FB bans mom for posting photos of son who lived 8 hours

[treemom]

I will not fault someone for hope, even if it appears that the situation is hopeless. I also don't fault a mother for choosing to carry to term knowing her baby would die. Even if she does have other children. Life comes with loss, tragedy and grief and for most of us it is not of our own choosing. There is no right choice in this, there simply isn't. It is all heartbreaking and fraught with pain. Choosing to terminate does not magically spare anyone one from pain or grief, it just presents different difficulties. And choosing to terminate does not spare the children either.

Being pro-choice means that to me. I support women and their doctors to make the choice they feel is the right one. Because it is. It is always the right choice.

[treemom]

I'm glad FB apologized as I can't see the pictures being against their terms of service. I know parents approach grieving differently, but if those pictures had appeared in my newsfeed, I would have been distressed. I wouldn't have reported her but I'd have been either removing her as a friend or hiding her for fear more would show up. I know I'm tenderhearted about seeing things like that so I'm not going near her blog or the news stories. I think a link to the blog might have been more appropriate in consideration for others but then I'm also not going to hold someone who just carried and gave birth to a stillborn with such severe issues to a high standard of considering other peoples' feelings either.

The child was not stillborn, he was born living.

But I will say this, whatever you felt about seeing the pictures is but a sliver of pain or discomfort of the parents. If one chooses to have grace then one would not choose to hide or defriend someone on facebook over this. They would deal with their distress and comfort the grieving.

I realize I am being hand slappy, and admit that my own experience of a termination and a still birth back to back means I am sensitive. But those who opted to work through their discomfort, tenderheartedness and distress to care for me as a human mean the world to me. And I think good things come from discomfort, tenderheartedness and distress.

[treemom]

I really don't get how Mark Zuckerberg gets all the blame for the deleted photos on Facebook. It stopped being his personal project years ago, and many people actually work on Facebook to take down all of the reported photos, comments, and users. One person can't possibly moderate the postings of millions of users. He may very well be fine with breastfeeding himself, it's the people who actually moderate the pictures who aren't.

As for deleting a picture of a grieving mother and her dying child... that's pretty low. Why would that even be reported?

Artmom once had a picture removed of her daughter and was quite upset. She felt angry at FB as well, until I pointed out it had to have been a friend who had reported it.

[2xx1xy1JD]

I will not fault someone for hope, even if it appears that the situation is hopeless. I also don't fault a mother for choosing to carry to term knowing her baby would die. Even if she does have other children. Life comes with loss, tragedy and grief and for most of us it is not of our own choosing. There is no right choice in this, there simply isn't. It is all heartbreaking and fraught with pain. Choosing to terminate does not magically spare anyone one from pain or grief, it just presents different difficulties. And choosing to terminate does not spare the children either.

Being pro-choice means that to me. I support women and their doctors to make the choice they feel is the right one. Because it is. It is always the right choice.

Amen. :clap:

There are no happy endings in a situation like this - only different versions of horrible.

The other thing to recognize is that not all women will even have the choice in a meaningful way. Doctors have been killed for daring to provide later-term abortions.

[treemom]

Amen. :clap:

There are no happy endings in a situation like this - only different versions of horrible.

The other thing to recognize is that not all women will even have the choice in a meaningful way. Doctors have been killed for daring to provide later-term abortions.

So true. The world is a different place than it was for me. And even then many women weren't able to have a real choice. I could travel and had the support of my spouse.

I also think it is a very dangerous habit to say whether or not termination is the one right answer, the unselfish ones. It feeds into the anti-choice propaganda that we want and desire for women to have abortions.

[Coconut Flan]

Treemom, I do feel you were being a bit handslappy. Having lost five pregnancies myself, one of my ways of handling the grief is to not put myself in the way of certain things. Looking at those pictures for instance would not be healthy for me. If you give that woman the freedom of handling her grief her way, I get to handle things my way, as you also have the freedom to handle your grief and your feelings about this woman's situation.

I plainly stated I had not looked at her blog and have no intentions of doing so.

[Kitty]

Artmom once had a picture removed of her daughter and was quite upset. She felt angry at FB as well, until I pointed out it had to have been a friend who had reported it.

Indeed. That's how Facebook works: nothing gets taken down unless it gets reported. I've seen quite a lot of shit fly under the radar because nobody would report it.

I feel like this is worth saying/repeating: Don't blame Facebook for everything. It can be used for good, and it can be used for evil. It is a tool and nothing more. If "Facebook" is giving you problems, take a good, long look at your friends list to go about fixing them.

[alba]

I feel like this is worth saying/repeating: Don't blame Facebook for everything. It can be used for good, and it can be used for evil. It is a tool and nothing more. If "Facebook" is giving you problems, take a good, long look at your friends list to go about fixing them.

I agree on Facebook being a tool that's largely what you make of it. However, I disagree that it's entirely the friends list that's the problem. Facebook is notorious for making changes to things like privacy settings without letting users know, so that no matter how discriminating you are with your friends list you're still not as in control of your information as you were five years ago.

