Andrea Mills of YouTube infamy Had Cancer and Died

[Dandruff]

10 hours ago, under siege said:

Also, what the diagnoses to end was rapid, Andrea may have had cancer for quite some time.

In a recent Walmart shopping post I remember them saying she was having headaches and her neck hurt...and thought that meant it was time for a new pillow.

[Palimpsest]

@sdjp123 and @under siege thanks for your input.  It sounds as though you have been watching Andrea for a long time.  And to Free Jinger.

I think Tom is going to get an awful shock if (or when) Scamaritan invokes that little clause about not "sharing" your needs if your bills have already been covered by other fundraising.

A lot of other things have been covered already but:

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Me and Asher sat down and made a list of all the things we do in the house; from changing diapers to making dinner. It's by no means complete yet, but we have a good chunk. Once we complete it we will divide things up between family members based on time and availability.

Ok, sitting down with Asher is not a bad idea to get a grasp of how many tasks need to be done.  I'm fairly sure Asher was doing a lot of them anyway.  Other family members with time and availability or the children though, Tom?  You may be in danger of parentifying poor Asher even more than he has already been parentified by the buddy system you huge families are all using.  Boundaries, man, boundaries.  Your children still have to be children so don't use the older boys and Eden as substitutes for Andrea.  

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Tonight is the 24th, as you guys probably know, it is our date night. I will not allow myself to miss this as out planned shopping trip. I will be taking either Asher or Thomas with me to start,

Date night.  Ouch.  More danger of parentification.  Perhaps go by yourself, Tom, or with a friend not one of your sons.  And film yourself.  You will have to go on your own at some point, unless you plan on turning that chore over to Thomas and Asher.

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 Honestly I wasn't wanting to start [filming] so soon, but our channel is about how to life REAL LIFE! Many people are helped by lots of things, but we have never tackled how a large family recovers from something like the loss of the mommy.

Then honestly, don't.  Focus on the children who need help right now.  He can do a talking head video when he has his thoughts organised.  I think more of his viewers will be turned off if he keeps filming such raw grief.  And it does seem that he wants to, or needs to, continue to accept donations.  Youtube helps with that.

I think it is very wrong for people to contact Tom to give him "hate."  Perhaps he should not look at the comments on his videos or open emails from strangers right now.  I hope he is not surfing the internet for forums like ours at the moment too.  He should put down his phone or step away from his keyboard. 

So he justifies continuing to film because he may be helping others in the future and:

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 Real life keeps going, it doesn't stop for grief, and yet we must take it. While some may think I am being disrespectful, those of you who know my wife understand...if I didn't do these things, then THAT would be the disrespect...and I WON'T allow that!

My concern is that Tom is disrespecting his children and their needs in his conviction that he is respecting Andrea's memory.  

I hope he has friends and relatives who will look out for the children.  

Edited August 26, 2019 by Palimpsest

[under siege]

9 minutes ago, Dandruff said:

In a recent Walmart shopping post I remember them saying she was having headaches and her neck hurt...and thought that meant it was time for a new pillow.

Yes, she had neck and back problems too. 
Her digestive/stomach/bowel problems had been ongoing for years but in a recent(ish) community post, she mentioned it was getting worse. What she mentioned were indicators that something serious was wrong. So many people pleaded with her to get her gallbladder checked. Which she eventually did but we all know the result of that sadly.

[FecundFundieFundus]

Even IF they had seen and figured out it was cancer, from my understanding biliary duct cancer is very aggressive and Andrea wasn't trusting of conventional medicine or doctors. Most of the "what if" scenarios more or less lead to the same place. At least she didn't accidentally poison herself with her EO concoctions, which is where I thought the liver issues may have originated. That would have made everything more difficult to process for her family

[under siege]

Just now, Palimpsest said:

@sdjp123 and @under siege thanks for your input.  It sounds as though you have been watching Andrea for a long time.  And to Free Jinger.

 

 

 

Thanks and yes. I had a weird fascination for large homeschooling families and their religious beliefs. Andrea and I would never be friends but I was intrigued with her world.   I like natural medicinal options to a point so those, and her organisational videos, were quite interesting.  I usually skipped over anything with Tom and certain kids but yes, I watched about 50% of her videos.

Edited August 26, 2019 by under siege
Error as to where reply was posted.

[Koala]

24 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

I think Tom is going to get an awful shock if (or when) Scamaritan invokes that little clause about not "sharing" your needs if your bills have already been covered by other fundraising.

