No Fathers Day honorarium on the Maxwell blog?!?

[IReallyAmHopewell]

Sorry I didn't see this and started a new thread--can we combine them??

[treemom]

I don't get why he had to give up marathons and flying...I really don't. They never seem to make it sound like financial...

[fundiefan]

I don't get why he had to give up marathons and flying...I really don't. They never seem to make it sound like financial...

God told him to? It took time away from planning for death? It took him out of the house and compromised his control? Because perfect, godly fathers have no interests outside their children and all those who do are evil, bad daddys and their children's purity and mind control could be left unprotected?

Or, maybe there is no way of knowing what the hell goes on in their heads or what their reasoning could possibly be.

If I were to give them the benefit of the doubt, maybe Teri's depression meant he really couldn't leave the kids in her care without support? Depression is so much more than even they acknowledge, as many here know, and if he initially got clipped because of the depression, there may have been very real issues that meant it wasn't a good idea for him to be away from the kids/family for any length of time?

Mostly though, I don't think there is an answer to that question because it really makes very little sense.

[Guest Anonymous]

That's exactly what I thought - that someday Steve will be flying around in heaven as an angel. I swear these people just can't wait until they die. What a crappy way to live your life, only focused on what's going to happen to you after you're dead. They must really think heaven is going to be fantastic if it's worth the frumpers, extreme isolation (sorry Sarah, you ARE isolated, even though you don't think you are), suffering from depression and doing nothing to treat it, and sucking every bit of enjoyment out of everyday living.

These people manage to both bizarrely fascinate me and infuriate me, yet I can't look away. At least I'm in good company with that here.

I'm just mean enough to hope that Steve's ultimate destination will be substantially south of heaven. :banana-rock:

[zcccrv]

I don't get why he had to give up marathons and flying...I really don't. They never seem to make it sound like financial...

I think the Maxwells are wrong 9/10 times but I do admire that they truly attempt to live like Jesus did according to the Bible: erratic and somewhat contradictory in theory but calm and consistent in practice. I think that the giving up pleasure part of the equasion is sometimes plain old necessary on Steve&Teri's part so that they have amunition for emotional blackmail aimed at the kids. How in the world could they rebel when their parents are sacrificing so much for the wellbeing of the family? They are certainly fascinating and I would love to figure them out more.

[treemom]

I think the Maxwells are wrong 9/10 times but I do admire that they truly attempt to live like Jesus did according to the Bible: erratic and somewhat contradictory in theory but calm and consistent in practice. I think that the giving up pleasure part of the equasion is sometimes plain old necessary on Steve&Teri's part so that they have amunition for emotional blackmail aimed at the kids. How in the world could they rebel when their parents are sacrificing so much for the wellbeing of the family? They are certainly fascinating and I would love to figure them out more.

I don't think they actually live like him at all.

[VodouDoll]

He had to give up flying and running because they're FUN. The only things you're supposed to enjoy in life are praying and working. Anything else is sin because it's wasting time that the Lord wants you to spend praying and working. Fun is sin. That's why none of them are allowed to do anything they enjoy, from Steve quitting flying to Steve making Jesse quit the instrument he loved playing but let him keep on with the instrument he didn't really care about one way or the other. If something is pleasurable, fun, enjoyable, diverting, whatever, then it is by definition a deviant activity.

[Koala]

I don't think they actually live like him at all.

Me either. :? How does emotional blackmailing your kids = "living like the lord" 9/10 of the time

You have to be a shitty person to do that to your kids....

[fundiefan]

All those concepts/reasons make complete sense when viewed with Maxwell glasses.

It must be painfully stressful to have so many rules for life. I would think if Jesus had needed people to live that way, he would have said so.

And, like Treemom said, he would have lived that way himself. They are not living 'like' Christ or for him...but they (or, daddy M is and forcing his family to follow his lead) do so in Jesus's name. That gives Jesus a really bad name and they can't be surprised if others don't want their Jesus.

Especially since everyone can go to their bible and see what Jesus said for themselves - but there are sadly those who don't/won't.

I have a question. I didn't read where the son had to give up his instrument because he enjoyed it. I came late to the Maxwell's (although not late enough). Wouldn't something one enjoys and is good at be a...calling? Maybe god was calling that son to music and that instrument. That would mean daddy Steve interfered with god's calling and knows better than god. How else does one get a calling? How else does god tell/show someone what they should do, if not by giving them a love and talent for it?

Edited because I always have to edit stupid mistakes.

[VodouDoll]

No. The instrument was fun for the kid. More fun than working. More fun than praying. Ergo, the instrument was an idol and had to go.

The Maxwells make me wish I'd taken more than just intro psych. If ever there were a blogger to armchair analyze....