ETA: Yes, Facebook only bans or deletes pictures if your friends report them, but I think to say all problems boil down to the friends list lets FB off the hook.

[treemom]

Treemom, I do feel you were being a bit handslappy. Having lost five pregnancies myself, one of my ways of handling the grief is to not put myself in the way of certain things. Looking at those pictures for instance would not be healthy for me. If you give that woman the freedom of handling her grief her way, I get to handle things my way, as you also have the freedom to handle your grief and your feelings about this woman's situation.

I plainly stated I had not looked at her blog and have no intentions of doing so.

And i still think it would lack grace to defriend someone.

[treemom]

I agree on Facebook being a tool that's largely what you make of it. However, I disagree that it's entirely the friends list that's the problem. Facebook is notorious for making changes to things like privacy settings without letting users know, so that no matter how discriminating you are with your friends list you're still not as in control of your information as you were five years ago.

ETA: Yes, Facebook only bans or deletes pictures if your friends report them, but I think to say all problems boil down to the friends list lets FB off the hook.

I am still as in control, but I took a long time to figure out the privacy settings.

[JesusFightClub]

With my shop steward hat on, a strong warning.

DO NOT FRIEND WORK COLLEAGUES. EVER. ESPECIALLY NOT YOUR MANAGER.

We're getting more and more cases of accusations of gross misconduct and even dismissal for things people say on FB. In my work it's "bringing into disrepute." In the private sector it's worse.

Examples from LabourStart:

Woman who lost her job for saying "Some days I think I work in a nursery, and I don't mean plants!" Didn't mention her employer, locked down FB. A "friend" printed out the page and took it to HR. Dismissed.

Guy (with cancer). Same scenario. He said "So great to be back at work lol not really" Again, a helpful "friend" showed it to the powers that be. Dismissed and escorted from the building.

Both those cases won at tribunal. Neither was reinstated. We are seeing tiny payouts and almost 100% non reinstatement.

Be careful.

[2xx1xy1JD]

...and that's part of the reason why I have still not added any friends to my experimental FB account.

I can deal with LinkedIn. It's work, period. I don't add Contacts who have the power to "bring me into disrepute".

With Facebook, though, I have pending Friend requests from:

- my husband

- my daughter (7th grade)

- a former member of a mommy board who wanted my legal advice on dealing with her former neo-Nazi boyfriend

- my Member of Parliament

- friend from my old synagogue

- current best friend

- former clients

- people that I don't know

I can't imagine having all of these people together in the same room. Why would I want them in the same virtual space?

[StarrieEyedKat]

...and that's part of the reason why I have still not added any friends to my experimental FB account.

I can deal with LinkedIn. It's work, period. I don't add Contacts who have the power to "bring me into disrepute".

With Facebook, though, I have pending Friend requests from:

- my husband

- my daughter (7th grade)

- a former member of a mommy board who wanted my legal advice on dealing with her former neo-Nazi boyfriend

- my Member of Parliament

- friend from my old synagogue

- current best friend

- former clients

- people that I don't know

I can't imagine having all of these people together in the same room. Why would I want them in the same virtual space?

That's actually what I really like about facebook. It allows people to connect to others that they normally wouldn't, and out of their safe bubble of like minded friends. Sure, right now I'm participating in an equal rights argument on a friends wall, but I find that to be a positive thing, not a negative.

[JesusFightClub]

Exactly 2x.

And you can't control what people see fit to post. I had someone post on my wall "I love Gerry Adams! Between the Armalite and the ballot box, he will lead us to victory." At 5am.

While I was amused by the notion of someone waking up with a rush of love for Gerry Adams at 5am, such sentiments can get you in trouble. I had one person who er, went a bit further, someone posting in favour of Sion na Gael someone else posting in praise of North Korea. Defriended.

[Witsec7]

Yea, and for all those reasons I'll stick to my phoney FB account.

[Maul the Koala]

To bring this back to fundies, did anyone else follow the Faith Hope thing?

http://babyfaithhope.blogspot.com/2008/ ... o-far.html

Baby born with anencephaly, mother firmly believes that with God all things are possible, and that her baby is totally normal.

There was also some drama about Faith's father, who was a fundie pastor (I think? I can't remember the details) and rejected Myah, Faith's mother, when she got pregnant.

I can't snark on that blog. I feel awful because I'm reading it and there's a definite overtone of that the medical community was 100% wrong and everything was normal. I think she takes comfort in that she thought the baby could hear, see and respond to her. I can't deprive the mom of that. There is one blog from Brazil where the daughter has acrania and they are actively campaigning against the government allowing induced labour/abortions of pregnancies where the fetus has acrania or any form of anencephaly.

belovedvitoria.blogspot.ca

[alba]

I am still as in control, but I took a long time to figure out the privacy settings.

