The other side of unplanned pregancy from rape.

[MamaJunebug]

Some years ago, I heard a woman interviewed who had survived rape by an intruder, became pregnant from it, had the baby and kept it.

She was married at the time and had 2 or 3 children with her husband, who was out of town at the time of the attack.

They were of European descent and the rapist of African descent, and the baby's appearance made it evident who the father was.

She was interviewed as a great heroine for having refused an abortion, and for having kept the child of the rapist.

However: she and her husband had divorced, and I don't think that was mentioned in the interview. It was obliquely alluded to in her website.

She and her daughter appeared very happy and secure with each other in the photograph on the blog.

*heavy sigh* I am all for choice, and if she chose to continue the pregnancy and then to keep the child and raise her well, more power, etc.

But what if she had chosen to give up the child to a couple who dearly wanted one and couldn't conceive? Would that have been as loving as keeping the baby? I think so. Would it have increased the likelihood that her marriage would survive, what with her husband's survivor's-guilt? What difference would it have made to her children with her husband, to know that the little baby went to a couple who couldn't have their own and loved it very much, as opposed to having a half-sis and no dad in the home, in part because of the half-sis?

I mean ... we can "what-if" forever. The point I want to make is that there are other choices for women who give birth to children from rapists' sperm. The woman I'm writing about, and the show that presented her as a heroine, only showed one set of choices.

I will say without apology, I am all for adoption. What if the little boy about whom this topic started had been relinquished by his 12-year-old mom to a happily adopting couple?

There are more choices than to abort a child and/or to keep a child.

Forgive me if I sound like a judgmental jerk. It's just such a sad thing.

[Chowder Head]

Where was the social service stystem for his 12yr old mom, ehere was at 2 dirty and found on the street. Grandma on coke. Where were they at 8 and the school is go ahhh the kid needs help look whats he is going. F%%%&:$ EVERYTHINH THAT IS HOLY... the kid needs help atleast try counsling and help first. Not saying let him out but atleast try. Ok im going to go cry for my school kids i have lost to this thing called bs. We know they need help but they ate to old..foster care is rarely provided to older kids...yes we knoe she is 12 and preganant and its the moms bf but we advised her to kept them aeay from the house....ahhhhh i been told this shit over and over in my 10 yrs ......no words cant type ..just ahhhhh :angry-banghead: :angry-cussingwhite: :angry-fire: :angry-screaming: :evil:

[MrsYoungie]

But those stories can't be true - isn't every person born just so fucking deliriously joyful to have not been aborted that we all just sing and dance all day long?

Because there's no such thing as depression or extreme poverty or child neglect or just plain horrible parenting. Right?

My husband's half brother was one who, given the choice, might have chosen oblivion. He ended up committing suicide in his 20s. A sad end to a sad life.

[SisiL78]

I read a heartbreaking story once written by a woman who found out as an adult that she was conceived by rape. Her mother, a Catholic woman, was attacked while out on a walk. Mom was pro-life so couldn't have an abortion, and decided against adoption as she didn't want to have to tell her story to everyone who would ask why a married woman was putting her baby up for adoption. So they kept the baby, but her entire life she was neglected by parents who obviously preferred her older siblings to her- so much that she was left out of family photos, left at home with a babysitter during family vacations, etc. When she turned 18 her dad told her that she was out on her own now, and that they never wanted to hear from her again- something they obviously didn't do to her older siblings. This woman didn't find out until years later why she was so ostracized from her family. It was heartbreaking to imagine being in that situation- either as the daughter or the mother.

That's just unbelievable. I still can't fathom how people could treat a child that way. Better to leave her at the hospital and pretend she died in childbirth. Where were her siblings in this? Didn't any one of them speak up as to why she was treated this way? Did they help her in life? I can see how she would be a painful reminder of a horrible act, but abuse of her doesn't undo what happened or get any revenge against the rapist.

