Arkansas Midwife Loses License - Mother Speaks Out Merged

[SilverBeach]

1 hour ago, ClaraOswin said:

Well, like I said...I'd never do it. For basically the same reasons you've stated.

But I also know that not everyone thinks like me. A lot of people don't mind the mess. Some have a lot of fear about hospitals. Some are comfortable without doctors nearby (I am the opposite.) It's easy to weigh a baby at home. (I would be more worried about the baby's health than weight.)

I would hope these home birth women would take their baby to a hospital sooner rather than later. Things like the pulse ox screening are pretty important. I wonder how long they wait before going in.

Yes, that's why I emphasized to each her own, because I know there are plenty of women that don't think like I do. I also don't understand fear of hospitals. I don't like them but I am not afraid of them. When I mentioned the scale, that was just one of the many post birth activities that needs to take place, for health reasons. I was concerned about all of that. I hate mess, again that is just me, but it was hardly my reason for wanting a hospital birth.

I would hope that any prospective mother would make her decision on the basis of the  best medical interests of the baby, not her preferential birth experience. But, and I cant state this often enough...to each her own.

Baby Wren's tragedy happened in six minutes and his family was very near a hospital. So, so sad.

[SilverBeach]

2 hours ago, Four is Enough said:

I wouldn't say they're "trendy"... My father and mother were both born at home.. and so were their siblings. That was circa 1929, but most births were done at home until doctors got hold of it for a revenue source..

Home births were the default method in the earlier parts of the 20th century. For poor people and minorities, particularly in rural areas, there was no other option. My dad was born in 1923 in Chicago, at the county hospital. My mom was born in 1926 in Arkansas at home. 

Throughout history, childbirth has been one of the riskiest things a woman could do, and infant/ mother deaths were common. Better medical care has decreased maternal and infant mortality  substantially. I don't quite agree with your last paragraph. Is childbirth natural? Yes. Is it a physical process that can be fraught with peril? Yes. Babies and mothers have poor outcomes even in hospital settings, so to take unnecessary risks does not seem wise to me. Like I said before, Im not very crunchy. YMMV and likely does and that's OK! 

[countressrascal]

As a medical professional (BSRN,WHNP-BC, CNM) I did home births i rural AZ for about 5 yrs, before malpractice insurance issue. All my patients had the same per-natal care that they would have received from an OB/GYN, if there any red flags they would be switched to the Count and have  a hospital birth, about  25% of them were ruled out. Here is the  issue with CPM they operate alone without any OB/GYN oversight which is very dangerous. Since I do on call for a local hospital L&D I see the transfers from home births that go wrong all the time, it has increased since they can do VBAC now bad idea plus their per-natal care is lacking. Now they want to be covered by insurance-no way. When State of AZ was rewriting the home birth guidelines, medical professional tried to upgrade the qualifications to get a CPM license but it did not pass. We wanted them to have LPN (2 yr community college), 3 yrs of hospital L&D experience, have a professional relationship with OB/GYN, 24 hrs of professional CME per year plus use the exam that is used in England for CPM, they would not hear of it. Now that they want to get covered by insurance they will have to step up to the plate and become the "medical"professional that they want to be. 

One of the reason that people chose home birth because it is less expense that a hospital birth by about $2,500 but is that worth someone life. 

[Snarkylark]

4 hours ago, Timetostoplurking said:

Hospital birth for me!!  All 3 of them.  I would do that again in a heartbeat.  The nurses were wonderful, the doctors awesome, my hubs?!?!  Well, he managed to not pass out. Lol.    The rooms were comfortable and hubs spent the night with me and the new baby.  Even the food was pretty good.  For me, my birth didn't have to be extra special, or super personal.  It wasn't a test of my pain tolerance or stamina.  I just had to feel safe and comfortable.  I just wanted an average, low stress, run-of-the-mill birth.  That's what I got!!   

Yes, exactly! I even stayed the extra day allowed by my insurance each time because it was wonderful to have nurses and doctors all around, lactation consultants, and dietary!!! I didn't have to worry about a thing except for bonding with my baby. I knew that the second I got home it would be much harder to rest and recover once I had other little mouths to feed, piles of laundry to do, and the like;)

[ClaraOswin]

I had a c-section so obviously a hospital was best for that...haha! But I felt as comfortable as I could in a hospital. My c-section was on a Tuesday. I went home Friday afternoon. If the bed hadn't been super uncomfortable, I probably would have stayed longer just because it was nice having room service for every meal and snacks. My son always had leaky diapers 100 times a day so I was happy to not have to do any of the laundry.

[FundieFarmer]

I have zero fear of hospitals and feel safe in them because of my condition, but I've asked about why others are afraid and my physicians have told me it's often because family members have died and they associate hospitals with a bad loss and fear it in that situation for them. Kind of like PTSD. Of course there are other reasons I hear about every day in my line of work- bad physician experiences, billing and insurance practices, incompetencies, etc- but those are more annoyances than true fear.

So glad you mentioned pulse ox, ClaraOswin! It's so important!!

[ClaraOswin]

Yep...

"For every 200 children with a critical CHD (congenital heart defect), at least 1 death due to an undiagnosed critical CHD could potentially be avoided if all hospitals screened newborn babies for critical CHDs using pulse oximetry." 

http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/heartdefects/screening.html

And just in case anyone reading this is planning to have a baby....here's some info on all of the newborn screenings....

http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/newbornscreening/

Some hospitals don't do the pulse ox unless you ask, I think. Kind of scary because I think a lot of people are still unaware of it. I know my hospital made it standard the year before I had my son. Or maybe even the year of.

[FundieFarmer]

Yep...

"For every 200 children with a critical CHD (congenital heart defect), at least 1 death due to an undiagnosed critical CHD could potentially be avoided if all hospitals screened newborn babies for critical CHDs using pulse oximetry." 

http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/heartdefects/screening.html

And just in case anyone reading this is planning to have a baby....here's some info on all of the newborn screenings....

http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/newbornscreening/

Some hospitals don't do the pulse ox unless you ask, I think. Kind of scary because I think a lot of people are still unaware of it. I know my hospital made it standard the year before I had my son. Or maybe even the year of.

Yes! I have a CHD so that's why I'm so glad you said it! Many don't unless you ask, actually. It's kind of a crusade of mine but I usually bite my tongue (great crusade, huh?). It wasn't even a consideration when I was born so my pediatrician happened to catch it and send me to the ER at my two week checkup. That's another thing that concerns me about home births. A lot of deadly things can be missed in two weeks. I got lucky.

[ClaraOswin]

I hadn't heard of it until I was pregnant. A friend of mine has a son with heart problems and she posted about the screening on Facebook so I looked into it. I had it on the list of questions to ask our (possible) pediatrician when we "interviewed" her. I was happy to hear our hospital did it for ALL babies now. It's sad that not all hospitals do it as standard procedure.

[Ali]

I did not know about the pulse ox and I don't know if that was done for either of my children. I guess I need to file that information in brain somewhere where I won't forget in case we have another baby.

I really liked the hospital where my second was born at. The food was pretty good and the hospital staff did not disturb us during certain hours. I was nice to have people taking care of me.

[FundieFarmer]

I tell pretty much everybody who's pregnant around me, haha! But that's about it. It's frustrating it's only law in a handful of states since it's critical for identifying quite a few conditions.

[ClaraOswin]

I think it might be law in most states now.

https://www.newsteps.org/sites/default/files/pictures/CCHD%20Screening%20Status%20Report%2023FEB2016.pdf

[FundieFarmer]

I think it might be law in most states now.

https://www.newsteps.org/sites/default/files/pictures/CCHD%20Screening%20Status%20Report%2023FEB2016.pdf

Yesss! So my crusade is behind the times. Thanks for the fantastic news!!

[silverspoons]

Now that pulse oxi-meters are affordable($20 range) I think they should be as common a purchase as a thermometer. I have a peds one and adult one. It has made such a difference in knowing when to take my child to the doctor especially when my child was younger and had a communication disorder. So many people come to borrow mine and they are shocked that their child is not just sick but in distress. Same with my teenage son who has mild asthma that is trigger by allergies, he carries pulse-oxi-meter in his backpack and the school staff borrow it frequently.

It is such a great device not only for telling how serious an illness is but to tell if you are dehydrated or helping get back into shape after bed rest or inactivity safely.

[ClaraOswin]

1 hour ago, silverspoons said:

Now that pulse oxi-meters are affordable($20 range) I think they should be as common a purchase as a thermometer. I have a peds one and adult one. It has made such a difference in knowing when to take my child to the doctor especially when my child was younger and had a communication disorder. So many people come to borrow mine and they are shocked that their child is not just sick but in distress. Same with my teenage son who has mild asthma that is trigger by allergies, he carries pulse-oxi-meter in his backpack and the school staff borrow it frequently.

It is such a great device not only for telling how serious an illness is but to tell if you are dehydrated or helping get back into shape after bed rest or inactivity safely.

Is there a certain brand you'd recommend?

[Chickenbutt]

A pulse ox in the ER is considered a vital sign....along with blood pressure, pulse, respiratory rate and temperature, for everyone no matter the complaint or age.

[JillyO]

10 hours ago, FundieFarmer said:

Yesss! So my crusade is behind the times. Thanks for the fantastic news!!

I'd like to see it as your crusade being very successfull.

[InThePrayerCloset]

9 hours ago, silverspoons said:

Now that pulse oxi-meters are affordable($20 range) I think they should be as common a purchase as a thermometer. I have a peds one and adult one. It has made such a difference in knowing when to take my child to the doctor especially when my child was younger and had a communication disorder. So many people come to borrow mine and they are shocked that their child is not just sick but in distress. Same with my teenage son who has mild asthma that is trigger by allergies, he carries pulse-oxi-meter in his backpack and the school staff borrow it frequently.

It is such a great device not only for telling how serious an illness is but to tell if you are dehydrated or helping get back into shape after bed rest or inactivity safely.

OT - My friends father invented the pulse oximeter... i inevitably ramble about it to my anaesthetist as i go under... 

[littlemommy]

On April 11, 2016 at 6:44 AM, InThePrayerCloset said:

OT - My friends father invented the pulse oximeter... i inevitably ramble about it to my anaesthetist as i go under... 

Ugh, that sounds like something I'd do. Apparently I told my OBGYN that I thought he was very handsome as I went under for my hysterectomy. Unfortunately I do this for every male doctor during any surgery....or so I'm told.

[jozina]

Don't worry littlemommy, it happens fairly often. I'm sure he's heard worse!

[countressrascal]

44 minutes ago, jozina said:

Don't worry littlemommy, it happens fairly often. I'm sure he's heard worse!

It happens all the time-Count is told that he has beautiful eyes, love his hair etc. after the women is out of recovery he always says thanks. As a L&D nurse my vocabulary increased with words that would shock my grandmother & parents. On the other hand you do not want to know what the medical professional say about patients or their conditions we do not sugar coat it among the secret society of the doctor/nurse lounge.

[littlemommy]

On April 11, 2016 at 0:02 PM, countressrascal said:

It happens all the time-Count is told that he has beautiful eyes, love his hair etc. after the women is out of recovery he always says thanks. As a L&D nurse my vocabulary increased with words that would shock my grandmother & parents. On the other hand you do not want to know what the medical professional say about patients or their conditions we do not sugar coat it among the secret society of the doctor/nurse lounge.

I can well imagine, and that's my nightmare. My mom is a nurse and I had heard her complain about obnoxious patients. The first surgery I ever had was a sinus surgery, and I was trying so hard not to ask for pain medicine. When the nurse questioned me for not asking for what was obviously needed, I said "I'm trying to be a good patient!" I didn't want to be the subject of someone's venting when they got home. 

[19Kittens]

I think a lot of the problem here was VG was not following a lot of basic protocol with this delivery. I am currently in school to become a midwife, and I've been following this story and it just makes me cringe. Not all midwives are incompetent fuckwits that can't separate THEIR PASSION!!!!111ELEVENTY from the health and best interests of both the mother and child. 

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

On 4/9/2016 at 0:36 AM, ClaraOswin said:

Wow. Why would mothers continue to use her as a midwife?! That is just.....shocking. And really sad.

These are women who have little to no education, they do not use the internet or watch TV they do what the churches tell them and or their husbands.  Then there are the moronic educated ones who have their Google MD's and there for know more than doctors and everyone. I have a friend like this she is anti doctor anti pharma anti vax.  She risked her life and her babies to have a home birth knowing he was breach, she didn't tell her midwife he turned after her external cephalic version (ECV) the week prior. the baby was born blue, and had a zero APGAR 911 was called, luckily he perked up, but while they were checking him out she started hemorrhaging so mom and baby wound up in the hospital anyway. Her midwife contemplated suing her, because this very well could have cost her her license. So friend had to find a new Midwife, but her name spread though the MW community and she wasn't able to find one until she moved across country.  

[2manyKidzzz]

40 minutes ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

These are women who have little to no education, they do not use the internet or watch TV they do what the churches tell them and or their husbands.  Then there are the moronic educated ones who have their Google MD's and there for know more than doctors and everyone. I have a friend like this she is anti doctor anti pharma anti vax.  She risked her life and her babies to have a home birth knowing he was breach, she didn't tell her midwife he turned after her external cephalic version (ECV) the week prior. the baby was born blue, and had a zero APGAR 911 was called, luckily he perked up, but while they were checking him out she started hemorrhaging so mom and baby wound up in the hospital anyway. Her midwife contemplated suing her, because this very well could have cost her her license. So friend had to find a new Midwife, but her name spread though the MW community and she wasn't able to find one until she moved across country.  

This is really sad to hear. I'm glad it worked out well for the mom and the baby.