Agreed.  I am betting Scamaritan is going to totally screw Tom, and if they don't, it'll only be because of the amount of attention on this particular situation.  

What those people get up to should be illegal. That said, these adults go in with eyes wide open. 

[AliceInFundyland]

I am by no means defending her woo.

It makes me hate our health system a little bit more.

I have symptoms I am tracking warily and not full on testing due to costs.

That symptoms like hers (which, granted, a normal person may have investigated and still had similar results) are so deceptive is so scary.

FYI - I found out that Brca genetic testing should be covered by the ACA the other day. If anyone has been putting that one off and is in a risk group. Look into it.

[sdjp123]

2 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

@sdjp123 and @under siege thanks for your input.  It sounds as though you have been watching Andrea for a long time.  And to Free Jinger.

 

Thanks for the welcome. I've been watching their channel for a long time and have been quite disturbed by the "education" the children are receiving as well as how much responsibility the children have, especially the 3 oldest boys, for maintaining the household and child rearing.

It is shocking how quickly it went from Andrea getting checked out to her death. On the other hand, I suspect that things were really bad by the point she considered going to an actual doctor for treatment given her views on medical professionals.  Even if the final outcome would have been the same, I do wish she had been diagnosed earlier so that the family could have had some time to prepare for her death and she could have given the children a proper goodbye.

[Terrie]

Can we update the subject for this one to note she has died?

[Palimpsest]

1 hour ago, Terrie said:

Can we update the subject for this one to note she has died?

Many thanks to whichever Helpmeet or Admin did just that.

Edited August 26, 2019 by Palimpsest

[Coconut Flan]

4 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

Many thanks to whichever Helpmeet or Admin did just that.

You're welcome.  Life is not allowing me to always notice things like that these days.

[Queen Of Hearts]

I don't think Scamaritan would be dumb enough to screw Tom.  The Mills family has a large following, many of who are either Scamaritan members themselves or potential customers.  They know if they refused to pay Tom would publicize it and they would lose many current and future members and that is publicity they do not want.  

Much has been said about Tom prioritizing the You Tube channel over his kids.  To be fair, I would hardly call a couple short videos since the funeral prioritizing.  He's trying to make sense of the unthinkable and figure out how he and the family will function.  I am sure he is utterly panicked.  Andrea had a huge online community that supported her and I am sure staying connected to them is giving Tom strength, too.  I'm willing to cut him some slack and give him time to see how things progress before I start attacking him.  

Along those lines, I don't see anything wrong with working with the older boys to determine what needs done around the house, taking one out for 'date night'/shopping, etc. This family has demonstrated they function as a team even when Andrea was living.  That's certainly not going to change now.  Tom can't do it alone and I am sure the older boys want to help where they can.  That doesn't mean that he is making them 'parent' but they all had their lives turned upside down and I am sure the older kids are just as much in survival mode as Tom is and want to step up where they feel able and comfortable.

I guess I am just saying maybe we should let the dust settle a bit and see how things play out before judging this family too much. They have been through a hell few of us could understand and I am sure the family we see in 3-6 months will not look like the family we see today.  

[Snarkasarus Rex]

2 minutes ago, Queen Of Hearts said:

I guess I am just saying maybe we should let the dust settle a bit and see how things play out before judging this family too much. They have been through a hell few of us could understand and I am sure the family we see in 3-6 months will not look like the family we see today.  

This is why I'm reserving judgement of Tom even though I find his actions since her death concerning.  We'll see how things go as they try to navigate their new 'normal'.  However, his comments about filming because it may 'help someone else' really rub me the wrong way, because it's the same argument the Duggars use to justify their TV 'mini$try'.  

Time will tell. 

[FecundFundieFundus]

The kids are already parentified, but he is indeed making plans that will make it worse. Teenagers and kids expected to financially support their siblings, do meal planning, shopping for the whole family, be responsible for cooking meals, homeschooling their younger siblings, take care of home maintenance, etc. surpasses chores and helping out. That's a wildly inappropriate amount of responsibility for a parent to expect from their child. The older ones should be planning their future careers and, yes, helping out at home if they're still living there. Raising someone else's kids is not their job. 

There are other, more detailed sources, but wiki has a decent overview of the concept of parentification and sources listed at the bottom. It's a common issue with many of the fundies we follow 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parentification#targetText=Parentification is the process of,alienating parent's emotional life.

