The Continuing Fall of VF and Doug Phillips is a tool-Part 4

[AlexIsAwake]

I am so confused about what Jen and TW are even saying anymore. All the contradictions are staggering. Jen is now saying the Cassandra/Hero story is a coverup, yet they've gone to great lengths to illustrate that there really was a relationship going on between the two of them for 10 or more years, even claiming they were engaged. Well which is it?? Is the C/H story true, or is it a cover up? And to act like it's even a possibility that there was no sex between them is the most absurd thing I've ever heard. They were in a relationship for 10+ years, yet never had sex? Not even possible. Jen/TW are something else.

[MamaJunebug]

I've pretty much gotten to where I just skim this topic, but I believe what Jen was saying before was meant in irony:

"Doug has an emotional affair for 10 years but there's no sex ....yeah, suuuuuure......"

That's really paraphrased, of course. I can't wade through all the verbiage. I'm still woebegone that the only posts left on SpirchalSndngBrd from WomanforFreedom were not about Phillipses behaving badly on Blanco Road....

[Extricated]

I just can't with Jen's blog anymore. I'll follow the rest of the story from here. I only have one question. Do we know that Jen and T.W. are in fact separate people? There is a facebook profile for T.W. but it only has Jen as a friend. I realize that doesn't mean much, but it seems like a "good cop/bad cop" routine with Jen, the only person with a verifiable identity being the kinder side who defends what T.W. says until it's challenged, then she comes back with "Well, I didn't say that, you'll have to ask him." The posts and comments from either identity seem to talk in circles and contradict themselves. I can't help but think that "T.W." is Jen hoping that an alternate identity will keep any legal action from sticking to her.

[Palimpsest]

Eston has a new post up. An interview with Pastor Robert Gifford Doug's "spiritual father" who also wants to dissociate himself thoroughly from Doug.

I find it very strange that a fairly mainstream Evangelical Baptist would choose the mess that is JensGems to give his side of the story, but this one seems to be genuine. Or at least easily disproven. He supposedly approved the article.

[Palimpsest]

I just can't with Jen's blog anymore. I'll follow the rest of the story from here. I only have one question. Do we know that Jen and T.W. are in fact separate people? There is a facebook profile for T.W. but it only has Jen as a friend. I realize that doesn't mean much, but it seems like a "good cop/bad cop" routine with Jen, the only person with a verifiable identity being the kinder side who defends what T.W. says until it's challenged, then she comes back with "Well, I didn't say that, you'll have to ask him." The posts and comments from either identity seem to talk in circles and contradict themselves. I can't help but think that "T.W." is Jen hoping that an alternate identity will keep any legal action from sticking to her.

We don't know that Jen and TW Eston are separate people. If they are the same person, then Jen's brain will explode any second! I suspect they are separate people because the writing styles are so different. I also suspect that, if they are two separate people, they may not be getting along for much longer. TW is an asshole and he and Jen are not on the same page. Jen is full of vitriole against Doug on a personal level, TW seems to be concerned with taking down a larger group than just being content with Doug.

I think "T.W. Eston" is a pseudonym for someone male. He ignores all requests for him to identify himself. We have speculated that it could be Mark Epstein but I lean more towards Don K. Preston, or someone very like him, at the moment.

I have a feeling that both Martin Selbrede and Pastor Gifford do know who he is. But I really don't know.

ETA: clarification

[hoipolloi]

I've pretty much gotten to where I just skim this topic, but I believe what Jen was saying before was meant in irony:

"Doug has an emotional affair for 10 years but there's no sex ....yeah, suuuuuure......"

That's really paraphrased, of course. I can't wade through all the verbiage. I'm still woebegone that the only posts left on SpirchalSndngBrd from WomanforFreedom were not about Phillipses behaving badly on Blanco Road....

Haven't been following SpiritualSoundingBoard (too much cray-cray, too little time) - did WomanforFreedom pull or have her comments on her neighbors removed?

[hoipolloi]

Eston's newest post, allegedly reporting on an interview with Gifford, is interesting but also strikes me as diversionary. It conveniently allows him to abandon the previous thread on clergy sexual abuse and its 900+ comments. Notice that he didn't respond to Mr. McCann's questions.

Also, as Palimpsest said, you have to wonder why Gifford would even put a toe into this cesspool let alone provide lengthy responses & commentaries.

