Seewalds 41: Christian Hero Ivy Jane

[WarriorJane]

19 hours ago, AmericanRose said:

I think part of the American healthcare issue is that Drmocrats push for universal (at least, they do now), and Republicans push for limited government. So we end up with something not fully funded, that Republicans point to and say, "see? Government can't get anything right!" If we would fully fund government entities, I think we would be in much better shape.

I recently read a book about politics in the '90s and found it interesting that in order to balance the budget (gee, where did that concern go?) Republicand wanted to cut education and... I want to say Medicare? funding.

100% This.

[SilverBeach]

On 6/26/2019 at 12:42 PM, Eponine said:

I live in the biggest city in the US and I have literally seen people dying in the streets because they are poor.

It is not because they are poor, it is likely because they are mentally ill.  In any event, in my state, closure of residential mental health facilities led to a huge increase in homeless people who may not have the ability to care for themselves, who unfortunately may avoid seeking medical treatment and die. Many know to go to the ER or the county hospital for help. 911 would certainly respond and take a homeless person to the hospital, if someone passing by called. 

From their website: 

"NYC Health + Hospitals is the largest public health care system in the United States. We provide essential inpatient, outpatient, and home-based services to more than one million New Yorkers every year in more than 70 locations across the city’s five boroughs.

Our 11 acute care hospitals provide top-ranked trauma care, dozens of inpatient specialties, and mental health services, making communities healthy through a robust network of hospital-based primary care services for children and adults."

There is much more community based care offered, including a low/no cost insurance program. It may happen in NYC (I'm assuming that's where you live, as that is the largest city n the US) that someone dies in the street, but it is not due to health care not being available for the poor.

 

[SilverBeach]

On 7/4/2019 at 9:47 AM, Abstract said:

If the U.S. had universal healthcare, V.A.-style is what everyone would be getting.

I tell you one thing the VA excels at, it's procuring prescription drugs at low prices for the veterans. The VA negotiates hard, I know because I used to work for them and this is what I did. The VA also runs a state-of-the-art mail order pharmacy.  The VA I worked for was right next to a well-respected teaching hospital and they had a reciprocating arrangement, with doctors from the teaching hospital caring for VA patients. The VA is not without it's problems (politics being a main one), but it is not without value and is not as overall horrible as commonly thought.

I would only hope that universal healthcare would be modeled on successful Canadian and UK systems after some study to determine what would be best here. In all honesty, there is already a broad range of quality in the care received under the present system, and given how opaque the system is, it is hard to know the quality of any given provider. 

[nvmbr02]

On 7/5/2019 at 5:35 PM, SilverBeach said:

I tell you one thing the VA excels at, it's procuring prescription drugs at low prices for the veterans. The VA negotiates hard, I know because I used to work for them and this is what I did. The VA also runs a state-of-the-art mail order pharmacy.  The VA I worked for was right next to a well-respected teaching hospital and they had a reciprocating arrangement, with doctors from the teaching hospital caring for VA patients. The VA is not without it's problems (politics being a main one), but it is not without value and is not as overall horrible as commonly thought.

I would only hope that universal healthcare would be modeled on successful Canadian and UK systems after some study to determine what would be best here. In all honesty, there is already a broad range of quality in the care received under the present system, and given how opaque the system is, it is hard to know the quality of any given provider. 

YES! The mail order pharmacy is amazing. 

[patsymae]

The diabetic who drops dead in the street because he couldn't afford his insulin is dead because he is poor, not because of mental illness. Americans die every day because they can't afford medical treatment. I can't believe anyone would actually dispute this.

[nausicaa]

23 minutes ago, patsymae said:

The diabetic who drops dead in the street because he couldn't afford his insulin is dead because he is poor, not because of mental illness. Americans die every day because they can't afford medical treatment. I can't believe anyone would actually dispute this.

I think the point was that our current healthcare system (usually) creates the most issues for the working and middle class. Poor people can (again, usually) get onto Medicaid or Medicare. 

With the spike in the price of insulin, you don't have to be poor to be unable to afford it. Most cases that I've heard about diabetics dying from rationing insulin were working class people who made too much to qualify for Medicaid.

[SilverBeach]

 

58 minutes ago, patsymae said:

The diabetic who drops dead in the street because he couldn't afford his insulin is dead because he is poor, not because of mental illness. Americans die every day because they can't afford medical treatment. I can't believe anyone would actually dispute this.

I posted FACTS about public health care in NYC and got downvoted, LOL. Must be my day on FJ. A diabetic insulin-dependent homeless (I will google that) has a host of issues, not the least of which is insulin must be refrigerated (28 year diabetic here). Nowhere did I say that health care is optimal for everyone everywhere.  I have previously said that the middle class has the most trouble with health care costs because the truly poor can access programs the middle class cannot. Please do not put a spin on my actual words. 

26 minutes ago, nausicaa said:

With the spike in the price of insulin, you don't have to be poor to be unable to afford it.

I suggest that anyone needing brand-name expensive medication appeal to the manufacturer, there are unpublicized programs to help. I get subsidies for two of my medications. Unfortunately, one must be aggressive in this system to get what you need. It's bad sometimes. I have donated unused, non-expired insulin which I think went overseas because it couldn't be used here. Ridiculous. 

Edited July 8, 2019 by SilverBeach

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

Many of the homeless are there due to mental illness, and those folks don't have health care, with mental health facilities closed down all over the US, these folks are generally only helped in jail/prison.  As for people not having health care or substandard health care, they are the working poor, those who can't afford it, they will have homes, normally but they can't afford that home and their insurance, or medications, like insulin, and a roof over their heads. 

So both of you are right, homeless folks and the working class poor are dying all around us because of lack of access to health care and medical insurance. 

[OyToTheVey]

21 hours ago, nvmbr02 said:

YES! The mail order pharmacy is amazing. 

Depends who you ask. I own a pharmacy. 50% of my patients left because of mail order. Caremark forces people to get mail order even if they don't want it. 

[nvmbr02]

32 minutes ago, OyToTheVey said:

Depends who you ask. I own a pharmacy. 50% of my patients left because of mail order. Caremark forces people to get mail order even if they don't want it. 

I can't speak about Caremark as I have never heard of it and have no clue as to what it is. Silverbeach was discussing the VA mail order pharmacy, which is something the VA does very well. We switched to it shortly after my youngest was born so late 2009/early 2010 and have never had an issue with it. Even when we lived overseas or when we lived in a US territory that was quite a distance to the US they had the prescriptions to us in 7 or 8 days, now that we are back on the mainland US they are usually here in less than 5. It is a huge improvement on going to the VA and waiting a significant amount of time to pick up.

[AtlanticTug]

13 hours ago, SilverBeach said:

not the least of which is insulin must be refrigerated (28 year diabetic here).

My kwikpens do not need to be refrigerated once opened (good for 4 wks at up to 86F/30C, they don't last that long though).

[Alachantal]

On 6/23/2019 at 4:56 AM, AussieKrissy said:

Do you have a health care card? 

Ambulances are not free in nsw unless you have a health care or pension card.

i am lucky the one and only time I had to take an ambulance it was only a “cheap” ride and it was about 340 and my health care cover I had at the time paid it. 

Since then I have cancelled my health care cover, but found out that one ambulance ride can cost 2.5k. 

I decided to pay about a 100 bucks a year to cover any ambulance rides and I’m pretty sure helicopter rides  for me and my daughter. 

I think when I was googling there was one state here that was free. 

Edited to add that everytime I read anything American health care related I thank good for own crappy flawed but pretty much free health care. People don’t die here because they are poor. 

Yeah universal health care. Thank you Bob Hawke and Medicare. 

That's crazy - 340$ for an ambulance ride! I think it was 50$ last time I needed one in Canada. 

[patsymae]

I'm so sick of hearing that poor people get all these wonderful things that working people don't. First of all, it's very possible to be both working and poor (that would be me, for instance, and you can add elderly (over 65)). With an income of under $1000 per month, the state of Florida denied me Medicaid but designated me as "medically needy" and agreed to pay any of my not-covered-by-Medicare (which would be 20 percent of everything, if not more) out-of-pocket expenses that exceeded $645 a month. So that would be paying $135 for Medicare and $645 for out of pocket, leaving me with a walloping $200 a month for rent, food and other incidentals. I have worked since I was 13 years old and am still working.

Poor people get crap medical care just like many middle class people get crap medical care. Some counties don't even have doctors who accept Medicaid even if you get it. ER does not help much if you have a chronic condition (ask Jimmy Fallon).

Rich people, on the other hand, get good medical care. For everybody else it is a crap shoot, and more of a crap shoot the poorer you get.

[Virago]

In my state - which includes urban areas - a family of four has to make under $800 (last I checked) for the adults to qualify for Medicaid and they cannot hold assets in excess of a few thousand dollars (so, better not own a car!). Additionally, my state did not opt into the Medicaid expansion with the ACA passage so many people make too much for Medicaid and too little to qualify for federal subsidies. I would hardly argue that a family making $801 per month for a family of four isn’t poor. Our best coverage option for the adults in my family is $500 a month for a $20k deductible plan, full pay until deductible is met.

 

So sure, a few states offer great public health care, for which people qualify based on fair and realistic real world income/asset requirements. Many states do not. It’s mind blowing to me that people are on here arguing that poor people (even if only in urban areas) don’t die for lack of medical coverage because that’s objectively not true.

[nausicaa]

30 minutes ago, patsymae said:

I'm so sick of hearing that poor people get all these wonderful things that working people don't. First of all, it's very possible to be both working and poor (that would be me, for instance, and you can add elderly (over 65)).

If this is aimed at my post, I just want to clarify that I never stated that "poor" is synonymous with "not working." I did use the term "working class," which is generally used as an income and cultural designation. 

[AliceInFundyland]

I don't know what to think.

I'm in Oregon.

I spent quite a long time on full-time state funded coverage. I was working but PT and under the level. Then I spent some time on a program where I paid a subsidy of $9/month.

I bankrupted out over surgery bills.

I have had hospitals cover my expenses in a couple instances (including recently when I was actually fully insured because I met their financial aid requirements).

Other than the growing issues with opioids, which tend to be applied to all classes of patient. I do not believe I have experienced any discrimination in my care in the wide range of medical situations I have had to deal with.

I would like to think this is universal. I know better.

And, I know from my job the state problems that exist sometimes aren't solvable by a person's finances. We have bed shortages for mental health.

There are so many issues. It's the government. It's Big Pharma and the lobbyists. It is fifty states with different existing systems and taxpayers who do not believe. It is 10 competing insurance companies within the state.

Right now there are five foods I can swallow reliably without gagging. Do you know how much an endoscopy costs? The tests I had to take before I could get to that point cost $1200.

My employer can't afford to give me better coverage although ironically I do make more money than I have ever have.

There are so many agendas in this game. We have got to standardize it across the country. It is such a problem.

 

[spacecase33]

I work for the Medicaid program of a state that hasn't been mentioned here yet (anything I say here is my personal opinion and not my employer's, obviously).  It makes me happy to see that many of you who have used your state's Medicaid program had a positive experience.  We work hard every day to make sure our enrollees receive the quality care to which they are entitled, and I remind my employees every chance I get that they play an important role in making sure a significant number of people in our state have health care.  As others have alluded to (and this definitely isn't the case in all states), Medicaid in my state offers a richer benefit package than most commercial plans, especially when it comes to covering behavioral health needs. 

As for the very real problem of the income tier that doesn't qualify for Medicaid but would struggle to purchase commercial coverage, my proudest accomplishment of my career thus far was a small role I got to play in my previous job (also in state government) in getting approval for a new program that has made significant strides in stopping the rising premiums on our Exchange and making individual insurance coverage more affordable again.  I was uninsurable on the individual market due to (non life threatening) preexisting conditions before the ACA, so providing access to quality health care is something I take personally.  Just thought I'd step in here to show that "real" humans are behind providing government health care ?.

[AussieKrissy]

On 7/9/2019 at 1:14 AM, Alachantal said:

That's crazy - 340$ for an ambulance ride! I think it was 50$ last time I needed one in Canada. 

That is cheap from what I have heard and I shared the ride with another patient who was being picked up from the same medical center. She got the bed while I sat in the passenger seat. 

It was the most expensive "taxi ride" of my life. I was very fortunate I did not actually "need" their services at the time though. 

I begged the Doctor to let me drive to the hospital but she would not let me as she thought I was stroking out. Fair call, in hind sight.

[Someone Out There]

7 hours ago, AussieKrissy said:

That is cheap from what I have heard and I shared the ride with another patient who was being picked up from the same medical center. She got the bed while I sat in the passenger seat. 

It was the most expensive "taxi ride" of my life. I was very fortunate I did not actually "need" their services at the time though.  

I begged the Doctor to let me drive to the hospital but she would not let me as she thought I was stroking out. Fair call, in hind sight. 

Yup $340 is a cheap Ambulance ride in Australia.  One I know of was $8xx from wherever the Hobart Cruise Ships dock to Hobart Hospital.  The really expensive ones are the ones with helicopters and remote areas.  I'm not entirely sure what Australian's pay for those, but people from overseas should definately have travel insurance when travelling in remote locations in Australia (you should anyway).

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

All the medical woahs are going to get worse, If the assholes in the GOP get their way, they will completely gut the ACA, bring back preexisting conditions, kids will no longer be able to stay on their parents health care until 26, which will really fuck my daughter who is planing on going to dental school, which means she has 8 years of university, she won't finish dental school until she's 26, you trying working full time and going to dental school (which is basally medical school just specializing on the mouth/teeth) full time while doing a full time unpaid internship. You can't do it, there aren't enough hours in the day.  All this because the GOP are fucking evil hateful monsters who get off on the suffering of others. And Fuck Trump because he is the worst of them all. 

[JDuggs]

2 hours ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

All the medical woahs are going to get worse, If the assholes in the GOP get their way, they will completely gut the ACA, bring back preexisting conditions, kids will no longer be able to stay on their parents health care until 26, which will really fuck my daughter who is planing on going to dental school, which means she has 8 years of university, she won't finish dental school until she's 26

The university she attends will require that she has health insurance and she’ll have the option of being covered through the university’s insurance. It may not be as economical as your insurance though. I totally agree that the ACA is crucial and we need to preserve all of its benefits.

[EmmieJ]

On ‎7‎/‎7‎/‎2019 at 5:18 PM, patsymae said:

The diabetic who drops dead in the street because he couldn't afford his insulin is dead because he is poor, not because of mental illness. Americans die every day because they can't afford medical treatment. I can't believe anyone would actually dispute this.

For a couple of years, I did not have health insurance, due to not being able to afford it any longer.  I became a patient of a local health care clinic, which charged on a sliding scale.  Fortunately, I was in pretty decent health, so I didn't have a lot of office visits, which cost me around $40 per visit.  I could afford that.  I was prescribed medication for high blood pressure and through Target's pharmacy, was able to get those meds at a fairly affordable cost (generic).  A local winery had a program that provided low-cost to no-cost mammograms for women who qualified, and I was one who did qualify. 

But I then had a car accident.  I went to  a local urgent care clinic (not the emergency room), and received treatment and a prescription for pain meds and muscle relaxers.  The charge was also on a sliding scale, and I could make installment payments if needed.  I think I was charged $100 for the visit.  I got the prescriptions filled at Target - not so cheap but I was able to afford them.  I was able to get a few physical therapy visits covered by the med pay coverage on my auto policy.  When that ran out, I stopped getting p.t. because I couldn't afford it.

Then the ACA began to kick in, and because I lost a family member to colon cancer before he turned 50, and I was over 50, I got a colonoscopy.  That was "covered" under the ACA --- but a lot of the associated charges were not, like the anesthesiologist's bill, which was over $1,000, and the "operating room" where the colonoscopy was performed.  It took me many months, but I did finally get those charges paid off. 

Thankfully, I didn't have a more serious disease or medical condition during that time, because I can see how easily it would have bankrupted me.  There is certainly some medical care available at low or no cost to uninsured people, but it's not comprehensive.  It covers the basics, like an eye exam, or doctor's visits, but it does not help if you need an expensive drug or treatment for cancer or something serious like that.

(Once the ACA fully kicked in, I signed up for Kaiser coverage through California's website.  I know some people weren't happy with the ACA, but it has been a lifesaver for me and I've been able to afford the monthly premiums.)

[AmericanRose]

It's all part of the Republicans plan -- make sure the ACA has weak legs so it can't be all that it was intended to be, so when it's threatened people write it off as 'it didn't work that great anyway'. I'm still trying to figure out how freedom entails being 'free' from healthcare....

I don't really remember insurance before the ACA -- I was young and fairly healthy, plus I heard horror stories of rising premiums and "pre-existing conditions" -- as I had been diagnosed with asthma at age 2, I figured I wouldn't be approved anyway. I had to visit a walk-in clinic in 2013 and paid $163 for the visit and $50 for the antibiotic (I got a coupon!) and then I got a bill from the lab for $710.
I've since added Graves' disease and anemia to my health resume, so no ACA doesn't bode well for me!

I would prefer Medicare for All, but the ACA is better than the nothing we had before. Insurance companies are out to make a profit, they don't give a shit about your health.

 

[patsymae]

On 7/7/2019 at 8:50 PM, nausicaa said:

I think the point was that our current healthcare system (usually) creates the most issues for the working and middle class. Poor people can (again, usually) get onto Medicaid or Medicare. 

With the spike in the price of insulin, you don't have to be poor to be unable to afford it. Most cases that I've heard about diabetics dying from rationing insulin were working class people who made too much to qualify for Medicaid.

Thus the guy who drops dead on the street from lack of insulin. Who might have been walking to work.

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

The whole point of it is, we live in a supposed Christian country, but in our country (USA) guns are a God given right and health care is a privilege.  That really doesn't sound very Christ like to me, but what do I know, I'm just an evil liberal who thinks, everyone should have access to health care, mental health care, dental health care, food, education, clean air and water. Call me crazy, call me a socialist, or what ever, but I believe in God, and I believe in healthcare, education, clean water and clean air for everyone. I guess my version of Jesus is messed up according to the "Religious right".