Bro Gary Hawkins 23: Give Us the History

[Pammy]

1 hour ago, thoughtful said:

Here's how it describes Onesimus:

"Onesimus is a man in the Bible that had done wrong and had to go to prison.  While in prison, he met the Apostle Paul who led him to Christ.  When Onesimus was ready to get out of prison and go home, he didn’t have a place to go.  Paul wrote a letter to Philemon (the book of Philemon in the Bible) and asked Philemon to take him in, help him out, and get him started in his Christian life on the outside of prison."

The word slave seems to be missing there, Dave.

That's an absolutely wild take on the Onesimus story.

For the first and most obvious thing: there's no reason to believe Onesimus was or ever had been a prisoner of any kind. *Paul* was under arrest, but it was 'house arrest' (a Roman version of it) and there's no info on when/where/how Paul and Onesimus got acquainted (before or during Paul's captivity).

Second: the thing that Onesimus had 'done wrong' was that the escaped from servitude under Philemon (potentially taking some money or resources with him in the escape) -- a 'wrong' that we don't usually consider wrong here and now. Escaped slaves were returned to their 'owners' for punishment; they were not put into prison.

Onesimus was never 'ready to get out of prison' or 'go home'. He was sent 'home' (to his 'owner') *by Paul* -- on purpose and at great risk. He could have gone anywhere. He was doing just fine as an escaped slave making some kind of life in Rome. Back to Philemon was absolutely the most dangerous place for him to go. Philemon (and only Philemon) had legal grounds to execute him. He also had grounds to go after Paul for knowingly sheltering him (for any amount of time) before sending him 'home'.

Paul wrote to Philemon to ask him to accept his 'property' back without the normal punishments for his 'crime' (escaping, taking things) and to live with his 'property' in a way that treats him as a brother and an equal. Which was an absurdly strange and huge thing for Paul to be asking.

(And Paul doesn't stop there. He hints clearly that 'the right thing to do' would be to grant Onesimus the status of freedman, so Onesimus could head back to Paul. Paul wanted to keep working with Onesimus himself, and was only facing this problem because working with Onesimus, knowing he was an escaped slave, was illegal -- it was 'theft'.)

[thoughtful]

Thanks, @Pammy. That's the way I understood the story, when hearing it explained by those who know the history better than I do.

I just didn't have the patience to write it all out, and couldn't find the stuff I'd read or videos I've watched before about it, to check the details or just link here. I think it's because it was mentioned only briefly, as part of a longer discussion about slavery in the bible.

Baker is not alone - some apologists argue that Paul saw Onesimus as an equal, was asking Philemon to treat him with respect, that Onesimus was being restored and saved, and  some fold it into the "we are all slaves to something, let's all be slaves to Jesus" argument, since Paul uses a lot that language at the beginning of the letter.

Hey, at least historians think this one was actually written by Paul, unlike the Timothy letters and Titus.

[Ozlsn]

On 10/6/2023 at 9:29 AM, thoughtful said:

Tchwd - that's classic Gary. He didn't even notice it.

And I love that he could only get as far as "government thing" to describe it, in his tiny little brain.

A commenter knows the solution, of course:

Oh good, will put a reminder in my calendar for that one, just to see if any of these numbnuts vanish in a puff of self-righteous anger in November next year. Somehow I think they'll all still be there whinging online.

[thoughtful]

Today is the 51st anniversary of Gary's birth

Age in Jesus - 24+

Maturity level - toddler.

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[thoughtful]

Becky must have reminded Gary to thank everyone.

[thoughtful]

Here is one of the nearly 300 birthday greetings Gary got on Facebook:

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You may need to search a bit, but it does say Happy Birthday in there somewhere.

[Xan]

That might officially be the most emojis I've ever seen in a post.  

It is a little weird that he used the line, "Through the grace of God, and the Blood of Jesus Christ, we become brothers and sisters" and immediately followed it with, "God created marriage as the greatest relationship between a Man and a Woman."  Which is it, Jay?  Are we brothers and sisters or are we supposed to be in romantic relationships?

[thoughtful]

13 hours ago, Xan said:

That might officially be the most emojis I've ever seen in a post.  

It is a little weird that he used the line, "Through the grace of God, and the Blood of Jesus Christ, we become brothers and sisters" and immediately followed it with, "God created marriage as the greatest relationship between a Man and a Woman."  Which is it, Jay?  Are we brothers and sisters or are we supposed to be in romantic relationships?

Jay is a wedding officiant. He wants everyone to be brothers and sisters in Christ, and come pay him to officiate at their wedding when they find the brother or sister they want to marry, of course !

https://www.facebook.com/scwc.weddings4u/

 

[Alisamer]

15 hours ago, Xan said:

Are we brothers and sisters or are we supposed to be in romantic relationships?

Insert South Carolina joke here...

 

On 10/7/2023 at 4:49 PM, thoughtful said:

Today is the 51st anniversary of Gary's birth

Age in Jesus - 24+

Maturity level - toddler.

  Hide contents

 

Hat: Made in China.

I'm still blown away that half-wits and black and white thinkers like Gary can manage the mental gymnastics to excuse all of Trump's clearly non-Christian living and behavior. Can you imagine if someone asked Trump which version of the Bible he prefers? I'd be surprised if he knows there ARE different versions. And the one time he's been seen with a Bible for a photo op it wasn't a King James and he was holding it upside down. 

[AmazonGrace]

Umbrellas, how do they work?

there's no room for anyone to stand under those umbrellas except the kids. And if there's any wind the rain can be pretty horizontal over here and those children will be soaked.

[Joyster]

According to Gary’s sister, Gary’s mom has been in ICU the last few days with septic shock. Gary’s ex sent love on the original post. 