[Kitty]

Where was the social service stystem for his 12yr old mom, ehere was at 2 dirty and found on the street. Grandma on coke. Where were they at 8 and the school is go ahhh the kid needs help look whats he is going. F%%%&:$ EVERYTHINH THAT IS HOLY... the kid needs help atleast try counsling and help first. Not saying let him out but atleast try. Ok im going to go cry for my school kids i have lost to this thing called bs. We know they need help but they ate to old..foster care is rarely provided to older kids...yes we knoe she is 12 and preganant and its the moms bf but we advised her to kept them aeay from the house....ahhhhh i been told this shit over and over in my 10 yrs ......no words cant type ..just ahhhhh :angry-banghead: :angry-cussingwhite: :angry-fire: :angry-screaming: :evil:

Judging by this blog about child abuse that I follow, it seems that Florida's CPS equivalent is absolutely awful. Read any post on that blog about a kid from Florida, and one news article linked will mention that CPS had been been called several times in the past. Often those posts are about the death of the abused child in question.

So yeah, this kid got screwed, as did his poor mother when she was raped and had a child at 12 years old. No child belongs in that type of environment. I'd argue that at 11, the kid was very much emulating what he had seen and experienced up to that point.

Life in prison will not do anyone any good, especially the kid. He's only 13, so maybe there is a chance he could be rehabilitated. Killing animals at 8, though, makes me question that, but that was most certainly not his fault. He is definitely a product of his environment.

[SisiL78]

Another note.....

Its so hard to adopt in this country yet I hear of stories like this all of the time. Children who are unwanted being raised in home where they are hated, neglected, abused, and so much else. And yet, there are so many homes where a couple is trying desperately to find a child to adopt. How can this be? It truly breaks my heart that there are people willing to love and care for a child and children out there who need that love. But, they are so rarely matched up. I think there needs to be some system set in place where people can abandon their children and get a death certificate in return. That way they can get rid of the kid they don't want, but can save face in front of their neighbors.

[starfish]

I remember reading a news story a few years ago from Florida, where a young teenage girl in a vegatative state was raped in the nursing home where she permanently lived as a ward of the state. Then Gov Jeb Bush ordered that she could not have an abortion. I wonder what ever happened. Pretty sure Jeb Bush didn't adopt the child.

[shesinsane]

I remember reading a news story a few years ago from Florida, where a young teenage girl in a vegatative state was raped in the nursing home where she permanently lived as a ward of the state. Then Gov Jeb Bush ordered that she could not have an abortion. I wonder what ever happened. Pretty sure Jeb Bush didn't adopt the child.

I never heard of this, I did a little surfing, and maybe you're merging two cases? Terri Shiavo was in a persistent vegatative state and Gov. Jeb Bush interevened to try and stop efforts to remove her feeding tube.

Then there's the case of "L.G." a 13 year old orphan who wanted an abortion but as a ward of the state, couldn't get permission from the DCF. In the end, the state relented and Planned Parenthood's website said she got her abortion.

Getting back to the topic, those of you who ask "who's going to raise the rapist's baby" are thinking too far ahead. The prolifer/forced birthers will demand that a victim of rape be forced to carry an unwanted pregnancy to term, they don't give a rat's ass about what becomes of the baby once it's born. This case is a great example - it's possible the 12 year old wanted to abort but was persuaded not to by some, but none of those prolifers were outraged when a neglected 2 year old was found wandering near his grandmother's crack hotel room. As soon as he was born, this child went from being a special fetal snowflake to just another poor minority to avoid when walking alone at night.

[themadapple]

Getting back to the topic, those of you who ask "who's going to raise the rapist's baby" are thinking too far ahead. The prolifer/forced birthers will demand that a victim of rape be forced to carry an unwanted pregnancy to term, they don't give a rat's ass about what becomes of the baby once it's born. This case is a great example - it's possible the 12 year old wanted to abort but was persuaded not to by some, but none of those prolifers were outraged when a neglected 2 year old was found wandering near his grandmother's crack hotel room. As soon as he was born, this child went from being a special fetal snowflake to just another poor minority to avoid when walking alone at night.

They also don't consider the fact that perhaps the woman (or, unfortunately, young child) may not want to endure a pregnancy in the first place with all of its consequences.

[Sola]

We had a case in Michigan where a 12 yo boy was convicted of 1st degree murder. It may have been a lesser charge, but it was found that he deliberately shot and killed a random adult. There was a lot of debate about what to do with him. Eventually he was sent to a juvenile facility and stayed there until he was 18. The media would give periodic updates on his stay. He was trying, but would get in trouble.

When he was released, there some media fanfare and it looked as if the young man had been rehabilitated. Fast forward about 2 years and he was arrested for possession . He has since been in and out off trouble. More often in than out.

