40 days for a boy, 80 days for a girl

[fakepigtails73]

I read that in some fundie circles when a woman gives birth to a baby boy she has to abstain from sex for 40 days, while if she gives birth to a girl it's 2X that (80 days).

Is that biblical? Is that an ATI-Gothard thing? Is there a lot of christians who apply that?

Why the difference? I hate the fact that it takes much longer for a daughter. It's as if she's unclean or something.

"In the real world" doctors recommend 4 to 6 weeks before doing it.

[ErinIsSik]

I have heard that J-Boob And J-Chelle follow this. Not that my reply in any way answers your question, just thought I would chime in with what I do know.

[emmiedahl]

It is Jewish law from the OT. I am not familiar with the various reasons behind the gender differences, although I am sure that many rabbis have debated them and come to some sort of conclusion.

[Jessica]

It's from Leviticus.

[AnnoDomini]

I have never heard of this practice in modern-day Christian couples.

[ErinIsSik]

I want to say I saw it in an old Ask The Duggars special, but it wasn't actually said out loud. I think it was in a black bar across the bottom added by TLC. Those always remind me of VH1's pop-up video, and I sometimes get confused when I don't hear the pop noise.

[saraelise]

I read that in Orthodox Jewish circles, you double the number of days abstained for a girl because of the girl child's ability to one day create life. So, like, a double honouring of the mother who created life and the child who will one day. It ties in to the whole Jewish family purity thing, I think.

[Bookworm]

I used to wonder about this too - it is possible it was actually a kind rule in the beginning. In patriarchal societies men really want to have as many children, particularly boys, as possible, and if their wife disappoints them by having a girl, it is probable that many men would want to *immediately* start trying to make the next one. This way, women would be gauranteed a little rest after any birth. I read this explanation somewhere, forget where.

[Cerysbell]

I have heard of a few Christians who practise this, not über-Fundies, but not messianic Christians either. I don't know why they pick that one to follow. Does it double for twins, does anyone know?

[fakepigtails73]

It's from Leviticus.

Ah yes, Leviticus. The Fundies' fave book out of the OT, or so it seems.

[VodouDoll]

What do you do if you have a boy-girl set of twins? Abstain for 120 days? Or just go for the 80?

[Soldier of the One]

It's Leviticus chapter 12, to be exact: Parashat Tazria-Metzora, the dread and doom for every bar or bat mitzvah child.

As another poster suggested, I've also read the interpretation that 'the giver of life who gives life to a giver of life' (a mother who has a daughter) is rendered impure twice as long because of the 'doubling' of life-giving abilities. Impurity in the Biblical/Torah system has no moral stigma attached to it, and being impure probably allowed women - and men, who could also become impure! - some much needed rest.

Now I want to know why fundamentalist Christians practice this. Do their wives also immerse after menstruation? Do men immerse/wash after ejaculation? Do they immerse after being in contact with the dead or with vermin? Do they not eat pork and shellfish? Do they not light fire on the Sabbath day? Are they, after all, 'Judaizers'?

My Jewish brain fails to compute.

[fakepigtails73]

It's Leviticus chapter 12, to be exact: Parashat Tazria-Metzora, the dread and doom for every bar or bat mitzvah child.

As another poster suggested, I've also read the interpretation that 'the giver of life who gives life to a giver of life' (a mother who has a daughter) is rendered impure twice as long because of the 'doubling' of life-giving abilities. Impurity in the Biblical/Torah system has no moral stigma attached to it, and being impure probably allowed women - and men, who could also become impure! - some much needed rest.

Now I want to know why fundamentalist Christians practice this. Do their wives also immerse after menstruation? Do men immerse/wash after ejaculation? Do they immerse after being in contact with the dead or with vermin? Do they not eat pork and shellfish? Do they not light fire on the Sabbath day? Are they, after all, 'Judaizers'?

My Jewish brain fails to compute.

If I was a Jew I'd be a bit angry as to how some fundies seem to be so pro-Zionism. Their way is almost like: "We want you to be in Israel so that Jesus can come back, then you can convert or not but one way or the other He is back so the heck with y'all". Very strange. And add all these "pick and choose" things that some fundies now do (Sabbath, no pork, 40-80 days)...

[FlorenceHamilton]

If I was a Jew I'd be a bit angry as to how some fundies seem to be so pro-Zionism. Their way is almost like: "We want you to be in Israel so that Jesus can come back, then you can convert or not but one way or the other He is back so the heck with y'all". Very strange. And add all these "pick and choose" things that some fundies now do (Sabbath, no pork, 40-80 days)...

