Seewalds 25: Jessa is allowing Spurgeon to "jump for joy", er, dance

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

Yeah, I have a friend that is positive breast milk will cure cancer she is also anti vax and had 2 dangerous home births, one that could have cost her midwife her license. She neglected to tell the midwife that the baby had turned breach the morning she went into labor so by the time she got there she was 9 cm and ready to deliver, she had a bad hemorrhage and almost died and spent 4 days in the hospital baby was born blue as his dead was stuck. The husband was so upset at the wife that he was yelling at her that they should have gone to the hospital.  the midwife did her duty, but then filled a report against my friend, and she was essentially banned from all the local midwives in her area.  All that because she was afraid of a c/section, but she also wasn't able to have anymore kids because of her stupidity. I've called her out many times about her Google MD bull shit, and I'll take notes of that but ima stick with what my doctor says. 

[Rachel333]

1 hour ago, Galbin said:

Which claims in particular? 

Like that it increases IQ and prevents diseases like eczema. I had a friend who had bad eczema and her mom felt so guilty for not breastfeeding because she thought breastfed babies didn't get eczema. I have eczema too and my mom thought it had to be something else because I was breastfed. Those dramatic benefits just aren't supported by research when you control for income and education, though.

Breastmilk is good, but so is formula, and there are times when one or the other is the better choice for the mother or baby so there's no need to judge either way!

Someone earlier in the thread mentioned the Adam Ruins Everything segment on breastfeeding vs. formula, and I agree that it's pretty good.

Spoiler

 

 

[Jenn The Heathen]

@Rachel333 I honestly think those claims about IQ and eczema and everything else breast feeding is supposed to make your child better at/ resistant to, etc were made up to guilt mothers into stopping use of formula.  My mom told me that when I was a baby (in the early eighties), you were considered better off if you could afford to formula feed your baby.  Don't know how widespread that thinking was, but the best way to counteract that would be to make breast milk seem like the end all be all to childhood issues. Nothing gets moms on a bandwagon faster than convincing them that doing one thing or another will make their kid the best.

[Letizia]

2 hours ago, Shadoewolf said:

I won't jump in on the weaning /breast/bottle thing. A fed baby is a happy baby. 

HOWEVER, I would absolutely rake Jessa if she is allowing him to fall asleep with a bottle, be it naps or at night. Bottle rot of the teeth is very real and can have permanent consequences.

Oddly enough Mellow-Yellow in my bottle at bedtime until I was four had no effect on my teeth. Nor did the sweet tea and Coke I perpetually guzzled all day. Yet my parents were always wondering why I never napped,never seemed to want to sleep and was prone to running in circles singing "I'm so Excited" at the top of my lungs. And when I say I have had no problems with my teeth I mean I am in my 30's and never have had a cavity. My wisdom teeth even came in perfectly with no crowding issues. Each new dentist has complimented me on this and mentions my parents must have been strict with their dental hygiene practices concerning me. You should see their faces when they learn the truth. 

 

I'm sure some are wondering if I was an obese child and the answer is no despite the constant crap my family ate. How? Well I would be starving when I would sit down to eat so I would slurp down Coke at warp speed while waiting on my nearly daily happy meal.The Coke would give me a false sense of being full and so I'd be full after about two bites of food. Despite changing my diet once I was old enough to realize how bad it was (in high school) to this day the only time I've felt normal hunger and been able to eat a normal amount of food is when pregnant.Just in case everyone isn't thoroughly impressed with my parents' skills let me share  how they finally got me to give up that pre-bedtime bottle: they told me on Christmas morning that Santa stole them.That decision comically backfired on my mother but that is a whole other story. 

For any wondering how I'm still alive just go with what my husband concluded after he learned I was adopted: I'm clearly at least half mutant. Yep I'm adopted which means that no I didn't have two unsure teens making these parenting decisions but two educated people in their mid 30's. And no the constant sugar and caffeine had no effecton my behavior at school. I was even allowed to skip kindergarten and went right into first grade mainly because I had advanced reading skills thanks to my mother. Age appropriate  books for kids bored her so she taught me to read using her tabloids. 

Needless to say my parents have looked down their nose at me for shocking parenting decisions like choosing to breastfeed, not starting a two week old on solids,not feeding a 6 month old steak,not filling a newborn's crib with stuffed animals,using carseats and no soft drinks in the bottle. In fact just last week my mother warned me that my daughter was drinking too much milk and she would end up like Kyle. Took me a second to know who Kyle was and then I remembered he was the little boy in my kindergarten class who had a horrible case of milk rot. 

