Another one bites the dust- Daniel Lockwood MERGE

[Howl]

Prevention, thanks so much for your post. Prior to reading your post, I had assumed that Daniel was a "difficult" man (generally an ass and hard to live with); this sounds as though he is much worse than that.

It is obvious that Jaynee loves her children; hopefully this can give them the strength to soldier on until they leave home.

I also get the sense from her blog that even though she writes about how God is So Good™, comforting, healing, strength from Jesus who saved all sinners, that she will never, EVER truly accept herself as the loving, good and decent person she is and that what she is is enough, because SINNER.

I'm not a doctor and don't play one on TV, but it seems there is a good possibility of underlying depression or just an underlying, pervasive sadness, even prior to Daniel's "moral failing."

Anyway, I went back to her blogpost Forever. For always. No Matter What

Click on the comments section at the bottom and head down to Karen's comment on May 2, 2014 at 4:23am. The comment is totally sane and on target, but one commenter has to stir it up with with this crap:

"I'm sorry, but I would be remiss not to respond to Karen and Anonymous (see above and below). Jeremiah says that our hearts deceive us, and the Bible says to follow the commands of Christ and His Word.

"The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately sick; who can understand it?" Jeremiah 17:9

I am certain that Jaynee knows what God says, and, by God's grace, is going to be obedient to the edicts of Scripture."

This type of thinking doesn't allow a person to know what they think OR feel. So very, very sad and utterly crazy making.

Personally I think the heart is pure love and is 100% reliable 100% of the time, but that is just me! :D

Pending some type of world-view altering experience via LSD, I'm not seeing any changes ahead in Jaynee's thinking. That said, I do wish her well with 100% of my 100% reliable heart.

[Palimpsest]

Anything that I do not hear from the mouth of a family member I would consider to be a "rumor". This person who told me is apart of their church and I would consider it to be very reliable but I would still use the term "rumor" since it lacks family confirmation. Yes, I do know the lockwoods personally and very well and yes I can assure you that Jaynee's family has offered support and tried to talk reason to Jaynee. You CANNOT make someone leave who is unwilling to leave. I know these families and I know that both sides have tried to help Jaynee get away only to be completely laughed off and rejected.

Church discipline would be standing in front of the church membership and confessing what you did after repenting to God and your family. You hurt the church body as a whole so they are also due an explanation and apology especially after providing much financial support. Dan has always been a prideful guy...I won't say "man" because a man doesn't do what he has done to his family. I feel bad for Jaynee. And I know that posting what I know on here doesn't do any good for Jaynee---or does it? You see, I know she has read this blog in the past, and I am hopeful that she is still reading it now. Jaynee if you are reading this please get away from Daniel. Protect those kids. Ask your family or his family for help in getting out. I know your parents and sisters would do anything to help you.

I also post here as a way to vent my frustration about the situation and to squash ridiculous rumors from pure speculation (I have stated that before). I am no longer in regular contact with any of Jaynee's family members but I do see Dan's family members often.

Prevention: A very Proverbs 15:1 answer. :)

Thanks for clarifying the source. I now understand what you mean by rumor. My apologies for taking out some of my own frustration with this situation on you. As you can see, I dislike unfounded gossip so I also thank you for coming here to quash (or squash) speculation when it goes completely off track.

I agree completely: no-one can force anyone to leave a marriage or destructive relationship until they are ready. They have to reach that decision for themselves. It is good to know that Jaynee's family has offered support. I hope they don't get discouraged and continue to offer support and to reason with Jaynee. She may have to hit rock bottom before she decides to reach out for help, if she ever does. Both families can also be available and helpful if the children decide they have had enough in the future.

I hope Jaynee reads here. I think the last time she posted here was after Daniel had found us first. I wonder whether he will let her read, let alone post here, again. However, please do go ahead and vent here too.

On the Church Discipline discussion: Was Daniel an IFB-type missionary similar to John Shrader, who we also discuss here? I have been trying to figure the relationship out between Sending Churches and the missionaries, and how much control the sending church has over missionaries who go off the rails. We know that Dan was pulled out of Mexico, but I suppose the reason is still under wraps as he has failed to confess his sins and apologize to the church.

[Jasmar]

Jaynee, if you do read here, I urge you to check out an excellent Christian domestic abuse website called cryingoutforjustice.com. Use a computer that Dan doesn't have easy access to if there's any chance you think he checks your history, but do go check it out. It is not from what you'd consider a liberal viewpoint, and it's really, really helpful. You'll be shocked to see what the Bible really says about marriage when taking in context,about what really constituted abuse (it's rarely just physical, and many of us in abusive marriages have not experienced battering), and about who you are to Jesus (hint: His beloved, not a Wife).

[Mitz_]

Well, Dan's sending church can withdraw their support but they can't "pull them out " of Mexico. They decided to leave on their own. They own their house there, or so they say, and they could have obtained work permits and legal residency. Still, it would have been very difficult to find work that would support a family of that size in the style to which they were accustomed with no freebies and "support" to rely on.

On the other hand, since "God provides" it seems like he could have provided just as well in Mexico since they were called by God himself to go there. Dan and Jaynee certainly preached this to the desperately poor people they were trying to convince to have large families .

[snickerz]

I'm just curious where the assumption that Dan is abusive comes from. Dan has admitted to being a cheating louse, and I think ALL these patriarchal quiverful types are spiritually abusive, (to their wives AND children) but it sounds like many here think he's gone above and beyond that to maybe physical abuse?

[socalrules]

I wonder how they are surviving financially. Were they the family whose child "found" the same amount of money that was "lost" and they were able to buy food? I cannot see them having a lot in emergency funds. It is one of those things I always wonder about fundies. If the Daniel doesn't have a job, how are they paying the bills? I know Jaynee isn't allowed to work and I assume they won't try for government aid, so I can't see where the money would come from. I supposed their family could be helping out, but for a family of that size it would be financially draining to have to support them on a regular basis. Do you allow your children to go hungry because youdo not believe in government aid? If Jaynee doesn't believe in getting aid, it is one more reason she would not leave because she wouldn't be able to put food on the table. I have an education and a well paying job. I could not support so many kids on my salary, so I just don't see how they are doing it with no visible source of income.

[Palimpsest]

Well, Dan's sending church can withdraw their support but they can't "pull them out " of Mexico. They decided to leave on their own. They own their house there, or so they say, and they could have obtained work permits and legal residency. Still, it would have been very difficult to find work that would support a family of that size in the style to which they were accustomed with no freebies and "support" to rely on.

On the other hand, since "God provides" it seems like he could have provided just as well in Mexico since they were called by God himself to go there. Dan and Jaynee certainly preached this to the desperately poor people they were trying to convince to have large families .

More a series of questions and comments on the bolded than anything else:

1. Did they leave on their own? Daniel gave the impression that the family had been pulled out of Mexico in his letter on Jaynee's blog. "My pastor and church have given me three months to transition from Mexico to the United States and to find a Mexican pastor to take over the ministry here." So did he mean the US pastor and sending church or some affiliation with other churches in Mexico. They certainly found a Mexican national pretty quickly to take over. I'm really interested in what, if any, control other than cutting off funding Sending Churches have over missionaries running amuck.

2. Did Daniel and Jaynee really own the house in Mexico or was it purchased with Sending Church $$$ for the mission? Does it belong to the church he planted there? Oy, these IFB (is Daniel even IFB?) "missionary" finances are very unclear to me.

3. Daniel (but not Jaynee) became a Mexican (dual US?) citizen in 2009. That would take care of work permits. The children from Noah on down all have dual citizenship as they were born there.

4. I agree, given the much lower COL in Mexico why did they move back to the US? Totally riding the ISB, Daniel left before some legal issues caught up with him in Mexico? Our theory that it was sexual hanky-panky is -- just a theory.

[Palimpsest]

I'm just curious where the assumption that Dan is abusive comes from. Dan has admitted to being a cheating louse, and I think ALL these patriarchal quiverful types are spiritually abusive, (to their wives AND children) but it sounds like many here think he's gone above and beyond that to maybe physical abuse?

If Dan has admitted to being a cheating louse I somehow completely missed it. Moral failing does not necessarily = extra-marital sex. Link, please?

But to answer your question re. the abuse "assumption." Some of us suspected emotional abuse years ago because of just reading her blog. It seemed clear that Jaynee's self esteem was in the toilet and she beat herself up so badly whenever she perhaps strayed from being a "perfect" submissive wife to Daniel. I could probably go back and isolate times where she quoted things Daniel had preached at her, which sounded unbelievably manipulative and emotionally abusive. Long-term emotional abuse is incredibly destructive and probably contributes to the depression many of us see in Jaynee's writing. Jaynee may not be "prone to depression" but she may be depressed because she is in an untenable position. While I agree that Patriarchal insistence on "submission" is intrinsically abusive to women, not all women are going to experience it as such. Many do, especially when it is combined with other abusive behaviors.

Our suspicions were confirmed by Prevention on page 6 of this thread, and Prevention does seem a legitimate and trustworthy source. YMMV.

First, I agree that no one here deserves an explanation but his supporting churches definitely do. Second, I do not believe that this was anything illegal or financial but rather sexual in nature as some have pointed out. Knowing the Daniel that I grew up with: it was most certainly sexual in nature. He was always going after the girls in class at school. He even dated the principal's daughter at one point but had to break it off for touching her inappropriately. Daniel comes from a family of 12 with all but 3 being boys and all those boys are hyper-sexed. Daniel's dad is a bizarre man, but I digress.

I read through here and saw someone asking about Jaynee's family. I know her family well. Although I haven't seen them in recent years I do know that they are sad about her situation. Jaynee's family is genuine and kind--good down to Earth people who were smoothed talked by Daniel like most people are. They had their reservations about their marriage and tried to keep them apart. Daniel was physically abusive toward Jaynee before they were married and that had her Dad in an uproar. Then Dan comes across so repentative and sincere and he just smooth talks his way out of anything. He's been like that since he was a kid---always a charmer, very polite as others have pointed out, but he is a deceptive guy. I never liked him so I don't mind telling it like it is. For those who wondered about Dan's job history-yeah he worked at a grocery store in town for like 10 yrs but his most successful position was at selling food door to door. I know the name of the company but won't put it here. He made good $$$$ doing that. He sold to my parents--one of the things he would do is hand out pictures of his 7 or 8 kids at the time and ppl felt compelled to order from him.

ETA: clarification and bolding. Prevention "believes" that the moral failing was sexual. He states past physical abuse as a fact.

[nausicaa]

More a series of questions and comments on the bolded than anything else:

1. Did they leave on their own? Daniel gave the impression that the family had been pulled out of Mexico in his letter on Jaynee's blog. "My pastor and church have given me three months to transition from Mexico to the United States and to find a Mexican pastor to take over the ministry here." So did he mean the US pastor and sending church or some affiliation with other churches in Mexico. They certainly found a Mexican national pretty quickly to take over. I'm really interested in what, if any, control other than cutting off funding Sending Churches have over missionaries running amuck.

2. Did Daniel and Jaynee really own the house in Mexico or was it purchased with Sending Church $$$ for the mission? Does it belong to the church he planted there? Oy, these IFB (is Daniel even IFB?) "missionary" finances are very unclear to me.

3. Daniel (but not Jaynee) became a Mexican (dual US?) citizen in 2009. That would take care of work permits. The children from Noah on down all have dual citizenship as they were born there.

4. I agree, given the much lower COL in Mexico why did they move back to the US? Totally riding the ISB, Daniel left before some legal issues caught up with him in Mexico? Our theory that it was sexual hanky-panky is -- just a theory.

Regarding point four, I was going to say that maybe it was sexual AND illegal in nature (someone underage), therefore he needed to leave as fast as possible. But a little research showed that 12 is the age of consent in Mexico, which is a little disconcerting for me on multiple levels.

[Palimpsest]

Regarding point four, I was going to say that maybe it was sexual AND illegal in nature (someone underage), therefore he needed to leave as fast as possible. But a little research showed that 12 is the age of consent in Mexico, which is a little disconcerting for me on multiple levels.

Yikes to 12 being the age of consent on Mexico. Very disturbing.

However, according to Wikipedia [my bolding].

The age of consent in Mexico is complex. Typically, Mexican states have a "primary" age of consent (which may be as low as 12), and sexual conduct with persons below that age is always illegal. Sexual relations between adults and teenagers under 18 are left in a legal gray area: laws against adults "corrupting" minors may be used sometimes to punish such sexual encounters, as well as laws against engaging in sexual relations with "chaste and honest" teenage girls by means of "seduction". These laws are situational and are subject to interpretation.

So Dan could still be in trouble for seducing a girl under 18?

[nausicaa]

Yikes to 12 being the age of consent on Mexico. Very disturbing.

However, according to Wikipedia [my bolding].

So Dan could still be in trouble for seducing a girl under 18?

Good catch. Yeah, that's a definite possibility.

Aside: The "chaste and honest" phrase in that law makes me wanna scream.

[snarkopolis]

I wonder how they are surviving financially. Were they the family whose child "found" the same amount of money that was "lost" and they were able to buy food? I cannot see them having a lot in emergency funds. It is one of those things I always wonder about fundies. If the Daniel doesn't have a job, how are they paying the bills? I know Jaynee isn't allowed to work and I assume they won't try for government aid, so I can't see where the money would come from. I supposed their family could be helping out, but for a family of that size it would be financially draining to have to support them on a regular basis. Do you allow your children to go hungry because youdo not believe in government aid? If Jaynee doesn't believe in getting aid, it is one more reason she would not leave because she wouldn't be able to put food on the table. I have an education and a well paying job. I could not support so many kids on my salary, so I just don't see how they are doing it with no visible source of income.

Why you send out a blog report/message to your sheeple telling them about your problem (in the guise of saying God will provide) and the $ comes in; see Schrader, John. We non fundamentalists call this BEGGING.

[Prevention]

Yes, Daniel is an IFB missionary. Someone asked that earlier in this thread. And yes Dan owns his home in Mexico, not the church. He built it himself. I don't know how they are living right now but I would suspect that Dan is doing odd jobs and having the older kids pick up odd jobs as well.

[church_of_dog]

Jaynee has a new post up -- apparently Daniel, who was away from home working, is in the hospital with pancreatitis.

lockwoodfamilytomexico.com/2014/08/please-pray-for-danielhes-in-hospital.html

[Trynn]

I hope he is ok... For her and the children's sake

[docmom]

I hope they have decent health insurance for Jaynee and children's sake...

[WonderingInWA]

Oh, geez. Nice one, Daniel! Hope this works out for your 13 dependents and that before you cheated on your wife you managed to arrange for some medical insurance! Time to put out the begging bowl!

[Jana814]

I just read the post, I also hope he is going to be OK for the kids sake. According to the post it looks like her oldest is off to Bible college. How could they afford something like that.

[feministxtian]

Pancreatitis is nothing to mess with...my husband nearly died from it. Any surgical remedy they try is going to cost some serious cash though...I doubt seriously scamaritan will pay for it. My husband had a total pancreatectomy and autologous islet cell transplant 18 months ago and the bill for that was about 500k. We won't discuss the $$$ that we spent prior to that and since then as the transplant failed and he's now a brittle diabetic. The replacement enzymes he has to have with each meal run somewhere on the order of 3k-4k per month without insurance.

[Palimpsest]

Pancreatitis, acute or chronic, most definitely isn't a stroll in the park. I hope Daniel recovers quickly because of all the kids and Jaynee who depend on him. I also really hope the whole family has some kind of health insurance, and I still think Jaynee and the kids should run far, far away from him.

No offence intended feministxtian, because there definitely many causes of pancreatitis, but the DX in Daniel also makes me ponder whether his spectacular fall from grace might have something to do with the Demon Alcohol.

[feministxtian]

Pancreatitis, acute or chronic, most definitely isn't a stroll in the park. I hope Daniel recovers quickly because of all the kids and Jaynee who depend on him. I also really hope the whole family has some kind of health insurance, and I still think Jaynee and the kids should run far, far away from him.

No offence intended feministxtian, because there definitely many causes of pancreatitis, but the DX in Daniel also makes me ponder whether his spectacular fall from grace might have something to do with the Demon Alcohol.

No offence taken. My husband's was caused by a combination of factors including alcohol abuse. The upside is that if it's acute, he may not have any more problems. But if it becomes chronic, he's screwed.

[treemom]

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Scamaritan will kick you off if you admit to not being monogamous. So there is a chance if that is the case with Daniel they don't have it.

And also interestingly enough, probably means that DPIAT may not either.

[lilith]

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Scamaritan will kick you off if you admit to not being monogamous. So there is a chance if that is the case with Daniel they don't have it.

And also interestingly enough, probably means that DPIAT may not either.

Does just the cheater lose coverage, or would Jaynee and the kids (or Beall and the kids) lose coverage too? How very Christian - talk about loving the sinner. Alcohol use is meant to void Scamaritan too, isn't it? But the Coghlans are open about drinking (quite a bit in Perry's case) and they use Scanaritan too.

[uber frau]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought 'coverage' with Scamaritan basically meant that they'd give you a few lines of space in their monthly newsletter to beg for money and that it was up to the other suckers members to decide whether or not your particular story was worth their membership dues for the month.

If that's the case, it seems like it's just a high stakes popularity contest. The likes of J'chelle and Melanie Maxwell would find it fairly easy to have their costs covered. The likes of DPIAT might not anymore.

[lilith]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought 'coverage' with Scamaritan basically meant that they'd give you a few lines of space in their monthly newsletter to beg for money and that it was up to the other suckers members to decide whether or not your particular story was worth their membership dues for the month.

If that's the case, it seems like it's just a high stakes popularity contest. The likes of J'chelle and Melanie Maxwell would find it fairly easy to have their costs covered. The likes of DPIAT might not anymore.

DPIAT still has a fair following - I think he'd still do better than an unknown, homely family without a web presence would for non pregnancy related needs (which always seem to get priority, cause babies).