Gwen Shamblin 4: Lick the Fork

[tankgirl]

I just cant get over the fact, that Gwen took what sounds like pro Ana "helpful tips" or some twisted diet seen on an After school Special, and created a religion out of it, to be honest, enough of them must chuck God and Gwen just far enough out front, of this whole behaviour, because I am shocked more people aren't looking like Elizabeth. Gwen's daily devotions,  probably would be indistinguishable from anything promoted on a pro-Ana site, that is terrifying. I dont think any one will save Elizabeth unless they are not full believers, or are scared for the church. In fact, "Hey Gwen, get your daughter help, if she dies from your diet, that might just hurt your church." Sad part, she might be so disordered in her thinking, neither women feels she needs help

 

For the wrong people this cult could kill and thats scary.

[Katzchen24]

1 hour ago, SuperNova said:

People who are starving can have both auditory and visual hallucinations. It doesn't seem like a stretch to think that an RF member who sees god because they are literally starving would be held up as an example of the power of the growl. And by extension, if you truly believe that god almighty exsists in the growl, wouldn't dying of starvation make you a martyr for the faith, someone who transcended their physical form?

 

Early Christian ascetics often used fasting and other forms of privation to bring themselves closer to God. That’s a really inward-looking form of spiritual practice. It seems such a so wrong and so dangerous that Gwen is trying to impose this very personal form of practice on the public. 

[anjulibai]

How does "the growl" work with children? Is there a certain age under which kids are exempt? I feel like this could get into neglect so easily, so I'm curious how they deal with children, who are still growing and need to eat to develop normally. 

[dawbs]

48 minutes ago, anjulibai said:

How does "the growl" work with children? Is there a certain age under which kids are exempt? I feel like this could get into neglect so easily, so I'm curious how they deal with children, who are still growing and need to eat to develop normally. 

Seriously.
I am a parent to a 40 lb kid, of average height, age 8.  SHe's in something like the 60th percentile for height, 2nd for weight (I think I made a happy-dance post the time we made it ONTO the effing growth chart.  Because she usually falls off the bottom).
If I forget to tell her to eat, she will easily go 12 hours.  And be in a fit of hangry absurdity where she insists she doesn't want food.  It becomes a horrid cycle.

Under a certain age the ability to listen to their own body is hard.  
(It is a little harder w/ mine, because she has SPD so her entire body's responses to the other 3 senses--the ones we don't learn about in school, are a bit off.  But her BFF would be in the same state, and she's neurotypical she's just...8)

[Maxwell]

On 11/14/2018 at 9:09 PM, dawbs said:

... she has SPD so her entire body's responses to the other 3 senses--the ones we don't learn about in school, are a bit off.

SPD... SPD... she's 8, so I'm guessing she doesn't have a misaligned pelvis due to pregnancy... so it's probably "Sensory Processing Disorder"?  That explains the reference to "the other 3 senses" but I'm left wondering, what *are* the senses of which you speak?  Asking because I'm genuinely curious.

[dawbs]

11 minutes ago, Maxwell said:

SPD... SPD... she's 8, so I'm guessing she doesn't have a misaligned pelvis due to pregnancy... so it's probably "Sensory Processing Disorder"?  That explains the reference to "the other 3 senses" but I'm left wondering, what *are* the senses of which you speak?  Asking because I'm genuinely curious.

Sensory processing, yes
Sorry, I tried to put the link in, but it's not super obvious.

They're:
Vestibular (sense of movement in space--the ones the inner ear works on),
Proprioceptive (where our limbs are in relation to the rest of the rest of our body--knowing your arms are extended, etc)
Interoception (the understanding of our internal organs--so hunger and thirst and the like)

People learn how to interpret these senses, the same as they learn the others--we aren't born automatically knowing how to process information from any of our senses.  But since people are less aware of the last 3, people who know "hey, these kids w/ SPD are very under/over sensitive to noise--either sensory seeking or sensory avoiding" don't always think "hey, these kids w/ SPD are under/over sensitive to the rest of their body like knowing when to use the bathroom" (think either extreme there.  Having to pee every hour, because having to go 'just a little' makes them crazy OR not realizing they have to pee because they're ignoring it.  And just to keep the grown-ups on their toes, the same child will swing between the 2 extremes)

