through shame? Jessa - when we were foing the DHS investigation that was really... its another thing to talk to a complete stranger Jill - our parents told us to share what happened and they told us to be open and honest, share what happened. Jessa - we told them and we were honest and my parents said that we could trust them, its a safe place. Brainwashing is an amazing thing - part 2 Megyn - Any hesitation when you decised to be on tv that this would come out? Jessa - No, the reality show was 5 years afet all this. We had dealt with it and moved on Megyn - so you werent laboring under a fear... Jessa - No I think all the people in our lives, the official... they knew about this it wasnt a complete secret. Jill - people during that time knew. We didnt think we had to share with people who werent a part of the problem or the solution. Jessa - We had dealt with that when the investigation was closed. they praised our parents said they had done and amazing job and said that your home is a safe place for children (anyone think this is odd and IMPOSSIBLE that this was said to a 9 year old???) Megyn - what about some of the critics who say you put your neck out advocating strong christian values? JIll - I think that some people say we're hypocrites. If you look back we never said we were perfect, we said we are a family with lots of kids that have 20 times... Megyn - how about josh and the FRC - gay and lesbians etc. Jessa - Its right to say heres what I beleive even if youve made stupid mistakes, failures, if you've had failures in your past. It doesnt mean you cant be changed. People are making it sound like this happened yesterday Jill - and that its ongoing Jessa - it happened 12 years ago. He was a child himself and so I think seeing the change in his life Jill - we live with him. Our viewers feel like they're in our home and they know him. But we're friendly but we dont know them. People expect to know every detail of our lives but its been taken care of Megyn - when you gound out this was going to be on the cover what was your reaction? Jessa - we were pretty furious. Jill - I called my husband and I was in tear. crying - I couldnt believe what was going on. I calle dhim - cries more - whenever I heard the police report had been released I said. This isnt right, we're victims, they cant do this to us. and they did. Jessa - the system htat was set up .... greatly failed (this is the teaser). You go to the store and theres a picture on a magazine Jill - and like theres like, whatever choices or like legally, they can say "we can do this or that' its like, its obviously not... they're not protecting us here Jessa - the FOIA is not you cant foia a juvenile cases, everyone knows that (oh, you have a law degree now?). There was some hokey pokey going on there I dont know what the deal was Jill - there may be an agenda. The tabloids are USED TO EXPLOITING WOMEN. Jessa - the parent company Bauer publishing, they're a major porn provider ( sure, this is a real interview... ) I dont know, maybe theyre just used to MAKING OBJECTS OUT OF WOMEN. Maybe we didnt seem any different. Megyn - Jill, we see the tears, what was it about the disclosure that was so painful? Jill - I see it as a revictimization thats a thousand times worse (sobbing) because this is something that was already dealt with. We already forgiven josh, we already moved on... its not the truth, everything was distorted and our story was not being told and it shouldnt have been told. We're the victims and we're the only one who can speak. Now that its warped and told how they want to portray it we felt like thats why we wanted to say "thats not what happened." We've dealt with this and we've taken care of it. Megyn - do you feel like you are speaking on behalf of your other sisters? Jill - we cant speak for the otehr ones but I feel like as far as Jessa - I can speak for the others and say that everyone is angry this was publicised. Everyone has forgiven Jill - Long ago Megyn - what about hte babysitter? Jessa - Yeah, definitely Megyn - what about legal action? We TOTALLY got real counseling. The diploma was in color! Part 3 Megyn - your parents indicated they will look into legal action, do you want that? jessa - what was done was very wrong. Youre helpless in the moment over the actions of other. We're again helpless as to the people handing oer the report... printing is, using it for your own profit. Megyn - People arent staning up for child vicitims... is this because of who you are? Jessa - I feel like people that dont like our family would be the ones to spread this aroudn... slander... malice JIll - i feel for the other families out there. 2/3 of families deal with this. I feel for the other victims where the parents will take a pause to do something to report to take care of what going on and maybe these other victims will continue to live just not even having their situations handled (OMG - YOU MEAN LIKE YOU DID???) Megyn - SOme referred back to the incident initially - the SOL had run. Would you have supported a prosecution? Jessa - by the time that was done it was very obvious to everyone that josh was a changed person. He had not gone there for years, he was humble before god. Jill - we all got counseling. Josh had to pay for his own Megyn - did you work that out? What were you working out? Jill - you talk about what happened and what was dont. We wanted to make sure everything in our hearts were taken care of. Jessa - I'm really glad that my parents encouraged us to get that LICENSED counseling. I think it was really