I often joke I should write a parenting book with my mother where I ask her advice on how to handle certain situations and then recommend doing the exact opposite of whatever she says. It would cover basic things like denying a child Doritos isn't child abuse,don't frame Santa for a crime he didn't commit and that Pretty Woman and Dances With Wolves aren't ideal movie choices for a 5 or 6 yr old.....especially if you don't want your child calling Cinderella "Cinder-fucking-rella" or proudly telling her teacher she saw Kevin Costner's bare ass. 

[Bad Wolf]

@Letizia Your parents sound...actually, I can't think of a word to describe them. We're they fun?

[seraaa]

On 9/7/2017 at 7:15 PM, SapphireSlytherin said:

Yes. They're fried. They look like blood clots... hahaha

The only part of the Full English I'll eat is the eggs. Maybe the hashbrown (depending on where in the UK you order it, sometimes you get a hashbrown).

I prefer a tattie scone* to a hashbrown, and will go for that if there's an option, but hash browns are also good!

 

*not actually a scone

[KnittingOwl]

10 hours ago, Jenn The Heathen said:

I really don't care what Michelle's reasons for weaning were.  I hate that so much of a mother's worth is based on how long she breast feeds for.  I wasn't able to breast feed at all.  My oldest had a difficult time latching and became dehydrated because I felt like I had to breast feed to be a good mother.  Finally the hospital said he would either have to get a bottle or be hooked up to an IV in the NICU.  Obviously I chose the bottle.  After that, he wanted nothing to do with the breast.  My youngest I just didn't produce enough milk.

A fed baby is best.  There's a lot to snark on Michelle for, but when and why she weaned isn't one of them.

(This isn't directed at anyone here, but I saw the post above about the mother's in the homeschool group telling people she weaned in order to get pregnant again).

::HUGS::

I had a similar struggle. I just never produced enough milk for my daughter. She was crying constantly because she was so hungry, and I was crying because I was on this insane "feed baby as long as she wants then pump 10 minutes" schedule from the lactation consultants. At 6 weeks, she was still losing weight. Her pediatrician was finally the one who sat with me and gave me to permission to let it go and stop beating myself up. Talking with my endocrinologist, about 20% of women with hypothyroidism have inadequate milk supplies. And yet the lactation consultants wouldn't even entertain the idea. I'm still kind of bitter. 

[AlwaysExcited]

Formula baby here. My mother wasn't able to breastfeed because of medical issues and has felt bad about it for longest time. I think I turned out ok despite eating the Baby Food of Doom. I was fed and didn't die from diarrhea mother's milk gave me. 

[JillyO]

6 hours ago, ThunderRolls said:

Yes! I wondered that as well. Poor little thing. Who knows what's going on in that child's home. 

I had a broken arm as a baby. When I was 15 months old, my mom and I were at her best friend's house. I was sopposed to be peacefully playing with said friend's 18-month-old daughter on our blanket on the floor. Except I decided that I'd rather climb up the outside of the spiral staircase that led to the second story, and then, when I'd reached the top, to simply let go.

There was a baby gate on the staircase, but no one had ever thought that we would climb up the OUTSIDE of the staircase. Also, I was just super-quick. It's not like we were alone for hours. I just snuck out and up the stairs in like a minute or two.

So I really wouldn't go around insinuating child abuse if we know absolutely nothing about what happened to complete strangers. Some kids are just active and get into trouble a lot.

[samurai_sarah]

2 hours ago, AlwaysExcited said:

Formula baby here. My mother wasn't able to breastfeed because of medical issues and has felt bad about it for longest time. I think I turned out ok despite eating the Baby Food of Doom. I was fed and didn't die from diarrhea mother's milk gave me. 

Another formula baby here. Mum didn't produce enough milk, so breastfeeding wasn't an option. By baby nr 2 (me), she had dealt with enough rubbish to stop feeling bad about anything, as long as the babies got a healthy meal. Allegedly, we were all pretty wilful and stubborn babies, who had strong opinions on how we wanted to fed, and would go on hunger-strike if we didn't get precisely what we wanted.

My pragmatic mum did the logical thing. She gave herself a "get out of jail free" card, binned all her baby-bible books, and worked with us to keep us nourished. And she told everyone who felt bad about not breastfeeding about her own experiences.

