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Captain Bret Alan Smith Pt. 3: Fundie Cat Fights, Ahoy


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What I'm wondering is what relations are like between Captain Brett and Michael Morton senior?  With the Mortons very much supporting Katie and her kids, I'd love to see Michael Morton's reaction if Captain Brett took him to task for the S'Morton daughters not honouring the Captain...

(For anyone who has been following them for a while, do you know how the parents met? Since I found out about them, I've always wondered why the Mortons went along with Smith ideas, re the weddings etc.  Captain Brett is so much about self-publicity, with his "pop videos" and his "Christian film show", and the way he puts himself out there, while the Mortons seem much less publicity-hungry.  I know they share the same views about not educating their daughters, quiverfull brood-mare culture, purity culture etc, but it seems strange that the disconnects are so dramatic)

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I remember an entry from way back on the Morton blog in which Adeline posted about the Morton daughters and their father first meeting the Sanders girls and their father at a Vision Forum father-daughter tea.  

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3 hours ago, dramallama said:

I remember an entry from way back on the Morton blog in which Adeline posted about the Morton daughters and their father first meeting the Sanders girls and their father at a Vision Forum father-daughter tea.  

I remember that too - when they met the Sanders.

I have no idea how or when the Mortons & Smiths hooked up. Or why. Even before the bottom dropped out of their mutual love fest I wondered what the hell the Smiths had to offer the Mortons and what led to their joining forces so strongly.

I was reading back from the beginning of the Morton blog not too long ago. It was really disjointed and didn't follow much of a format or timeline.

I also remember reading the 'love note' comments between Alan & Katie and thinking they sounded like jr. high kids, not only in their words, but the using of the public blog to express them, and the words themselves. They were very immature and their parents still married them off to each other.

I know we cut the Mortons lots of slack lately given their obvious support of their daughter in a horrendous situation. But, they are still dangerous fundies who intentionally married off their uneducated daughter to an uneducated man, and are proud that she couldn't even decide to marry or not since she'd never made a decision before. They still promote hatred of gays and other religions. They still believe in marrying off their young children to other young children to make the babies for jesus.

I'm all for them supporting their daughter, but can't help be pissed that they put her in that position in the first place. Of course, no one knew what Alan would later do, but they did put her in the position of marrying an uneducated boy with no life experience, living in the trailer on his parent's property, no job - he quit that truck driving job as quickly as he started it, all surrounding the courtship & marriage,- no way to support his wife or the multitude of babies he was expected to make - and did. He had a huge ego because he was taught to. His bride washed his fucking feet at their wedding because they were both raised in an environment where that was entirely acceptable and so sweet there wasn't a dry eye in the house.

Ahem. Sorry. I went into a giant rant there. I was thinking of Katie this morning after I saw a picture on someone's IG and I guess I just dumped all my thoughts on all of you.

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33 minutes ago, fundiefan said:

I know we cut the Mortons lots of slack lately given their obvious support of their daughter in a horrendous situation. But, they are still dangerous fundies who intentionally married off their uneducated daughter to an uneducated man, and are proud that she couldn't even decide to marry or not since she'd never made a decision before. They still promote hatred of gays and other religions. They still believe in marrying off their young children to other young children to make the babies for jesus.

I'm all for them supporting their daughter, but can't help be pissed that they put her in that position in the first place. Of course, no one knew what Alan would later do, but they did put her in the position of marrying an uneducated boy with no life experience, living in the trailer on his parent's property, no job - he quit that truck driving job as quickly as he started it, all surrounding the courtship & marriage,- no way to support his wife or the multitude of babies he was expected to make - and did. He had a huge ego because he was taught to. His bride washed his fucking feet at their wedding because they were both raised in an environment where that was entirely acceptable and so sweet there wasn't a dry eye in the house.

Oh, I'm with you, all the way.  It's a horrific reason that Katie's a single parent right now, and of course they couldn't have anticipated that - BUT he could have had a car accident, or illness, or lost his job - so many ways she could be the destitute mother of seven, with no way to support them, having no choice but to submit to her husband and have baby after baby, or face a life alone.  When we think about the incidence just of cancer, it's not an unlikely scenario.  

I guess we'll see if they've learned anything about the Courtship to someone the kids don't really know/early marriage without prospects etc, as the next Morton boys hit 18.   I really, really hope this makes them reconsider their approach - especially about trusting people just because they proclaim godliness, and ideally about the patriarchal approach (but I don't hold out much hope)

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Interesting defunct attempt at a blog from 2008 - with some of the Smortons in Paraguay.

