Harry & Meghan 14: The Reverse Harry - Restoring the Angevin Empire

[rosamundi]

8 minutes ago, just_ordinary said:

@rosamundi maybe it makes commercial sense though? I doubt Royal Lodge would just sit around empty. So maybe the lease it out for a higher rent, no family tariff this time. No idea how much PA.pays, but if it’s not a family tariff, it would make no sense if Charles has to step in and pay PA rent. 

As part of the lease negotiations with Prince Andrew, it was decided that the Royal Lodge can only be leased to people in the Royal Family (the current lease can only be assigned to Andrew's daughters). Because of where it is, it is felt that it is in too sensitive a position to be leased to any old bod due to the security risks. You can read the 2005 review in the Royal Property leases PDF linked here. Realistically, the pool of "people in the Royal Family who want to lease the Royal Lodge, a Gardener's Cottage, the Chapel Lodge, six Lodge Cottages, and police security accommodation in addition to 40 hectares of land" is going to be quite small, so whether the decision to only lease to the Royal family changes, or if it is used for something else, who knows?

[Coconut Flan]

Royal Lodge has 30 rooms including seven bedrooms.  The tabloids consistently make the error of listing the number of rooms as the number of bedrooms for royal properties.  

Quote

The main building has some 30 rooms, including 7 bedrooms, and a saloon (48 by 30 by 30 feet, 14.6 by 9.1 by 9.1 m). The original conservatory survives. The grounds contain the miniature cottage Y Bwthyn Bach, a gift to Princess Elizabeth as a child from the people of Wales in 1932.

 

[prayawaythefundie]

58 minutes ago, Jackie3 said:

Of course he has that option, if he's lived a decent life. What is he so afraid of? What secrets does Andrew know?

King Charles should not be held hostage to a pedophile's threats. Or to anyone's threats. A real king would say, "Write what you want, I'm not afraid." 

Yeah, everyone just has to accept what‘s written about them - except for Harry & Meghan.

[Manda]

What a thing to have worked themselves into - being known as two grudge carriers:

https://www.geo.tv/latest/473760-prince-harry-abusing-freedom-as-delusional-duke

[Jackie3]

1 hour ago, Manda said:

What a thing to have worked themselves into - being known as two grudge carriers:

https://www.geo.tv/latest/473760-prince-harry-abusing-freedom-as-delusional-duke

It's great he doesn't worry about "how he is known." What a waste of time that would be. Do people really live their lives like that? Imagine worrying about the opinion of a "royal commentator".

In any event, looks like King Charles is king of grudge-carrying too. "You were mean to me, so get out of my musty cottage!"

Edited March 2, 2023 by Jackie3

[Coconut Flan]

Gentle reminder:  This is a Harry thread not an Andrew thread.  Please take Andrew discussion to its own home.  Thank you.  

[hoipolloi]

1 hour ago, Coconut Flan said:

Gentle reminder:  This is a Harry thread not an Andrew thread.  Please take Andrew discussion to its own home.  Thank you.  

Pursuant to the gentle reminder, a number of Andrew-related posts have been moved to the existing PA & Epstein thread.

 

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

Not that we can know - but how much of H and M's stuff is there anyway? In the netflix thing wasn't there a section about packing up frogmore and finding some blanket they forgot about?

It must be sad for Harry if all this is true.  I think he's an ass but it's gotta feel awful to be not wanted in your home country. A whole country that's like "yeah go away" and he was so popular all his life. I don't care who you are and whether you're a conceited ass or not - It has to be a terrible feeling.

I expect Charles has a lot of plans he's been waiting to implement. Maybe some of these buildings will get new unexpected uses? 

Did you all see some tabloid "insider" saying Meghan expected to live in Windsor castle and was dismayed by the nottingham cottage? The article made it seem like Meghan was awful for not being graciously in love with a small house - 2 bedrooms? I think? 

But really? if I was a rather wealthy american used to living in my own very nice house and I married a literal freaking prince who was also rich - My expectations for housing would actually be pretty high.

My real life self would be perfectly fine with most any place if it suited my needs. But if I married a millionaire and won a million dollars myself - I'd upgrade housing and I don't think anybody would shame me over it.

 

[Coconut Flan]

It's all a matter of interesting perspective.  For some reason the queen and Charles could have loads of properties, but the grandchildren higher in the line of succession pretty much were allotted places like Nott Cott until after marriage.  Lower in the succession and I guess they've been on their own or on their parents' dime.  William and Kate lived there for a time so it wasn't shocking that Harry was there until a property was allotted him and refurbished.  Harry and Meghan didn't need to look far back for the precedent.  

[Jackie3]

1 hour ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

It must be sad for Harry if all this is true.  I think he's an ass but it's gotta feel awful to be not wanted in your home country

It's terrible optics for the King right before his Coronation. Really, an unwise decision.

