Michelle and Priscilla it's all about prayer - MERGED

[Coco]

Yeah - that is odd. It would have been a great m/d bonding moment. Or if it's David's project, why isn't Cilla doing it with her own mom?

One of my 13YO daughter's best friend's gave me the greatest compliment a few weeks ago. She said my daughter tells me everything -to the point that her friends are surprised how much she tells me. I am not naive, this is my 4th child, I know she doesn't tell me everything. But I know she is pretty open about her life without us "purposing to pray about guarding her heart". My girl is also more religious than I am - she goes to church and youth group and on retreats. She has me fasten her cross around her neck every morning. She is a genuinely good person with a generous, loving and forgiving heart. She's been raised to be tolerant and kind, which when combined with her ability to confidently confide in her mother and her spirituality, makes her a really neat person to be around. I don't have to go by a list of questions and purpose to pray and guard her heart, etc. to nurture this bond. It happens because I care about my child and her life and her choices in her life, and I let her be herself within the confines of our well established family values. It isn't a project, it's just about being real with your kids and not making everything so damned complicated where really the only "purpose" is to craft a talking head.

Think about it - could you stand outside of your house and talk about your own parenting with a combination of Biblespeak and deliberateness? I think most parents would have a TH that would go something like this: "I try to be the best person I can be, and model that for my kids. Yeah, I mess up sometimes but I admit that to them and we move forward because we are human. I try to not be a tyrant or a judgmental bitch so my kids can come to me when they are in trouble and I can help them find a workable solution. When they are out at night I pray hard they don't wreck the car or get into alcohol or drugs or get someone pregnant/get pregnant, but I understand that this is part of growing up and learning. They understand the consequences of such things and know they have a lot to live for and don't want to mess that up. They've dreamed their own dreams of what they want to do when they are adults and I just explain those things can be cut short by poor choices as teenagers and we discuss that a lot. Because they are exposed to a lot of different experiences they can see choices that others are making and we discuss the impact of that choice on their acquaintance - good and bad. They know they can come to me at any time - including knocking on a closed master bedroom door - and I am here for them. And I may yell and scream and carry on but I can't help it - that's how I am feeling at the time and it will blow over and we'll get through it together. I respect that they are other individual human being separate from me and work hard to help them develop their unique and wonderful individual selves. I understand that God gave them to me to raise up and send on their way - that they are not my possessions to rule over."

And my talking head would ramble on and on more because I honestly DON'T know what I am doing, I just try to do my very best every day. I don't have lists of what to ask my kids. I don't have to "make time" to pray with them. I don't have to pray away their attraction to another person - I just say, "I think they are a bad influence, and this is why" and we discuss it. I don't think I am some phenomenal parent - I think I am normal. I call bull shit on organized parenting. There's no way to have lists and every day talks, etc with a real normal teenager. Parenting a teen is like participating in a ping pong game that never ends. There is no way that Mrs. Duggar has prayed away PMS, hormone swings, etc. for her girls. Although I guess she's managed to take away other teen girl pressures like making grades, making the team or hoping the boy asks her to Homecoming, which she would put in the "win" column.

UGH. I am fired up about this bull shit video. I take it this will be played for a group of moms and daughters, who are then going to take this as "expert gospel" and try to work it into their lives when it is unrealistic as hell. Which then makes those girls and women who are already going through the land mine that is teen parenting feel even more incompetent because they "only have 1 (or 2 or 3)" girls and they can't achieve what the Queen Mother has accomplished with her brood of 95.

That's beautiful. i'm going to print this out for when my almost-5 year old gets to her teens. :worship:

[Divemaster01]

Very interesting combo those two. On a related note, I had been on the waiting list for a long time on Swap-a-DVD for the "Tea With Michelle Duggar" DVD. I am off the list, it is coming my way now. Should be a great snark! :dance: :popcorn2:

[DGayle]

Really cannot stand the way Michelle talks.

A few years ago I had to do a speech on Jackie Onassis for a speech class in college. During the research, I was surprised to learn she also spoke in a breathy, childish way on purpose.

Is it really such great advice from Michelle when she says to talk to your daughters every day? I wonder how that works out in her house.

"Hey, Girls, get those younger kids out of here. Mama's got a headache!" That's talking. It's not conversing, but she'd be speaking words at them. Talking.

And what kind of household has she had if "talk to the people who live in it" has to be a said rule instead of a given? If there are so many kids that you have to make a point of speaking a sentence or two to each one a day, it means you have too many kids. Stop hoping for another.

[WonderingInWA]

Used to wonder why news anchors regularly turn their heads to look at each other - now I know. To have two faces just chattering on and on and on while they look at you steadily is unnerving.

I love that PT chooses to tape outside without any anti-wind mufflers. Makes everything sound *so* bad, surely that and the staring lecturers will turn *some* people off!

