Jahi McMath 3: Issued Second Death Certificate and Will Finally Be Allowed to Rest

[Ozlsn]

18 hours ago, AmazonGrace said:

Oh excessive bleeding after surgery again, just like the first time. Did she have some kind of blood clotting disorder?

Interesting thought. I suspect if she did it was undiagnosed. 

I am glad she is at peace, hard as that is on her family. I hope they have good support, particularly her siblings.

[mango_fandango]

I knew this had to happen eventually. 

I cannot imagine how the family feel, particularly the siblings.

[ColeJo]

Clinically speaking, even after a few weeks on a ventilator, there is this term called "ventilator brain." The brain essentially turns to mush (I'm shuddering as I'm writing this). I can't imagine several years after brain death.

[Palimpsest]

Well thank goodness Jahi's desecrated corpse can finally be laid to rest.  In peace, poor little girl.

Jahi has been dead and  brain dead since 2013.  She has not felt pain since then.

Everything surrounding this case has been about pathological denial and politics.  And money.  Lots of it.

Perhaps now her mother can finally let go of the corpse and allow Jahi's siblings to move on with their lives in peace.

I hope so.

[Jug Band Baby]

8 hours ago, Briefly said:

Yes, and I do feel for her family.  But she has been dead for years and they should have just let her go.  I know it must have been hard, but that poor girl can now rest.  I hope that her family is able to find some peace now.

I do wonder how they could find a doctor that would operate on her.

Either her mother was using her death for all the money she could, or people around her were feeding a delusion instead of getting her mental health help to accept the death of her daughter, and no matter which way it is, Jahi's siblings have been forced to play along and treat Jahi like she's alive.  I can't believe for a second that all of the siblings believed she was still alive.  No way about any of this is okay.

And since Jahi's body was in New Jersey, where rejecting brain death is allowed, I doubt doctors can really treat her differently than someone who really is alive.  I read a couple articles over the years by anonymous nurses about how mentally difficult it was having to treat a body as if it was still alive when all the medical evidence and the death certificate say she's not.  What even is the protocol?  For a surgery, what does an anesthesiologist have to look for for signs of pain when a person is dead?  Doctors on med school use corpses to learn their way around the body, but what are they supposed to look for on a dead body to know they're doing it right or wrong, or do they just half-ass it since there's no point, and then have to deal with guilt because of the instinct to do their best, even though Jahi was dead?  When I read those articles a while back, it made me think about the toll it had to be taking on medical staff who were required to use their skills on a dead body instead of using that time taking care of patients who were alive.  Medical workers do tend to see dead bodies as worthy of some dignity and respect, and Jahi was deprived of both by everyone being forced to treat her body like she was alive and well.

[LaLele]

19 hours ago, ColeJo said:

Clinically speaking, even after a few weeks on a ventilator, there is this term called "ventilator brain." The brain essentially turns to mush (I'm shuddering as I'm writing this). I can't imagine several years after brain death.

I *think* (its been more than a few years since my neuro classes) that as long as the garbageman brain cells (can't remember name of the cells) still functioned then they would have taken the mush out and the brain area would have been mostly full of cerebral spinal fluid at this point years later.   There is a lot of *if still functioned* going on in my hypothesis.  Since other waste systems were still functioning this might be a possibility though?  I am not a doctor so ignore or correct me if someone knows more or feels like googling.  

 

[curlykate]

Wow. FInally. What a sad relief that poor Jahi’s body finally gave out. As sad and difficult a time as this must be for her loved ones, hopefully now they can find closure and finally lay Jahi to rest. 

[ADoyle90815]

Hopefully, her family can now have closure, now that her body can be laid to rest after being dead for these years.

[HarryPotterFan]

5 hours ago, LaLele said:

I *think* (its been more than a few years since my neuro classes) that as long as the garbageman brain cells (can't remember name of the cells) still functioned then they would have taken the mush out and the brain area would have been mostly full of cerebral spinal fluid at this point years later.   There is a lot of *if still functioned* going on in my hypothesis.  Since other waste systems were still functioning this might be a possibility though?  I am not a doctor so ignore or correct me if someone knows more or feels like googling.  

 

I’ll ask my brother about this. He’s a doctor and majored in neurobiology in college.

I’m glad Jahi can finally be laid to rest. Hopefully her family can accept this reality and properly grieve.

[PennySycamore]

@LaLele, I just looked the term up in my neurobiology text and those cells are microglial cells which are phagocytotic cells which become active during injury or illness.  

[Rachel333]

*sigh*

The legal battle will likely keep going. From DocBastard's post:

Quote

Nailah plans to pursue a federal civil rights lawsuit to get the date of death on the death certificate changed from December 12, 2013 to June 22, 2018.  I haven't a clue what she thinks that would accomplish nor how much time and effort this would take away from her caring for her three other children.

 

[Jug Band Baby]

23 minutes ago, Rachel333 said:

*sigh*

The legal battle will likely keep going. From DocBastard's post:

 

What I think she is hoping to get for is is lots of money.  If the original death certificate is changed, then Jahi was "harmed" and her mom can probably try to get millions for "pain and suffering" since it wouldn't be a death case, which has a cap.  That woman needs to start spending some time with her other kids before they kick her out of their lives.

