Seewalds 34: No News Yet

[MoonFace]

4 hours ago, Yomoaw said:

My parents tried to put a leash on me when I was 2 and we went to Disney. As long as it was on me, I would lay down on the sidewalk on my stomach and refused  to move or acknowledge them. When I hear stories about myself as a baby, I'm somehow never surprised that I'm an only child.

We used to live in the boonies - with a 150 YARD drive way off a dead end road with only a couple houses past our drive way.   My kids had no concept of what traffic was.   We went to visit my mother in NYC .  She lived on a 4 lane street with a lot of traffic.   

I put a 'leash' on the running toddler.   Someone passing by said I was cruel to do that to him.   I was of the opinion that it would have been more cruel to let him run into traffic and get killed.   But that was my humble opinion.   

Then the second child came along and she was even faster.........

[Yaoichan12]

1 hour ago, Carm_88 said:

You can be the best parent in the world and have a child get lost or run away. My brother got away from my parents when he was a kid, he was about to run out into the street in a panic when a lady grabbed him and brought him back into the store. My parents were inside, keeping their eye on me and panicking looking for him. Unfortunately humans have not evolved to have a second set of eyes, so leashes and other measures to keep kids with their parents are a really good idea. 

Yes, this. I was in Oklahoma visiting a friend. We we're out with her 9year old, three year old, and 2 year old. Me, friend, and kids were on one side of rode looking at a sign for a canal ride. All kids were right by us. Other friend was across the cobblestone road taking pictures.

Next thing we hear is the screeching of tires and a horn. We look and 3 year old was in middle of street. Unharmed luckily. Friend grabbed her daughter and was fussing at her while daughter was crying. 

A very nice lady standing nearby just had to walk over and lean in to say "that wouldn't have happened if you'd been watching her" 

Excuse you! That is not something to say to someone. We ignored her but friend said if we were on a canal boat with the lady, she'd give her her two cents on her opinion

[Yomoaw]

19 minutes ago, MoonFace said:

We used to live in the boonies - with a 150 YARD drive way off a dead end road with only a couple houses past our drive way.   My kids had no concept of what traffic was.   We went to visit my mother in NYC .  She lived on a 4 lane street with a lot of traffic.   

I put a 'leash' on the running toddler.   Someone passing by said I was cruel to do that to him.   I was of the opinion that it would have been more cruel to let him run into traffic and get killed.   But that was my humble opinion.   

Then the second child came along and she was even faster.........

Oh, I don't have an issue with leashes and I think my parents were smart to try to use one at a crowded park. I was just a master of passive resistance from a very young age. I'm not sure if you were responding to that. 

[MoonFace]

20 minutes ago, Yomoaw said:

Oh, I don't have an issue with leashes and I think my parents were smart to try to use one at a crowded park. I was just a master of passive resistance from a very young age. I'm not sure if you were responding to that. 

Just agreeing that leashes are a good thing - especially if there is a fast (or determined!) child involved.   

They were smart to use the leash, even if you chose to have a sit in in protest.   Who knows when something may have distracted you from your resistance and ZOOM - off you'd go!   

I now have a granddaughter who can disappear in the blink of an eye.   She just turned 8 and I'd like to put a leash on her at times.    

43 minutes ago, Yaoichan12 said:

Yes, this. I was in Oklahoma visiting a friend. We we're out with her 9year old, three year old, and 2 year old. Me, friend, and kids were on one side of rode looking at a sign for a canal ride. All kids were right by us. Other friend was across the cobblestone road taking pictures.

Next thing we hear is the screeching of tires and a horn. We look and 3 year old was in middle of street. Unharmed luckily. Friend grabbed her daughter and was fussing at her while daughter was crying. 

A very nice lady standing nearby just had to walk over and lean in to say "that wouldn't have happened if you'd been watching her" 

Excuse you! That is not something to say to someone. We ignored her but friend said if we were on a canal boat with the lady, she'd give her her two cents on her opinion

On the bolded:  We were once in a small town when we saw grandparents with a little boy of about 3.  They each held one of his hands as they walked along the sidewalk.   Little boy snapped his hands out of the grandparents hands and ran into the street.   Narrowly missed being hit by a car.   Grandfather picked him up and popped him on the butt - through his snow suit.   A cop ran over and yelled at the grandfather telling him to keep a better watch on the kid and he wouldn't have to abuse the child!   

