Baby Dilly

[JHeathen]

I really just need to make a small correction here. Hospitals are not the ones that are passing out Pitocin like candy to stay on a schedule. Hospitals are open 24/7, 365 days a year. They are prepared to handle a delivery anytime of the day or night.

The rise in the number of Pitocin induced labor is primarily due to physicians. And, also the consumer. It is easy to completely put it on the doctors, but in truth lots of people want to plan the day they deliver. They want to be sure they have their extended family there, or that they don't have to bother their neighbor at 3am to watch their other kid when they rush off to deliver in the middle of the night.

Having worked Labor and Delivery for several years in 2 different time periods, I can definitely say that consumers, patients, whatever you want to call them, played a big part in the rising C Section rates and the rising Induction rates. The two go hand in hand. When you induce labor, you increase the odds of a c/s delivery for many reasons (most obvious is the body wasn't really ready for labor, so things just don't go as well), and there are several women who just plain would prefer to sign up for a C section and avoid labor. Also, OBs are very fearful of being sued, so many of them will prefer what they view as a more controlled situation, during normal hourse rather than an emergency at 3am. And finally, not to give them a free pass, but I would challenge most people to work as an OB for even 5 years and not have them grow fatigued with working all day and then being called in all night. Not that it is an excuse, but it is kind of understandable that the idea of having your patient's have scheduled deliveries would be desirable. I don't think most OBs go into it thinking they are going to push inductions on their patients but I think the job wears them down after awhile.

Inductions with Pitocin usually increase epidural use, which can also put you at higher risk for a c/s so again it all plays together.

But just to be clear, the driving force behind Increasing Inductions was not due to hospitals. In fact, in the past 2 years at least, hospitals are penalized if their elective induction rates at less than 39 weeks are high. The responsibility for high inductions and c/s rates is mostly physicians and the patients combined.

Good point...I (and probably many others) see the doctor as being part of "The Hospital" but of course they are not. (They bill separately, LOL!!) But it was "policy" (whose? dunno) at my births that if anyone went over X number of hours in labor, they would be given Pitocin. My CNM was very clear about that.

[Rescinded and Mended]

In my case, and this was about 15 years ago, my doctor simply told me that she did rounds on Tuesdays and Fridays, and that

my son was going to be born on the Tuesday closest to his natural due date. After I checked in, my amniotic sack was punctured right around when the pitocin was introduced in my IV.

I can see where OB/GYNs have their own issues to worry about regarding scheduling and not being sued and all, but my doctor seemed really adamant that I have the c-section from the get-go. She also ignored what I'd written on my birth plan. I wound up overdosed on the Demerol (not the doctor's fault, I don't think), I didn't get to hold my son right after he was born, and the doctor wound up running late to my delivery. I guess my point is just that even though it was my birth experience, in many ways, my doctor didn't seem too interested in my input about it. At least everything turned out okay with my son's birth, and the way my doctor behaved certainly isn't typical.

There are a lot of factors that are at play when it comes to labor and delivery, and many of them have nothing to do with meeting a schedule, I guess in my case it was just how the doctor made me feel.

I do see the value in introducing pitocin when a labor doesn't progress. When I was pregnant, I watched a labor and delivery show about a woman who was in labor for two days. No one gave her pitocin or a c-section, they just let her sit there while her labor stalled. The baby was stillborn. :cry: I knew nothing of such things at the time, but still wondered why no one did more to help her.

[calimojo]

Good point...I (and probably many others) see the doctor as being part of "The Hospital" but of course they are not. (They bill separately, LOL!!) But it was "policy" (whose? dunno) at my births that if anyone went over X number of hours in labor, they would be given Pitocin. My CNM was very clear about that.

What your CNM was probably referring to has to do with how many hours a woman is ruptured. If a woman is ruptured (Amniotic fluid is leaking), then after about 18 hours, the risk for an infection called Amnionitis drastically increases. So if labor seems to be lagging, and the mom has been ruptured for several hours, then Pitocin is indicated to try to facilitate delivery sooner before the risk of infection rises. Amnionitis is an infection of the amniotic membranes and possibly the placenta. It is dangerous to both mom and baby.

But most hospitals don't have a policy about mandating pitocin be used within a certain number of hours. I hate to say this, but if your CNM said this, it was probably her bending the truth a bit to get you to agree to it without having to be the one who claims to own the decision. I see doctors do this all the time, Blame the "ebil" hospital for what they want to do, so the patients don't get mad at them.

