Harry & Meghan 14: The Reverse Harry - Restoring the Angevin Empire

[DalmatianCat]

More reflections…Prince Phillip sent Charles to Gordounston and Charles (who’d wanted to go to Eton), hated it. So Charles sent his own sons to Eton and Harry hated it. I wonder if perhaps he would have enjoyed a boarding a school in remote Scotland that highlighted physical tests (I have no idea if it’s still like that) better than Eton which just seemed way beyond Harry’s intellectual level. This is nothing against Harry‘s intelligence, it was just didn’t seem like the right fit for him just like Gordounston was not the right fit for Charles.

[Jackie3]

2 hours ago, DalmatianCat said:

More reflections…Prince Phillip sent Charles to Gordounston and Charles (who’d wanted to go to Eton), hated it. So Charles sent his own sons to Eton and Harry hated it. I wonder if perhaps he would have enjoyed a boarding a school in remote Scotland that highlighted physical tests (I have no idea if it’s still like that) better than Eton which just seemed way beyond Harry’s intellectual level. This is nothing against Harry‘s intelligence, it was just didn’t seem like the right fit for him just like Gordounston was not the right fit for Charles.

LOL, Harry admits himself that Eron was a good school for academic kids, and a poor fit for "non-brilliant" boys like himself. He basically says he didn't have the interest or ability to excel academically there.

Harry is reported to be good at sports, and clearly has an athletic build, so he may very well have preferred Gordonstoun.

I wonder why no one asks these kids which school they'd prefer? That's what I'd do, if I had a 13-year old boy.

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

10 hours ago, DalmatianCat said:

More reflections…Prince Phillip sent Charles to Gordounston and Charles (who’d wanted to go to Eton), hated it. So Charles sent his own sons to Eton and Harry hated it. I wonder if perhaps he would have enjoyed a boarding a school in remote Scotland that highlighted physical tests (I have no idea if it’s still like that) better than Eton which just seemed way beyond Harry’s intellectual level. This is nothing against Harry‘s intelligence, it was just didn’t seem like the right fit for him just like Gordounston was not the right fit for Charles.

That's a thought. He did thrive in the military environment later on. Always interesting to me to ponder the what ifs.

[Four is Enough]

Clearly, Jackie 3 has never had a 13 year old boy. The majority of them have no earthly clue which high school they'd like to attend. At least not on the basis of any real merit. 

The food at the cafeteria was the focus of attention for all three of my boys.. Hello! did you attend any classes, or did you just hang out in the cafeteria on the visit days?

[FluffySnowball]

19 hours ago, DalmatianCat said:

More reflections…Prince Phillip sent Charles to Gordounston and Charles (who’d wanted to go to Eton), hated it. So Charles sent his own sons to Eton and Harry hated it. I wonder if perhaps he would have enjoyed a boarding a school in remote Scotland that highlighted physical tests (I have no idea if it’s still like that) better than Eton which just seemed way beyond Harry’s intellectual level. This is nothing against Harry‘s intelligence, it was just didn’t seem like the right fit for him just like Gordounston was not the right fit for Charles.

Yeah, it’s quite sad if you think about it. The BRF has the money to afford the very best and most fitting education for their young members. They could hire tutors, pay for any interests and hobbies, boarding schools and private schools, etc. But at least with Charles and Harry, they failed to choose the suitable school (though I assume this was more detrimental for Charles than for Harry cause the latter’s issues seem to rather stem from his mother’s death, his role as a spare, etc). It’s likely that Eton alone didn’t fuck him up. 

33 minutes ago, Four is Enough said:

Clearly, Jackie 3 has never had a 13 year old boy. The majority of them have no earthly clue which high school they'd like to attend. At least not on the basis of any real merit. 

I agree with you, it’s not as simple as asking a teenager to make such a difficult decision. Nonetheless, discussing the school choice and involving the child should be a vital part of the decision making process (if there are options at all, many young people simply go to their nearest middle and high school). But I wonder if members of the RBF are great at openly and freely communicating with each other. 

[louisa05]

We don't know that they did not involve the kids in the decision. And adult Harry basically hates everything his father ever did or thought about doing or did in his vivid imagination or might possibly but probably not do in the future, so that doesn't mean he actually hated it then. His father wrote him loving notes about how proud he was of him and he hated it. There was clearly no making this kid happy. 

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

Harry's got issues. But Charles aside, it seems like going to Eton did add to his troubles because William told him to act like they don't know each other. So Harry seems to have felt abandoned by his brother. The book makes it seem like Harry expected to join in with his brother's friend group and have a buddy already baked in at Eton. He didn't get that and felt very rejected by it. There's possibly other schools that Harry may have thrived at that were less academic and more sporty or military prep or something not just Gordounston. Maybe would have been worse or maybe would have given him some confidence sooner?