Obviously, they've been planning to expat their way to Paraguay for many years.

http://elchacotrip.blogspot.com/

And, Alan's old blog seems to have been opened up all the way back to 2005. I remember reading it earlier in the year and it was only a smattering of entries.

Anyone who gets all discombobulated reading the dreamy way Addie writes - the way all the Smorton girls write, actually - will love the way Alan writes. He very clearly learned words at the SOTDRT but he didn't learn basic communication. He is above and beyond in his attempts to sound clever and/or smart. He just comes off as a Jr. High kid. Again. 

http://malachi4-6.blogspot.com/

An example. 

Alan Smith said...

Aww, you're very sweet, Hon, I love you too! :) Thankfully though, Love, your visage indubitably bears the preponderance of the beauty congenital to this twain ;) -- for which force majeure, among myriad others, am I to our dear Lord ever eternally indebted...

24/12/05 03:00

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1 hour ago, fundiefan said:

Aww, you're very sweet, Hon, I love you too! :) Thankfully though, Love, your visage indubitably bears the preponderance of the beauty congenital to this twain ;) -- for which force majeure, among myriad others, am I to our dear Lord ever eternally indebted...

WTF? I just threw up a little in my mouth. Also, his use of force majeure makes no sense in this context.

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3 hours ago, fundiefan said:

Interesting defunct attempt at a blog from 2008 - with some of the Smortons in Paraguay.

Obviously, they've been planning to expat their way to Paraguay for many years.

http://elchacotrip.blogspot.com/

 

I think some of us were puzzling over that blog shortly after the Mortons moved last year-- it's super vague and hard to tell who's writing, but it's part of the Smith blog account. I wonder why it was never mentioned on either of the families' main blogs, if they both had sons on a big overseas trip.

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@fundiefan I'm reading that extract over and over, and I can't make head or tail of it.  My charitable side says maybe it's an in-joke, because my siblings and I used to do over-the-top pretentious communication all the time...  but that theory explodes in the context of the whole damn blog.....

ETA The blog is written by both Katie and Alan, isn't it?  Mostly Katie?

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11 hours ago, fundiefan said:

Alan Smith said...

Aww, you're very sweet, Hon, I love you too! :) Thankfully though, Love, your visage indubitably bears the preponderance of the beauty congenital to this twain ;) -- for which force majeure, among myriad others, am I to our dear Lord ever eternally indebted...

24/12/05 03:00

Preposterous, pretentious, priggish prat.  Wonder if Katie knew what the hell he was saying unless she had a dictionary nearby.

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4 hours ago, Lurky said:

@fundiefan I'm reading that extract over and over, and I can't make head or tail of it.  My charitable side says maybe it's an in-joke, because my siblings and I used to do over-the-top pretentious communication all the time...  but that theory explodes in the context of the whole damn blog.....

ETA The blog is written by both Katie and Alan, isn't it?  Mostly Katie?

Alan appears to have started it then when they got married Katie took it over. And since she was always knocked up or getting that way and they were living a vagabond life with no home of their own, she didn't really have time for it, understandably.

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Bret smiths latest facebook post :

REPENTANCE 

A few weeks ago, Beall Phillips posted information about the dismissal of litigation against Doug Phillips.  I had shared the post, but it somehow was removed, probably from Mrs. Phillips’ tweaking her permissions regarding who can do what with the post.  During the time it was on my Facebook timeline, some very unbiblical and uncharitable comments were attached to it.  Malice and slander against a brother 3 years after he has publicly confessed and repented of a sin indicates some serious problems that need to be addressed.  I certainly cannot address them all, but for my friends who are truly seeking to understand, participate in, and help spread the wondrous gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ, I have some Scriptures regarding Repentance that may bring some encouragement.

Repentance is turning away from sin and turning toward God.  When Jesus began his public ministry, his message was a call to repentance.

Mark 1:14-15
After John was put in prison, Jesus went into Galilee, proclaiming the good news of God. 15 "The time has come," he said. "The kingdom of God is near. Repent and believe the good news!"  (NIV)

The good news, or the gospel, that he proclaims is that the kingdom of God is available to all those who repent and believe.  In addition to the generic message he gives us to repent, we see him giving specific guidance to individuals regarding repentance.  In John chapter 5, he heals a crippled man who was lying at the pool of Bethesda.

John 5:14-15
Later Jesus found him at the temple and said to him, "See, you are well again. Stop sinning or something worse may happen to you."  (NIV)

Jesus makes it clear that repentance means to stop sinning.  In John chapter 8, the Pharisees brought a woman who had been caught in the act of sexual sin.  There is historical evidence that she was probably a repeat offender.  Her accusers want Jesus' approval to stone her to death.  But Jesus looks at the accusers and says,

John 8:7
"If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her."  (NIV)

After considering this, the accusers wisely abandoned their mission of condemnation.