[zcccrv]

I think they do try to live like Jesus did, trying to incorporate modern world into Biblical worldview which is IMO imposible to do but I'm not religious so what do I know. I certainly see that they try to make it work. They make it such a priority over everything else that issues like emotional blackmail (necesary to hold the puzzle pieces together) are just not considered important and probably therefor not considered wrong. Those are tools. Unfortunately the "means to an end" approach to raising children leaves zero space for variation in individual "ends". I can't understand how it doesn't bug them that they've defined eight new lives so precisely according to their old system, made carbon copies of their kids. That is such a tremendous burden for them probably. I mean, if they start to doubt themselves in a certain area, which we all do sometimes, they don't just have Steve&Teri to reevaluate but also have to take 8 extra belief systems into account. Talk about NO confidance in people and in human nature.

[thoughtful]

The very thought of the Maxwells saddens me.

The first of the pictures he took, of the soldier waiting for mail, was very moving.

The pic of Uriah was weirdly random, although I'm always happy to see him.

About the rest of the post -- sadness again. Of course she loves her Dad, and I'm sure he gave up some activities to spend more time being a Dad.

Hey, so did mine, but without the weird baggage that comes with being a Maxwell. And he encouraged hobbies, humor, independence and education for this girl. That's a big part of what made him a good father!

Not having hobbies or drinking a beverage because they can become "idols?" Keeping daughters so "sheltered" that they are stunted? Obsessing over death and reward in Heaven, at the expense of life here? Selling and selling and selling something that people can have for free? Ick.

Again, when I hear how these people twist themselves around to make their actions and philosophy seem to make sense, I can only picture the mental version of this:

[mausi]

I do not understand; what was/is the big deal for them with T. Maxwell and Pepsi and addiction? Sorry, am relatively new to this family.

[zcccrv]

I do not understand; what was/is the big deal for them with T. Maxwell and Pepsi and addiction? Sorry, am relatively new to this family.

Teri is most probably missing joy and pleasure in her life so when she found something soothing and pleasurable (Pepsi) she became addicted consuming it, I believe, twice daily. Then she gave it up all together, much like Jesse gave up his beloved instrument (I'm not talking about his dong you perverts).

[gardenvarietycitizen]

What instrument did Jesse have to give up? When was it?

...yeah I might be a tad obsessed. But hey, this thread has 43 posts in it so it ain't only me!!! :lol:

Papa Maxwell used to work outside the home, in an office, and his sons (the two older ones) played Little League. Sarah wore pants. At some point, he got "convicted" (heck, reading their blog I think I'd rather be convicted of an actual crime and do prison labor!!) and had the vasectomy reversal, quit his job to work at home, etc. Apparently at this time, he started really asking himself the Ray Comfort question - do you know where you will go when you die?

Which makes me wonder just what happened around then. Yeah, it's some other guy's private life but it's on the internet so I can't help but wonder. As I posted on the other board, I have a sense that the obsession with death was actually first, and this is the form it then morphed into. So I just wonder, what event happened to make the change? Did he run into someone else with a tract? Experience a death in his inner circle? Or?

[marmalade]

Thinking of Steve Maxwell (and the indoctrinated adult children) always brings this guy to mind:

[MamaJunebug]

I find the claim that Steve is such an humble, self-sacrificing man

to be inconsistent with

the claim that Teri won't remind him about a chore because that would be disrespectful on her part.

[emmiedahl]

She doesn't have to remind him, MamaJuneBug. God does it for her, remember? Only God can know for sure whether you are meant to have pizza for dinner.

I find the Maxwell's more pleasant to read about than other fundies. I hate the bad mommy blogs. They make me so sad. I'll take soul-crushing, joyless existence any day over beating your sick infant. Not that it is inherently better, just that I find it less upsetting.

[treemom]

The maxwells seem to fear death more than I do. Because i dont fear death. I do what i can as many days as i can...because this is the only life i have. I wont have regret in heaven...that is what steve fears i suspect. This is what an obsession with an afterlife does to you.

[treemom]

I think they do try to live like Jesus did, trying to incorporate modern world into Biblical worldview which is IMO imposible to do but I'm not religious so what do I know. I certainly see that they try to make it work. They make it such a priority over everything else that issues like emotional blackmail (necesary to hold the puzzle pieces together) are just not considered important and probably therefor not considered wrong. Those are tools. Unfortunately the "means to an end" approach to raising children leaves zero space for variation in individual "ends". I can't understand how it doesn't bug them that they've defined eight new lives so precisely according to their old system, made carbon copies of their kids. That is such a tremendous burden for them probably. I mean, if they start to doubt themselves in a certain area, which we all do sometimes, they don't just have Steve&Teri to reevaluate but also have to take 8 extra belief systems into account. Talk about NO confidance in people and in human nature.