Charles doesnt' seem vindictive or angry enough to do such a thing. And while Harry breaks a royal taboo by writing about his life, he really doesn't say anything that terrible about Charles.

But he does say bad things about Camilla. I think Camilla convinced Charles to take this step.

 

 

[prayawaythefundie]

I would assume that both couples knew Nott Cott would only be a transitional home until after their actual wedding gift home was done. Maybe it‘s another case of Harry not passing on information to his wife?

[klein_roeschen]

5 hours ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

Not that we can know - but how much of H and M's stuff is there anyway? In the netflix thing wasn't there a section about packing up frogmore and finding some blanket they forgot about?

It must be sad for Harry if all this is true.  I think he's an ass but it's gotta feel awful to be not wanted in your home country. A whole country that's like "yeah go away" and he was so popular all his life. I don't care who you are and whether you're a conceited ass or not - It has to be a terrible feeling.

I expect Charles has a lot of plans he's been waiting to implement. Maybe some of these buildings will get new unexpected uses? 

Did you all see some tabloid "insider" saying Meghan expected to live in Windsor castle and was dismayed by the nottingham cottage? The article made it seem like Meghan was awful for not being graciously in love with a small house - 2 bedrooms? I think? 

But really? if I was a rather wealthy american used to living in my own very nice house and I married a literal freaking prince who was also rich - My expectations for housing would actually be pretty high.

My real life self would be perfectly fine with most any place if it suited my needs. But if I married a millionaire and won a million dollars myself - I'd upgrade housing and I don't think anybody would shame me over it.

 

I may sound harsh here, but if they were that unhappy with Nottingham cottage, they could have looked around London and rented a house/ apartment that would have better suited their wants. As you said, she married a millionaire and he could have afforted it instead of expecting his family to provide housing they deemed suitable.

Megan is an US citizien and she should be familiar with the American Revolution. One of the reasons the people got rid of the the british king there was because they don't want to pay for the lavish lifestyle of said royals with their taxes.

3 hours ago, prayawaythefundie said:

I would assume that both couples knew Nott Cott would only be a transitional home until after their actual wedding gift home was done. Maybe it‘s another case of Harry not passing on information to his wife?

What I find more and more baffling here is not only Harry's deep lack of communicating what is expected of Megan, but also Megan's lack of asking questions. She has a degree in International Relations and was well into her 30s when she met Harry. She couldn't be that naive and star struck about her future role as a public member of the Royal family.

[prayawaythefundie]

@klein_roeschen I think they couldn‘t have just rented any luxury home in london because of their undeniably high security needs. Both Frogmore Cottage and Nottingham Cottage are on the grounds of already existing royal residences with very high security standards.

I could imagine Harry showing his fiancee Frogmore Cottage and telling her they would get it as a wedding present but not mentioning they would have to live at tiny Nottingham Cottage for a while first. 

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

11 minutes ago, prayawaythefundie said:

@klein_roeschen I think they couldn‘t have just rented any luxury home in london because of their undeniably high security needs. Both Frogmore Cottage and Nottingham Cottage are on the grounds of already existing royal residences with very high security standards.

I could imagine Harry showing his fiancee Frogmore Cottage and telling her they would get it as a wedding present but not mentioning they would have to live at tiny Nottingham Cottage for a while first. 

Yeah I think to Harry it was a natural progression, knowing there'd be a wedding house gift . 

But I imagine for Meghan it wasn't so obvious how things work and it seems Harry didn't explain much of anything well.

It is weird to me that being single seems to leave you in limbo. Harry was in his 30s too and that cottage was his home base as a bachelor right? 

Kinda strange like at 30 they didn't arrange something a bit more...settled? For him.

You're a full on adult, rich, and a prince but you're just living in the equivalent of your parents basement.

What a bizarre way to grow up.

 

[viii]

I feel like Harry also didn't stop to question things until Meghan came along. He probably thought Nott Cottage was great until Meghan showed up and was like 'ew'. Sometimes things that are "obvious" to others aren't obvious to us if we're too close to the situation. 

[Baxter]

The house situation is just one more example of Harry not explaining things to Meagan. Both Andrew and Edward got their houses after they were married. I believe Edward was on the older side when he got married so this shouldn't have been a shock to anyone. 

Also, I feel that with the royal family, there is a weird dichotomy of luxury and frugality. So I doubt anyone I'm the family would have thought it was weird that Harry and then Harry and Meagan would live there for a bit. William and Kate did. I believe at least one of Andrew's daughters has lived there too. 

Also, Queen Elizabeth liked to use some of her smaller houses on her at times like Wood Lodge at Sandringham. They were more intimate and a change from her normal life. So she may have thought it would be nice for them to live in a cozy cottage for a bit until Frogmore Cottage was ready. 

I don't see anything wrong with Harry and Megan living there for a while. I don't see this as a case of them not being treated fairly. Harry is either too dense to understand how things work in his family or too dense to understand he needed to explain things to Megan. 