I am a secular Jew. At work one day, I was conversing with a Modern Orthodox Jewish man who was verty politically conservative and very involved in politics with the Christian fundamentalist right wing faction. We were both quietly writing on patient charts. I looked at him and said, "You know that you made a deal with the devil, dont' you?" He answered, "Yes, but it is ok because they are very pro-Israel and they are wrong about what will happen." I threw up a little bit in my mouth.

[Soldier of the One]

It is a dangerous deal, at least from a theological standpoint, if not from a political standpoint.

Replacement theology is a real concern for Jews. Fundamentalists keep 'Torah law' because they want to show us that their Christian theology has supplanted ours, while losing none of its 'Old Testament' relevance.

Usually, I fully support free interchange on the marketplace of ideas. If someone wants to try and convince someone else that their way if life is particularly meaningful, go for it. But the disproportionate proselytizing of a small and vulnerable religious minority that has seen so much persecution (of the genuine kind) throughout history disgusts me.

Would they really want us all to accept Christ and lose our ties with authentic Judaism? I am afraid we all know the answer to that.

[fakepigtails73]

If you doN,t mind my asking, what is "replacement theology"?

[Soldier of the One]

If you doN,t mind my asking, what is "replacement theology"?

Of course I don't mind you asking :) Replacement Theology, a.k.a. Supercessionism is a certain brand of Christian theology that states that the 'Old' Covenant of the Jewish people has been replaced by the 'New' covenant through Christ and that Judaism, therefore, is defunct.

For a more nuanced explanation, see:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supercessionism

Hope this helps :)

[fakepigtails73]

Much thanks!

[FuManchu]

This rule comes with the nauseatingly plausible image of Jim Bob ticking off days on a calendar, until it's one minute past midnight on the 41/81st day.

[emmiedahl]

I could totally see JB doing something like that, not even realizing that a Jewish day is from sundown to sundown.

Realistically, a lot of moms are not even in shape for sex in 40 days.

[Deleted06]

This rule comes with the nauseatingly plausible image of Jim Bob ticking off days on a calendar, until it's one minute past midnight on the 41/81st day.

Or perhaps he has a different daily activity?? :shock:

[2xx1xy1JD]

It's actually a misinterpretation of Leviticus.

Actual length of no-sex after childbirth = 7 days for male, 14 days for female or if gender wasn't known in the case of a miscarriage. Orthodox Jews today, however, follow a Talmudic law that starts the counting of days not from the actual birth, but from the first "clean" day after bleeding stops, so it ends up being around 6 weeks except in the case of an early miscarriage. The 40 and 80 days are a reference to a waiting period before going to the Temple in Jerusalem, which is no longer standing.

[gustava]

What do you do if you have a boy-girl set of twins? Abstain for 120 days? Or just go for the 80?

Can't believe that the Boobs waited 120 days, but the question is a good one. What saith Leviticus?

[BoomerLynn]

It's Leviticus chapter 12, to be exact: Parashat Tazria-Metzora, the dread and doom for every bar or bat mitzvah child.

As another poster suggested, I've also read the interpretation that 'the giver of life who gives life to a giver of life' (a mother who has a daughter) is rendered impure twice as long because of the 'doubling' of life-giving abilities. Impurity in the Biblical/Torah system has no moral stigma attached to it, and being impure probably allowed women - and men, who could also become impure! - some much needed rest.

Now I want to know why fundamentalist Christians practice this. Do their wives also immerse after menstruation? Do men immerse/wash after ejaculation? Do they immerse after being in contact with the dead or with vermin? Do they not eat pork and shellfish? Do they not light fire on the Sabbath day? Are they, after all, 'Judaizers'?

My Jewish brain fails to compute.

What exactly do you mean by immerse? Is it basically a bath or is there more involved? Just curious. I have learned so much about Judaism from reading on here and I find it very interesting. Thanks in advance :)

[2xx1xy1JD]

What exactly do you mean by immerse? Is it basically a bath or is there more involved? Just curious. I have learned so much about Judaism from reading on here and I find it very interesting. Thanks in advance :)

You take a dunk, totally nude, in either a natural body of water, or something called a mikvah which looks like a small pool or large hot tub, but is constructed by allowing natural rain water to fall into a pool, and then supplementing that water with regular tap water. The mikvah is indoors, so you get some privacy and reasonable temperature control. Add "religious requirement to go skinny dipping" to the list of things that you never knew about Orthodox Jews.

Soldier of the One: I'm not going to ask too many rhetorical questions like that, because I'm afraid the answer may be that Lina does these things.