Also, there is a shared memory for Gary on his daughter’s Facebook page. I guess little Joe was born? Maybe? The poor girl got Gary’s gift for writing confusing messages. maybe she’s just referring to him in her uterus. 
 

 

[thoughtful]

Becky and Gary got another dog. I think the missing word in the third sentence is "wife."

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I hope it gets good care.

I wonder what happened to their second dog, Gideon the chihuahua. At this point, I'm guessing Rascal is long gone, but we don't really know. And I have no idea if Caleb's dog is still with Becky and Gary.

ETA - he already got a brilliant, creative suggestion for a name, and gave it a thumbs up.

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Edited October 10, 2023 by thoughtful
adding something

[postscript]

More name suggestions in the comments - Weasel, Gospel and Spanky. Please don’t give Gary ideas with the first two. Someone asked Gary the breed, and he says “chiweenie.” I assume that means a cross between a chihuahua and a dachshund, but it sounds like a Chicago style hot dog. 

Oh, and someone else posted a photo of their own absolutely adorable puppy. 

[thoughtful]

More comments. Carol seems to have made the same guess about the missing word as I did.

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Oh, and this guy may have the worst case of Automatic Apostrophe Before an S Syndrome I've ever seen. He did it to his own name when creating his Facebook account.

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[thoughtful]

If I am understanding this correctly, Gary and the King James College gang seem to be stealing ideas from Pastor Baker, and trying to get their crappy materials into prisons.

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[Alisamer]

A co-worker’s son did some time in prison, followed by residential rehab before going home on parole. (Drug related, I suspect self medicating for bipolar as he’s clean except weed since that’s being treated properly.) Apparently at the rehab they did some religious stuff and he began finding comfort in reading the Bible, but found the King James - all they had there - quite difficult. His mom mentioned it to me, since I’ve been to church more than she has over our lives. 

Gary would be horrified with me. The next day I found him a different translation that not only was easier to read but also had each of the well known Biblical stories marked out as they appeared in the text. He was very happy. I don’t even know if he still has it but it helped him through a tough transition far more than the KJV did. I can’t imagine their “college” course being all that helpful. 

[thoughtful]

Gary has asked for prayers for his mother:

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[thoughtful]

Becky and Gary were in church on Sunday morning.

Pastor Baker did a long wind-up to his sermon, claiming he didn't want to be sensational and preach about world news. He claims that, for three weeks, he'd been planning a sermon on the phrase "above all," and how it is used over and over in the bible.

Citing how many times the phrase was used, and in what context, he winds his way into claiming that God had planted that idea in his head weeks ago as a message that he was supposed to preach about Israel this morning. He says that sometimes the phrase refers to Israel or the ancient Hebrews, sometimes it refers to God, and sometime it even refers to the antichrist. So, somehow, that was a message from God. 🤷‍♀️

It's all prophecy to this guy.

He makes two crappy faux-modest preacher jokes in the process of setting up his subject: "What do you think God was leading to do? Dismiss early for lunch? You wish."

And he reminds them that usually, when he speaks about prophecy, it's a months-long series on Wednesday nights, but he thinks he can whittle this one down to about three hours hahaha. "Does anybody have a sack lunch, fish sandwiches maybe, we can pray over 'em, multiply 'em and pass 'em out? Anybody? All right, you guys get to fast."

Ten minutes were wasted on this crap, when he could have just said "I am going to speak about Israel."

More later, if I can stomach it.

[thoughtful]

Update on Gary's mom, from his sister's facebook:

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Quote

Update on my Mom her heart is only working 25% to 30% she is in heart failure she has had a few heart attacks and they say there is nothing they can do because of all the calcium buildup in her body. Her blood pressure is still low and they are trying to take her off of the medicine that is helping to keep it up. Please Pray for her and our family as we figure out what to do in the days to come. Momma is such a strong beautiful amazing woman and I love her so much! She has always been the best mom and grandma and we need your prayers it’s in Gods hands.

 

 

[Dana723]

On 10/9/2023 at 12:18 AM, Xan said:

That might officially be the most emojis I've ever seen in a post.  

 

Jill Rodrigues is jealous

[thoughtful]

I hope Gary isn't making everyone else miserable as they go through this.

He posted pictures of family members gathered around the bed with his mom in it. Her (?) poodle is on the bed with her - I like the idea that the hospital/hospice was OK with that.

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Edited October 15, 2023 by thoughtful
correcting error

[Xan]

There seem to be a lot of people on their phones.  Even Daddy Danny has his phone out.  The person who looks the most upset is Caleb's wife.

[thoughtful]

9 hours ago, Xan said:

There seem to be a lot of people on their phones.  Even Daddy Danny has his phone out. 

I noticed that, as well. It does look like they are ignoring Sheila altogether.

But, the pics just might have captured a moment when several of them were contacting other loved ones, checking messages coming in from worried friends and relatives, etc.

Gary, who I assume took the pictures, certainly wouldn't think through the possibility that what he captured might not portray them in an ideal light, let alone that posting pictures of a deathbed gathering is disgusting to begin with.

I couldn't help but notice  a classic Garyism - "weened" for "weaned."

ETA - I am now wondering if that is Gary in the middle of two of the pictures. I was assuming it was someone else (who also happens to have that stupid hat), since the person is beardless.

But maybe Gary shaved his beard (or rather, Becky shaved his beard). Here is a pic from church on 10/1:

 

Edited October 15, 2023 by thoughtful

[thoughtful]

The latest from Gary's sister:

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There are pictures posted - at least this time they show family members holding Sheila's hands and being close. One of the younger grandkids is cuddling in bed with her. Isaac is there.

[thoughtful]

It seems there's been a miracle:

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This was accompanied by pictures, mostly of various family members looking happy.