helpful for us. Megyn - what was the most difficult part of it? Jessa - I dont think we can exclude today. It was difficult when it came up, talking in counseling. Every step was hard but these past 2 weeks have been 1000 times worse Megyn - do you care about the show? Do you want it to continue? Jill - we've always had the mindset this show is a window of opportunity that god allowed to share our lives... Jessa - life goes on. We're not a tv family, we're a family that happens to be on tv. Jill - we love our film crew, they're family to us. We'll see what life brings Megyn - this is it, right? Theres not another secret? Jill - we've been through a lot and our viewers saw that. its not always easy but we've allowed the filminf and allowed people to see our struggles, see things that we've go through - josie, jubilee... this is another stuggle but its bringing the family closer together. Jessa - when all this came out I said, on the bright side, we all love eachother. Lets blame the liberal media! Part 4 They reshow Jill sobbing when she found out the report was being released... Jessa doesnt even look at her. Megyn - you could hear izzy crying in the room below as Jill cried... these are vibrant beautiful women who are supposed to be in the prime of their lives... what ethical obligation did in touch have to think of them Howard Kurtz - watching jill and jessa struggle... blah blah victimized by the porn rag... put aside the legalities, why is OK for in touch to violate an iron clad rule and identify these women megyn - they did and it didnt take a lot of math. We're supposed to follow a code. Is it because they're christians. I dont see that exception in the ethics book Howie - maybe they thought because of the reality show... when you look at those 2 women its like they were collateral damage. Megyn - pundits on other shows asking where were the parents? Where is the media now asking who was there for the girls howie - the stunning thing is the media conduct has been a non issue. Josh didnt join the interview. The parents put them at risk. To listen to jill and jessa, media can inflict a lot of damage and these 2 women are victims. They've been dragged through the mud megyn - what of the other victims who are out these considering calling the hotline - they have a promise of confidentiality and they see this howie - that the worst part of it. We want them to report and there has to be some doubt ... the media needs to wrestle, at what point is the story not worth it because of the damage inflicted. Lets all call it a sophies choice! Part 5 I'm just going to point out that fox is clearly backing away from their ridiculous "illegal release" arguments from earlier. This whole "bad liberal" is much more like them. Emily Horowitz - got lots of credentials and stuff - I think it highlights the complex nature of sexual abuse in families. they love their brother. It wouldnt have been the best thing for him to go to prison. 1/3 of people who abuse children are chilren themselves... I interviewed people on the registry... the average age is 14 Megyn - thats important. Is josh duggar a child molester in the term we understand? Emily - Sex offenders have lower recidivism than we believe. (Is fox pro sex offender now). The treatment is effective Megyn - 85 - 90 % dont reoffend Emily - treatment and intervention works Megyn - they faced a tough choice... our viewers say its the duggars fault Emily 0- theres so much emotion... pitchforks... its a terrible dilemna. If you go to the police you will be put in jail (UM, NO). This was unusual Megyn - what message does the outing of this send to other victims Emily - i think families are hesitant to get help FINAL THOUGHTS Megyn -The judge in the duggar's juvenile case says this report should never have been disclosed the city attorney maintains its lawful. The law needs to be changed... we need to better protect victims. Flashes hotline again. I JUST HAVE TO SAY, WEDNESDAY WAS BAD, THIS WAS EVEN WORSE. I CANT BELIEVE SHE CALLS HERSELF A JOURNALIST.
Buzzard will be posting her live-recap of The Interview here. Feel free to continue to persecute the poor, poor Duggars. For the pre-game analysis see: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26202 Note: This thread is to specifically discuss the Megyn Kelly interview and reactions resulting from it. For general discussion on the issue not related to the interview, please use the main thread. Edit: here's the link to all of the recap posts: Part 1: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26243&start=200#p960234 Part 2: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26243&start=280#p960328 Part 3: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26243&start=340#p960383 Part 4: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26243&start=400#p960452 Part 5: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26243&start=420#p960483 Preview of Friday with Jill and Jessa: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=26243&start=440#p960492 Full recap below: J'Megyn does the Duggars - Part 1 Megyn is wearing a red shirt... no cleavage. She welcomes us and says that "hours ago" she sat down with the Duggars, discussed the allegations from 12 years ago. She issues a trigger warning. She gives an overview of the Duggars, saying that they seemed to live a "charmed life" - reliable, responsible. They were homeskooled - shows shots of boob playing with littles in fall leaves - Shots from way back when - frumpers... They rose to prominance when boob was in the house of reps. In 