Harry & Meghan 14: The Reverse Harry - Restoring the Angevin Empire

[tabitha2]

If you revel in being miserable, offended, slighted and have no discernible sense of humor nothing will ever ever be good enough  

[Jackie3]

6 minutes ago, tabitha2 said:

If you revel in being miserable, offended, slighted and have no discernible sense of humor nothing will ever ever be good enough  

They seem pretty happy to me. Whatever they are doing, it's working for them.

[Jackie3]

9 hours ago, tabitha2 said:

If you revel in being miserable, offended, slighted and have no discernible sense of humor nothing will ever ever be good enough  

Agreed. I do wish she'd keep sweet. If someone calls her son a chimp or her mom "straight out of Compton" (cause she's Black). . . .it's so wrong to be offended. It shows you lack a sense of humor. Meghan should just have smiled and been happy she was there! 

Escaping from abuse is just so wrong. They should have remained in the UK and just taken whatever abuse the tabloids had to dish out.

Edited February 24, 2023 by Jackie3

[Jackie3]

Interview with Thomas Markle, Jr. Wow, Meghan's father sounds like a despicable human being. Poor Meghan, no wonder she was looking for family.

He doesn't like Doria, either, but Thomas comes across as an evil person who flies to Thailand for sex and provides his son with drugs. This is part 2, but there are parts 1, 3, and 4 as well on youtube. 

While it's very nice that Thomas chose to turn things around with Meghan, she has every right to estrange herself from such a damaged, horrible person. 

Of course, this is a man who has multiple DUIs. Thomas Jr and Samantha are both obviously very damaged by their evil father.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHxYU5fpe1g

All in all, you can see why Meghan saw the royals as family, which was a mistake. The Windsors wanted to be seen as royals, they weren't interested in being family.  

Edited February 24, 2023 by Jackie3

[just_ordinary]

I think Charles did a classic move in overcompensating when he put H into Eton. Diana seems to have been in agreement though, so both made the wrong choice there. All parents do that one way or another. Thankfully it’s mostly not as diametral for the children. Harry might also have asked to follow Wiliam. And it seems they wanted them to stay close by, which H might have preferred himself as well. In any way, his parents should have really looked at him, his personality, strengths and weaknesses and made a decision based on that. Maybe Gordonstoun would have been a better fit? But I think H would have had big problems dealing with being so far away from his parents- no quick whisking them away for the afternoon in Scotland. He might have felt sent away, while W was allowed to stay in the vicinity, which would have probably led to resentment again. 
I don’t know if there is another prestigious school close by with a less academic curriculum. Maybe with a bigger focus on sports.

[Coconut Flan]

I think you have it with almost any decision about schooling would be viewed with resentment now.  It's the filter Harry has chosen for his childhood.

[Jackie3]

3 hours ago, Coconut Flan said:

I think you have it with almost any decision about schooling would be viewed with resentment now.  It's the filter Harry has chosen for his childhood.

True. If only he had a rose-colored filter and thought everything was always grand! Including racism and calling his son a "chimp".

He also doesn't realize that people are not allowed to be unhappy about their high school years. 

 

10 hours ago, just_ordinary said:

I think Charles did a classic move in overcompensating when he put H into Eton. Diana seems to have been in agreement though, so both made the wrong choice there. All parents do that one way or another.

Can't blame Diana for this choice. She died a year before Harry entered Eton.

Quote

Maybe Gordonstoun would have been a better fit? But I think H would have had big problems dealing with being so far away from his parents- no quick whisking them away for the afternoon in Scotland.

Gordonstoun is in Scotland. 

Quote

 In any way, his parents should have really looked at him, his personality, strengths and weaknesses and made a decision based on that. 

 I am reading the  Baronness Glenconner's new memoir. She was  lady-in-waiting to Princess Margaret. 

She had three sons. She flatly states that the kids' preferences are not considered. Boys go to Eton unless they can't pass the entrance exam.

I think the royals have more freedom in that regard, though. After all, the royals aren't social climbing--they already ARE at the top. So they have freedom to make other choices, as Phillip did with Charles.

It's said Charles was miserable at Gordonstoun and wanted to go to Eton. So he sent his sons there. He probably didn't think too much about Harry's strengths. He chose Eton and called it a day. But there are many, many other prestigious prep schools in England that have turned out successful young adults--Harrow, Repton, etc--if he had thought about Harry a bit more. Harrow's just outside of London.

In Spare, Harry is not gnashing his teeth and spewing hate about his father's choice. He is simply pointing out he wasn't academic enough to thrive there. However, I realize that even this mild criticism of Charles is not allowed, and is very bad.