Something that I haven't seen mentioned yet, is something both my parents enjoyed about bottle-feeding us kids. Dad really enjoyed giving us our bottles. He liked being so closely involved, being very hands-on from the moment we were born and being able to give mum a break. Mind you, while lovely, it's NOT a reason not to breastfeed, just a nice side-effect.

Overall, I'm squarely in my mum's camp. Do what you can to healthily nourish your baby, sod the mummy-wars and don't lose sight of the long-term goal: a healthy child.

[Chewing Gum]

3 hours ago, KnittingOwl said:

::HUGS::

I had a similar struggle. I just never produced enough milk for my daughter. She was crying constantly because she was so hungry, and I was crying because I was on this insane "feed baby as long as she wants then pump 10 minutes" schedule from the lactation consultants. At 6 weeks, she was still losing weight. Her pediatrician was finally the one who sat with me and gave me to permission to let it go and stop beating myself up. Talking with my endocrinologist, about 20% of women with hypothyroidism have inadequate milk supplies. And yet the lactation consultants wouldn't even entertain the idea. I'm still kind of bitter. 

I'm liking your post as a sign of support, I'm another mom that never produced enough. Or I just say, not a single drop. While I had PLENTY during pregnancy, it dried up around 36 weeks just to never be seen again. I knew nothing was coming out but the "no she's latching on and drinking for 20 min, she must be getting something. Just keep her on the boob!" still leaves me with bitter feelings.  She was starving by day three and I combined boob with fingerfeeding bottels until day 6 and finally stopped trying. That repeated for 8 days with #2 and I even tried to relactate at three weeks. It hurts so bad when you want to BF and just can't. 

[HurricaneBells]

Fuck those three little words annoy me. Breast is best. Well yes gee thanks we never considered that, it feels so condescending and insensitive it drives me mad even now, 3 years later! Master Bells lived to tell the tale and is a strong happy smart 3 yo so.... 

[ladybug15]

i was formula fed. 

For my boys, the entire pregnancy I cared about 1 thing, to be able to breastfeed them (twins). I had a breakdown at 5 wks post partum, as one was not getting enough. And I mostly started to pump almost exclusively. I never made enough so I did combo for 9 months, formula and breastmilk. Now my number 1 advice to new moms is, that its her choice (and her husbands) so whatever she chooses to do its her right and noone else is right but her when it comes to her child (including some doctors/nurses who might guilt you either way)

[Carm_88]

I was formula fed, my mother didn't want t breastfeed. I turned out quite fine. I think it's just silly to say "This is best for ALL babies." That's too general of a statement. 

[cascarones]

Mr. cascarones, bless his heart, is new to the idea of a baby and walked right into this entire debate and got himself shouted at by the ladies of his family. In his head mother's rooms at work are nice and soothing like a spa, not the reality of many places where it is a storage closet, since the only requirement is a private place with a door that locks. We'll have to wait and see how it goes, I've had surgery that shouldn't affect my ability to BF, but might anyway and there's so many other reasons why it doesn't work. In my head it's like the birth experience where the goal is "healthy baby, healthy mama", so "fed is best". 

One of my best friends just hated BF, but would always says she stopped because her milk dried up to inquiring minds, because she didn't want them to think she was less of a mother. She tried to use the Podee bottles (the ones where it's got an extended straw), so she could do other things. I hated them when I watched him, poor baby had such bad gas, I don't know if I was doing it wrong, but I avoided them.

[SamiKatz]

3 hours ago, JillyO said:

So I really wouldn't go around insinuating child abuse if we know absolutely nothing about what happened to complete strangers. Some kids are just active and get into trouble a lot.

My nephew was a crazy active toddler/young child and absolutely fearless.  I can't tell you how many times my sister had to take him to the hospital after some act of baby derring-do.  No broken limbs but he did break his nose once.  I'm really surprsied the CSA was not called in to investigate at some point.

[ThunderRolls]

3 hours ago, JillyO said:

So I really wouldn't go around insinuating child abuse if we know absolutely nothing about what happened to complete strangers. Some kids are just active and get into trouble a lot.

You're right, accidents happen that are innocent on the part of the parents. I will say, when a mother thinks dunking her baby's arm in breast milk is going to heal it, then yes, I'm going to question her judgement. 

[Lurker]

I was formula fed, in the 50's.  Childbirth was not natural.  My mother told me she was wheeled in to the delivery room and anesthetized.   She woke up with a huge episiotomy and a 5 pound baby.   She did not breast feed because formula was considered superior and more hygienic.  She was given injections to dry up her milk.

