Where in the World is Doug Phillips? Part 13

[noseybutt]

On 9/18/2023 at 11:34 AM, Antipatriarch said:

Very good point! And it reminds me of Piper's analogy about the woman who has a black belt in karate (emphasis mine):

Who cares if she could easily save them both? Who cares if he gets killed? It's his role, not hers. Sorry Daddy's never coming home again, kids, but at least he "did it God's way".

The absolute rules of complementarianism throw common sense right out the window. There's no accounting for ability or unique circumstances or judgment. There's only one correct path for every woman or man, whether it makes sense or not.

You know Piper is a joy in bed 😳🙄

[frumperlicious]

OMG Faith’s ridiculous Instagram posts about “airborne school”.

As an actual fucking veteran, this is not freaking airborne school you ridiculous cosplaying fools. 
 

I almost posted a comment saying so (because at the moment I am Going Through Some Stuff and lack a filter). Apples and trees I guess, roleplaying life 🙄

[Columbia]

[ptm6114]

On 10/31/2023 at 1:34 PM, frumperlicious said:

OMG Faith’s ridiculous Instagram posts about “airborne school”.

As an actual fucking veteran, this is not freaking airborne school you ridiculous cosplaying fools. 
 

I almost posted a comment saying so (because at the moment I am Going Through Some Stuff and lack a filter). Apples and trees I guess, roleplaying life 🙄

She is mild compared to Liberty. Naive people will straight up comment “thank you for your service” on Liberty’s photos (posted by WARTOG) and they block comments of people saying “she’s not a veteran. It’s absolutely asinine. It’s so fucking weird. 
A thought: compose a pamphlet to hand out at all the events Liberty and faith attend tying them to vision forum along with the bs propaganda vision forum pushes out, along with the endless exploitation of our veterans from the Phillips family. Operation meatball/bridge to history- in my opinion is vision forum/hazardous journeys 2.0 At least at that point people can form their own opinions from facts.
At least faith posted this: although a better spot for her to have posted this would have been under her cosplaying post. I love how they think they’re doing something revolutionary 🤣

Sooooo does anyone have more in depth information about this? The article didn’t really dive in to specifics. 

[hoipolloi]

2 hours ago, ptm6114 said:

Sooooo does anyone have more in depth information about this? The article didn’t really dive in to specifics. 

The 2014 lawsuit was retaliation against the former VF employees who, with two others, confronted Doug in October 2013:

This World Magazine article gives some more context. Also, there is a lot at Spiritual Sounding Board blog. 

[Inky]

Does anyone know where the 2014 lawsuit ended up?

 

Oops - followed the link and it appears to have been settled. With a gag order of course.

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by Inky

[Howl]

Interesting 2013 blog post on The Junto, a group blog on Early American History with a focus on VF and the Lost Cause.  Doug Phillips and David Barton make appearances, of course.  Be sure and read the comments, some specific to Doug Phillips. 

Godly Heritage and Plantation Chic: The Case of Vision Forum  

Tags:  Antebellum South, Civil War, David Barton, Lost Cause, patriarchy, Slavery

"A recent news story has me thinking about the weird enduring appeal of the Lost Cause. It seems to me that this news story about a contemporary religious organization might lead us into an interesting case study."

[Antipatriarch]

38 minutes ago, Howl said:

Interesting 2013 blog post on The Junto, a group blog on Early American History with a focus on VF and the Lost Cause.  Doug Phillips and David Barton make appearances, of course.

Quote

Through its merchandise arm, it distributes (or at least has distributed) books like an updated version of William Gouge’s Of Domesticall Duties, a 1622 treatise on family life. (A sample of the original wording: “Mildness in a wife hath respect also to the ordering of her countenance, gesture, and whole carriage before her husband, whereby she manifesteth a pleasingness to him, and a contentedness and willingness to be under him and ruled by him.”) The online store sells a two-DVD set called “Tea and Hospitality with Michelle Duggar,” inviting viewers to “celebrate the fruit of the womb with [mother-of-nineteen] Michelle!” Vision Forum also sells studiously gender-specific toys like an “all-American boy’s crossbow” and a “Princess Virginia” dress meant to encourage a girl as she “identifies with Mommy and experiences how unique and wonderful it is to be a girl, to be a daughter of the Most High King—to be His little princess!” Vision Forum’s entire merchandise catalog seems to be designed to encourage as much differentiation as possible between boy leaders and girl followers.