Edited February 25, 2023 by Jackie3

[MamaJunebug]

Cartch-up Question out of the blue, if I may. Meghan is often referred to as throwing crockery. What’s the origin for this? Was it ever documented that she did throw dishes? Thanks very much advance-ally.  

On the subject of Harry and Eton, I was thinking today during a long drive, how he was the kind of kid who probably needed to be with a mom and dad as much as the everyday middle class North American kid enrolled in day school is. Needed a lot of personalized attention and correction. But hey, hindsight is XX-XX. 

[Jackie3]

23 hours ago, MamaJunebug said:

Cartch-up Question out of the blue, if I may. Meghan is often referred to as throwing crockery. What’s the origin for this? .  

 

Racism is the origin for this. She never threw crockery. 

Mixed-raced-woman-with-courage-and-confidence---that's the origin. Gotta knock her down.

 

On 2/23/2023 at 12:20 PM, tabitha2 said:

If you revel in being miserable, offended, slighted and have no discernible sense of humor nothing will ever ever be good enough  

I want this kind of miserable, too!

[prayawaythefundie]

8 hours ago, MamaJunebug said:

Cartch-up Question out of the blue, if I may. Meghan is often referred to as throwing crockery. What’s the origin for this? Was it ever documented that she did throw dishes? Thanks very much advance-ally.  

Having no background knowledge on Meghan, I always just assumed this to be a stereotypical and slightly misogynist depiction of an angry woman.

Edited February 26, 2023 by prayawaythefundie

[Coconut Flan]

I don't believe I've ever heard the crockery story.  Is it possibly a piece of made up internet lore?

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

On 2/25/2023 at 9:11 AM, Coconut Flan said:

I think you have it with almost any decision about schooling would be viewed with resentment now.  It's the filter Harry has chosen for his childhood.

I guess my thought is maybe if he had gone to a different school and felt more sure of himself/better adjusted waaaay back then through the training and culture of a different school - then maybe he wouldn't be the way he is now. Maybe he'd be a confident army leader guy....as many of the royal family before him did. I'm sure those elite type schools purposefully instill in their students things like "hey you're a leader, go on to a leadership role in the military, and then when you do look out for us"

as I understand Eton likes to groom politicians and that type of mover and shaker. The culture of meeting similar people who are all similar background and goals and all that. You make a lot of networking type connections in these schools

I expect UK has some elite schools that into military or whatever. Just a different culture and he would have met up with a slightly different set of peers and maybe the expectations and training and whatnot would have better prepared him to deal with whatever it is being the Spare functionally was/is.

Just seems like many places that the people in young Harry's life could have encouraged him one way or the other and maybe things would have been different. An interesting thing to ponder.

[prayawaythefundie]

3 hours ago, Coconut Flan said:

I don't believe I've ever heard the crockery story.  Is it possibly a piece of made up internet lore?

Cambridge Stans (equivalent to the Sussex Squad) use phrases like „there will be dishes flying in Montecito today“ or somthing similar on social media when the headlines of a news day are favourable towards W&K or unfavourable towards H&M. They project their delight at it, thinking the Sussexes (or often just Meghan which I don‘t get) will be fuming. It‘s cringeworthy to downright ugly to watch.

Edited February 26, 2023 by prayawaythefundie

[AmazonGrace]

I know absolutely nothing about Eton and whatnot but Harry went to Sandhurst and served quite a while in various roles and it seems to me that Harry had options if a lifelong career in the rmed forces was something that he desired. 

[tabitha2]

The military or church has always been the place for younger sons of royalty or nobility to find their place in life and make their name. Ideally it keeps them out of trouble and gives them an officers good income combined with their inheritance to live very very well if not lavishly. 
 

Harry could have had a real future in a job that would have steadied him and given him focus but he figured other  things were more important. Too late now. 

[rosamundi]

21 minutes ago, AmazonGrace said:

I know absolutely nothing about Eton and whatnot but Harry went to Sandhurst and served quite a while in various roles and it seems to me that Harry had options if a lifelong career in the rmed forces was something that he desired. 

My understanding is that Harry was a bit stuck in terms of Army options. The papers publishing that he was in Afghanistan immediately painted a huge target on him and the rest of his unit, which placed extra and impractical strain on the units serving in Afghanistan. So that knocked out active service as an option.

His next promotion would have been to Major, and once you've been promoted to that level, and higher, particularly if you can't do active service, you end up "flying a desk" as the RAF has it, basically an office job with shiny boots, and he didn't want a desk job.

[AmazonGrace]

Yeah, not saying he liked his options.

But he had them.

Lots of people have a desk job and make a go of it.

[SoSoNosy]

I thought his greatest desire was to be active military, and got yanked home because he was a danger to himself and his unit when his presence became known.