 

[Glasgowghirl]

On 07/09/2017 at 5:30 PM, cptbailey said:

What are cookies doing in this sewing kit tin?? 

I used to hate that tin as a child, you would open it and be disappointed to find thread instead of biscuits. Now I appreciate it.

[Glasgowghirl]

12 hours ago, Shadoewolf said:

HOWEVER, I would absolutely rake Jessa if she is allowing him to fall asleep with a bottle, be it naps or at night. Bottle rot of the teeth is very real and can have permanent consequences.

My pet hate is people who do that and put sugary juice in bottles. One time while I was working in KFC, I watched a woman put Pepsi in her child's bottle he was about a year old. I had to walk away because I was tempted to say something. 

[karen77]

9 hours ago, Letizia said:

 

Needless to say my parents have looked down their nose at me for shocking parenting decisions like choosing to breastfeed, not starting a two week old on solids,not feeding a 6 month old steak,not filling a newborn's crib with stuffed animals,using carseats and no soft drinks in the bottle. In fact just last

Hey, don't dis the 6 month old and steak thing!! I did that with baby led weaning, and yeah, he mostly just go the juice, but my son went at it with no teeth!! (he was also breastfed, so this wasn't his main source of nutrition). I have a video of it, it's pretty cute actually.

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

1 hour ago, cascarones said:

One of my best friends just hated BF, but would always says she stopped because her milk dried up to inquiring minds, because she didn't want them to think she was less of a mother. She tried to use the Podee bottles (the ones where it's got an extended straw), so she could do other things. I hated them when I watched him, poor baby had such bad gas, I don't know if I was doing it wrong, but I avoided them.

Those bottles with the straw where great when I was out and about chasing a toddler and the baby needed to eat, or they were both screaming at the same time and I knew she would stop if I popped a bottle in her mouth but he needed momma. but other wise I wouldn't use it, I didn't like just setting my baby down all the time with her bottle and not holding her, that was our snuggle time and I loved it. I NEVER EVER used one with #1 I had it but thought it was awful, just another one of those never say never things you do with kid #2 or more.  Mom's gotta do what moms gotta do sometimes.

[Captain Obvious]

9 hours ago, Letizia said:

Just in case everyone isn't thoroughly impressed with my parents' skills let me share  how they finally got me to give up that pre-bedtime bottle: they told me on Christmas morning that Santa stole them.That decision comically backfired on my mother but that is a whole other story. 

Now come on - you don't tease us like that without telling that whole other story!

9 hours ago, Letizia said:

I often joke I should write a parenting book with my mother where I ask her advice on how to handle certain situations and then recommend doing the exact opposite of whatever she says. It would cover basic things like denying a child Doritos isn't child abuse,don't frame Santa for a crime he didn't commit and that Pretty Woman and Dances With Wolves aren't ideal movie choices for a 5 or 6 yr old.....especially if you don't want your child calling Cinderella "Cinder-fucking-rella" or proudly telling her teacher she saw Kevin Costner's bare ass. 

I would totally fucking buy that book. I don't care what anyone says - your mum sounds awesome!

[2manyKidzzz]

My kids are grown. I did breastfeed and it went fine, but I always threw in a bottle a day. I heard that it was good for immunity. Don't know if it is true.

But it just doesn't work sometimes. My second boy was a big baby and infant. Hadtosupplemment with formula more and more and then he just went off. He cried because he was to hungry with just breastmilk.

But I am not an activist!! Keep the sweet baby fed in whatever way works best! 

[cascarones]

17 minutes ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

Those bottles with the straw where great when I was out and about chasing a toddler and the baby needed to eat, or they were both screaming at the same time and I knew she would stop if I popped a bottle in her mouth but he needed momma. but other wise I wouldn't use it, I didn't like just setting my baby down all the time with her bottle and not holding her, that was our snuggle time and I loved it. 

2

Nice! I just looked them back up, part of it was I think they were using them when he was too young to get the proper amount of suction (they say > 3 months, or you need to start it which I didn't know then). The bigger issue was she likely went undiagnosed with PPD and refused to go and see anyone about it, she didn't feel any attachment or interest in her baby, would occasionally cry when I brought him home from being watched. Thankfully it seemed to sort itself out with time as he "started doing fun things" and everyone else was quite obsessed with baby, so he was well loved even if mom couldn't quite be there at first. She's done much better with her set of younger ones and able to BF, I think part of that is having a great partner who himself is a big advocate for mental health care.