My point or my opinion is, the system worked as best it could. This kid got lots of support within the system and several people and organizations that tried to help him. In the end, it was up to the young man.

I read the story about the child in Florida and hope for the best. The system can work, but do you make the child understand or change his cultural, moral, ethical point of view?

That's just it though, it's no good just releasing him at 18 and expecting everything to go smoothly, even if he's had therapy all that time.

Therapy and support needs to continue once he's been released and it needs to continue for a bloody long time. People can, sometimes, be rehabilitated when they've gone through such dreadful childhoods like this and killed as children themselves, but it takes years upon years of therapy and support. It might be that the boy reaches the age of 30 before supervision, support and therapy can stop and he can become a productive and law abiding member of society. All that costs money and how many people want their taxes spent on murderers, even if that person was a child when they committed the murder.

[Gil]

I never heard of this, I did a little surfing, and maybe you're merging two cases? Terri Shiavo was in a persistent vegatative state and Gov. Jeb Bush interevened to try and stop efforts to remove her feeding tube.

Then there's the case of "L.G." a 13 year old orphan who wanted an abortion but as a ward of the state, couldn't get permission from the DCF. In the end, the state relented and Planned Parenthood's website said she got her abortion.

Is it this case?

[chaotic life]

At 17, I placed her for adoption because I couldn't be 100% that I wouldn't ever hold the rape where she was concieved against her. I have an open adoption with her and at 18, she considers me her only mother, since her adoptive mother flaked out and abandoned her but not her adoptive father.

My brother raises a son who was concieved by rape. He didn't meet and start dating his wife until his son until the boy was 3 and married his mom when my nephew was 4. He IS that child's father, the only father my nephew has ever known. Yet, he cannot legally adopt his son because the sperm donor who created him, has never met him and is still in prison for the act that brought him into this world won't relinquish my nephew for adoption and the law gives him the power to hurt in that refusal.

I have two siblings my parents adopted who were concieved by rape. Well, technically one was called molestation but that is such a mild word for raping your stepdaughter from the time she was 8 until she landed pregnant at 14.

Of all of those children, the only one with issues is the brother from the 14 year old birthmother. However, he was treated differently from his background and I FIRMLY believe it was my estranged mother's mistreatment of him and NOT his conception that has been the cause of his struggles.

According to the Murder class I took a year ago, child killers CAN be saved, but they MUST have their future full of therapy and help and NOT more of the same as their past.

[valsa]

According to the Murder class I took a year ago, child killers CAN be saved, but they MUST have their future full of therapy and help and NOT more of the same as their past.

I believe some child killers can be rehabilitated (I think using the word "saved" is incorrect) but not all. Sociopathy develops early and cannot be "fixed", so even a young teen can already be beyond rehabilitation.

The main questions are "how do we recognize the child killers who can be rehabilitated, how best can we rehabilitate them, is the cost worth it, and what do we do with the ones who can't be rehabilitated?" Right now our criminal justice system is ill equipped to answer those questions, so we're basically left with holding the kid in juvie until he's 18-21 (highly unlikely to be enough time to rehabilitate him, if we're able to rehabilitate him at all) or sending him to adult prison.

[desertvixen]

There is an aspect that I abhor, but did think of.... how many men are thrilled with the prospect of being a stepdad to child if their wife is raped? I have yet to see a pro-life man walk up and proudly tell of the tale of the child that is not his, yet he loved as his own and raised after his wife was raped. It is odd that not many men seem to believe this could actually happen to them in IRL- the two (pro-life) men I asked of this situation looked as if I slapped them in the face. I would love to ask Paul Ryan if he would be willing to prayerfully raise a child of rape. Or even two, since it is possible.

The 'rape gave me a blessing' stories all seem to be sweet girls that gave the baby up for adoption, not married women with a family that had to suffer with her.

Limiting the discussion to the men we discuss on Free Jinger, this crowd can't even handle raising the child of their wife by a previous relationship.

Chris Jeub comes to mind here.

Kelly at GC as well, although Bria doesn't seem to be treated any differently from the others except for her oldest-daughter-servitude, and that might have happened anyway.

Cheryl's (Treasure from a Shoebox) husband.

I'm sure we have others.