(Flip side of all those frustrations of "Go pee now.  I don't care that you don't have to go, go pee now" and "you can leave the table once you eat 3 crackers with cheese because it's been 12 hours and you're a raging hanger beast that  spits fire and is ready to explode",  my kid has been tested w/ the fine motor skills of a child twice her age--that's where her brain HAS grown.  Her body forgets to tell her to eat or pee, but her artwork is amazing.  And she's hilarious.  And she understands fairness in a way that would be awesome if adults would.  And she's brilliant <probably biased--although her teachers mostly agree, when she's not making them crazy)

[Maxwell]

Thank you for the explanation!

[formergothardite]

Well the last couple of daily devotionals have totally left out the growl worship. 

Yesterday's devotional.

Quote

You have to figure out what it is that you have really been longing for. And maybe it is breakfast, but you have been skipping it for years…so all morning long you are drinking coffee, but your body did not want that coffee. You were drinking it to try to ward off hunger, then eating lettuce for lunch and trying to save up your hunger for the evening…but you were miserable skipping all of those hungers. You are going thru these panic stages of not giving your body or your heart what it really wanted. It creates a tension that builds inside of you because you are never satisfying anything. It would be like the person never being able to sleep when they are sleepy—or never getting to breathe when they need air.

Today's 

Quote

God and His Spirit of love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, and self-control is special! That should make your heart rate go up! That should make you excited—a chance to get close to God, a chance to commune with God through Jesus Christ. King David considered this relationship with God better than gold and sweeter than honey. That is exceptional, that is superior! Food, alcohol, or TV is not the reward you give yourself at the end of the hard day anymore. It is God and a relationship with Him, a chance to get alone with Him. That is what you reward yourself with. 

This remark makes  me think that Gwen is surrounded by children who have had her teachings pushed on them way too young.

Quote

look at little children. They are not excited about the food.

All the kid birthday parties I've been with have had plenty of children excited about the cake and ice cream! 

Question for those who have done her diet before. I was thinking about it this morning and I could have it wrong, but it seems from what I've read you only eat a small amount of food to end the feelings of hunger. I was thinking of this when I ate my oatmeal this morning. Five bites in and I'm not longer really hungry. but if I stop eating now I'll be hungry again in about an hour. Plus I'll have just wasted an entire bowl of oatmeal. Is stopping eating and then eating again in another hour when I"m hungry again what she teaches? 

[JermajestyDuggar]

My children are not overweight and I don’t have them on any weird diets. Yet they are always excited for cake and ice cream at birthday parties. All the kids are. And after they eat, they are then excited for playing games or opening gifts. Kids get excited about many things. Including special birthday food. 

[tankgirl]

1 hour ago, formergothardite said:

Well the last couple of daily devotionals have totally left out the growl worship. 

Yesterday's devotional.

Today's 

This remark makes  me think that Gwen is surrounded by children who have had her teachings pushed on them way too young.

All the kid birthday parties I've been with have had plenty of children excited about the cake and ice cream! 

Question for those who have done her diet before. I was thinking about it this morning and I could have it wrong, but it seems from what I've read you only eat a small amount of food to end the feelings of hunger. I was thinking of this when I ate my oatmeal this morning. Five bites in and I'm not longer really hungry. but if I stop eating now I'll be hungry again in about an hour. Plus I'll have just wasted an entire bowl of oatmeal. Is stopping eating and then eating again in another hour when I"m hungry again what she teaches? 

Now I see how this cult diet works, you mix in some reasonable advice, with all this nutter stuff. The first quote has some sense to it, the second I see some Godly folks just loving. This mix of reasonable must make it easier to take in, and believe instead of all being the nutter stuff we have seen.

Kids love sweets, no matter, its normal. I sometimes feel its just my kid, but was with a group of school age kids yesterday, when the adult in charge told them she had a treat for them, about 6 of the 30 kids called out, "Candy?". It is not a sign they have bad character, they are just normal.

[DaisyD]

10 hours ago, dawbs said:

Sensory processing, yes
Sorry, I tried to put the link in, but it's not super obvious.