[bal maiden]

What so interesting is the people of El Salvador are predominantlyRoman Catholic, the oldest form of Christianity.They do not need cult members preaching to them- They already have God.

Ummm, no, RCism isn't the oldest form of Christianity! Plenty of Middle Eastern churches such as the Syriac church are far older.

[MatthewDuggar]

My mom said that I was a scheduled c-sect baby. It was time to take me out of the oven, but I was not done yet! :mrgreen: Makes me wonder if some of the issues I had as a baby and growing up could have been prevented had I been born at a natural time. For example, I was allergic to milk and had to be fed soy as a baby....

[Georgiana]

Sorry to double post,

But Wow Jill looks very big for where she is in her pregnancy. Yes, all women carry differently, but she is objectively big. Not big like she has gained a lot of non-baby weight, but abdomen is big. No way around it. They had better hope she doesn't deliver a few weeks early or it will be a tough sell to claim she wasn't knocked up prior to the wedding day.

My friend was like that for her first baby. Just big. Baby was only 6lbs, and it was all water weight and swelling. Had every symptom of pre-eclampsia but the protein in urine.

She was smaller for her second (9lb) baby.

Seeing as Michelle had pre-eclampsia with the twins, Jill could be dealing with the same thing my friend had, and just have a lot of localized water-weight. However, if she does deliver early, I would be sure that they would tell us they induced labor for one reason or another.

I feel bad for Jill that she has to have all this pressure to not deliver early, but if you make an entire season of a show about your pure and perfect courtship/engagement/marriage, I'm not going to feel too bad for you. You put yourself in this situation.

[Quiverfullofit]

I was born cesarean because I was transverse. My sister says my mom was in labor for 12 hours but mom says she was so heavily sedated she really doesn't know. Heck, she says I could have had a twin as she was seeing double!

The first vaginal birth I've ever encountered was this year though. She was given something for the pain and it was the fastest delivery! I was in the delivery room and walked to the waiting room to tell her mother to go in. By the time we came back the baby boy was already born and cleaned up!

And since he was the first normal birth I had experienced, I didn't know his head would be so.. cone-y.

[ljohnson2006]

If Jill has pre-eclampsia, and it's been diagnosed. I pray to God that she doesn't attempt a home birth.

[HOTW]

If Jill develops pre-eclampsia she will no longer be a low risk delivery and should not be slated for home delivery, any midwife who would agree to it should be barred from practicing.

I had 3 births my first was with an epidral and total lack of interest from the nursing staff-it was hell. My second was with a midwife, ruptured membranes and within twelve hours we decided to go with induction as labour was not beginning, it was tough but after having an epidural wear off just as my first birth was beginning I refused to go with drugs-learned a lot from my midwife and had a great experience.

Third baby was once again an induction due to ruptured membranes and no labour. Ended up kicking the labour nurse out as she kept trying to shove drugs down me, DR was a jerk who refused to call my midwife, I almost assaulted him during delivery- delivery was hell and midwife was beside herself next morning when she found out who had delivered me. Apologized for weeks afterwards.

I am all for midwife delivery in the right cases, low risk only, because a midwife stays with you, rather than coming in and out on her own schedule. My mother had 3 babies at home and one unexpected unpredicatable complication but the midwife who was a laymidwife, knew what she was doing and handled it with no complications, but then again she had delivered well over 2,000 babies by her mid- thirties and she was in her fifties when she delivered my mother.

I am fully in support of midwifery because I have dealt with both drs and midwives and feel that there is too much fear driven politics in childbirth. Too many times fear drives the Csections and inductons. A body that is not ready for induction quite often has complications because the body knows it isn't supposed to deliver. My deliveries were long even with induction but my body responded well to the drug because the membranes had ruptured and the babies were engaged, ready to go.

[calimojo]

as a former labor nurse, I am in favor of midwives for normal risk pregnancies, labors and delivery as well. But just like doctors, not all midwives are great. Some are similar to doctors, in that they want to control the labor etc. What I think is best is to be well informed and to be sure you have 2 people who know and understand your plans well. And to also have a clue as to when you might need to change your plans.

When I worked that area, women would come in with a 10 page birthing plan and quite honestly, there was no time to read through that. Instead, I would enter into a verbal agreement with the mom to be, and her birth partners. I would talk through the most important things they wanted for the labor and delivery and then we would talk about when I got to take over making decisions. For example, if I felt mom or baby were in danger, then the Birthing plan would be tossed out, and we would be working to the common goal of healthy mommy and health baby. To be honest, I rarely had to overturn the plan, but it was important for them to understand that in the real world things can happen and we have to act quickly. In a true obstetric emergency there isn't much time for hand holding and worrying about following a birth plan.

The other issue with birth plans and sometimes doulas, is that there are times when the mom, in the midst of her labor, changes her mind about what she wants. I have seen husbands and doulas bully a woman into not taking pain meds because of a birthing plan that was created at the kitchen table with no pain. . I was all for working through pain and trying natural pain reliev techniques and in truth the very worst part of labor for most women doesn't actually last all that long, so most people can be successfully coached past that, but there are some women who have more difficult labors and get to a point where they want pain meds. They should not be made to feel guilty if they take something.

On more than one occasion, I have seen a mom apologize to her doula for giving in and taking meds and it really broke my heart.

People should be educated and they should have plans for when things go a bit differently than anticipated. And the dad or other labor support people should shut the hell up if she decides to chuck the birth plan out the window and do something else.

[Trynn]

I was born cesarean because I was transverse. My sister says my mom was in labor for 12 hours but mom says she was so heavily sedated she really doesn't know. Heck, she says I could have had a twin as she was seeing double!

The first vaginal birth I've ever encountered was this year though. She was given something for the pain and it was the fastest delivery! I was in the delivery room and walked to the waiting room to tell her mother to go in. By the time we came back the baby boy was already born and cleaned up!

And since he was the first normal birth I had experienced, I didn't know his head would be so.. cone-y.

When my little brother was born, I thought his head looked just like an Easter egg shape.

To this day, 19 years later, I still sometimes refer to him as "Easter egg head."

[SportsgalAnnie]

my mom saw a picture of Jill today and said "Of course their going to exploit this for every cent they can get" while shaking her head She me I'm being to condescending on the duggar$. She also thinks Jill may be having more then one Baby but not saying anything because TLC surprise.

[YourGodIsNotMine]

Are they for real? They act like no child has ever been born before. And am I reading the scripture right - they seem to compare their son to Jesus Christ. It's like they have no critical thinking skills. They just blindly regurgitate bible quotes.

http://instagram.com/p/xDdlWOLsyY/

[MatthewDuggar]

Are they for real? They act like no child has ever been born before. And am I reading the scripture right - they seem to compare their son to Jesus Christ. It's like they have no critical thinking skills. They just blindly regurgitate bible quotes.

http://instagram.com/p/xDdlWOLsyY/

Wow, yeah as a Christian, I wouldn't use that scripture to reference a birth other than Jesus'.

Derrick looks drawn and exhausted.

[coffeebean7]

That Christmas picture is awful! I've seen people do jinder reveals on Pinterest with the bow around the stomach thing and think that's a little weird, but this is beyond cheesy and so very Jill.

[Californiacicle]

The other issue with birth plans and sometimes doulas, is that there are times when the mom, in the midst of her labor, changes her mind about what she wants. I have seen husbands and doulas bully a woman into not taking pain meds because of a birthing plan that was created at the kitchen table with no pain. . I was all for working through pain and trying natural pain reliev techniques and in truth the very worst part of labor for most women doesn't actually last all that long, so most people can be successfully coached past that, but there are some women who have more difficult labors and get to a point where they want pain meds. They should not be made to feel guilty if they take something.

On more than one occasion, I have seen a mom apologize to her doula for giving in and taking meds and it really broke my heart.

Oh my goodness this was me! I went through Bradley training, had a detailed birth plan, midwives, was at a baby friendly hospital but nothing prepared me for 24 hours of non stop contractions with an OP baby who was also stuck with his head at an angle. After hour 18 I begged my DH for an epi. BEGGED. My BFF an RN who was there for my son's birth, said it was the most pitiful thing she had ever heard. My DH tried to not make me feel bad about it but he wasn't completely supportive either and kept trying to talk me out of it. Even the L&D nurses were trying to convince me to keep gong natural. I was delirious with pain though and very close to a section.