 

[louisa05]

9 minutes ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

Harry's got issues. But Charles aside, it seems like going to Eton did add to his troubles because William told him to act like they don't know each other. So Harry seems to have felt abandoned by his brother. The book makes it seem like Harry expected to join in with his brother's friend group and have a buddy already baked in at Eton. He didn't get that and felt very rejected by it. There's possibly other schools that Harry may have thrived at that were less academic and more sporty or military prep or something not just Gordounston. Maybe would have been worse or maybe would have given him some confidence sooner?

 

And that's typical of most older siblings who don't want a younger one tagging along in social settings. Painting William as "abandoning" his brother over perfectly normal sibling behavior is absurd. But clearly, William is the root of all evil in the world and poor angel baby Harry is his victim. 

[DalmatianCat]

10 minutes ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

Harry's got issues. But Charles aside, it seems like going to Eton did add to his troubles because William told him to act like they don't know each other. So Harry seems to have felt abandoned by his brother. The book makes it seem like Harry expected to join in with his brother's friend group and have a buddy already baked in at Eton. He didn't get that and felt very rejected by it. There's possibly other schools that Harry may have thrived at that were less academic and more sporty or military prep or something not just Gordounston. Maybe would have been worse or maybe would have given him some confidence sooner?

 

I definitely think it would have helped him forge more of his own identity to not be at the same school as his brother. It would be nice to hear William’s perspective of their time at Eton, but alas, we most likely never will. 

On some level I think Harry and William both came to feel their family life growing up wasn’t “normal” and set out to find something they felt they’d missed out on as they entered adulthood. I think the Middleton family was part of the reason William was attracted to Kate. I think Harry saw that and wanted something similar. I noticed he mentioned both of Chelsy’s parents and how they would make fantastic in-laws and he also had a couple pseudo families in Africa. It’s interesting that he ended up marrying someone who had as complicated a relationship with their own family as he does with his. I just realized he never mentioned Doria in his book. Either she asked him not to and he respected it, or he just had nothing to say.

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

15 minutes ago, DalmatianCat said:

I definitely think it would have helped him forge more of his own identity to not be at the same school as his brother. It would be nice to hear William’s perspective of their time at Eton, but alas, we most likely never will. 

On some level I think Harry and William both came to feel their family life growing up wasn’t “normal” and set out to find something they felt they’d missed out on as they entered adulthood. I think the Middleton family was part of the reason William was attracted to Kate. I think Harry saw that and wanted something similar. I noticed he mentioned both of Chelsy’s parents and how they would make fantastic in-laws and he also had a couple pseudo families in Africa. It’s interesting that he ended up marrying someone who had as complicated a relationship with their own family as he does with his. I just realized he never mentioned Doria in his book. Either she asked him not to and he respected it, or he just had nothing to say.

Given Harry seems to feel abandoned by his mother (fantasy that she left and would come back one day) I think he brother ignoring him hit extra hard.

I think he must like Doria. She seems warm and loving. She's stayed with them quite a bit. And Harry mostly talked about people he didn't like or was disappointed in (Chelsy. Clearly he hoped somehow she would be able to overcome all and be with him after all). I think if he had anything negative to say about Doria it would have come out in some form.

Plus the last third of the book was so much about tabloids. And Doria's non-exciting life didn't attract tabloids as much. So there's nothing for him to complain about.

But maybe it's just cuz he didn't want to upset Meghan. Who knows.

Having run his whole family through the mud...and the hype dying down - What will he do now???

[prayawaythefundie]

5 minutes ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

Having run his whole family through the mud...and the hype dying down - What will he do now???

Write that second book? Clearly, there‘s an audience for it.

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

17 minutes ago, prayawaythefundie said:

Write that second book? Clearly, there‘s an audience for it.

Yeah probably.

I wish he'd write something just calmly talking about all the unique cool things he's experienced.

But I'm more wondering how he will react once the book dies down more. I doubt think it's gotten the reaction he imagined (begging on their knees, BRF please come back harry we miss you?) What does he have now to attract attention to himself?

Edited February 19, 2023 by WatchingTheTireFireBurn
typos

[tabitha2]

5 hours ago, Four is Enough said:

Clearly, Jackie 3 has never had a 13 year old boy. The majority of them have no earthly clue which high school they'd like to attend. At least not on the basis of any real merit. 

The food at the cafeteria was the focus of attention for all three of my boys.. Hello! did you attend any classes, or did you just hang out in the cafeteria on the visit days?