Grandfather went nose to nose with the cop and said he and the grandmother had been holding the child's hands and he escaped and the kid needed to know that there are things he CANNOT do.     A few of us applauded the grandfather. 

Kids are quick.  Some adults are idiots. 

 

[ElephantPatronus]

My sister was always anti-leash, UNTIL her third child came along and was a runner. #1 and #2 would always listen and wait patiently next to the car when in parking lots. #3 (as soon as she was mobile) would take off FAST through the parking lot. My sister was pro-leash after that!

I also hate when people think you know nothing about children just because you’re not a mother. I’ve changed more diapers than some  mothers I know. My cousin had a baby and I watched her put a onesie over the baby’s head and pull it down to the belly before attempting to put a diaper on the child-of course, the baby peed and the clean onesie now had to be changed. My cousin got frustrated, so I suggested putting the diaper on first. She told me that since I didn’t have kids, I didn’t know what I was talking about. She was 3 weeks into motherhood at that point. I proceeded to watch the same thing happen again (soiling another clean onesie) before she silently took my advise.

[Kittikatz]

I don't see why leashes on children are even controversial - I remember being dragged along by an adult and it was irritating to have my arm wrenched up at such an angle. I would probably rather have been given the freedom of even a short leash. Also, I wouldn't let my dog or cat walk on the sidewalk in a busy area without one - why would I let a small child run loose? It's one thing if said cat/dog/child is on a very quiet street or in a park with lots of running space around them, but counting on being able to keep an eye/hand on them or them immediately hearing/complying with commands if they get loose isnt always realistic. 

One of my friends was with her 2 1/2 yo son in the Paris Metro during an event of some sort. He bolted and got swept up into the crowd going the other way. If he hadn't balked at the stairs and started screaming she may have really lost him in the crowd. Better safe than sorry.

[klabourdeth]

My husband remembers being on a leash for years (up to age 10). His mother would have a set up that all four kids would be tethered together. A godsend from what I heard with it being very tiring to keep up with kids each a year apart in age. Although if one got lose she would point at one of them and asked 'have you seen another kid like this?'. It usually worked since my husband & his siblings are black and living in an area that was mainly white.


Me on the other hand I don't think my parents ever used a leash with me, there is a lot hazy memories from 6/7 years of age. It would probably been wise a decision. One of my mom's favorite stories involved me attempting suicide via of Disney's monorail. I guess I kept it up for at a minimum of 3 trips with a ruling of no monorail as transpiration.

The monorail suicide was probably the more mild of things I did. There was one month that they had to take me for stitches 3 separate times from the times I thought I could be Batman or fly like Superman using a waterbed for the starting point. Stories of the head of the trailer park bring me back when I escaped naked. So so many stories that would have been red flagged today.

[TuringMachine]

A friend of mine was a leash toddler. His mom can't walk very well, so she wouldn't have been able to chase after him if she needed to. Seems reasonable to me.

[nastyhobbitses]

I spent my infancy and toddlerhood in Manhattan. I was on a leash until I was three and one of my earliest memories is my (terrified) dad shouting at me to never run into the street. When we moved to the suburbs, my mom would dress me and my sister identically when we went out so that if one or both of us got lost, she'd only have to remember one outfit to describe to the police. 

[AliceInFundyland]

My brother was kept on a leash. He wandered. When we went to the amusement parks (Disney] my parents wanted to ride roller-coasters. So they leashed him (4) to me (7) and stuck us on a bench with treats, knowing I was obedient. In retrospect this seems like a REALLY dumb thing to do. It made little me nervous. Those lines were long.

Bro needed the leash though. Total space cadet.

[BrandoBarks]

3 hours ago, Kittikatz said:

I don't see why leashes on children are even controversial - I remember being dragged along by an adult and it was irritating to have my arm wrenched up at such an angle. 