[AmazonGrace]

And he learned nothing from that, writing a book about things that might put people in danger.

[louisa05]

3 hours ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

I guess my thought is maybe if he had gone to a different school and felt more sure of himself/better adjusted waaaay back then through the training and culture of a different school - then maybe he wouldn't be the way he is now. Maybe he'd be a confident army leader guy....as many of the royal family before him did. I'm sure those elite type schools purposefully instill in their students things like "hey you're a leader, go on to a leadership role in the military, and then when you do look out for us"

as I understand Eton likes to groom politicians and that type of mover and shaker. The culture of meeting similar people who are all similar background and goals and all that. You make a lot of networking type connections in these schools

I expect UK has some elite schools that into military or whatever. Just a different culture and he would have met up with a slightly different set of peers and maybe the expectations and training and whatnot would have better prepared him to deal with whatever it is being the Spare functionally was/is.

Just seems like many places that the people in young Harry's life could have encouraged him one way or the other and maybe things would have been different. An interesting thing to ponder.

Or he would have written in his saga of complaints that he was sent to a lesser school because his parents didn't think he was smart or as important as William or some such thing. 

 

[just_ordinary]

3 hours ago, tabitha2 said:

The military or church has always been the place for younger sons of royalty or nobility to find their place in life and make their name. Ideally it keeps them out of trouble and gives them an officers good income combined with their inheritance to live very very well if not lavishly. 
 

Harry could have had a real future in a job that would have steadied him and given him focus but he figured other  things were more important. Too late now. 

I don’t know if there is much truth to it nowadays. The church option stopped long ago. While being a high leading church official meant real power in terms of money, land (and the people on the land) and maybe even a little private army (in many countries they were basically on the same level as worldly aristocratic land owners) it was indeed favourable to have someone on those positions. Especially when the church was also the another big power player on the mix of crown, nobility and church. And it kept those sons busy, gave them power to feel important but kept them from going for the crown/family wealth, in catholic countries it also made sure no legal heirs would show up from this family branch. It didn’t prevent all of them to become a problem but many. But those days are long long gone. The church has lost its appeal in that regard. I don’t think it was a popular option ever since the 19th century, maybe even the 18th century. The church has way less to basically non influence over people’s life, only a small voice into politics (not true for all countries but I think it’s definitely true for at least half of Europe) and their very real power in terms of money and property goes completely hidden under the radar.
The military has also run its course. Being a high decorated rank is way less meaningful than 70 years ago. I would argue that since the 2000s we haven’t seen a young royal pick this as a serious option. I don’t think H would have stayed on under different circumstances. I agree that H, could have had a future there and that it would have been incredibly beneficial for him. It’s not as if combat in wherever or chained to a desk are the only options. I don’t think though he could have ever let go from his grand ideas of how important he was/would be as a royal. From all he wrote and said, I think it’s very clear he always wanted a job in the royal business. Even the exit statement said as much. The RF just didn’t have any of it. 

 

Edited February 26, 2023 by just_ordinary

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

In some ways it's almost like everybody but Andrew and Harry got the "new slimmed down" RF memo that Charles has been talking about for some time - So they made other plans. Which I think is more than just Charles, I think the writing on the wall has been pretty obvious for a long time that a lot of this stuff is going the way of the old country houses (most got torn down, those that are left have had to be very creative to stay afloat, and none of the traditional way of things lasted).

At what point is the BRF so patently just a curious tradition and tourist attraction that there's nothing left "to do?"  

[Jackie3]

15 hours ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

- then maybe he wouldn't be the way he is now. Maybe he'd be a confident army leader guy....as many of the royal family before him did. I'm sure those elite type schools purposefully instill in their students things like "hey you're a leader, go on to a leadership role in the military, and then when you do look out for us"

Harry was a Forward Air Controller and an Apache helicopter pilot. In the US, these jobs have Special Forces status!  

He rose to the tank of  Captain . Do you feel Captains int he. military aren't leaders? I don't know much about the military, but I know that Captains are officers whose commands must be followed. 

He was definitely a  "confident army guy" (whatever that means).

 

 

Harry could easily have remained safely in Britain and worn fake medals that dont' mean anything. Like his Uncle Edward. Is that what you mean about the older RF members before him? Is it really preferable to drop out of the military after a few months and then wear fake medals for the rest of your life? 

 

 

Edited February 27, 2023 by Jackie3

[TN-peach]

I believe that the dishes being thrown story is from rumor about her throwing a teacup/ tea pot during their visit to Australia.

[AmazonGrace]

According to Bower, "according to one report", "allegedly" https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/world-news/meghan-markle-threw-tea-made-27516662#