2004 they had the series documentaries, then the hit series. Lots of shots from TLC shows... including strict courting rules, no hand holding etc. Shot of Michelle in 2014 saying that its a great plan to be pure for your wedding day and then you get to enjoy the physical aspects of the relationship. The program WAS an enourmous hit, drawing millions of viewers... but with celebrity came controversy... abortion (shot of boob holding josie up as DQ blathers in her blue shirt) "there is a baby holocaust taking place"... gay marriage Josh saying that the american family is at stake, marriage is central to the family and every child deserves a mother and father... and emphasis that women should submit to their husbands (shot of michelle smiling like a stoned deer in headlights). There have been petitions to cancel, but the ratings soared. Jill's wedding had 4.4 milion viewwers... then... in touch DUM DUM DUM... shots of the police report that she says was ILLEGALLY released. She goes through the details of the report and that they include the sisters. He went to elders and rehab. No formal investigation until 2006 when the SOL was up, no charges. Josh issues an apology. Anna and DQ/Boob issue statements... they read them. The media "pounced"... shots of ebil liberal media calling them out for being hypocrites. Megyn - why would a family with such a sekret have a show... And now, boob and Michelle... Michelle is wearing her usual blue shirt with a black t shirt beneath it. Both boob and Michelle have professional makeup on and her hair is uber crunchy. Boob is wearing a green shirt. Megyn - take us back to 2002. How did you first learn that there was a problem with josh? Boob - Well, 12 years ago we went through one of the most darkest times that our family has ever gone through (michelle pensively looks up in sadness and concern). Our son, josh, came to us on his own crying and had just turned 14 and said that he had improperly touched some of our daughters. Michelle - we were shocked, we were just devastated. I dont think any parent is prepared for a trauma like that and I think we had one ray of hope in theat josh came and shared on his own even though the others didnt know anything of his wrongdoing. Megyn - this is a young boy who has come to you with shockin ginformation. WHat did he say and how did you respond? WHat was that like? Michelle - There was so much grief in our hearts, I think as parents we felt "we're failures we tried to raise our kids to do whats right, to know whats right" and here, one of our children made REALLY BAD CHOICES and, as a parent, we were devastated. Megyn - did he explain why? Boob - He said he was just curious about girls and just went in and touched them over their clothes while they were sleeping. THEY DIDNT EVEN KNOW HE HAD DONE IT! (bullshit) and so we went and the first thing was to protect the girls. Discussion about where the girls slept. Boob - we really talked to him and then talked to the girls Michelle - it was so important for us, as parents, to talk our girls and make sure nothing else happened. One by one, none of them were aware of Josh's wrongdoings. Megyn - at this point, how many had he done this to? Boob - that was to two Megyn - neigther had any recolection boob - no Megyn - what was their reaction when they learned it from you? Boob - they really didnt know. What happened was we asked them first if anything happened and then it was after some other things happened that we shared with them... at first we tried to deal with this in house, as parents we were in shock. We were trying to figure out what was the next step. Looking back, WE DID THE BEST THAT WE COULD under the circumstances. At that point, nobody knew about it, we thought "what do we do?"... we talked to him, put "punishments" on him, watched him all the time, I took him to work with me, we just poured our life into him. Megyn - were you scared? Were you worried when you went to bed? Boob - nothing like that happened again in the girl's bedrooms. We had safeguards that protected them from that... there were 2 different insances where girls were laying on the couch and he had touched over the couch and touched their breasts while they were asleep... as we talked to other parents a lot of families said they had similar things happen in their families. For us, this is public shame that our son did this, 12 -13 years ago... Megyn - when you heard the behaviour resumed, what was that like? Boob - we thought at first that josh was on the road to mend but he was still a kid, he wasnt an adult. There were a couple more times where he came and told us what he had done and we were devastated. All these, again, this was not rape or anything like that. This was touching over the clothes, a few instances touching under the clothes. It was liek a few seconds and then he came to us crying. It was after the 3rd time where we felt like we had done everything as parents and we need to get help. We went to outside folks and asked very close friends to come over, we talked about it. We pulled josh out of the home. We knew of a man who mentored young men, who helped young men who made unwise choices in their lives to get straightened out. He was running a training center in little rock. Under the roof was little rock police and a prison ministry. He could do construction work and he would counsel him, and get him straightened out. Megyn - some people have said why did they wait, why didnt they go to the authorities or go for counseling at the very first time he came to you Boob - You know, I talked