Where I live(d) in Germany (and Italy), leashes are very unpopular because they‘re seen as a way to control children, „helicopter“ partenting and a limit of freedom. In fact, I have seen one only one time, a cute backpack leash actually. People prefer to put their toddlers in strollers and take preschoolers by hand. Older kids are expected to behave.

Now, my 3 year old ist not only incredibly fast but also very autonomous... Even in non crowded places he likes to take off and doesn’t listen to our screems. I’m now 15 weeks pregnant, already slow and so my husband has to chase him when he’s with me and we don’t have the stroller. Often I longed for a leash to keep him save in trafficked areas or in crowds. But I’m afraid to be judged and I’m really not sure about the “kids are no animals so don’t put a leash on them” argument a lot of people use. Reading your comments has me thinking though 

[GutenbergGirl]

On 7/5/2018 at 7:43 PM, SapphireSlytherin said:

Actually, nobody EVER should say anything to a parent about what they choose to feed their kids. Unless, of course, it's rat poison or bleach.

There was a time I would have agreed 100%.  

Then, I saw my niece feeding her 3 month old tiny pieces of pizza.  And chicken.  And taco meat.  Peanut butter.  Putting regular milk with strawberry Quik in Baby's bottle at 4 months....  Coke at 5 months.

So, yeah.  As gently as I could, I pointed out to her that feeding her infant this crap was the most idiotic thing I'd ever seen.  Choking hazards, allergies, not to mention Baby was always gassy, and miserable.  

I don't regret saying something.

(But, I agree, short of actual hazards.)

[mpheels]

3 hours ago, GutenbergGirl said:

There was a time I would have agreed 100%.  

Then, I saw my niece feeding her 3 month old tiny pieces of pizza.  And chicken.  And taco meat.  Peanut butter.  Putting regular milk with strawberry Quik in Baby's bottle at 4 months....  Coke at 5 months.

So, yeah.  As gently as I could, I pointed out to her that feeding her infant this crap was the most idiotic thing I'd ever seen.  Choking hazards, allergies, not to mention Baby was always gassy, and miserable.  

I don't regret saying something.

(But, I agree, short of actual hazards.)

There’s a huge difference between giving unsolicited advice to a stranger and making gentle suggestions to a good friend or close family member. I would never give advice to a random stranger (I will intervene if a kid is in immediate danger - like stopping a kid from running into traffic, or keeping an eye on a roaming toddler until a responsible adult catches up). For good friends, I will gently mention something if they appear to be struggling, or they are doing something that I know to be dangerous. I love thier kids as if they were my own and I’m the theoretical guardian for several kids should anything happen to thier parents.  Just as I would want good friends to tell me if I was doing something stupid or harmful with my own life, they are open to helpful/supportive advice.

[Jenn The Heathen]

I never felt the need to use leashes with my kids, but if other parents used them, so be it.  That’s their choice.  However, my sister’s mother in law gave my older son one as a gift when he a year old.  I thought it was an odd gift for a child to receive and just shoved it in his closet and forgot about it until a couple of years later when my second son started walking.  The boys had found the leash and were taking turns walking each other around the house.

[VelociRapture]

10 hours ago, ElephantPatronus said:

My sister was always anti-leash, UNTIL her third child came along and was a runner. #1 and #2 would always listen and wait patiently next to the car when in parking lots. #3 (as soon as she was mobile) would take off FAST through the parking lot. My sister was pro-leash after that!

I also hate when people think you know nothing about children just because you’re not a mother. I’ve changed more diapers than some  mothers I know. My cousin had a baby and I watched her put a onesie over the baby’s head and pull it down to the belly before attempting to put a diaper on the child-of course, the baby peed and the clean onesie now had to be changed. My cousin got frustrated, so I suggested putting the diaper on first. She told me that since I didn’t have kids, I didn’t know what I was talking about. She was 3 weeks into motherhood at that point. I proceeded to watch the same thing happen again (soiling another clean onesie) before she silently took my advise.

I do this sometimes with my 19 month old and have never had issues. The key is to put the clothes on prior to removing the dirty diaper and to be ready to use the dirty one as a shield of the baby starts peeing. This was especially helpful considering my daughter was a December preemie - it helped keep her warm during changes.