They're:
Vestibular (sense of movement in space--the ones the inner ear works on),
Proprioceptive (where our limbs are in relation to the rest of the rest of our body--knowing your arms are extended, etc)
Interoception (the understanding of our internal organs--so hunger and thirst and the like)

People learn how to interpret these senses, the same as they learn the others--we aren't born automatically knowing how to process information from any of our senses.  But since people are less aware of the last 3, people who know "hey, these kids w/ SPD are very under/over sensitive to noise--either sensory seeking or sensory avoiding" don't always think "hey, these kids w/ SPD are under/over sensitive to the rest of their body like knowing when to use the bathroom" (think either extreme there.  Having to pee every hour, because having to go 'just a little' makes them crazy OR not realizing they have to pee because they're ignoring it.  And just to keep the grown-ups on their toes, the same child will swing between the 2 extremes)

(Flip side of all those frustrations of "Go pee now.  I don't care that you don't have to go, go pee now" and "you can leave the table once you eat 3 crackers with cheese because it's been 12 hours and you're a raging hanger beast that  spits fire and is ready to explode",  my kid has been tested w/ the fine motor skills of a child twice her age--that's where her brain HAS grown.  Her body forgets to tell her to eat or pee, but her artwork is amazing.  And she's hilarious.  And she understands fairness in a way that would be awesome if adults would.  And she's brilliant <probably biased--although her teachers mostly agree, when she's not making them crazy)

My oldest is like this. Especially with clothes and food (and the fairness thing, oh my heck). He will NOT eat anything he doesn't absolutely love, and there was a time where he would only wear one brand of shirt because it was the only kind he was comfortable in. My mom is similar too. Noise makes her go into herself so far that she won't even know you're there. They do generally learn to get along in a world that doesn't necessarily understand them.

[Curious]

I've been catching up on this thread while eating ALL of my delicious breakfast and thinking about "waiting for the growl" and then eating a few bites.   We have seen pictures of some of the members of RF and tons of pics of Gwen and it seems to me there has to be some "cheating" going on.

If all the people were really following Gwen's twisted "theology" wouldn't there be far more people that look like her daughter, Elizabeth?   In all the pictures, the only person I can recall that looks like they are literally near death is Elizabeth.  Gwen is thin, but she doesn't look like she is a skeleton covered with skin. 

In some of the pictures at the beach house the women were not obese, but on the heavier side of what I guess I would call a healthy weight.

Why is that, I wonder.

 

Edit to add: I'm not in any way suggesting anyone was fat/fat shaming.  Rufus knows my fat ass has no room to talk.   I think we are accustomed to seeing people that are really quite thin being presented as "normal" when in reality they are very thin and thus "average" weight folks look heavy in comparison.

[JermajestyDuggar]

4 minutes ago, Curious said:

I've been catching up on this thread while eating ALL of my delicious breakfast and thinking about "waiting for the growl" and then eating a few bites.   We have seen pictures of some of the members of RF and tons of pics of Gwen and it seems to me there has to be some "cheating" going on.

If all the people were really following Gwen's twisted "theology" wouldn't there be far more people that look like her daughter, Elizabeth?   In all the pictures, the only person I can recall that looks like they are literally near death is Elizabeth.  Gwen is thin, but she doesn't look like she is a skeleton covered with skin. 

In some of the pictures at the beach house the women were not obese, but on the heavier side of what I guess I would call a healthy weight.

Why is that, I wonder.

It may be partly due to the fact that Gwen almost encourages high fat, high carb junk food at times. She focuses on eating what your body wants. So she doesn’t push for eating a certain diet like salad and lean proteins. Her followers will eat three bites of a hamburger and 2 onion rings for lunch. That’s ok in Gwen’s world. So they are getting some real calories and saturated fat in there. Just not enough to make them obese. 

[church_of_dog]

I commented earlier on how "junky" (high fat, processed) the food was that is focussed on.

But I guess the logic works the other way as well -- if I know I'm only allowed to eat for a few minutes (because after that the growl goes away), I'd want those few minutes to be filled with dense, high-fat, psychologically-satiating foods as well. 