John 8:10-11
 Jesus straightened up and asked her, "Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?"

11 "No one, sir," she said.

"Then neither do I condemn you," Jesus declared. "Go now and leave your life of sin."
NIV

Once again Jesus makes it clear that repentance means to turn away from your sin.  He does not ask her for some kind of three-step public show of remorse, or even to say “I’m sorry” to anyone.  He simply tells her to repent – to leave her life of sin.  

It is also important to note that Jesus does not stand with the accusers, but with the accused.  Revelation chapter 12 tells us who is the father of accusers.

Revelation 12:10
For the accuser of our brothers, who accuses them before our God day and night, has been hurled down.
NIV

In stark contrast to the accuser, Jesus defends those who confess and repent.

1 John 2:1
My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have one who speaks to the Father in our defense — Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. NIV

In Isaiah's wonderful prophecy about Jesus, he says:

Isaiah 53:12
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.
NIV

It did not matter to Jesus that this woman did not repent until her sin was exposed, until she was “caught.”  Our loving Father will bring about whatever circumstances are necessary to bring us to repentance.

2 Corinthians 7:10
Godly sorrow brings repentance that leads to salvation and leaves no regret, but worldly sorrow brings death.  (NIV)

Repentance is not a demonstration of sorrow or remorse; remorse MAY lead someone to repent, or he may choose to self destruct, like Judas Iscariot when he felt remorse over his betrayal of Jesus.  When John the Baptist told the Pharisees to “produce fruit in keeping with repentance,” he was not telling them to display some sign of remorse.  He was telling them to demonstrate that they had STOPPED SINNING.  Although Jesus talked about doing some hard things as a disciple, he never made it hard to repent.  The only people he repeatedly condemned were the self righteous who condemned others and made up their own rules about what repentance looks like, making it hard for people to turn to God.

Matthew 15:8-9
"'These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me.
9 They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.'" (NIV)

Luke 11:52
"Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering." (NIV)

Matthew 23:4
They tie up heavy loads and put them on men's shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them. (NIV)

By contrast, Jesus said:

Matthew 11:29-30
Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.  (NIV)

His gentleness in dealing with those who seek his mercy is described in

Matthew 12:20
A bruised reed he will not break, and a smoldering wick he will not snuff out, till he leads justice to victory.   (NIV)

This same gentleness is to be the mark of how we bring restoration to a brother who has sinned, and help him carry his burden of temptation.

Galatians 6:1-2
Brothers, if someone is caught in a sin, you who are spiritual should restore him gently. But watch yourself, or you also may be tempted. 2 Carry each other's burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ.
NIV

The church in Corinth had a brother who was living in open sin.  He was not violating some “rules made by men,” or some disputable matter that someone had to try to build a case against.  He was openly living in adultery with his father's wife.  After the church censured him, he repented – he stopped living with her.  Notice then how Paul deals with this:

2 Corinthians 2:6-11
The punishment inflicted on him by the majority is sufficient for him. 7 Now instead, you ought to forgive and comfort him, so that he will not be overwhelmed by excessive sorrow. 8 I urge you, therefore, to reaffirm your love for him. 9 The reason I wrote you was to see if you would stand the test and be obedient in everything. 10 If you forgive anyone, I also forgive him. And what I have forgiven — if there was anything to forgive — I have forgiven in the sight of Christ for your sake, 11 in order that Satan might not outwit us. For we are not unaware of his schemes.
NIV

It is regrettable that all too many people are totally unaware of the schemes of the Accuser of the Brethren.   Rather than gently seeking to bring restoration and the carrying of one another's burdens, they heap condemnation on those who have stumbled, and tie up heavy loads to put on their shoulders.

It is also a very dangerous thing to ignore the Biblical principles of due process.  

Deuteronomy 19:15-16
One witness is not enough to convict a man accused of any crime or offense he may have committed. A matter must be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.  (NIV)

This commandment is one of the foundations for the biblical principle that the accused is presumed innocent until proven guilty.  God's law places the burden of proof on the accuser, and judges are to carefully examine the integrity of the witnesses.  If it is determined that someone is giving a false witness, then whatever punishment was going to be given to the accused now is given to the accuser.

Deuteronomy 19:15-21
If a malicious witness takes the stand to accuse a man of a crime, 17 the two men involved in the dispute must stand in the presence of the Lord before the priests and the judges who are in office at the time. 18 The judges must make a thorough investigation, and if the witness proves to be a liar, giving false testimony against his brother, 19 then do to him as he intended to do to his brother. You must purge the evil from among you. 20 The rest of the people will hear of this and be afraid, and never again will such an evil thing be done among you. 21 Show no pity: life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.  (NIV)

It is a sobering thing to be an accuser.  For if you do not tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, you bring God's condemnation down upon yourself.  And yet people are so flippant about making – and passing along – accusations about things to which they are not eyewitnesses.  God is so serious about this that he included it in the Ten Commandments.

Exodus 20:16
You shall not give false testimony against your neighbor.  (NIV)

When someone makes a lot of noise about justice, but they deny or even ridicule due process, you can know for certain that there is a hidden agenda, some personal reason for their desire to condemn someone.  WHERE THERE IS NO BIBLICAL DUE PROCESS, THERE IS NO JUSTICE.

What makes the Gospel good news is forgiveness and restoration!  

1 John 1:9-2:2
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives.

2 My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have one who speaks to the Father in our defense — Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. 2 He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.  (NIV)

This was written by the disciple whom Jesus loved.  It is the essence of the Gospel of Jesus Christ!  He is our Defender, our Advocate with the Father. He does not stand with the Accuser, but with the accused.  We ALL have sinned, and must run to Jesus to obtain forgiveness and purification.  The Gospel declares that Jesus will not accuse, but defend those who turn to him.  But if God will not forgive and restore a sinner like Doug Phillips, then there is no hope for me – and whether you acknowledge it or not, there is also no hope for YOU.

The most dangerous thing I can imagine is to refuse to forgive those who ask us for forgiveness; to have no mercy on those who ask for mercy.

Matthew 6:14-15
For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15 But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.   (NIV)

I read this powerful quote recently:

"Sinners speak of their own sin & God’s grace, pronouncing peace. The proud speak of the sins of others & pronounce judgment."

Luke 18:11
The Pharisee stood up and prayed about himself: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men — robbers, evildoers, adulterers — or even like this tax collector.  (NIV)

And yet, it was not the Pharisee who went away justified before God, but the tax collector.  Dear Friend, run away from self righteousness!  Flee from the spirit that condemns your brother!  Never join yourself to those who judge the hearts and motives of others with statements like “I don't believe his repentance is genuine!”  This is the type of spirit that Jesus repeatedly warned us against.

Matthew 7:1-2
"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.  (NIV)

Luke 6:37
"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.  (NIV)

It is only logical that the kind of godly sorrow that leads to repentance will evidence itself in remorse and a desire to bring restitution where possible.  But to stand in judgment against someone and say, “You have not repented because you did not do what I think a repentant person should do,” or to condemn someone who is asking for mercy, is just about the most foolish thing I can imagine!

Matthew 12:36-37
6 But I tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken. 37 For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned."  (NIV)

Can you imagine what it will be like for so many who will stand before God at the judgment, and hear their own words of condemnation being repeated back to them: “You never showed signs of true repentance.”  In the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

Dear Jesus, I pray that my Friends will never put their trust in their own self righteousness, but in your mercy.  

Matthew 5:7
Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy.  (NIV)

 

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What a blowhard! The man is a waste of humanity and I have nothing but contempt for him, his existence and they way he has fucked with the lives of those unfortunate enough to come within his sphere.

I am really glad I don't get my moral foundation from Bret Smith.

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Wow, that's a seriously loaded post.  I do wonder if he'd include quite so many citations if it wasn't for the situation with Alan?

I also wonder if Alan has admitted what he did.  The part of the rant I was able to get through hinged on the fact that if a man has confessed and repented we must welcome him to his new sin free life and not continue to punish him for it.  Not to mention, Brett, it isn't slander if it's something Douggie confessed.  

As for the older blogs.  I read through the Alan/Katie blog.  It appears that Alan and one of his sisters originally wrote it and then Alan and Katie took turns after.  Interesting to read.  He attempted to build his own car even though he couldn't do simpler car repairs?  I have to admit I was impressed with Katie's writing, the Mortons clearly care more about education.  

Cap'n Brett really needs to slither off somewhere and leave the world alone.  I can't even imagine the discussions/arguments he had with his married daughters and Katie after Alan was arrested.  I think the only reason the Mortons were initially associated with them were like minded hateful beliefs.  I continue to be impressed that the Mortons did the right thing and supported their daughter, but fully agree that they are the ones that set her up for it.  We can't forget their VF dominionist patriarchy that hobbled their children, especially their daughters, and left their daughters vulnerable for being in a situation where they are the single mom to 8 kids with no means of support and no concept of self sufficiency.  