And this next part is just an “in general” type post and isn’t directed at anyone here specifically:

Offering legitimately helpful advice once and then backing off is fine (unless it’s actually a dangerous situation - do what you feel is necessary at that point.) But if it’s not a safety issue and the parent/caregiver indicates they aren’t interested in advice then please drop it! Nothing has quite pissed me off since becoming a mom then people insisting on sharing advice repeatedly after I politely indicate I’m not interested.

My mother (who I love dearly and who truly means well) is the worst about this. One example is when I casually mentioned via group text for my immediate family that a newborn Velocitoddler hadn’t enjoyed her bath in her baby bath tub. My mom proceeded to insist that we didn’t need the baby tub and she’d show me how to bathe her in the big tub next time she visited. After I politely told her we had it handled she repeated herself. This happened maybe three or four more times before I finally snapped, told her my husband and I had made a decision that was best for our family, and that she needed to butt out immediately. She finally listened and dropped it, but this has been an ongoing issue between us ever since I found out I was pregnant with my daughter. It’s obnoxious and disrespectful to constantly assume you know better than the parent/caregiver does. So yeah... just don’t do that. Lol!

[HurricaneBells]

The always eloquent @VelociRapture said most of what I was thinking  (and sympathy hug because mums and advice, me too aaargh!) but wanted to add that I find the leash debate so funny. I had one as a kid so they are nothing new..... who cares, better safe than sorry and there are hardly any lasting effects. I mean I only bark at stray cats these days..

[HarleyQuinn]

Quinn1 got leashed at day care once because he was running off when they were walking to a park. His provider actually called and apologized. I thought it was funny.

I have a more lenient view on leashes now as a parent. Before that was a big "hell no" for me wanting to use one because I associate leashes with pets but I see now that they are necessary for some children. 

I did see someone once at an airport literally dragging their kid on a leash when running from gate to gate. The child was crying and one of the employees that drive those smart carts around yelled at him to pick his kid up instead and the guy got all flustered and did. Those people shouldn't have leashes. 

[scoutsadie]

8 hours ago, BrandoBarks said:

Now, my 3 year old ist not only incredibly fast but also very autonomous... Even in non crowded places he likes to take off and doesn’t listen to our screems. I’m now 15 weeks pregnant, already slow and so my husband has to chase him when he’s with me and we don’t have the stroller. Often I longed for a leash to keep him save in trafficked areas or in crowds. But I’m afraid to be judged and I’m really not sure about the “kids are no animals so don’t put a leash on them” argument a lot of people use. Reading your comments has me thinking though 

Hugs, @BrandoBarks, and best wishes on your pregnancy. I totally get not wanting to be judged and possibly hassled by others, but if you and your husband decide that a restraint is the best thing for your son at this point, I hope you can learn to feel secure (ha) in that if others comment. Sounds like you have his best interests at heart!

[Lovebug]

22 hours ago, Shadoewolf said:

I get weird looks when I hold my 10 year old's hand in public. That sort of eye roll, isn't he a little old for that considering he's almost as tall as me kinda thing. No, he isn't too old, he's autistic and him holding my hand is part of our communication system for him to alert me if he's getting anxious or overstimulated. We had a monkey backpack leash for him as a toddler too.

I'm so sorry people do this, Shadoe!  People make me crazy sometimes...

My youngest son just turned 12, and is not autistic.  He still sometimes reaches for my hand when we're out and about, and I don't give a rat's ass who gives me the side eye for it.  Kids are only kids for so long, and I will hold his hand if he needs me to - he needs me to sometimes, ya know?  It doesn't happen as often as it used to because he is getting older, but I couldn't imagine refusing nonetheless.  Apparently, he's slowly realizing how embarrassing I am.

And to be honest, in this day and age where it's not uncommon for kids his age to be doing lots more than playing with Hotwheels and holding their mom's hand when needed, I'll take that he's playing Hotwheels and occasionally holding my hand when needed...