It took me a long time to forgive myself for "giving up and giving in" and getting drugs.

[Alexa]

Wow, yeah as a Christian, I wouldn't use that scripture to reference a birth other than Jesus'.

Derrick looks drawn and exhausted.

Both Jill and Derrick look exhausted, wonder why?

[Marshmallow World]

I truly hope that Jill has a drama-free L&D with no problems. That said, I hope that she is open to having a different birth experience than she plans. I had everything perfectly planned for Lil Marshmallow, but ended up having to be induced. My body simply wasn't going into labor, and my ObGyn was concerned that Lil Marshmallow might defecate in the womb, and then breathe it in, which can be deadly. We scheduled to the induction after the weekend if I didn't go into labor.

I didn't and the day I was scheduled, both my parents and Mr. Marshmallow's parents called and BEGGED me not to be induced. They saw it as a failure, and told me that if I waited God would allow the baby to come when s/he was ready. I was tired, hungry, and emotional, and I felt so horrible. I still went in to be induced because the thought of a stillborn was incomprehensible. I didn't buy what my parents and in-laws said, but it still stung and I still get snobby comments about it from my MIL almost a decade later.

I don't get why people are so judgy about other's birth experiences (not here on FJ, just in general). I hope Jill realizes that a hospital birth is not a statement of your personal worth. Hell, J'Chelle had plenty of those, even with cameras.

[Coco]

I hope Jill has the birth she wants, but she looks kind of scared in all her photos. I hope she can manage it okay. And that she forgives herself if circumstances change and she has to deliver in an unexpected way.

[lascuba]

Oh my goodness this was me! I went through Bradley training, had a detailed birth plan, midwives, was at a baby friendly hospital but nothing prepared me for 24 hours of non stop contractions with an OP baby who was also stuck with his head at an angle. After hour 18 I begged my DH for an epi. BEGGED. My BFF an RN who was there for my son's birth, said it was the most pitiful thing she had ever heard. My DH tried to not make me feel bad about it but he wasn't completely supportive either and kept trying to talk me out of it. Even the L&D nurses were trying to convince me to keep gong natural. I was delirious with pain though and very close to a section.

It took me a long time to forgive myself for "giving up and giving in" and getting drugs.

I was with my cousin when she gave birth and it was brutal. You could hear the screams from two closed doors and several yards of corridor away. When she asked for an epidural, her husband and I--both very reluctantly because her pain was stressing us out--gently reminded her that she told us to talk her out of an epidural if she asked for one. Her MIDWIFE said, "No, I'm getting her the epidural. She needs it." Got the epidural, promptly fell asleep and woke up several hours later fully dilated. That was four years ago and she still feels bad about it, especially because her sister just gave birth for the first time and it was relatively easy for her.

[Jana814]

If Jill has pre-eclampsia, and it's been diagnosed. I pray to God that she doesn't attempt a home birth.

Agree!!

[Jana814]

I agree w/ the person above who said that they hope Jill gets the birth she wants. But sometimes births don't go as a person hopes they will. My cousin's wife wanted an all natural birth for their first child. Did the natural birth classes and everything. He was 2 weeks late and she ended up having a c-section because her labor would not progress.

[FreeHannie!]

Are they for real? They act like no child has ever been born before. And am I reading the scripture right - they seem to compare their son to Jesus Christ. It's like they have no critical thinking skills. They just blindly regurgitate bible quotes.

http://instagram.com/p/xDdlWOLsyY/

I can't stop laughing at the 'To Jill and Derick, from God' on the bow around her belly.

[Rescinded and Mended]

I think it's terrible that there are so many husbands and other family members that are willing to make a woman feel badly for the choices she makes about her own birth experience. I'm pretty sure the person who is actually laboring to deliver the child would always be the best judge in knowing how much pain she can handle and whether or not she needs drugs.

Everyone else who is outside of her womb, body, and pain levels can sod off.

[txmommyof4]

The pressure on women to have these perfect births is so incredibly sad. I had 4 c-sections thanks to my first son being an emergency classical at 25 weeks. This was after being told early in my pregnancy how perfect my body was for delivering babies so it really hurt. I have heard some mighty cruel things from 'friends' through the years, including "well It's kinda like you aren't really even a mom at all". It took awhile for me to get smart, look at my 4 gorgeous, healthy boys and realize that people are just idiots.