[Petronella]

4 hours ago, Queen Of Hearts said:

 I'm willing to cut him some slack and give him time to see how things progress before I start attacking him.  

No one here is “attacking” him. Expressing concern for the kids’ privacy isn’t “attacking” Tom.

[livinglongerthanyou]

On 8/25/2019 at 10:38 AM, Petronella said:

30 miles?? Wow. That surprises me hugely. (I am not a rural person.)

I live in rural Alaska. Most of the kids in our little community travel a minimum of 40 miles to get to school. For some, it's up to 60. Fun times in the winter when it's 40 below. LOL

[Dandruff]

1 hour ago, livinglongerthanyou said:

I live in rural Alaska. Most of the kids in our little community travel a minimum of 40 miles to get to school. For some, it's up to 60. Fun times in the winter when it's 40 below. LOL

Wow.  What are the school hours?  Sounds like the kids spend a lot of time not at home...though I guess it's something to do in the dead of winter.

[FecundFundieFundus]

I'm not from Alaska, but I'd spend the hour to hour and a half long bus rides* studying and doing homework so I could goof off when I got home. Rural roads suck, so I had to rewrite anything I did usually. Kids these days with their computers and tablets and speech to text have it easy now get off my lawn.

* Except half of the morning trip I'd curl up in the fetal position and half sleep leaned up against the cold ass window because mornings are the worst part of the day 

[Maggie Mae]

48 minutes ago, FecundFundieFundus said:

I'm not from Alaska, but I'd spend the hour to hour and a half long bus rides* studying and doing homework so I could goof off when I got home. Rural roads suck, so I had to rewrite anything I did usually. Kids these days with their computers and tablets and speech to text have it easy now get off my lawn.

* Except half of the morning trip I'd curl up in the fetal position and half sleep leaned up against the cold ass window because mornings are the worst part of the day 

It's dark in the morning and afternoon for much of the year. Do parents pack headlamps @livinglongerthanyou? Or do they sleep? I know during the recent 7.1 earthquake a bus driver friend mentioned that most of the kids barely noticed or looked up from their phones. 

The -40 makes me think you're in the interior somewhere. 

[FecundFundieFundus]

I'm not Alaskan, but I did live relatively far up north (about the 45th parallel). In deep winter there wasn't daylight until we were almost at school. I personally used a penlight or did the fetal-position-half-nap zombie routine, but this was way before smartphones. 

 

Edit: I had a portable CD player eventually, so you know I was cool as shit with my Mariah Carey morning swagger

Edited August 27, 2019 by FecundFundieFundus

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 hour ago, FecundFundieFundus said:

I'm not Alaskan, but I did live relatively far up north (about the 45th parallel). In deep winter there wasn't daylight until we were almost at school. I personally used a penlight or did the fetal-position-half-nap zombie routine, but this was way before smartphones. 

 

Edit: I had a portable CD player eventually, so you know I was cool as shit with my Mariah Carey morning swagger

You had some steady hands! I remember those discmans skipping after you moved a centimeter! 

[onlythetruth]

On 8/27/2019 at 3:48 AM, under siege said:

Yes, she had neck and back problems too. 
Her digestive/stomach/bowel problems had been ongoing for years but in a recent(ish) community post, she mentioned it was getting worse. What she mentioned were indicators that something serious was wrong. So many people pleaded with her to get her gallbladder checked. Which she eventually did but we all know the result of that sadly.

The truth is Andrea only used herbs/potions and refused to see doctors. Even Tom said on one of his recent posts that the family did not trust doctors. I am sorry but that is irresponsible. Doctors have degrees and have studied the body and how to fix it. Early detection is being responsible for yourself and MORE SO nine precious lives who NEED their mother. I get that Andrea was a Christian but what I cannot rap my head around is why she didn't see that God has given doctors knowledge to help and treat his people.

More so; prevention is better than finding a cure. Listen to dietitians; the heart foundation and other professionals about what will help you from getting sick in the first place. Mountain dew, processed foods, lollies and other rubbish is NOT healthy and will cause disease. Obesity kills. 

I was a single mother and I realised the importance of a healthy diet. I loved my children TOO MUCH to get sick. If I went down, we all went down. A mother is the MOST important person in the household. I know what it was like to lose a mother when I was young due to a poor diet. Yes you can still get diseases on a healthy diet but you are able to fight those diseases due to a healthy immune system. 