[2manyKidzzz]

8 hours ago, BrandoBarks said:

Where I live(d) in Germany (and Italy), leashes are very unpopular because they‘re seen as a way to control children, „helicopter“ partenting and a limit of freedom. In fact, I have seen one only one time, a cute backpack leash actually. People prefer to put their toddlers in strollers and take preschoolers by hand. Older kids are expected to behave.

Now, my 3 year old ist not only incredibly fast but also very autonomous... Even in non crowded places he likes to take off and doesn’t listen to our screems. I’m now 15 weeks pregnant, already slow and so my husband has to chase him when he’s with me and we don’t have the stroller. Often I longed for a leash to keep him save in trafficked areas or in crowds. But I’m afraid to be judged and I’m really not sure about the “kids are no animals so don’t put a leash on them” argument a lot of people use. Reading your comments has me thinking though 

Keep your child safe no matter what. If someone snarks at you, just say “ I”m so sorry that is a problem for you”. Sweet, puts them off and means nothing, 

[melon]

2 hours ago, VelociRapture said:

I do this sometimes with my 19 month old and have never had issues. The key is to put the clothes on prior to removing the dirty diaper and to be ready to use the dirty one as a shield of the baby starts peeing. This was especially helpful considering my daughter was a December preemie - it helped keep her warm during changes.

And this next part is just an “in general” type post and isn’t directed at anyone here specifically:

Offering legitimately helpful advice once and then backing off is fine (unless it’s actually a dangerous situation - do what you feel is necessary at that point.) But if it’s not a safety issue and the parent/caregiver indicates they aren’t interested in advice then please drop it! Nothing has quite pissed me off since becoming a mom then people insisting on sharing advice repeatedly after I politely indicate I’m not interested.

My mother (who I love dearly and who truly means well) is the worst about this. One example is when I casually mentioned via group text for my immediate family that a newborn Velocitoddler hadn’t enjoyed her bath in her baby bath tub. My mom proceeded to insist that we didn’t need the baby tub and she’d show me how to bathe her in the big tub next time she visited. After I politely told her we had it handled she repeated herself. This happened maybe three or four more times before I finally snapped, told her my husband and I had made a decision that was best for our family, and that she needed to butt out immediately. She finally listened and dropped it, but this has been an ongoing issue between us ever since I found out I was pregnant with my daughter. It’s obnoxious and disrespectful to constantly assume you know better than the parent/caregiver does. So yeah... just don’t do that. Lol!

I feel you,it's been years,but both my mother and mother in law did that,,to me.It's very obnoxious and disrespectful.If I do have grandchildren or a grandchild,I hope I don't do this.Even worse,my MIL and my mother disagreed on certain things,and both told me I should do whatever it was they did.

[dawbs]

9 hours ago, BrandoBarks said:

*snip*

Now, my 3 year old ist not only incredibly fast but also very autonomous... Even in non crowded places he likes to take off and doesn’t listen to our screems. I’m now 15 weeks pregnant, already slow and so my husband has to chase him when he’s with me and we don’t have the stroller. Often I longed for a leash to keep him save in trafficked areas or in crowds. But I’m afraid to be judged and I’m really not sure about the “kids are no animals so don’t put a leash on them” argument a lot of people use. Reading your comments has me thinking though 

I understand not liking them, they're not my favorite.  My dad was always passive aggressive about them.  But, much to my amusement, he was caught kinda flat footed when my grandma (if I haven't mentioned, my grandma was one of my favorite people on the planet.  she was awesome) reminded him that she used to leash him to the clothesline when she worked sometimes.

Someone got smarmy with her and told her how awful it was to see a kid on a leash.  ANd her response was "would you rather see him as a greasy smear in the middle of the road?"

ANd I will say, one of the advantages I've had being an older mom is that I get to have a 'fuck it, we do waht works for us, I give a shit less about your thoughts" about my kid.  If I had been 25 when I had my kid, I'd probably be all over myself trying to explain her special needs to people when I got that look.  But really, anymore, I hand her over her tablet (which is sometimes a toy/tablet, but it's also sometimes an 'assistive device' with things like 'settle your glitter' on it, to help her control and breathe), give a hug, put on her earmuffs, and say "Hm.  I'm sure someone would be glad for that advice" and on rare occasion, flip someone off (harder to do now that she knows thats a 'swear' ).