I want to know the answer to @formergothardite's question as well -- if you stop eating as soon as the growl is gone, and then are hungry again an hour later, are you supposed to eat again an hour later, ad nauseum (pun intended) all day long?

[formergothardite]

RF has a video on their FB page about putting the steeple on the church and the deep meaning behind that steeple. Gwen looks a lot better back then.  She looks healthier and the hair is way less crazy. She says the copper in the steeple was taken from a church where Robert Frost was buried. This is important because he wrote the Road Less Traveled(it is actually The Road Not Taken). She then goes on to explain that this has meaning for the church because the poem is about taking the narrow road and the person going down that road is making all the difference in the world and eternity. 

Um, Gwen and RF folks reading here, did no one actually bother to read the poem before they decided that it held deep symbolism for the church? This is shades of the Bates naming their daughter a biblical name without bothering to find out what the person with that name actually did in the Bible. 

Quote

Though as for that the passing there

Had worn them really about the same,

And both that morning equally lay

In leaves no step had trodden black

If you read the poem it is clear that both roads are equally traveled. There is no less traveled road to choose, they are both equal. This is not about taking a narrow road and finding out it made a difference for eternity. It was written as a joke about a friend of Frost's who was indecisive when he took walks when it came to choosing which path to go on. Apparently the guy didn't take the poem too well and it hurt his feelings. In a letter to his friend Frost once said that no matter what path he chose he always sighed and ended up wishing he taken the other path. He always wanted to know what was on the road he didn't take.

Anyway, I'm just amused that even when building a church steeple Gwen is superficial, She didn't bothered to actually look into this poem that she seems to think holds meaning for the church. I bet she thought of the last line because it is very popular and didn't go any deeper than that. 

[church_of_dog]

@formergothardite thank you, that is fascinating about the poem!

I am NOT a fan of poetry in general but I do have a fondness for both Robert Frost and Gary Snyder due to their focus on/appreciation of nature.

Part of my difficulty with poetry in general is that I tend to take everything literally and don't 'grok' poetic symbolism.  So it's particularly pleasing to learn that such a famous poem was not actually intended symbolically at all, but was rather truly about someone choosing which path in the woods to take!  

[formergothardite]

33 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

It may be partly due to the fact that Gwen almost encourages high fat, high carb junk food at times. She focuses on eating what your body wants. So she doesn’t push for eating a certain diet like salad and lean proteins. Her followers will eat three bites of a hamburger and 2 onion rings for lunch. That’s ok in Gwen’s world. So they are getting some real calories and saturated fat in there

Yes, Gwen's advice is to eat whatever you want. One could easily eat a high calorie diet while following her plan. I notice that she tends to serve high calorie junk food at church events. Sure you are only eating a tiny bit, but that tiny bit can have a whopping amount of fat and calories. She seems to look down on advice to eat lots of healthy food. 

So instead of eating a bowl of oatmeal for breakfast that I figured has around 300 calories and 4 grams of fat and will keep me full most of the morning, which Gwen's plan I would go with whatever I craved even if that was a triple breakfast stack McGriddle from McDonalds. Even if I only ate half of it I would have ended up with over 400 calories, 30 grams of fat and probably be hungry for more food in an hour or so. Once I got a stomach growl I could eat another high calorie snack.  

8 minutes ago, church_of_dog said:

such a famous poem was not actually intended symbolically at all, but was rather truly about someone choosing which path in the woods to take!  

If I remember correctly Frost was annoyed people took the poem so seriously instead of realizing that he is saying both paths are equal in a rather joking manner. I'm sure he would roll his eyes and Gwen's remarks.

[JermajestyDuggar]

Gwen also seems to shun major exercise. One of her followers had a testimonial about how she was exercising too much to maintain her weight. So it makes me think that Gwen doesn’t think exercise is necessary to keep your weight in check. Again, this doesn’t seem healthy. I would love to see the health check ups on her followers. 

[Winneepoo]

Well the last couple of daily devotionals have totally left out the growl worship. 
Yesterday's devotional.