But of course it won't happen to them because their wives are virtuous, and that never happens to their kind.

[Rowan]

It is his fault he killed another child.

But is it? The article said their mother waited over EIGHT hours to seek any real medical help and that they could have likely saved him otherwise. Is what this child did to his stepbrother horrible? Yes. Was it the sole and proximate cause of the death? I really don't think so. The inevitable conclusion was not the death of the toddler until the mother failed to deal with the situation. But she was a child when she had him due to a horrible act and she clearly didn't have good role models so she's had a ton to deal with also and almost certainly doesn't think and process those sorts of situations like the majority of people would.

The whole thing is horrible and tragic for everyone involved. :( :cry:

[valsa]

But is it? The article said their mother waited over EIGHT hours to seek any real medical help and that they could have likely saved him otherwise. Is what this child did to his stepbrother horrible? Yes. Was it the sole and proximate cause of the death? I really don't think so. The inevitable conclusion was not the death of the toddler until the mother failed to deal with the situation. But she was a child when she had him due to a horrible act and she clearly didn't have good role models so she's had a ton to deal with also and almost certainly doesn't think and process those sorts of situations like the majority of people would.

The whole thing is horrible and tragic for everyone involved. :( :cry:

Yes, it is. This was not a one time incident. The kid has already broken the 2 year old's leg two weeks before he beat him to death. He was clearly escalating his torture of the child. Even if the mother had gotten prompt medical attention for this injury, he would have escalated further at a later point and probably outright killed him.

I don't get to shoot into a crowd and then claim I didn't really kill anyone because medical attention wasn't given quickly enough. And while the mother should be punished for her medical neglect of the toddler, that doesn't mean the boy isn't responsible for the fact that the beating he perpetrated on the baby caused his death.

[DarkAnts]

Regarding rehabilitation. I think that a child who goes into the juvenile jail system should be given a chance at rehabilitation. But, I think there should be an extensive mental evolution before they are released as adults. If they are still mentally ill, then they should not be released into society. If they have made significant improvement and are deemed safe, then they should be released. They should be monitored after they are released. There should be a plan in place if trouble develops after their release.

[luckystone]

I think in a lot of cases where they are released as adults, they re-offend (usually something more minor though, like the possession example above). It's really common, I can think of a lot off the top of my head.

Unfortunately, you can't know if this is because of who they are, or because they spent their formative years in jail, come out and nobody wants anything to do with them (if they are not anonymised)...

I'm always torn on these, I think they can't really be bad and it's so unfair to give a teen a harsh sentence, but then I realise most of them will just get worse and are not safe for society.

[LilMissMetaphor]

I hate the "he deserves a second chance" bullshit.

The baby he killed doesn't get a second chance, does he?

[Parkersmom120106]

I live in the area where this happened (well, next county over, but if I'm out of town I say I'm from Jacksonville) and it's so weird to see this being brought up everywhere all of the sudden. The Young Turks did a video about it. It seems like it happened so long ago. I understand that he did something horrible, but after the life he lived I can't bring myself to say "just put him in jail for the rest of his life". He most certainly should not be released. I think he needs extensive therapy. The juvienille system in Duval County is horrible. He'll come out just as bad as if he had sat in prison. The mother was sentenced to 30 years for her part in all this. She not only delayed medical attention, but she left the baby alone with the boy KNOWING that he had already harmed him in the past. This child was failed in so many ways. I think of this story when people say that women who are impregnanted by rape shouldn't be allowed to get an abortion. It also reminds me of an argument I had with an old family friend about abortion. She said it was better for the child to be born into a life of abuse than to be aborted because we don't know what's going to happen to that child and they should have a chance to live. I was appalled. She's no longer my friend on facebook. Also, I'll have to look up the articles again, but on the Young Turks video they stated that the baby's head was slammed into a bookcase when his brother did a wrestling move on him. I remember when it first happened reading that the older boy repeatadly slammed the baby's head into the bookcase. I don't know if this kid can be rehabbed, but if he can we should try. I think he should be put in a mental health facility and given treatment.

[valsa]

Also, I'll have to look up the articles again, but on the Young Turks video they stated that the baby's head was slammed into a bookcase when his brother did a wrestling move on him.

The article posted by the OP also stated that supposedly the boy broke the baby's leg while wrestling with him, so I'm sceptical on both counts.