The other side of unplanned pregancy from rape.

[doggie]

of course we all know if you get pregnant from rape the world will turn all rosy for you and Christians will fall out of the tree's to help. but this the reality sometimes and the boy who lost out. no one won this one had turned into a monster.

JACKSONVILLE, Fla. (AP) - A decade before he was charged with murder, a 2-year-old Cristian Fernandez was found naked and dirty, wandering a South Florida street. The grandmother taking care of him had holed up with cocaine in a messy motel room, while his 14-year-old mother was nowhere to be found.

His life had been punctuated with violence since he was conceived, an act that resulted in a sexual assault conviction against his father. Fernandez' life got worse from there: He was sexually assaulted by a cousin and beaten by his stepfather, who committed suicide before police investigating the beating arrived.

http://m.apnews.com/ap/db_268773/conten ... d=xUmHPs5v

[tropaka]

Oh my God. This is a child and it's hard to say what should happen. Whether he's given a juvenile sentence or an adult sentence his future doesn't look good. The best chance for him is to put him in a youth facility but I don't know....

[SpeakNow]

My heart just breaks over this.

[Glass Cowcatcher]

This is a heartbreaking story. It gets me on one of those days where I'm depressed enough being a parent as it is, dealing with the issues from the circumstances of the offspring's own conception, I can't comprehend all the pain here. :(

[linnea27]

I read a heartbreaking story once written by a woman who found out as an adult that she was conceived by rape. Her mother, a Catholic woman, was attacked while out on a walk. Mom was pro-life so couldn't have an abortion, and decided against adoption as she didn't want to have to tell her story to everyone who would ask why a married woman was putting her baby up for adoption. So they kept the baby, but her entire life she was neglected by parents who obviously preferred her older siblings to her- so much that she was left out of family photos, left at home with a babysitter during family vacations, etc. When she turned 18 her dad told her that she was out on her own now, and that they never wanted to hear from her again- something they obviously didn't do to her older siblings. This woman didn't find out until years later why she was so ostracized from her family. It was heartbreaking to imagine being in that situation- either as the daughter or the mother.

[Witsec7]

I posted this earlier today on a forum deep in the bible belt. Besides some of the more overt racist remarks, a knuckle dragger reminded me that it didn't matter if this child was conceived from rape, any child born of his mother and their family background would likely meet the same end. I love the compassionate conservatism of some Missionary Baptists :roll:

[themadapple]

I had heard about this case, but hadn't known too much about the background.

How tragic. He's so young and just giving up on him just seems wrong. I understand that his crimes are horrible and that he shouldn't merely be let off. Given his background, though, he's been betrayed by everyone he was supposed to trust. I'm not seeing a life sentence as doing him any favors. If there's any chance at all that he could be rehabilitated, why not take it? Why not at least try?

And no matter what, I think the ultimate punishment in his case is that he will have to live with what he has done until the day he dies. That, coupled with the memories and effects of the abuse he's suffered... I really can't even imagine.

[Mythicwings]

I read a heartbreaking story once written by a woman who found out as an adult that she was conceived by rape. Her mother, a Catholic woman, was attacked while out on a walk. Mom was pro-life so couldn't have an abortion, and decided against adoption as she didn't want to have to tell her story to everyone who would ask why a married woman was putting her baby up for adoption. So they kept the baby, but her entire life she was neglected by parents who obviously preferred her older siblings to her- so much that she was left out of family photos, left at home with a babysitter during family vacations, etc. When she turned 18 her dad told her that she was out on her own now, and that they never wanted to hear from her again- something they obviously didn't do to her older siblings. This woman didn't find out until years later why she was so ostracized from her family. It was heartbreaking to imagine being in that situation- either as the daughter or the mother.

:crying-yellow: :crying-yellow: :crying-yellow:

[doggie]

I doubt much can be done with him he may be too far gone now. But lets hope not.