Yep, at first I thought that PT might not have been there because Prissy seemed not quite as scripted and looking for approval as she normally is, but the filming has the same amateur audio of all of PT's other videos. How do they always seem to find such windy places?

[DGayle]

I took this as proof that these daughters have almost zero say in who they end up with. I mean Priscilla says I had to gaurd my heart against someone I knew wasn't an option.

I don't believe for a minute that any of these girls get a say. Daddy has to approve just to court, and if Daddy gives permission to ask you to get married, and you've been raised to please Daddy, you better say yes.

[DGayle]

There's something about Prissy that's alarming. She really seems like she's a few cards short of having even one suit in a deck. I think Forest Gump has more independent thoughts than she does. I'm not sure if she can do much more than parrot what other people says with that brainwashed smile on her face. The way she moves her eyebrows and draws out words while trying to say something looks like someone trying to remember a speech she was taught instead of speaking naturally.

[ILoveJellybeans]

Why is Michelle doing it with Priscilla? Oh, right, cause her daughters couldn't honestly say anything nice about her. Priscilla sees her quite rarely, so doesn't know how much of a neglectful bitch Michelle is.

Go on Michelle, I dare you, ask Jessa to do it next time :D And no cheating, you cant threaten her with calling off the engagement while reading her Sarah's entries on the Maxwell blog, or bribe her with half an hour of non chaperoned time in Ben's cell.

I think the fact that she is talking to her son's sister in law about mother daughter relationships when she has nine daughters of her own, eight of which live at home, says a lot about how loved Michelle is. That and the video of the Jkids talking about what they like about Michelle.

[Jana814]

I have to agree with you!! The father's decide, they want to make sure they are Godly men.

[ViolaSebastian]

There's something about Prissy that's alarming. She really seems like she's a few cards short of having even one suit in a deck. I think Forest Gump has more independent thoughts than she does. I'm not sure if she can do much more than parrot what other people says with that brainwashed smile on her face. The way she moves her eyebrows and draws out words while trying to say something looks like someone trying to remember a speech she was taught instead of speaking naturally.

That and I've noticed she always scrunches up her forehead and looks at whomever is speaking (usually about less than intellectual topics) like they're trying to make her understand astrophysics.

[OneFifthQuiverFull]

That's beautiful. i'm going to print this out for when my almost-5 year old gets to her teens. :worship:

Thank you ... but I think it is normal for half-way decent parents to be that way.

It's a natural formula that you've probably already started. You begin by teaching natural consequences - i.e., your 5YO doesn't wear a sweater when you told her to, and she's cold, and you point out that she INSISTED on not wearing her sweater, and thus, she's cold.

Meanwhile you start to see her attributes - she loves dance. She's a great salesperson. She's an excellent student. She loves soccer. She has great attention to detail.

She wants to be a professional ballerina. You encourage that (a little) by taking her to dance. You realize she won't be a professional ballerina (most likely) but you don't take that away from her. You are teaching her to start investing in her own future.

She gets older and realizes she's great a math and thinks she wants to be a math teacher. She's a high school cheerleader who wants to cheer in college. She is Facebook friends with an upper classman who made her college squad. Her friend's brother's cousin was in a car accident last summer and is finally walking again, but that's after a year of home bound studies and tons of occupational therapy.

You talk to her about these things. You talk to her about what her FB friend did right to achieve the dream that your daughter shares with her. You discuss how terribly sad it is that the friend's cousin who was in a wreck lost a year of high school because someone was driving recklessly and explain that's why you worry. By then you've helped her "buy in" to her future. She is careful when she is out with her boyfriend because she realizes that a pregnancy could derail her dreams. She doesn't abstain because her Mommy told her to or her Mommy "purposed to pray about guarding her heart" but abstains because the dreams she has for herself don't include a teen pregnancy - though she knows if that happens, you will help her. She just doesn't want it for herself.

And then when she achieves her dreams - or doesn't. Or discovers another path that makes her even happier,.... and wherever her life leads her it is HERS. SHE gets to own it. SHE gets to celebrate it. SHE gets to be proud of it. It won't be because her mother bullied or coerced or beat into her HOW THINGS SHOULD BE, it will be because it is what she wanted for herself and she achieved it. And if she takes a long hard road or gets sideswiped or sidetracked by life, she'll learn resiliency and tenacity along the way.

I grew up in a non-fundie Duggar mentality. I didn't have sex because I was scared shitless to. I was told in no uncertain terms that if I came home pregnant it would be to gather my stuff and GTFO. So I did everything BUT *the deed* because why not? It was drummed into my head that PREGNANCY WAS BAD, SEX WAS BAD and I knew the only way I'd be "caught" is to get pregnant. So it wasn't myself and my feelings and my desires I was thinking about when abstaining, it was my parents and how much trouble I would get into if I came home knocked up. I wanted to be a writer but was told that was a dumb choice, so I went to college and floundered because I hadn't "bought in" to my future. I didn't have goals anymore - the goal was to get into college because my parents told me that I WAS.GOING.TO.COLLEGE and I got there and didn't know what I wanted to do or if I even wanted to be there! So I nearly flunked out - and quit. What *I* wanted to do never really got discussed when I was a teen - I was TOLD I would get good grades, go to college, not get knocked-up, and there was really no other way.