Did she have a twelve monthly '10 kilometre' check up? I; and millions of other responsible people have a proper check up once a year: blood test, blood pressure and urine test. These tests will show if you have fatty liver, cancer or other problems such as diabetes. This is preventive medicine and an assurance of early detection so that you may be treated. While not a guarantee it allows time for you to put things in place for your loved ones. 

My heart breaks for the children NOT the adults who choose ignorance rather than knowledge. 

[FecundFundieFundus]

45 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

You had some steady hands! I remember those discmans skipping after you moved a centimeter! 

It was like cradling an egg in a washing machine on dirt roads in old buses with what felt like suspensions made out of bungee cords. By gum listening to music took effort back then! Dang kids don't have work effort these days.

Cancer isn't always obvious and you can be healthy as a horse with a direct line to your GP and still get hit with cancer, disease or other disability. It's deeply unfair to blame people for somehow not preventing a disease which comes to almost everyone if they don't die of other reasons first. Healthy mammogram, felt a lump one month later, went back in and it ended up being Stage 3 that was approaching 4. Sometimes bad things just happen. It's scary because knowing we don't truly have control is a terrifying thought. But we don't, so blaming a woman who hasn't even been dead a week is a little harsh. There are people who smoke like chimneys and drink like fish and never exercise and eat like goats but live to be 90, health is built from our choices, yes, but it's also a matter of fortune. 

[JenniferJuniper]

13 minutes ago, FecundFundieFundus said:

Cancer isn't always obvious and you can be healthy as a horse with a direct line to your GP and still get hit with cancer, disease or other disability. It's deeply unfair to blame people for somehow not preventing a disease which comes to almost everyone if they don't die of other reasons first. Healthy mammogram, felt a lump one month later, went back in and it ended up being Stage 3 that was approaching 4. Sometimes bad things just happen. It's scary because knowing we don't truly have control is a terrifying thought. But we don't, so blaming a woman who hasn't even been dead a week is a little harsh. There are people who smoke like chimneys and drink like fish and never exercise and eat like goats but live to be 90, health is built from our choices, yes, but it's also a matter of fortune. 

This.  We like to think check ups and screenings and eating well will give us control over our health.  They really don't.  Sure, there are many lifestyle changes we can consciously make that can cut down on the chances of diabetes or delay heart disease, but bottom line, our bodies generally start falling apart around age 75.  And I'm sure many of us have known young health food, exercise nuts who have been cut down early in life by disease or elderly, obese smokers who lived well into their 80's.  We cannot know, but I doubt Andrea died as young as she did from a poor diet.  It sounds like a it was a very aggressive cancer that may well have killed her no matter what, possibly even if it was caught early.  That could happen to anyone.

 

[Koala]

 

1 hour ago, onlythetruth said:

The truth is Andrea only used herbs/potions and refused to see doctors. Even Tom said on one of his recent posts that the family did not trust doctors. I am sorry but that is irresponsible. Doctors have degrees and have studied the body and how to fix it. Early detection is being responsible for yourself and MORE SO nine precious lives who NEED their mother. I get that Andrea was a Christian but what I cannot rap my head around is why she didn't see that God has given doctors knowledge to help and treat his people.

More so; prevention is better than finding a cure. Listen to dietitians; the heart foundation and other professionals about what will help you from getting sick in the first place. Mountain dew, processed foods, lollies and other rubbish is NOT healthy and will cause disease. Obesity kills. 

I was a single mother and I realised the importance of a healthy diet. I loved my children TOO MUCH to get sick. If I went down, we all went down. A mother is the MOST important person in the household. I know what it was like to lose a mother when I was young due to a poor diet. Yes you can still get diseases on a healthy diet but you are able to fight those diseases due to a healthy immune system. 

Did she have a twelve monthly '10 kilometre' check up? I; and millions of other responsible people have a proper check up once a year: blood test, blood pressure and urine test. These tests will show if you have fatty liver, cancer or other problems such as diabetes. This is preventive medicine and an assurance of early detection so that you may be treated. While not a guarantee it allows time for you to put things in place for your loved ones. 

My heart breaks for the children NOT the adults who choose ignorance rather than knowledge. 

Blaming Andrea is absurd.  Jesus.  The woman had an aggressive form of cancer.  Her mom died of cancer.  It was not her fault.  

My heart totally breaks for her...she had to leave her babies behind.  She had to leave her husband behind.  She will miss out on birthdays, weddings, grandbabies...so many things.   She was in total agony in the end, and sadly, on display for the whole world to see.  If that doesn't break your heart, I don't know what will.