[longskirtlotsakids]

There is an aspect that I abhor, but did think of.... how many men are thrilled with the prospect of being a stepdad to child if their wife is raped? I have yet to see a pro-life man walk up and proudly tell of the tale of the child that is not his, yet he loved as his own and raised after his wife was raped. It is odd that not many men seem to believe this could actually happen to them in IRL- the two (pro-life) men I asked of this situation looked as if I slapped them in the face. I would love to ask Paul Ryan if he would be willing to prayerfully raise a child of rape. Or even two, since it is possible.

The 'rape gave me a blessing' stories all seem to be sweet girls that gave the baby up for adoption, not married women with a family that had to suffer with her.

[Maude]

I had heard about this case, but hadn't known too much about the background.

How tragic. He's so young and just giving up on him just seems wrong. I understand that his crimes are horrible and that he shouldn't merely be let off. Given his background, though, he's been betrayed by everyone he was supposed to trust. I'm not seeing a life sentence as doing him any favors. If there's any chance at all that he could be rehabilitated, why not take it? Why not at least try?

And no matter what, I think the ultimate punishment in his case is that he will have to live with what he has done until the day he dies. That, coupled with the memories and effects of the abuse he's suffered... I really can't even imagine.

This. They should send him to a juvenile detention center or something similar where he can get the care he so desperately needs. :(

[themadapple]

I doubt much can be done with him he may be too far gone now. But lets hope not.

Regardless of whether or not he's too far gone now, it would be a disservice to not at least attempt rehabilitation. Education, counseling, mentoring, whatever. He's still a child. A child who has been through more shit in 13 years than many of us will ever know in a lifetime. If there's any possibility that he could one day find some happiness and purpose in this life, then I believe that those around him have every moral obligation to provide the opportunities and assistance that he'll need. The alternative is not to, in which case he's almost sure to fail.

[doggie]

Regardless of whether or not he's too far gone now, it would be a disservice to not at least attempt rehabilitation. Education, counseling, mentoring, whatever. He's still a child. A child who has been through more shit in 13 years than many of us will ever know in a lifetime. If there's any possibility that he could one day find some happiness and purpose in this life, then I believe that those around him have every moral obligation to provide the opportunities and assistance that he'll need. The alternative is not to, in which case he's almost sure to fail.

fully true but I doubt much will happen.

[fundyfunland]

This is so sad! He is still a child! A CHILD....who, according to the Republicans is precious, and needs to be saved! Oh, wait...that would be a fetus. Despite there being rehab programs and serious interventions that could help this boy integrate properly back into society, I doubt he'll ever get those services, esp in FLA. He is pretty much doomed.

Where are all those pro-LIFErs when it really counts? Crickets chirping. Fuck it! This story makes me so sad and really, really mad!!!

[Gil]

In 2007, when Fernandez was 8, the Department of Children and Families investigated a report that he was sexually molested by an older cousin. Officials said other troubling incidents were reported, including claims that he he killed a kitten, simulated sex with classmates and masturbated at school.

Deeply disturbed by any eight-year-old that would deliberately kill a kitten?

But you guys forgot; his twelve-year-old mother wasn't legitimately raped because her body didn't shut that whole thing down.

There's nothing about this situation that isn't horribly tragic.

[DarkAnts]

I hope that kid gets the help that he needs. It will take lots of work on his part, but, I think that he could turn out ok if he is given help. Then again, I dont want to consider the possibility that his life is over before he has had a chance to truly live.

[CrazySister]

Deeply disturbed by any eight-year-old that would deliberately kill a kitten?

But you guys forgot; his twelve-year-old mother wasn't legitimately raped because her body didn't shut that whole thing down.

There's nothing about this situation that isn't horribly tragic.

This. SO much this!

[luckystone]

I remember reading about that in 2011. He still hasn't had his trial?! Then again, Florida is one of the worst places for juvenile justice

I suppose all court systems have delays but over there they seem to love waiting until frail kids go through puberty and bulk up from 2-3 years in prison before they put them on trial.