I know I am rambling but I truly believe that at about age 14/15 you stop being The Ruler and start becoming The Coach. You help put your teen into positions which will help themselves - and "the team" (be it the immediate family, their future family, their future selves, your future family, whatever) win. You start easing off the reins and then bring in the natural consequences of their actions so that they feel like they are in control (as they so wish) rather than that you are ordering them around (which causes them to go do exactly what you told them not to do). Hangovers make for terrible practices, so they don't drink. Staying out too late might mean they accidentally sleep through classes, so they get home early and go to bed. Spending their money on fast food every day means they can't afford the iPhone 6 when it comes out, so they eat at home and learn to save. Not because you nag them but because since they were little little you taught them about life, about others, about learning from others' successes and failures, about how X can effect Y, etc. etc. etc.

What Michelle and Priscilla is saying is "we box them in, we tell them how to think, we tell them how to act, we tell them to tell us everything, we tell them that that thought is bad, we prevent them from feeling what they feel" and that stunts their growth. They are like veal - they are never let out of their boxes and never allowed to live. They are there to serve the pleasures of their parents and that is that.

And that is WRONG. And making people feel like it's right is evil, IMHO.

[Coco]

ITA. Just a parent saying, "I'm for you, not against you, and i believe in you, i'm on your side" can go so far toward mutual respect. It gets killed off pdq with spanking and shaming. Throw in the stupid fundie ideas that all little kids are born sinners with a bent to rebel that has to be beaten out, that kids need their wills broken for obedience, and it's no wonder these parents want to box up their kids. It's miserable to be at odds, it was like that growing up in my family. Our parents were the enemy of freedom, not much of a help or support unless we toed the line. And none of us kids was really bad, the only "bad" things we did were trying to get a little gasp of relief from the control. :lol: Life would have been so much easier for my parents if they didn't set themselves up to be fighting against us all the time.

Kids make mistakes but i don't think they start out trying to be terrible. That's a reaction.

[CorruptionInc.]

I took this as proof that these daughters have almost zero say in who they end up with. I mean Priscilla says I had to gaurd my heart against someone I knew wasn't an option.

*sigh* :angry-banghead:

[HarleyQuinn]

I cannot listen to Pricilla talk. Good Lord.

[Dandruff]

That and I've noticed she always scrunches up her forehead and looks at whomever is speaking (usually about less than intellectual topics) like they're trying to make her understand astrophysics.

Wonder how the homeschooling will go...

[ILoveJellybeans]

Wonder how the homeschooling will go...

I would be a miracle if Paul and PecanBaby2 (and any more they might have) are literate by the time they are 18.

[eh02]

Priscilla seems so timid and meek. Yeah, maybe also a little slower than the rest, but there's just this emptiness and it makes me sad. She's a shell of a woman and seems almost incapable of speaking her own thoughts. I wonder what she was like as a child...if she's always been like this?

Sometimes when people just have to constantly, 24/7 remind people about just exactly how happy they are as saved Christians, you kind of just believe it less and less the more you hear it IMO. I'm not religious myself but know a lot of people whose faith truly makes them happy and they don't act like Priscilla, that's for sure. I do kind of lump Michelle in with the same mindset. They're mindless Bible zombies.

[thoughtful]

I know this is a rather old thread, but I just found that baby-voice festival, and the captioning yielded some fun:

Deep.

[bBvideo 560,340:o8bcrloj]

[/bBvideo]

[Disruptor Pistol]

Why were their cell phones going off throughout the video? I mean it was obviously scripted and planned... just bizarre

[RosyDaisy]

I gotta tell ya, the minute old sugar tits Duggar started flapping her jaws, my sleeping dog got up and fled the room. Lol. I won't do that to him again. Lol.

My feline headship does the same thing.

[Eternalbluepearl]

Old sugar tits Duggar!!!

[Joan of Snarc]

Sometimes when people just have to constantly, 24/7 remind people about just exactly how happy they are as saved Christians, you kind of just believe it less and less the more you hear it IMO. I'm not religious myself but know a lot of people whose faith truly makes them happy and they don't act like Priscilla, that's for sure. I do kind of lump Michelle in with the same mindset. They're mindless Bible zombies.

Yes, they are animated mannequins for Jesus.

:zombie:

Q for Pris and J'chelle: Why should I believe what you're saying is the truth if you have to be so obviously fake and affected when you say it? Makes me think your message is as fake as your delivery. :think: Y'all are really bad actresses, so next time maybe just say something short and directly to the point, or, even better, just STFU entirely.

:roll: