Blackjack Bateses! - Bates 21

[TheDuggarnaut]

Ok add me to the very confused.

If these young couples are already very physically affectionate, saying "I love you", and talking constantly while just being "special friends", what is the point of the courtship phase??? Why not go straight to engagement? The courtship stage seems pointless and redundant to me.

 

[Audrey2]

2 hours ago, TheDuggarnaut said:

If these young couples are already very physically affectionate, saying "I love you", and talking constantly while just being "special friends", what is the point of the courtship phase??? Why not go straight to engagement? The courtship stage seems pointless and redundant to me.

Of course they must have the courtship phase. That's how they show the world they're special snowflakes and not heathen daters like the rest of us! That way you can brag about how pure you are, and how you saved your first kiss for the wedding ceremony, before having your lips deflowered in front of 1,000 of your closest friends. 

[Eternalbluepearl]

I noticed in the episode where Meemaw got married, that Bobby and Tori were already holding hands. The Duggars would be appalled. Honestly, I like that they are showing more affection and acting a bit more like normal teenagers. Sometimes I think the Bates use the word "courtship" to still be like their friends but It's more like dating in reality. Kelly even referred to Evan as Carlin' s boyfriend and there has been no asking Gil for Carlin' s hand or anything that we know of. Just two teens with the hots for each other. 

[VelociRapture]

3 minutes ago, Eternalbluepearl said:

I noticed in the episode where Meemaw got married, that Bobby and Tori were already holding hands. The Duggars would be appalled. Honestly, I like that they are showing more affection and acting a bit more like normal teenagers. Sometimes I think the Bates use the word "courtship" to still be like their friends but It's more like dating in reality. Kelly even referred to Evan as Carlin' s boyfriend and there has been no asking Gil for Carlin' s hand or anything that we know of. Just two teens with the hots for each other. 

I have no doubts that the men ask Gil's permission. I think they're simply better at marketing than the Duggars and benefit from their show being edited to reflect better on them.

Dating does not involve constant chaperoning. Courtship does. The Bates and Duggars both use chaperones, both practice courtships, and use similar courtship models.

Both families claim to let their children choose their own standards. I think the difference you noticed in affection levels likely has more to do with the molestation history in the Duggar family than anything. I think the Duggar parents may have been more militant about physical contact - like holding hands - for that reason.

But the Bates kids aren't given free reign either. There's no kissing, nothing that looks like snuggling, they're constantly kept in view of other people... basically, they may have a bit more freedom but they aren't free to really choose their standards the way a normal couple does.

[WiseGirl]

So, doing some caretaking of parents and discovered they have Up. I was going to attempt to recap the show....when I hit a stumbling block. How the heck do you people stay awake during these shows?  I stand even more in awe of all you who recap this or any Duggar show. May Rufus continue to bless you and keep you awake during these....on the bright side I think I've discovered a cure for insomnia....

 

[AlternativeVoice]

So Carlin was getting to know someone before Evan and it didn't work out......any bets that it might be Joe ? Who proposed to the other chick at his sisters wedding ? Where Carlin was a bridesmaid ? Oh the tea I would love to sip at Joys wedding.

[TheDuggarnaut]

3 hours ago, AlternativeVoice said:

So Carlin was getting to know someone before Evan and it didn't work out......any bets that it might be Joe ? Who proposed to the other chick at his sisters wedding ? Where Carlin was a bridesmaid ? Oh the tea I would love to sip at Joys wedding.

I thought I remembered speculation about Carlin and Joe! Well, Carlin is so twitterpated right now that she probably didn't care that Joe was there.

[fluffernutter]

Front hugs during the boyfriend stage!! Not the courtship stage, not the engaged stage, but just boyfriend stage. I'm surprised the Smuggars even associate with them anymore. 

[wandering woman]

I found Evan's family to be super irritating. Carlin seems to adore them, however, and thinks that they are just like her family members.

[Mayluka]

This is slightly random, but I was just scrolling back through Carlin's Instagram to see if I could tell when Evan appeared in the picture. I noticed that Evan's sister has been commenting on Carlin's posts since June of last year. This seems earlier in my mind than I expected her to have become friends with the family, since Evan wasn't introduced until episodes that were shot in January or so.

[mstee]

Carlin and Evan seem to have the perfect teenage relationship...that in the real world would probably end in 6 months after some petty argument. Instead, we see his parents talking about marriage with them. Ahhh. No. I did enjoy seeing more of Katie, though. She seems very likeable. 

Id love to know who broke Carlin's heart. They make their courtships out to be fool proof by sweeping "failures" under the rug. I was impressed how they spoke about Ashley and Nathan not working out, but it was one episode. And never spoken of again. And they kind of had to since their special friendship was all over the show. 

[justmy2cents]

1 hour ago, Mayluka said:

This is slightly random, but I was just scrolling back through Carlin's Instagram to see if I could tell when Evan appeared in the picture. I noticed that Evan's sister has been commenting on Carlin's posts since June of last year. This seems earlier in my mind than I expected her to have become friends with the family, since Evan wasn't introduced until episodes that were shot in January or so.

They supposedly started dating in the fall after some women's conference.  Can people comment on old posts on Instagram?

[Mayluka]

19 minutes ago, justmy2cents said:

They supposedly started dating in the fall after some women's conference.  Can people comment on old posts on Instagram?

They can, but it shows how many weeks ago they commented. His sister's comments show they were from the same time that the pictures were posted. 

I feel like I remember Carlin vaguely mentioning they knew (or knew of?) his family for longer, and then she and Evan sort of got together after Erin suggested it at the women's conference. I just don't know if that was when she and Evan actually first met, or if it was more of Erin being like "Hey, we vaguely know you/your family and you guys are both single! Why don't you get together?"