[Ozlsn]

Interesting. From the doc bastard post linked above:

"Jahi started a slow but steady decline since then, including renal failure and lactic acidosis, culminating in disseminated intravascular coagulation, multi-system organ failure, and fulminant liver failure causing uncontrollable bleeding.  She was apparently brought back to the operating theatre for "one last look" on June 22, got back to the intensive care unit, promptly coded, and died.  Again."

Someone asked in the comments about the possibility of a clotting disorder and an interesting response was:

"I don't think they would have done the surgery the first time if they knew she had a bleeding disorder/clotting problems - if they did know about one, they would have corrected it first, waited until she was stable for surgery, and then proceed. I'm guessing the excessive bleeding the first time, was due to clot disruption...

The excessive bleeding the second time around was likely due to the liver failure - the liver makes a lot of the proteins involved in the clotting cascade....So if your liver isn't working, you won't clot well, and you'll have bleeding problems...

just the thoughts of an icu nurse =D"

Poor Jahi.

[PennySycamore]

Thanks for your informative post, @Ozlsn!

[unsafetydancer]

This was possibly the first topic I actually posted in, I never thought it would take over three years for it to end. RIP Jahi, at last her siblings can have closure and her body can be laid to rest.

[RosyDaisy]

Sweet angel, your body can now be laid to rest and desacrated no more.

[Buzzard]

2 minutes ago, RosyDaisy said:

Sweet angel, your body can now be laid to rest and desacrated no more.

Except they kept her brain to study, I mean, find a quack as a basis to sue the hospital over.

Her Mom will never let this child go until the gravy train runs out of steam.

[Jug Band Baby]

32 minutes ago, unsafetydancer said:

This was possibly the first topic I actually posted in, I never thought it would take over three years for it to end. RIP Jahi, at last her siblings can have closure and her body can be laid to rest.

Over 4.5 years.  Meanwhile, Nailha has other kids who have had to treat their dead sister like a living playmate, and doctors and nurses have had to act like this body was a living person.  Years of med school just to operate on a corpse to feed the delusion that the person is alive still.

[Jug Band Baby]

2 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

Except they kept her brain to study, I mean, find a quack as a basis to sue the hospital over.

Her Mom will never let this child go until the gravy train runs out of steam.

Please be kidding....

[Jug Band Baby]

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Case-of-Jahi-McMath-girl-declared-brain-dead-13039308.php

Okay, Nailha needs to be barred from filing more cases.  It's so obvious that she's definitely never going to stop.  I think it's a matter of pride.  And she doesn't even know what kind of damage she's trying to cause by trying to make it legal that brain death isn't death.  We have a system that can't handle keeping corpses on support indefinitely.  That's resources that are needed for living people.  Like it or not, when the brain is dead, the person is gone, and all this sort of incredibly expensive theatrical bullshit does is divert resources away from the living so that a family can delay a funeral.

[Buzzard]

6 minutes ago, Jug Band Baby said:

Please be kidding....

I wish I was

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.yahoo.com/amphtml/entertainment/jahi-mcmath-doctors-declared-brain-050443563.html

[SilverBeach]

It's a scary thought, but perhaps her mother thinks that preserving Jahi's brain is another way of keeping "her" alive. I hope this is not the case. Jahi did not have a neurological disorder, did she? Jahi's brain will be subject to what type of study? I wonder if this was the first death Jahi's mother had experienced. She just cannot let go and does not seem to understand that everyone dies, and death is a part of life. It is so sad that even though Jahi's body is truly dead, her mother still won't let her rest in peace. Establishing a memorial foundation or scholarship, helping other parents who have lost a child, these activities would honor Jahi instead of having her be some kind of freak. I'm a mother, I know a mother's love, my mom buried two children including one who was brain dead like Jahi. I just don't get this woman. So, so sorry for her family.

[SilverBeach]

My mom was on a ventilator for a week before she died. If Jahi did have any awareness at all, I cannot imagine her discomfort after several years with a tube down her throat. Jahi's mom just does not accept the validity of brain death and feels that her daughter's  living corpse is preferable to letting her go. Seeing my daughter in that condition for years would have devastated me. And what is the point of changing the date of death on the first death certificate? It will just feed the mother's illusion that Jahi has been alive all this time, which maybe is what she wants. This is all so fascinatingly sad. Something is definitely amiss with the mother.

[Jug Band Baby]

Jesus.  There are just a couple things that could be going on.  

A ) Nailha is just after money, which I think is the case.  

B ) Nailha believe Jahi is still alive for real.  If this is the case, somebody needs to get her mental health help so she can start to accept reality.

Under no circumstances should the definition of death be changed to appease someone who is, one way or the other, not mentally functioning in a normal and healthy way.  She's got other kids she left behind to pursue a case to claim a corpse is alive based solely on medical technology existing to delay decay by trying to push the body onward.  When those kids were shown in New Jersey, it was always uncomfortable photos of them pampering her like a toy.  She needs to stop this shit and start giving attention to the other kids.

I think Nailha thinks her daughter's atrophied brain matter belongs in a museum or something, with a plaque and about she "fought for life" despite having no ability to have consciousness.  Brain death is death because, without a functioning brain, you only have a body, not a person.

[Jug Band Baby]

3 minutes ago, SilverBeach said:

 And what is the point of changing the date of death on the first death certificate?

If the date is changed, then CHO could be forced to pay for all of that "health"care.  It would be money in Nailha's pocket since the care was paid for already, mostly though donations.  And you know that, if CHO had to reimburse the costs, that Nailha wouldn't reimburse the donors.