[snickerz]

I thought BRADRICK! said he was going to post some stuff before going into hiding going off FB for awhile. Give us the scoop, Petey!

[Palimpsest]

Meh, I've been suspicious of Jen and TW (whoever the fuck he is!) from the beginning. Of course, I think we all hoped that they would eventually come up with pay dirt, but no. TW and Jen have lost all credibility.

They also seem to be running out of salacious facts rumors, so the site is now really boring. I did have to laugh at the way Nony socked it to Jen, though. It rather made my day! :twisted:

If Bradrick! and Co have gone quiet, and in the absence of other reliable gossip, we'll have to wait to see if any criminal or civil charges are ever filed against Doug.

Not DP news, but a rather sad article from a young woman who had a narrow escape from VF thinking: spiritualsoundingboard.com/2013/12/20/a-young-womans-relationship-with-her-boyfriend-is-shattered-by-christian-patriarchy/#comments

Of course, again anonymous, so take with a pinch of salt. It does seem to have the ring of authenticity. If true, that young woman had a lucky escape and should run like hell. Also, I much prefer JulieAnn's take on spiritual abuse and the fall of Doug to Jen's rumor mongerings.

ETA. Doug Phillips is a Tool!

[Peas n carrots]

I'm so dissapointed...I was hoping Tool 'O Ween would turn into a Merry Toolmas. The story has gone stale, and even TW and Jen's wild rumors are boring.

Though I did seriously LOL IRL at this comment:

The idea of Doug Phillips being gay wouldn’t come as a shock to even half of his critics, but it does seem to go against several commenter’s tales of needing to keep their young daughters out of his line of site. So which is it now? Which direction are you running with? DP the pedophile? DP the homosexual train wreck? At this point DP would need to have sex with barn animals or space aliens to keep your readers wide eyed.

:animals-sheep: :animals-pig: :animals-cow:

[nelliebelle1197]

I'm so dissapointed...I was hoping Tool 'O Ween would turn into a Merry Toolmas. The story has gone stale, and even TW and Jen's wild rumors are boring.

Though I did seriously LOL IRL at this comment:

:animals-sheep: :animals-pig: :animals-cow:

At least we had a Happy Toolgiving!

[Closed Womb]

Maybe we'll ring in a Happy Tool Year.

[nokidsmom]

Yeah, the story has certainly gone stale. I would have thought by this time there would have been tons of real revelations not this dribble of unsubstantiated rumors and so called "insider knowledge but I can't quote my sources" stuff.

[Peas n carrots]

Maybe we'll ring in a Happy Tool Year.

I hope so. The beans will all spill eventually, but the question is how long will it be?

[church_of_dog]

I hope so. The beans will all spill eventually, but the question is how long will it be?

Hopefully before Valentool's Day...

[nokidsmom]

All I want for Christmas is to see the Tool do a perp walk but guess it will have to wait until next year.

[thoughtful]

All I want for Christmas is to see the Tool do a perp walk but guess it will have to wait until next year.

How about a song while you are waiting?

All I want for Christmas

Is the tool’s defeat,

The tool’s defeat,

Just the tool’s defeat,

Gee, if I could only see

The tool’s defeat,

Then I could have a Merry Christmas!

It seems so long since I could say,

“Gee I’d like to see him in a bustleâ€

Gosh, oh gee

How happy I'd be

To see the lawmen hustle!

All I want for Christmas

Is the tool’s defeat,

The tool’s defeat,

Just the tool’s defeat,

Gee, if I could only see

The tool’s defeat,

Then I could have a Merry Christmas!

Santa Claus, with your reindeer

Please don’t bring any toys or candy

I just want to see old Doug go down,

That would be a gift that’s dandy!

All I want for Christmas

Is the tool’s defeat,

The tool’s defeat,

Just the tool’s defeat,

Gee, if I could only see

The tool’s defeat,

Then I could have a Merry Christmas!

hs4x-FeGmTc

[snarkyjan]

How about a song while you are waiting?

All I want for Christmas

Is the tool’s defeat,

The tool’s defeat,

Just the tool’s defeat,

Gee, if I could only see

The tool’s defeat,

Then I could have a Merry Christmas!

It seems so long since I could say,

“Gee I’d like to see him in a bustleâ€

Gosh, oh gee

How happy I'd be

To see the lawmen hustle!