The problem is that FB changes things so that the responsibility is on the user not only to figure out the privacy settings, but to regularly check that nothing's changed. It's fine to say that users should check out the privacy settings and make sure they're comfortable with them, but that doesn't mean FB's blameless when it changes things without notifying users, so they only find out that FB's been recording what they do elsewhere online when they see it posted in their news feed.

That's pretty much why I disagree with the argument that it's entirely up to the user to control it. Yes, there are a lot of ways you *can* control things and should if you want your information kept relatively private, but FB should also respect users' privacy and their privacy settings.

[treemom]

The problem is that FB changes things so that the responsibility is on the user not only to figure out the privacy settings, but to regularly check that nothing's changed. It's fine to say that users should check out the privacy settings and make sure they're comfortable with them, but that doesn't mean FB's blameless when it changes things without notifying users, so they only find out that FB's been recording what they do elsewhere online when they see it posted in their news feed.

That's pretty much why I disagree with the argument that it's entirely up to the user to control it. Yes, there are a lot of ways you *can* control things and should if you want your information kept relatively private, but FB should also respect users' privacy and their privacy settings.

I wasn't making that argument, I was making the argument that I still have control over what gets seen by whom.

[alba]

I wasn't making that argument, I was making the argument that I still have control over what gets seen by whom.

I'm sorry, I misunderstood. I assumed that because the original point to which I was responding said that problems with FB are problems with your friends' list only you were agreeing with that statement. My mistake.

[treemom]

Np. I should have bolded. I was responding to this "so that no matter how discriminating you are with your friends list you're still not as in control of your information as you were five years ago."

I understand the frustration of the fb privacy settings, but it has gotten better in some ways over the last few years. For instance, you can change the security of a status message after you post it. You have some more flexibility in how the security is done.

We lost some things, but we also gained more granularity. I like that.

[JesusFightClub]

Oh yeah! I will friend you guys, my phone is just sulking with FB at the moment. I warn you though, I am boring. Think my last status update was a complaint about aa national newspaper's inaccurate description of the Met's firearms unit's weaponry. Yeah, I worry about that stuff.

ETA: Kevlar vests are not "ballistic vests". A ballistic vest is a suicide bomb. The unit is NOT equipped with fully automatic guns. They have modified semi autos. THINK ABOUT WHY THIS MAY BE. I hate coppers but there is a reason why firearms units don't have badge numbers. THINK ON.

Also, there would have been SAS as backup but NOT SBS. And the dual Glocks are because in a combat situation you can't sit around reloading. Duh.

And again "why couldn't this happen to the rioters last year" is a fucking stupid argument. Death for property crimes? You utter cunts.

Sorry, FJ. Not your fault we have stupidly right wing papers here which talk shite.

[alba]

Yeah, that's true. It's not all bad; I just don't like it when they change things and I don't realise :P I think that's why I feel less in control, because when I first joined FB they seemed to make changes far less frequently.

[StarrieEyedKat]

Oh yeah! I will friend you guys, my phone is just sulking with FB at the moment. I warn you though, I am boring. Think my last status update was a complaint about aa national newspaper's inaccurate description of the Met's firearms unit's weaponry. Yeah, I worry about that stuff.

ETA: Kevlar vests are not "ballistic vests". A ballistic vest is a suicide bomb. The unit is NOT equipped with fully automatic guns. They have modified semi autos. THINK ABOUT WHY THIS MAY BE. I hate coppers but there is a reason why firearms units don't have badge numbers. THINK ON.

Also, there would have been SAS as backup but NOT SBS. And the dual Glocks are because in a combat situation you can't sit around reloading. Duh.

And again "why couldn't this happen to the rioters last year" is a fucking stupid argument. Death for property crimes? You utter cunts.

Sorry, FJ. Not your fault we have stupidly right wing papers here which talk shite.

:dance: Feel free to add me, I'm the only active (redacted) on FB. I think you'll liven my news feed up some, I find the bits and pieces you talk about here fascinating.

[clibbyjo]

:dance: Feel free to add me, I'm the only active (redacted) on FB. I think you'll liven my news feed up some, I find the bits and pieces you talk about here fascinating.

MY dream of JFC FB friend is coming true! :dance: (Better go add some tough looking pictures or something...)

[MaroonMandy]

To bring this back to fundies, did anyone else follow the Faith Hope thing?

http://babyfaithhope.blogspot.com/2008/ ... o-far.html

Baby born with anencephaly, mother firmly believes that with God all things are possible, and that her baby is totally normal.

There was also some drama about Faith's father, who was a fundie pastor (I think? I can't remember the details) and rejected Myah, Faith's mother, when she got pregnant.

There's anotherd (fundie-light?) blog that I've seen and one of their kids had anecephaly. They're church-goers and the mom sees the babies death as a way for her and her God to reach out to others. She's also struggling quite a bit with people who think she should just move on.

thegiftofrachelslife.blogspot.com/

I found this blog when a college friend said they had found out her daughter would be born with the same condition and I went Googling to find out what exactly anecephaly was.