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59 minutes ago, cami said:

"Then neither do I condemn you," Jesus declared. "Go now and leave your life of sin."

I've often wondered when I hear this story -- go where?  What were this particular woman's options?  Look at the language Patriarch Smith uses 2000 years later:  "caught in the act of sexual sin," "repeat offender."  Was the other party to the sexual sin also rounded up?  Just one of my favorite passages to muse upon...

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Here's the thing about the adulterous woman - that was a "crime" that was a moral one, and "go and sin no more" and then maybe forgiveness is something that can be given.  (I've seen different interpretations about if adultery meant cheating on her husband, or having sex outside of marriage, as the word can mean both - so at worst it's a "sin" that hurts one person emotionally, and if she wasn't married, it as a completely victimless crime)

But raping someone is absolutely not a victimless crime, by definition - and incest is a fucking awful thing because a person supposed to love and protect the child is hurting them.  I do not for one microsecond believe that had Jesus met a child rapist, he would have said "go and sin no more" in the same way, AT ALL.

Captain Brett can wall of text all he likes, but I prefer Wesley and Rachel Morton's biblical quotes:

Quote

But if anyone causes one of these little ones who trusts in me to lose faith, it would be better for that person to be thrown into the sea with a large millstone tied around the neck.
Matthew 18:6

Because the sentence against an evil deed is not executed speedily, the heart of the children of man is fully set to do evil.
Ecclesiastes 8:11

Whoever says to the guilty, "you are innocent" will be cursed by peoples and denounced by nations.  But it will go well with those who convict the guilty, and rich blessing will come on them.
Proverbs 24:24

Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.
Ephesians 5:11

I've really struggled with how to write this, because I am SO ANGRY at how Brett Smith Snr has combed the bible to cherry-pick verses that basically say "Don't believe something said by only one witness" (trans:  never believe a child who's said they have been abused) and "If someone does something they repent, you HAVE to forgive them" (trans:  child rape is on the same level as not forgiving someone, and saying sorry negates everything) - it is making me so unbeleivably rage-ful, because he's saying to his other kids "I will never believe you if you come to me" and "if something terrible happens to you, but the other person says they're sorry, YOU'RE the sinner, because you want them to be prosecuted". 

So, so vile, and my heart is with his poor kids, having grown up in this environment, and having this pressure now.  And of course, the poor victim(s), having this self-righteous, awful excuse for a relative. 

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I can negate literally all of his ranting with yet another quote "Render unto Ceasar what is Ceasar's". I don't know all of the details of the DPIAT case (I don't know if he faced actual charges or not) but I know that Alan has some rendering unto Ceasar to do. If Brett wants to forgive anyone, that's his business. God does not command us to just forget about it when someone says sorry.

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Seems like Brett is really freaking out, between this epic rant and the "Honor your parents" video. He's loosing ground. Loosing his daughters' respect and loosing some of his friends it seems. 

But I don't get his point. Is he saying that Doug Phillips'/Alan's accusers were lying (all the false testimony/slander stuff), or is he saying they're guilty and we should forgive them? It's like it doesn't even matter to him. Whether his son raped a child or not, it's all the same to God as long as he repents. Tattle talers, however, will be harshly punished. 

If that's who God is I'd rather go to hell. 

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45 minutes ago, usedbicycle said:

 

If that's who God is I'd rather go to hell. 

I've been saying that for years. The fundie god is not one I want anything to do with. Nor their heaven.

And I really don't fucking want to be in the same eternal place as Bret Smith. Fortunately, I believe we are worm food and we are at least 1,000 miles apart, so his worms won't even be mingling with mine.

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50 minutes ago, usedbicycle said:

But I don't get his point. Is he saying that Doug Phillips'/Alan's accusers were lying (all the false testimony/slander stuff), or is he saying they're guilty and we should forgive them?

He's saying both - or rather he's throwing verses down about both, which is huge hypocrisy.  Unless he's just a really bad writer, and saying 1 case is one and the other is the other?  It's hard to tell, truthfully.

 

51 minutes ago, usedbicycle said:

It's like it doesn't even matter to him. Whether his son raped a child or not, it's all the same to God as long as he repents.

Genuinely, I couldn't forgive this one if it happened in my family.  I might understand that someone had been warped by experimental lifestyles, and behaved abominably because they were twisted in the head by their upbringing, but I wouldn't forgive them - and I definitely wouldn't forgive the parent who was responsible for the whole shitshow.

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Crimes are the domain of our secular justice system, Cap'n Bret. Your fool ass knows this. You just want to create a theocracy.

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