Also am I correct in assuming they would want to go to the schools or school most of their friends are attending? For William and Harry they would be Eton or one of the other elite prep schools. 

[noseybutt]

8 hours ago, louisa05 said:

We don't know that they did not involve the kids in the decision. And adult Harry basically hates everything his father ever did or thought about doing or did in his vivid imagination or might possibly but probably not do in the future, so that doesn't mean he actually hated it then. His father wrote him loving notes about how proud he was of him and he hated it. There was clearly no making this kid happy. 

Alternate perspective to the storyline that Harry was and is a spoiled brat and his father couldn’t win.

 In family system theory, Harry would be the identified patient, aka the problem child. But in any family, the most severe dysfunction lies within the family system rather than within one single individual.

I would have an easier time believing Harry is solely to blame if there weren’t generations of dysfunction and straight up callous meanness in this family. 

Which goes back to another basic premise of family systems theory. Whenever the identified patient seeks to change his or her role in the system, there will be intense push back from family members.

 

 

[tabitha2]

I mean even while they had youthful exploits and screw ups yet not one of his raised in the same  family and environment cousins nor his brother ended up as damaged as  Harry. Almost all of them were products of cheating parents who left them  to Nannie’s normally and boarding schools as well.    

 

 

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

1 hour ago, tabitha2 said:

I mean even while they had youthful exploits and screw ups yet not one of his raised in the same  family and environment cousins nor his brother ended up as damaged as  Harry. Almost all of them were products of cheating parents who left them  to Nannie’s normally and boarding schools as well.    

 

 

I can't see how we know whether or not any of them are more/less damaged than Harry.

Any one of them could turn out Andrew style or be a raging drunk  or suicidally depressed and we may never know.

Harry blew up publically but many people do not.

 

[tabitha2]

We can only go on what they have shown us buy nothing whatever speaks to any of that and i guarantee if Zara or Beatrice was going on raging benders and Louise was suicidally depressed that the  RF would not be able to cover up that for long. The rumors would be on fire then tabloids and respectable media would explode. 

[Jackie3]

11 hours ago, tabitha2 said:

I mean even while they had youthful exploits and screw ups yet not one of his raised in the same  family and environment cousins nor his brother ended up as damaged as  Harry. Almost all of them were products of cheating parents who left them  to Nannie’s normally and boarding schools as well.    

 

 

For someone who is "damaged", Harry is doing pretty darned well. He's in a loving marriage, he has beautiful kids, he travels, he is wealthy, he has friends and supporters. I know "healthy" people who haven't done half as well with their lives.

Would he be healthier if he lived in Britain? Would he be happier if he read insults about his wife and little son and daughter in the press every day? I'm not so sure.

 

 

12 hours ago, noseybutt said:

I would have an easier time believing Harry is solely to blame if there weren’t generations of dysfunction and straight up callous meanness in this family. 

 

Harry is the scapegoat. That is usually the healthiest one in the family, the one who points out the dysfunction. Scapegoats usually move away because they are the most abused. Sounds a lot like Harry.

 

22 hours ago, Four is Enough said:

Clearly, Jackie 3 has never had a 13 year old boy. The majority of them have no earthly clue which high school they'd like to attend. At least not on the basis of any real merit. 

The food at the cafeteria was the focus of attention for all three of my boys.. Hello! did you attend any classes, or did you just hang out in the cafeteria on the visit days?

Teenagers should be listened to, their opinions and feelings are important. 

I'm not a believer in making decisions for teens without taking their opinion into consideration.

After a term at Eton, young Harry could easily have said, "I don't like it there. Everyone is always studying,  and there's hardly any sport. I want to try Marlborough." Perhaps you would have discounted this, but it's the sort of thing parents would listen to.

 

17 hours ago, tabitha2 said:

Also am I correct in assuming they would want to go to the schools or school most of their friends are attending? For William and Harry they would be Eton or one of the other elite prep schools. 

Harry went to elementary school at Ludgrove. When he and his classmates finished here, they scattered to a variety of elite prep schools. Harry could have followed his classmates to any number of schools, not just Eton. They didn't all travel to Eton en masse.

 

9 hours ago, tabitha2 said:

We can only go on what they have shown us buy nothing whatever speaks to any of that and i guarantee if Zara or Beatrice was going on raging benders and Louise was suicidally depressed that the  RF would not be able to cover up that for long. The rumors would be on fire then tabloids and respectable media would explode. 

Sounds like you can say with confidence that all the royal family is mentally healthy and happy, without any alcohol or depression problems. Because if they had such problems, it would be in the press.