to someone who worked at those juvenile, youth, sex offender facilities... the success rate is not very good. We felt like that, going from a perspective of reaching his heart first would be important. Megyn - Did legal ever pop into your mind? Boob - as parents youre not mandatory reporters. The law allows for parents to do whats best for your child so we got him out of the home and we sent him down to this place and that was the best decision we made through this whole process. He was at this place, he just turned 15, and he came into himself and god worked in his life. He asked god to forgive him, he asked other he offended to forgive him, and the last jurisdiction was the law. megyn - the subsequent incidents involved daughters who were awake. Boob - there were a couple, yeah, and they didnt really understand. Michelle - it was really his heart, his intent, he knew that it was wrong but they werent even aware. It wasnt to them, they didnt understand that it was an improper touch. Megyn - the ultimate one, before you really got help, was a very young daughter... a single digit. What was that like for you to hear? YOu must have thought this was a pubescent boy, he's testing. But when he did that to a young daughter. Boob - right, at that point, thats when we pulled him out of thehouse. And said he cant be here and he went through working with THAT MAN... Megyn - when he was done with the counseling, not a licensed therapist, a christian based... Boob - Christian based, but I'll tell you what, it really had a huge impact on his life and it was the turning point on his life. Megyn - before Josh went away, and they all knew ... what was that like, what was the dinner table like? Boob - we tried to make things as normal as we can but we were keeping an eye on josh. Megyn - prior to him leaving, were you concerned for the safety of your daughers? Boob looks to michelle. Michelle - well we definitely put safeguards in our home. Boob - we also talked to our daughters and reminded them about wrong and right touch and that they... Michelle - they had a safe place to share their heart. We were trying to protect and watch and make sure that their hearts were safe and at the same time putting boundaries and putting safegueards up Boob - we werent giving up on josh... J'megyn saves the Duggars part 2 Megyn - the duggars were faced with questions including what to tell police and how to protect their children Did it feel at all like a sophies's choice? Boob - we felt like our son's heart had gone astray. Jesus shared a story... sheep... going after one... as parents we loved josh "and our other ones" we had to make sure that josh didnt make wrong choices. Michelle - it doesnt mean that youre not a good shephard, jesus was a good shephard but he went after one that went astray. We were doing the best we could to protect these and go after one... blah blah... devastated.. .we have to send him out. He has to go and get help. It was that evening when they left and took him, he was weeping and shared what he had done and we were weeping... and the little one was like "whats wrong?" The next day and for days I said 'josh has done some very bad things (tearless crying) and hes very sorry." Boob - I was thankful, and the ray of hope was... josh came and told us and his heart was still soft. We wouldnt have known if he hadnt came and told us. None of the victims really knew about this or understand what he had done... Megyn - what about that jim bob, as a parent, do you feel guilty when you learned that his behavior had continued and other girls had became victims? Boob - yes. We, I think as parents you feel like a failure when one of your kids does something wrong. You feel like "If I had done more training, or maybe something else" this wouldnt have happened but the truth is that kids will make their own choices and they will make decisions even though youve taught them right and wrong Megyn - I'm talking about, as the father of your girls not the father of josh. It must have been very hard to look at your little one and know that the behavior had been ongoing. Boob - right. I was so thankful, though that josh came and told us and that our girls, even though this was a bad situation, as we;ve talked to other families that have had other things happen, a lot of their stories were even worse. Megyn - just to clarify, it was 4 daughters and a babysitter, and you notified her... Boob - right, he called her and asked for forgiveness. She didnt know that had done anything either. It was more like just a, fondling, touch, while they were asleep for most of them and there were 2 incidents when they were awake. It was a bad thing. It was something we'd like to forget. Megyn - let me move back to therapy. You sent josh to this treatment center. Was there more therapy for josh and the girls? Boob - yes. What happened was, when josh came back from little rock, the last step was to make things right with the law because he had broken the law. We took him down to the local police station, the closest one to our house, and walked in and talked to a man there. Megyn - what was that like? How do you make the decision as a parent to bring your child to law enforcement and turn him over Boob - we felt like it was an important step for josh to confess to the police what he had done because he had broken the law and if we didnt do this that this would be something hanging over his head for the rest of his life... Megyn - was that terrifying? Boob - it was very terrifying. We didnt know if they were going to arrest him at