Because, what is 'best' and what is 'best for my family/my kid/me' are not always the same.  Go for 'best for my family' and let the rest of the world howl.

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

3 hours ago, HarleyQuinn said:

Quinn1 got leashed at day care once because he was running off when they were walking to a park. His provider actually called and apologized. I thought it was funny.

I have a more lenient view on leashes now as a parent. Before that was a big "hell no" for me wanting to use one because I associate leashes with pets but I see now that they are necessary for some children. 

I did see someone once at an airport literally dragging their kid on a leash when running from gate to gate. The child was crying and one of the employees that drive those smart carts around yelled at him to pick his kid up instead and the guy got all flustered and did. Those people shouldn't have leashes. 

FFS! Those leashes are for you to keep up with your child, not for them to keep up with you.  I don't know why I'm still amazed by the level of stupid in this world, but I am.

[Meggo]

3 hours ago, VelociRapture said:

I do this sometimes with my 19 month old and have never had issues. The key is to put the clothes on prior to removing the dirty diaper and to be ready to use the dirty one as a shield of the baby starts peeing. This was especially helpful considering my daughter was a December preemie - it helped keep her warm during changes.

And this next part is just an “in general” type post and isn’t directed at anyone here specifically:

Offering legitimately helpful advice once and then backing off is fine (unless it’s actually a dangerous situation - do what you feel is necessary at that point.) But if it’s not a safety issue and the parent/caregiver indicates they aren’t interested in advice then please drop it! Nothing has quite pissed me off since becoming a mom then people insisting on sharing advice repeatedly after I politely indicate I’m not interested.

My mother (who I love dearly and who truly means well) is the worst about this. One example is when I casually mentioned via group text for my immediate family that a newborn Velocitoddler hadn’t enjoyed her bath in her baby bath tub. My mom proceeded to insist that we didn’t need the baby tub and she’d show me how to bathe her in the big tub next time she visited. After I politely told her we had it handled she repeated herself. This happened maybe three or four more times before I finally snapped, told her my husband and I had made a decision that was best for our family, and that she needed to butt out immediately. She finally listened and dropped it, but this has been an ongoing issue between us ever since I found out I was pregnant with my daughter. It’s obnoxious and disrespectful to constantly assume you know better than the parent/caregiver does. So yeah... just don’t do that. Lol!

Are we related? Because my mother does the SAME.THING. 

I stopped mentioning things to her for the most part. It's sad that I can't talk to my mom about struggles I'm having with my son - but her answer is "Well - you're the boss! You tell him what's what!" (as if he's somehow going to be broken because I let him win the "no shirts with button holes" battle...)
And when she DOES hear about things - it becomes her pet project. "Well - I talked to So & So who's son didn't talk for a few years and now he's a doctor with his own kids!" (um - okay? so how is that helpful?

I also honestly would like to know from her - how she dealt with us. Because I know we weren't beaten (the occasional swat on the bum for running out in the road maybe) but we LISTENED to her and were compliant for the most part. My son... is not. (beaten or compliant by any stretch). 
 

[just_ordinary]

1 hour ago, 2manyKidzzz said:

Keep your child safe no matter what. If someone snarks at you, just say “ I”m so sorry that is a problem for you”. Sweet, puts them off and means nothing, 

Don’t be too sure people won’t respond to it and start a lengthy judgemental conversation. Especially old people without filter or a certain type of Hipster people. It can happen even though we Germans usually don’t talk to strangers but will make very clear by mimic and looks what we really think. 

I actually have never seen a parent using a leash in Germany. Children are taught to walk close by very early and if they don’t they „loose the privilege“ of walking without being on your hand. But then, we let our 3/4/5 year old walk to kindergarten alone if there aren’t too many roads and they have proofen they can handle the traffic (we obviously are preparing them to do it by themselves a lot before and most are 4-5). So far I know of no statistics that German children are in more accidents. Abduction is actually so rare I wouldn’t even think about it. I can see why a leash can make things easier but in my head leashes are for dogs. But I wouldn’t go up to anyone and bother them about their choice.