What about Andrew? His ugly behavior was kept hidden for years.

 

19 hours ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

But Charles aside, it seems like going to Eton did add to his troubles because William told him to act like they don't know each other. So Harry seems to have felt abandoned by his brother.

Here's an example where being in the royal family can mess things up.

William was a bit of an ass to say such a thing, but it's actually very common. Older sibs rarely want their younger sibs hanging about them. It would have been nice if William had been kinder, but most kids would have said something similar to their younger sibling.

Problem is, they weren't your average sibling pair. They both faced enormous pressure that most teen boys don't have. The media followed them around constantly, even at Eton (though they had promised not to). That's a huge stressor to an adolescent.  Harry needed help navigating this.  He'd also just lost his mother, which made the need even greater. Plus he was at a school that was very academic, when he wasn't. So it sounds like a tough time for him.

Edited February 20, 2023 by Jackie3

[prayawaythefundie]

Maybe that family is dysfunctional AND Harry is a spoiled brat. Charles is probably far from the perfect father and Harry is not a forgiving person. It‘s obvious he has been hurt and it‘s also obvious he can‘t let it go.

[tabitha2]

 He wants to and actively tries to hurt his family particularly his brother  in all sorts of petty ways.. from stupid veiled jibes about baldness to Dragging his innocent Niece and nephews into his “truth” and vendetta. 
 

This is more concerning and telling of what kind of person he is. 

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

30 minutes ago, tabitha2 said:

 He wants to and actively tries to hurt his family particularly his brother  in all sorts of petty ways.. from stupid veiled jibes about baldness to Dragging his innocent Niece and nephews into his “truth” and vendetta. 
 

This is more concerning and telling of what kind of person he is. 

yeah I'm not impressed by harry. I used to have some sympathy but he's burned it up.

[nokidsmom]

12 hours ago, tabitha2 said:

 He wants to and actively tries to hurt his family particularly his brother  in all sorts of petty ways.. from stupid veiled jibes about baldness to Dragging his innocent Niece and nephews into his “truth” and vendetta. 

This is more concerning and telling of what kind of person he is. 

While I agree that both the RF and Harry can be dysfunctional, publicly disparaging your family is just never a good look.  Doesn't matter who the family is.   It's says far more about the person doing it than it does about the people on the receiving end. 

Harry has revealed himself in many ways to be a pretty awful person and now I am wondering about the levels of PR the palace undertook to make him look more likeable than what he really was.  Without that PR, he's on his own and it's not pretty.

11 hours ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

yeah I'm not impressed by harry. I used to have some sympathy but he's burned it up.

I had sympathy for Harry as I did for William between the loss of their mother in the wake of their parents' public divorce while living in the RF fishbowl.  However, Harrys' been airing private matters, issues, conflicts while casting his family members as the villains in his saga for years now.  I get maybe having done it once, while not acceptable, it would be understandable as possible a one-time mistake.   But he has been doing it for years now and clearly has a vendetta.  

ETA:  I suspect he already has some regrets.  His expressions during the Jubilee and QE's funeral suggested to me he was clearly uncomfortable.  As in someone getting the cold shoulder.  

Edited February 20, 2023 by nokidsmom

[tabitha2]

As far as we know Eugenie is the only family member he still regularly associates and his old old school friends in The UK seem to have disappeared as well.  They probably make known in not so many words he is a big mouthed drama making black sheep they would rather not have around. 

[Coconut Flan]

20 minutes ago, nokidsmom said:

I suspect he already has some regrets.  His expressions during the Jubilee and QE's funeral suggested to me he was clearly uncomfortable.  As in someone getting the cold shoulder.  

It's interesting that he has labeled the atmosphere at both events "toxic."  It seems he wants to blame other people for not embracing his narrative and keeping him at a distance.

I still marvel that he and Meghan blamed Thomas Markle so heartily for talking to the press and they have gone so much farther than Thomas.  Yet, they felt justified in cutting ties with Thomas and yet feel they are being dreadfully mistreated when they get backlash.  The lack of comprehension is astounding.  

[nokidsmom]

8 minutes ago, tabitha2 said:

As far as we know Eugenie is the only family member he still regularly associates and his old old school friends in The UK seem to have disappeared as well.  They probably make known in not so many words he is a big mouthed drama making black sheep they would rather not have around. 

And in a way that's sad.   It appears that he has very few relationships where in the past he had quite a few.  He's lost friends, most family, has no relationship with his in-law family except for his mother-in-law.   This has all been in the years since he got married and I find that concerning.    Losing relationships that quickly is a giant red flag.