that point or what they were going to do... Michelle - and now, we were waiting to hear... we didnt know if they were going to come... Duggars make it all better part 3 Megyn - How did you choose the person to whom you would surrender him? Because theres been some question about whether you chose a friend, someone you knew who would go easy on him Boob - I had a towing business for years so I did know officers. We went into headquarters, went in and talked to him... we took a witness with us and he shared everything... we had no idea what that officer was going through... Megyn - did you have any idea what the officer was going through... Boob and Megyn reinforce that Boob knew nothing about it. Boob - I was questioning why he would say it (that Josh hadnt told everything). Maybe he'll get out on parole or something. We took a witness... he told everything Michelle - He said "if you continue down this path you are going to destroy your life and you could end up in prison. Megyn - when that was over... you thought it was over Boob - we didnt know. A few weeks went by, months went by... someone called the hotline... Megyn - we'll get to that but I want to talk about counseling. Was that the only counseling he got and what about your daughters? Boob - no, Josh actually went and had complete Michelle - All of our children recieved professional counseling after this, including josh who paid for his own counseling himself Boob - from an accredited, professional counselor. Megyn - did you feel, when josh had been though all of this, and he emerged, did you feel that he was a threat? Boob - not at all Megyn - did you ever worry that the treatment didnt work Boob - no. Josh was a changed person Michelle - and we still had those safeguards in place (you mean the ones that didnt work?) I mean, its like, there were a lot of things that changed. This first son... to come to this place... things we learned even since then... we dont let boys babysit, they dont play hide and seek... your'e not alone in a room iwth someone else. Little ones dont sit on big boys laps or even family members, unless its your daddy ... we just, theres boundaries that we've learned. Lies, LIES! ALL LIES! Part 4 Shots of duggars in frumpers walking in a line... In 2004 they gained national media attention. In 2006 things almost unraveled. Someone lEAKED the story... reads the email. Harpo called authorities... police reports... the family told police the truth. FIVE victims were interviewed and they denied further abuse. SOL had run and case was closed. Megyn - its all behind you and then in 2008 you launched the show. What would make you launch a tv show about your family given this past Boob - you know, back in early on, it was after all this was taken care of in 2002-2003. A magazine came and asked to do a story... Megyn - are you thinking "wait, this may not be a good idea"... cameras discovered things Boob - we had nothing to hide. We had taken care of this years before and when they asked us to do the reality tv show all this had been taken care of 5 years before and we had a clean bill of health from the state megyn did any of the girls or josh say "hold on mom and dad" Boob - we had no fear because we hadnt, everything was taken care of. It was a sealed juvenile record. They told us all this was sealed and under law it couldnt come out Megyn - did you live in fear that this could come out? Michelle - I dont know that we lived in fear because it was resolved, forgiven, we had moved on in life Megyn - when you heard that, in late may, that the story had broken and you hadnt been given a heads up, that they were going to do this, what was your reaction? Boob - I said "god, I know that there are a lot of families out there that are hurting and you know what, this isnt something we wanted to come out but if people can see that josh, who did these very bad things when he was a young person, god can forgive him for these terrible things, then I hope other people realize that god can forgive them and make them a new creature. Megyn - do, do you - was there any motivation for this police chief, that you know of, to want to hurt your family? Michelle - I figure there must be an agenda Boob - I dont know if there was a bribe or a personal agenda Michelle - it definitely wasnt to be caring about the victims Megyn - have you had any prior dealings with her? Boob - I think josh had talked to her one day at a meeting and she turned and wouldnt talk to him. She was getting ready to retire... she said there were a few things I want to do before I retire... I think I was on the list. Megyn - any chance of you suing her or the city for this disclosure? Boob - we're talking to some attorneys and we'll see. The big picture is protecting juveniles records, we want to be an advocate for protecting juveniles records (not victims of sex abuse) because the mistakes juveniles make when they're young should be sealed. Megyn - how has this effected your daughers? Boob - our daughters were shocked. It crushed them at first. They didnt want this out. No victim wants their minor story to be told. Every victim should have the right to have their own sotry told, not a tabloid. Megyn - the main story we've heard has been they are hypocrites, they preached family values... they had this secret and they werent honest Boob - I dont think you go up to total strangers and say "hi, my name is so and so and i want you to know what I did as a child." Every family has things happen in the familes. Some have darker things than other. Megyn - what the critics