🤮

[hoipolloi]

Just came across Marissa Burt who has been doing a lot of deep dives into the toxic stew of fundie parenting books. She has a 4-part series on Vision Forum in particular.

[ptm6114]

I have read a few things of Vision Forum being adamantly against social services and child protective services. Do any of you have any credible sources or direct quotes from Vision Forum or the Philips’ family to support this? Or anything related to child abuse/child endangerment? TIA!

[Columbia]

2 hours ago, ptm6114 said:

I have read a few things of Vision Forum being adamantly against social services and child protective services. Do any of you have any credible sources or direct quotes from Vision Forum or the Philips’ family to support this? Or anything related to child abuse/child endangerment? TIA!

I'm sure you can find something on Doug's Blog on the wayback machine. There are two things that come to mind immediately. The first is this lecture, given by one of VF's legal team members that talks about the evils of CPS. (They offer no alternative to how to protect children in dangerous situations.) The other one is this skit that Doug and Beall performed on one of their Family Strategies webinars. It was originally written by someone associated with HSLDA, I believe. 

[Jasmar]

I was a homeschool mom from 2004-2014, so prime Vision Forum days. I remember reading, and hearing stores about, endless agitation by HSLDA about how our kids were all at high risk of being taken away because we were conservative Christians. It’s hard to ignore that level constant of klaxon-alarming.

[Howl]

On 11/21/2023 at 7:23 PM, ptm6114 said:

I have read a few things of Vision Forum being adamantly against social services and child protective services. Do any of you have any credible sources or direct quotes from Vision Forum or the Philips’ family to support this?

Doug was a lawyer with HSLDA (Home School Legal Defense Association), which is basically adamantly against any form of oversight of the education and welfare of children.  I'm sure they are big time behind "Parents Rights" crap. 

[neuroticcat]

On 11/13/2023 at 8:56 AM, hoipolloi said:

Just came across Marissa Burt who has been doing a lot of deep dives into the toxic stew of fundie parenting books. She has a 4-part series on Vision Forum in particular.

Someone in the comments on this series talking about CPS visits. 

Spoiler

The screenshotted resource is so over the top. How to Watch a Movie with Your Family? How to take your children safely through the airport? I mean they obviously creepily wanted to control every detail but maybe they had to scrape up content for a 20 part seminar. 

[ptm6114]

Thank you for this! Someone may or may not be going to court soon and needs all the credible information possible to keep minors away from the Phillips family and those who associate with them. So what did Doug do in 2014 with a minor? Is that the Lourdes case?

Doug threatening to sue? Shocking. What an absolute embarrassment. Counting my lucky stars I wasn’t born into that family 🤮

[hoipolloi]

3 hours ago, ptm6114 said:

So what did Doug do in 2014 with a minor? Is that the Lourdes case?

Yes, Lourdes Torres-Manteufel (as she was then) filed this complaint in April 2014. In it she provides details of the abuse allegations.

There is a lot more info pertaining to the lawsuit (settled in 2016) at this link that may be of use to someone interested in this history. 

[marmalade]

I didn't know that Dougie was never a practicing attorney in Texas. What the hell did he actually do besides gallivant around with his wide stance? 

[Howl]

5 hours ago, marmalade said:

What the hell did he actually do besides gallivant around with his wide stance? 

Well, that and shutting down the plague of "jive talk" in his family. 

A lot of this crazy has to do with paranoia of the "evil" outside world, the role of the patriarch as protector from that evil,  and the fiction of the persecution of Christians.  

Doug started out as a lawyer for Home School Legal Defense Association.  That went sideways and he "somehow" got tight with James Leininger, a San Antonio physician who first became seriously mega wealthy after founding a medical technology company.  Leininger has his fingers in a lot of political and financial pies.  He was even on the board of IBLP at one point.  James Leininger WIKI 

Leininger, who is still alive, gave Vision Forum $2.5 million and (I think) owned several houses that the Phillips family lived in and maybe the business offices/warehouse for the business arm of Vision Forum.  

Really, the hey day of Boerne Christian Assembly, Jen Epps Fishburne's excommunication (chronicled in excruciating detail on her Jen's Gems blog) and the implosion of Vision Forum was fabulous peak drama. 