[klein_roeschen]

2 hours ago, prayawaythefundie said:

@klein_roeschen I think they couldn‘t have just rented any luxury home in london because of their undeniably high security needs. Both Frogmore Cottage and Nottingham Cottage are on the grounds of already existing royal residences with very high security standards.

I could imagine Harry showing his fiancee Frogmore Cottage and telling her they would get it as a wedding present but not mentioning they would have to live at tiny Nottingham Cottage for a while first. 

London is a destination for the families of the wealthy and powerfull. There is a market for luxurious residences with top notch security. If they wanted to find other lodgings more after their taste they would have found plenty. But they had to pay for that. But top notch private security costs and they made it known how they think about paying for their own security.

2 hours ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

Yeah I think to Harry it was a natural progression, knowing there'd be a wedding house gift . 

But I imagine for Meghan it wasn't so obvious how things work and it seems Harry didn't explain much of anything well.

It is weird to me that being single seems to leave you in limbo. Harry was in his 30s too and that cottage was his home base as a bachelor right? 

Kinda strange like at 30 they didn't arrange something a bit more...settled? For him.

You're a full on adult, rich, and a prince but you're just living in the equivalent of your parents basement.

What a bizarre way to grow up.

 

Or maybe they thought that after William and Kate where okay with spending their first married years in Nottingham cottage until after the birth of their first child, Harry and Megan would be the same.

[Jackie3]

3 minutes ago, Baxter said:

Also, I feel that with the royal family, there is a weird dichotomy of luxury and frugality. S

From what I've read, this is very true! At least of Charles. He was always getting upset about random bills, like feed for his polo ponies, without ever considering just giving up polo. I think it's guilt. 

[tabitha2]

Look at some of Harry’s actions… he acted like a drunken racist fool more than once. His brother was never that bad  Did he deserve to be bailed out or covered up for? 

[hoipolloi]

1 hour ago, Baxter said:

Also, I feel that with the royal family, there is a weird dichotomy of luxury and frugality.

Well said. QE2 was famous for her frugality -- reportedly sending Charles back outside to look for a lost dog leash -- but she never stinted herself on things like residences, royal yachts, and hobbies like horse breeding + racing.

1 hour ago, klein_roeschen said:

London is a destination for the families of the wealthy and powerfull. There is a market for luxurious residences with top notch security. If they wanted to find other lodgings more after their taste they would have found plenty. But they had to pay for that.

All this. For those with money -- like H & M -- there were good choices for a UK residence that did not rely on the BRF. They stuck with the BRF because they thought they were getting a bargain.

[mama4cor]

4 hours ago, prayawaythefundie said:

@klein_roeschen I think they couldn‘t have just rented any luxury home in london because of their undeniably high security needs. Both Frogmore Cottage and Nottingham Cottage are on the grounds of already existing royal residences with very high security standards.

I could imagine Harry showing his fiancee Frogmore Cottage and telling her they would get it as a wedding present but not mentioning they would have to live at tiny Nottingham Cottage for a while first. 

I thought I remembered that they rented a farmhouse somewhere at one point and lo and behold, they did…

https://www.countryliving.com/uk/homes-interiors/property/a21049880/prince-harry-meghan-markle-signed-lease-cotswold-home/

Just thought I’d share that info since I spent 20 minutes of my life searching online instead of working like I should be. 😂

[prayawaythefundie]

50 minutes ago, viii said:

I'm not saying that Harry didn't get any help, because he certainly did. They pushed the silly, mischievous angle as hard as they could, because it worked for Harry. He was the *cheeky* one. But he definitely didn't receive all the help that William did. 

Probably true but I also think he went further than William. There‘s wild partying & getting drunk and then there‘s taking psychodelic drugs and being photographed naked in Vegas.

[Coconut Flan]

Some things you simply cannot hide or gloss over.  

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

I forgot about that rental...but didn't it get slammed by paparazzi and helicopters or something?

 

It's weird how frugal they are...it's more like cheap.

Cuz frugal is living ina reasonable sized house and not eating out too much.

Cheap is bringing home all the free bread in your handbag.

I expect to Harry it was all "whatever" I dont think he even cared where he lived. But I'm sure it was shock to a woman who'd been living her own rich lady adult life for some time.

Did Kate ever *really* live on her own? Pay her own bills and have no expectation of marrying W?  If she did it was maybe a year or two with parental support. So I imagine she was already sorta prepared for bending to the BRF was of doing.

What in the world did M and H talk about if he never explained any of this to her? And how inflexible the whole thing is? There was a quote of him. I think during book interviews where he said he felt regret because Meghan was having difficulty and minimized it. He was so used to doing the royal performance so to speak that he put that 1st and pushed her to keep up appearances.

If so maybe every time Meghan was like "ummm what?!" Harry was like "oh its ok it will work out. Just go with it"

[tabitha2]

If he is going to be naked and drunk in a huge group of people with cameras around not much the family can do to help him.