You have to figure out what it is that you have really been longing for. And maybe it is breakfast, but you have been skipping it for years…so all morning long you are drinking coffee, but your body did not want that coffee. You were drinking it to try to ward off hunger, then eating lettuce for lunch and trying to save up your hunger for the evening…but you were miserable skipping all of those hungers. You are going thru these panic stages of not giving your body or your heart what it really wanted. It creates a tension that builds inside of you because you are never satisfying anything. It would be like the person never being able to sleep when they are sleepy—or never getting to breathe when they need air.

Today's 

God and His Spirit of love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, and self-control is special! That should make your heart rate go up! That should make you excited—a chance to get close to God, a chance to commune with God through Jesus Christ. King David considered this relationship with God better than gold and sweeter than honey. That is exceptional, that is superior! Food, alcohol, or TV is not the reward you give yourself at the end of the hard day anymore. It is God and a relationship with Him, a chance to get alone with Him. That is what you reward yourself with. 

This remark makes  me think that Gwen is surrounded by children who have had her teachings pushed on them way too young.

look at little children. They are not excited about the food.

All the kid birthday parties I've been with have had plenty of children excited about the cake and ice cream! 
Question for those who have done her diet before. I was thinking about it this morning and I could have it wrong, but it seems from what I've read you only eat a small amount of food to end the feelings of hunger. I was thinking of this when I ate my oatmeal this morning. Five bites in and I'm not longer really hungry. but if I stop eating now I'll be hungry again in about an hour. Plus I'll have just wasted an entire bowl of oatmeal. Is stopping eating and then eating again in another hour when I"m hungry again what she teaches? 

I was looking at some of the advice members would give newcomers. She said that she would eat 2-3 bites per meal twice a day! I couldn’t believe it! 4-6 bites of food each day?!?[emoji43]Some talk about sipping on a little juice if they feel weak or jittery to get their blood sugar back up so they won’t pig out because they feel so hungry.

[bea]

“The Road Less Traveled” was a self help book by Dr. M. Scott Peck that came out in 1978. I bet you anything Gwen read it.

 

My 9yo also has SPD - and both my kids have T1 Diabetes, so that’s SUPER FUN. She eats about ten foods. I’ve had lots (and lots and lots) of people tell me that I should just wait until she’s hungry, she’ll eat then, hurr hurr. Yes, we’ll, she’d also be dead because she’s stubborn AF and you can’t MAKE a kid eat.

 

Gwen is a nitwit and promotes damaging “theology” and runs a cult but the thing I cannot get past is what the hell is up with that ghostly white foundation. Blend, Gwen. Maybe some bronzer, if you can’t stand to move to a darker color. With all that money, surely there’s a makeup artist who could gently guide her.

[Winneepoo]

I was wondering the same thing with her foundation! Why so white and pasty? Is it to look so innocent and pure?

 

Oops, wrong pic[emoji1787]

[SJWaterford]

3 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Gwen also seems to shun major exercise. One of her followers had a testimonial about how she was exercising too much to maintain her weight. So it makes me think that Gwen doesn’t think exercise is necessary to keep your weight in check. Again, this doesn’t seem healthy. I would love to see the health check ups on her followers. 

Because exercise would then become an idol and would take time away from the church and Gwen. Isn't the diet coke an idol? or the wine?  Isn't spending so much time making sure you don't wear more than a certain number of colors at a time or spending so much time creating the creepy videos from her wedding and engagement taking time away from God? Oh, I'm sorry, takes away time from God but not from Gwen. So much time is spent on themselves, the way they look, ect that you don't see in any church I've been to. Is ego an idol? How about all of the time spent on her behalf searching the web for the antagonists? Lot's of time wasted. Lot's of families who've lost time together,  torn apart and broken so that they can spend time worshipping a woman that tells them if they are fat they are not obeying God. And who gets to say when they are thin enough? 

[WiseGirl]

Oh my gosh @Winneepoo give a WiseGirl some notice before unleashing such big photos like that!  

Yikes, but I totally see what you are saying about the makeup.  Very strange imo.

[JermajestyDuggar]

I just want to give Gwen a big tub of moisturizer! Her face looks so dry! 

[SuperNova]

Holy snack crackers, those pictures. Gwen is terrifying.

RF members who are spying on us: moisturize your leader!