Jen, who is her very own brand of wacky crazy,  has apparently left Christianity and somewhere in there became a flat earther.  Just google "Jen Epps Fishburne" and a lot of things will pop up.  I think she's doing YouTube now. 

 

Edited November 26, 2023 by Howl

[hoipolloi]

Re: James Leininger. His name just came up as one of the (formerly) secret donors behind the frightening Project 2025. Heʻs still a billionaire and still a fucking asshole. 

Re: Jen. Boy, she sure has moved on but I am sorry for anyone who takes her financial advice. A crypto bro would be more likely to have useful information.

 

5 hours ago, Howl said:

Doug started out as a lawyer for Home School Legal Defense Association.

This seems to be the only time in his adult life that he actually worked as a licensed attorney.

I've only been able to find him in the D.C. bar association where his license is currently suspended for non-payment. It does not look like he was ever licensed in TX. 

ETA: And speaking of the TX bar, I checked on our olʻ buddy Stephen Hammer. He's a junior woodchuck with a big bucks law firm that has bankrolled provided pro bono legal support for conservative/fundie & corporate cases. Indeed, Stephen's pro bono work focuses on "religious liberty issues." 

Edited November 26, 2023 by hoipolloi

[Hane]

@hoipolloi, thanks. Few of our fundies makes my skin crawl as much as Stephen Hammer does. He was brought up in a well-educated Unitarian Universalist family, then decided to take an opportunistic swing to the right by joining an ultraconservative Presbyterian church, joining the military, and scouring the interwebs for a rural fundie homeschooled virgin bride, setting himself up for alignment with the Republican powers that be. I wonder how his poor wife Sarah is doing.

[JermajestyDuggar]

8 minutes ago, Hane said:

@hoipolloi, thanks. Few of our fundies makes my skin crawl as much as Stephen Hammer does. He was brought up in a well-educated Unitarian Universalist family, then decided to take an opportunistic swing to the right by joining an ultraconservative Presbyterian church, joining the military, and scouring the interwebs for a rural fundie homeschooled virgin bride, setting himself up for alignment with the Republican powers that be. I wonder how his poor wife Sarah is doing.

Stephen’s wife just updated the fb profile pic. I’m happy to count 6 and not 7 little Hammers. 

[Giraffe]

What the heck is "jive talk"? That sounds like he pulled this out of a 1950's teacher's handbook!

[hoipolloi]

2 hours ago, Giraffe said:

What the heck is "jive talk"?

Maybe heʻs referring to this infamous scene from Airplane!

[neuroticcat]

2 hours ago, Giraffe said:

What the heck is "jive talk"? That sounds like he pulled this out of a 1950's teacher's handbook!

I mean google says it can refer to any kind of slang, but it also has racial connotations. So hard to say if they are being outright racists with this or snobby about their children speaking without slang. My guess is both.

[marmalade]

17 hours ago, Howl said:

Well, that and shutting down the plague of "jive talk" in his family. 

A lot of this crazy has to do with paranoia of the "evil" outside world, the role of the patriarch as protector from that evil,  and the fiction of the persecution of Christians.  

Doug started out as a lawyer for Home School Legal Defense Association.  That went sideways and he "somehow" got tight with James Leininger, a San Antonio physician who first became seriously mega wealthy after founding a medical technology company.  Leininger has his fingers in a lot of political and financial pies.  He was even on the board of IBLP at one point.  James Leininger WIKI 

Leininger, who is still alive, gave Vision Forum $2.5 million and (I think) owned several houses that the Phillips family lived in and maybe the business offices/warehouse for the business arm of Vision Forum.  

Really, the hey day of Boerne Christian Assembly, Jen Epps Fishburne's excommunication (chronicled in excruciating detail on her Jen's Gems blog) and the implosion of Vision Forum was fabulous peak drama. 

Jen, who is her very own brand of wacky crazy,  has apparently left Christianity and somewhere in there became a flat earther.  Just google "Jen Epps Fishburne" and a lot of things will pop up.  I think she's doing YouTube now. 

 

Yeah, I am aware of the history of Leniniger and VF. Dougie seems to have acted as its figurehead. I was wondering if anyone dug up more dirt on his dealings back then. Besides raping the nanny, that is.