are goin gfor is you shouldnt be preaching moral values, calling other people sinners when you in fact are sinners Boob - our son violated god's principles of doing improper touching. Thats terrible, but its been recently said that what josh did was inexcusable, but its not unforgivable. Megyn - Mike Huckabee said that. I know he is a friend of your family. Michelle, let me ask you, because you were in the news for making a robocall that suggested trans people would go into the bathrooms and may be child molesters... how could you unfairly in their view, suggest they are child molestors, knowing what you know about josh. Michelle - I think that protecting young girls and not allowing men and young men go into a girl's locker room is just common sense Megyn - But this is different because you injected child molestation into it Boob - I think you actually said pedophile. A pedophile is an adult that preys on children. Joshua was 14 and had just tuned 15. The legal definition is 16 preying on a child. He was a child preying on a child. We do not view josh as a pedophile. Megyn - what I'm asking you is can you understand the critics reaction to this news. Michelle - every one of us has done something wrong. Thats why jesus came. I feel like this is more about ... pause... pause... theres an agenda... pause... and theres people that are purposing to bring things out and twisting them to hurt and slander WE'RE BEING PERSEQUOOOOTED!!!!!!!!!! Part 5 Megyn - do you think that the backlash has been greater because of who you are and what you stand for? Michelle - I think some out there do Megyn - do you think in particular your christian beliefs are at issue here Boob - I think as people on the outside think well, christians are supposed to be perfect... no, all of us, as christian struggle everyday Megyn - what happenes to the duggars from here? Boob - I dont know if the rest of our family should be punished for the act of one of our children 12 years ago... we are fine whether they film us or not... we're going to go on and live life and serve god and make a difference in the world Michelle - enjoy our children and enjoy our grandchildren and continue on with life. Either way we are at peace. Megyn - do you think the show will be cancelled has TLC given you any indication? Boob - at this point our family is just trying to regroup from these attacks and when you are in every newspaper thoughout the world, its an unprecedented attack on our family and it was actually this informatio was released illegally... so I'm wondering why all these press is not going after these system for releasing the juvenile records. That is a huge story. What our son did 12 years ago is a major story to them too, but hopefully justice will be served on the ones that released juvenile records to protect other juvenile to prevent their records from being released. Megyn - it must have been terrible. I'm sure youre going through hell right now. Michelle - I think whats so devestating as a momma, for me. We took our children to the safety center, the children's safety center. We trusted them, the police department. Our children poured out their hearts, they shared everything (I thought they didn know anything...) and then to have their trust betrayed, for all their informatio to be turned over to a TABLOID! Shared in a slanderous way... as a mom that breaks my heart because this... they've ben victimized more than they WERE 12 YEARS AGO because they didn tknow then. In our hearts we havent been keeping secrets, we were protecting them and now, for people with an AGENDA in a for whatever profit they're going to get... god will use all of this for good... Boob - thank you for telling our story. Preview of friday - Jill and Jessa 1 in 5 girls and 1 in 20 boys is a victim of child sexual abuse 3 out of 4 of those abused were victimized by someone they know Researchers say that most young offenders are male and between the ages of 12 and 14. A 2009 analysis showed taht 85-90 % never are arrested for a sex crime again. If you know a victim in need of help call 18004224453 In a stunning follow up... we sat down with 2 sisters, jill and jessa. Jill - crying - we're victims, they cant do this to us Jessa - a system that was set up to protect kids... its greatly failed. Friday at 9 PM
TheJewAmongUs posted a topic in Quiver Full of DuggarsI was just thinking of the things I expect the Duggars to say in their Megyn Kelly interview. And the things I expect that they will never admit. Then I thought that someone could make a drinking game out of their buzzwords, but since they don't drink, that would be inappropriate. So I made bingo cards. 19 of them, so all your kids can play. Maybe not any more appropriate, but it's my way of keeping track of all the crap that has been spewed about raising children over the years and the glaring things that they'll never address. Here's the generator that I used. osric.com/bingo-card-generator/ Edited to add: I guess I can't upload a PDF here, will work on converting it.
duggarfamily.com/2015/5/next-week "Next week we will sit down with Megyn Kelly on Fox News to share our hearts with you about the pain that we walked through as a family twelve years ago, the tears we all shed and the forgiveness that was given. We appreciate the outpouring of love and prayers for our family at this time. -Jim Bob & Michelle Duggar" Disgusting! FOX is going to show some of it on Wednesday and then the full special one hour interview on Friday according to People. http://www.people.com/article/duggars-i ... on-scandal