[justmy2cents]

9 minutes ago, Mayluka said:

I feel like I remember Carlin vaguely mentioning they knew (or knew of?) his family for longer,

OK, I don't remember.  I only remember Erin saying something about his family being very musical and Carlin liking music so she thought they would be a good match.

[RosyDaisy]

Tori/ Bobby and Carlin/Evan have been touchy-feely since the guys were introduced on the show.

Carlin was a bridesmaid in Joy's wedding. There's a picture on the Joy and Austin thread that confirms it.

Could the heartbreak Carlin was referring to was Nathan and Ashley and not her own?

[VelociRapture]

@RosyDaisyI was wondering about whether her heartbreak was someone else's as well. Or she simply made it up or embellished a bit for some reason.

11 hours ago, AlternativeVoice said:

So Carlin was getting to know someone before Evan and it didn't work out......any bets that it might be Joe ? Who proposed to the other chick at his sisters wedding ? Where Carlin was a bridesmaid ? Oh the tea I would love to sip at Joys wedding.

Carlin is implying something along those lines. But other than a cryptic Instagram post, there's nothing to go off of.

4 hours ago, fluffernutter said:

Front hugs during the boyfriend stage!! Not the courtship stage, not the engaged stage, but just boyfriend stage. I'm surprised the Smuggars even associate with them anymore. 

I wrote this in an earlier post, but the two families are much more similar in their approaches than many people like to think:

- both have "getting to know you" periods.  

- both have official courtship periods.

- both appear to have engagements lasting around 3 months.

- no couples are allowed to be out of view and out of hearing of their chaperones. We've seen some evidence to suggest they both allow the couples to speak privately at some point, while still remaining in eyesight - the Keilens doing that worksheet thing in the woods with her parents and Jinger sitting all the way at the back of the chapel when Benessa or engaged.

- both families have certain expectations regarding behavior. For instance, no premarital sex or kissing or cuddling.

The Bateses appear much more comfortable with physical affection than the Duggars. That isn't really weird to be honest. Many people aren't comfortable being physically affectionate around chaperones or other people. The Duggars also have the sexual assaults of four of their daughters by one of their sons to contend with. It doesn't surprise me at all that they may have held most of their married kids so far to stricter standards than the Bateses have for that reason. 

[justmy2cents]

14 hours ago, RosyDaisy said:

Could the heartbreak Carlin was referring to was Nathan and Ashley and not her own?

 

14 hours ago, VelociRapture said:

Carlin is implying something along those lines. But other than a cryptic Instagram post, there's nothing to go off of.

She said in the last episode that the song (that Evan wrote)  'kind of related to some of my life, she had somebody but it kind of didn't work out, waiting patiently when you're ready to love again'. To me it definitely sounds like she's talking about herself.

[HarleyQuinn]

I remember when we all thought Joe got to go to Crown just so he could "get to know" a Bates daughter. IIRC it was split at first between Tori or Carlin as who he was getting to know. Maybe it is Joe she was referring to? She was probably too much of a handful for poor Beavis. 

[justmy2cents]

22 minutes ago, HarleyQuinn said:

I. Maybe it is Joe she was referring to? She was probably too much of a handful for poor Beavis. 

She and Kendra seem very different. 

There was an episode last season or before about the brothers where the  kidults were asked to describe an idea deal mate for the 3 older brothers. Wish I could go back and see what everyone had to say about Joe. I think most of them picked a blonde for him and he said brunette (or I have that backwards) and most everyone chose a quiet woman for him. This was during the time when there was speculation about him and Carlin.

[mstee]

Must suck in fundy land to be a woman (for way many more reasons than just this) having to wait around hoping the guy you have a crush on notices you, decides he has a crush as well, calls your dad up to see if he can text with you, dad approves it, and then texting or talking on the phone (with family around!) can begin. God I would never have the patience. 

[JMO]

@Eternalbluepearl Bobby and Tori were already courting prior to Meemaws wedding. Their courting episode was shown last season. It was very forgettable. I've actually watched it 3 times and still can't tell you what exactly happens. Except that they were on a beach in Florida.  And Alyssa was pregnant.  And they were told to save room for the holy ghost because they were cuddling so close. 

[ColeJo]

3 hours ago, mstee said:

Must suck in fundy land to be a woman (for way many more reasons than just this) having to wait around hoping the guy you have a crush on notices you, decides he has a crush as well, calls your dad up to see if he can text with you, dad approves it, and then texting or talking on the phone (with family around!) can begin. God I would never have the patience. 

There is no way I can be a woman in that type of family. I prefer privacy even when I'm talking to Customer Service. I just don't like being on the phone around other people. They have to emphasize letting the man lead the relationship.

[snickers34]

Random....has it been sufficiently discussed how amazing the Bates' complexions are? Perfect skin, not a blemish in sight, even for the teenagers. WTF, not fair?!

[QuiverFullofBooks]

4 hours ago, JMO said:

@Eternalbluepearl Bobby and Tori were already courting prior to Meemaws wedding. Their courting episode was shown last season. It was very forgettable. I've actually watched it 3 times and still can't tell you what exactly happens. Except that they were on a beach in Florida.  And Alyssa was pregnant.  And they were told to save room for the holy ghost because they were cuddling so close. 

I loved that Tori's response was "He's in our hearts!"

[wandering woman]

12 hours ago, snickers34 said:

Random....has it been sufficiently discussed how amazing the Bates' complexions are? Perfect skin, not a blemish in sight, even for the teenagers. WTF, not fair?!

That's why they're on TV. They're very attractive. The Duggar kids don't have such great skin. Jessa is prone to pimples, and so is Josiah.

I think that Tori and Bobby may be doing a bit more than hugging. My guess is that they will be married before her college graduation. Their hormones are running strong.