All I want for Christmas

Is the tool’s defeat,

The tool’s defeat,

Just the tool’s defeat,

Gee, if I could only see

The tool’s defeat,

Then I could have a Merry Christmas!

Santa Claus, with your reindeer

Please don’t bring any toys or candy

I just want to see old Doug go down,

That would be a gift that’s dandy!

All I want for Christmas

Is the tool’s defeat,

The tool’s defeat,

Just the tool’s defeat,

Gee, if I could only see

The tool’s defeat,

Then I could have a Merry Christmas!

hs4x-FeGmTc

:banana-dance: :banana-rock: :nanner-drums: :banana-tux:

[nokidsmom]

:banana-dance: :banana-rock: :nanner-drums: :banana-tux:

YES!! Thank you, Thoughtful!!

Now I am going to have an earworm going on all weekend.

ETA: I had to come back and say Thoughtful totally rocks with her lyrics.

[Evil Feminist]

This is waaaayyyy off topic, but Brad Voeller resigned from CollegePlus on Dec 16th. Apparently there was significant differences between him and the board of directors and executive team on strategy and planning. Hmm... if it wasn't for the timing and finding out how connected the Voellers were to BCA, I wouldn't have thought twice about it.

[WonderingInWA]

This is waaaayyyy off topic, but Brad Voeller resigned from CollegePlus on Dec 16th. Apparently there was significant differences between him and the board of directors and executive team on strategy and planning. Hmm... if it wasn't for the timing and finding out how connected the Voellers were to BCA, I wouldn't have thought twice about it.

I've heard of CollegePlus but don't know its origins. Was the program a BCA-invented program?

[hoipolloi]

I've heard of CollegePlus but don't know its origins. Was the program a BCA-invented program?

Brad Voeller's resignation may not be far off topic - see who their partners are? collegeplus.org/resources/partners

Here's a bit from CP's "about" page:

CollegePlus was officially started in 2004 by Woody Robertson, Brad Voeller and Ryan Yamane. It has grown from 50 students and 8 staff members that first year to thousands of students and over one hundred employees in just 8 short years...Brad Voeller was a young man who had discovered a problem.

A problem with higher education as a whole.

As a young man of 20 years old, Brad had taken a look at his life and his burden for the people in Asia and realized he needed something. He needed his Bachelor’s degree to really impact students and families in education-oriented Asia.

But he didn’t want to spend 4 years of his life earning that degree. He already had life experience on the mission field and wanted to get back there as soon as possible.

As he researched his different options, he discovered most of the colleges and universities weren’t very concerned with serving the unique needs of the students. They didn’t seem to care that Brad already had tons of life and ministry experience and knew exactly what he wanted to do with his life.

All he needed was his degree to credential him to be able to do that.

Everywhere he looked, there just wasn’t an opportunity for a customized experience within higher education.

After a lot of research with his entrepreneurial spirit, Brad was able to earn his fully accredited Bachelor’s degree in six short months, utilizing credit-by-exam and by documenting the life experience he had and receiving credit for it.

A lot more here: collegeplus.org/whoweare

@Wondering - CollegePlus is often called CollegeMinus at FJ.

[WonderingInWA]

Yes, I knew we called it CollegeMinus, but I was trying to figure out how it was interwoven with BCA. Not that it really matters, but I guess I haven't heard Voeller's name before. Thanks!

[Brigit Branwyn]

YES!! Thank you, Thoughtful!!

Now I am going to have an earworm going on all weekend.

ETA: I had to come back and say Thoughtful totally rocks with her lyrics.

I HAVE had an earworm all day!!!!! Argh!!!!!! Thanks a lot! lol

[Evil Feminist]

Brad Voeller and Woody Robertson came from an ATI background. Not sure about Ryan. I can find out though. Brad's dad was in charge of ATI homeschool curriculum and ran off with his secretary. Old story. Quite a few of the original CP team have backgrounds in ATI and ATI's college program, Verity.

Cplus or minus is based in San Antonio like VF. A lot of people in the VF crowd are attracted to CP because it allows their kids to stay at home, under parental authority, but still get a degree. Like Voddie Bauchams kids. So a continuation of homeschooling. There are CollegePlus employees who work closely with Doug Phillips.