When I read it I thought how tragic it was and how you can just tell some stories will get worse and worse from so many bad things happening.

[dianapavelovna]

Deeply disturbed by any eight-year-old that would deliberately kill a kitten?

Yeah, that's a huge red flag. It'd be very interesting to know more details about his history. Ugh, but this kid...he was only acting the way the adults in his life did...

[Claddagh]

The story is so tragic! :cry:

I also pray that this boy gets the help that he so desperately needs.

[valsa]

I'm torn. While there's no question that this boy has suffered horrific abuse, I'm nowhere near as optimistic about his ability to be rehabilitated as many people here.

I'm not sure I believe that guys like Bundy or Dahmer could have been rehabilitated if they'd started treatment at this boy's age (giving juvie only 8 years to rehabilitate before they have to release him at 21) and this kid gives clear indications that he has to potential to be just as big a sociopath as those two (killing animals at 8 years old, sexual abuse of a much younger child, and torture of a child (previously breaking his 2 year old brother's leg), and, of course, beating a toddler to death)

Sometimes people are beyond rehabilitation. Even sympathetic people.

[shesinsane]

I'm torn. While there's no question that this boy has suffered horrific abuse, I'm nowhere near as optimistic about his ability to be rehabilitated as many people here.

I'm not sure I believe that guys like Bundy or Dahmer could have been rehabilitated if they'd started treatment at this boy's age (giving juvie only 8 years to rehabilitate before they have to release him at 21) and this kid gives clear indications that he has to potential to be just as big a sociopath as those two (killing animals at 8 years old, sexual abuse of a much younger child, and torture of a child (previously breaking his 2 year old brother's leg), and, of course, beating a toddler to death)

Sometimes people are beyond rehabilitation. Even sympathetic people.

Agreed. There are other threads around here where it's pointed out that so and so's fundie children are ill equipped to deal with the world, and the older ones are a lost cause. If you've already given up on making some fundies upstanding members of society, how can you think a pre-teen murderer is fixable?

It's not Cristian's fault that he grew into who he is today, and it's not his fault his future is nothing but jails and possibly a mental hospital. It is his fault he killed another child.

This case is just sad and tragic on so many levels, and there's no happy ending. No therapist is going to breakthrough to Cristian and undo the decade of abuse/neglect, and there's no way to bring his victim back to life.

[changemanagement]

We had a case in Michigan where a 12 yo boy was convicted of 1st degree murder. It may have been a lesser charge, but it was found that he deliberately shot and killed a random adult. There was a lot of debate about what to do with him. Eventually he was sent to a juvenile facility and stayed there until he was 18. The media would give periodic updates on his stay. He was trying, but would get in trouble.

When he was released, there some media fanfare and it looked as if the young man had been rehabilitated. Fast forward about 2 years and he was arrested for possession . He has since been in and out off trouble. More often in than out.

My point or my opinion is, the system worked as best it could. This kid got lots of support within the system and several people and organizations that tried to help him. In the end, it was up to the young man.

I read the story about the child in Florida and hope for the best. The system can work, but do you make the child understand or change his cultural, moral, ethical point of view?

[themadapple]

My point or my opinion is, the system worked as best it could. This kid got lots of support within the system and several people and organizations that tried to help him. In the end, it was up to the young man.

I read the story about the child in Florida and hope for the best. The system can work, but do you make the child understand or change his cultural, moral, ethical point of view?

You're right. Ultimately he would have to choose what to do.

I agree that some people seem to be beyond help. And mind you, I'm not so optimistic where I truly believe everyone can be rehabilitated. My point is that it wouldn't be fair not to offer it. Hell, there's a chance he could embrace it. There's a chance he would not. It's not a sure thing but hell, few things are.

[smores]

I'm torn as well. I do think that he should undergo much counseling and therapy but honestly, at the same time, is it worth it for someone else to die if (and most likely - sadly - when) counseling and rehabilitation doesn't work? It's between a rock and hard place here for child killers, and that is so sad.