They might try, but they are wholly unsuccessful. See also: don't follow news or world events. Jesus wouldn't do that.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

Thinking of Steve Maxwell (and the indoctrinated adult children) always brings this guy to mind:

(guy with head firmly up the nether regions)

Ha! That's one of the OTHER few "conveniently already saved as 100x100 pixel avatar-quality images" I had on my computer when I registered :)

Can't deny it's more than kinda relevant...

[Koala]

She doesn't have to remind him, MamaJuneBug. God does it for her, remember? Only God can know for sure whether you are meant to have pizza for dinner.

I wonder if that reminder comes in the form of a heavenly post it note, or if God calls Steve directly. :lol:

[MamaJunebug]

Oh, what a horrible choice: Maxwells' blog or bad-mommy blogs.

At least with the b-m blogs (yeah, I know what I did there ;) ) one can hope that the children get away and get lives of their own. Steve and Teri seem to have that option pret-ty well eliminated.

I think they must be two of the strongest-willed individuals in the world, to stick to this thin excuse for a life for so many years, and with so many children. John was rebellious (or maybe just spirited) and they erased that, somehow.

Their lives sound so incredibly monotonous to me. They drag the children to sales events conferences and the children must see that other people don't dress alike, do have temper tantrums, do say 'no' on occasion to their parents.

They take the kids to Olive Garden where very likely the waitress was wearing trousers, as may have been other customers who the kids couldn't help but notice. They have to have seen that at least some of "the others" seem to laugh genuinely with each other and enjoy wine without becoming drunken.

They've seen nursing home attendants in pants and scrubs, some obese and some with wild haircuts who still are pleasant, happy, cheerful individuals and unafraid of life or death.

And yet the married boys, 30-year-old Sarah and the reversal babies who are now young adults apparently have never gotten close to a contrary thought.

Like Mary at 8 or 10 years old in the orthodontist's chair, what they want is "Whatever Mother wants for me."

I knew a woman who had a hold like that on her sons. The elder one finally married after his mother died (may she RIP) after having broken two engagements to women that his mother deemed unsuitable.

In fact, Elder Son would have gotten married to his fiancee (they'd been engaged several years) before the mother died, but his brother told him viciously (Younger Son told me this himself) that were Elder Son to take any kind of honeymoon, this is what would happen:

Younger Son would spend 24/7 at their mother's hospital bedside, filling in for his brother. Thus he would entirely ignore the family business and, the resutling chaos would be the entire responsibility of Elder Son upon his return from the honeymoon.

Thus the mother died with both her sons unmarried and still living under the family roof. Again, may she RIP, but until I read about the Maxwells, I had not found anybody else with the strength of will that the departed lady had.

I think the combined force of the Maxwell parents' personalities must be overwhelming to the extent that the children literally don't think about alternatives.

Point B: Do they live like Jesus? He said He had no place to lay his head - he didn't even have a foxhole to call his own. So from a practical point of view, no, they do not. From a devotional point of view - that is, my grateful devotion to the fact that God became human and endured the most paintful death ever in history - I maintain that they most certainly do not live like Jesus.

But that's just me.

ETA: The rant is ended; go in peace. (I'm embarrassed - didn't know I could get so exercised this early in the day!)

[zcccrv]

I don't think they try to live literally like Jesus did in the Bible but they probably do try to implement it to the real, modern world.

They are not "modest" but then wear tons of makeup and hair product like some we snark on. Or wear frilly "modest" dresses or develop a foot fetish. They also don't romantically stay on their lovely farm to grow colorful vegetables but spend half their time in a crowded bus for purpose of spreading the Lord's word. "Fellow shipping" in retirement homes is a regular thing. To my atheist eye they really do try.

Their missing out on current news is not what Jesus would do, that's true. They probably figured they can't risk contact with unpredictable sources (The Beast!) so better to eliminate it. Hey Steve, I have a suggestion for you. Why don't you start having more confidence in yourself so that you and the boys can publish some kind of daily internet news for the TV and newspaper depraved. It would probably have a better following than ITonRamp but would require a strong spirited man who would have to handle the dangerous input and sort it out. Considering you don't trust yourself with a computer password I guess that's out of the question.

As far as their family relationships go, I'm guessing that the kids had to put so much effort and focus into following in their parent's exact footsteps and being worthy of both them and the Lord that they are left with no capacity to genuinely care for each other. I would think they are cold towards their siblings and maybe even feel guilty about it.

It's all just speculation on my part.

[MamaJunebug]

zcccrv, I hadn't realized you are an atheist. Makes your comments even more interesting. :) At this point (remember, I didn't sleep hardly at all in the last 24 hours) I would take issue with one thing you write: That they travel "to spread the Lord's word." There is that part of their excursions, but I think that before The Word comes traveling to sell their version of patriocentricity, that is, "Dad has the only calling in the family, and the role of Mom and the children is to support that calling."

Like you, my friend-in-discussion, I'm just speculatin', of course. :)