Zach Bates and Whitney engaged

[halien13]

I've been doing a bit of research on Whit's family. According to this:

http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/TNANDERS/2002-06/1024622405

Johnny and Lydia (her parents) lost a daughter, Laklee to a car crash. At that point they only had two other daughters, Angel (m. Rickey Hayes 1994 and has two kids, Caleb and Brooke?) and Brittany (married a few years ago). Therefore they must have adopted their eight or nine other kids sometime in the past 11 years. So Whit was probably adopted in her early teens. I found the Facebook pages of some of Whit's cousins and siblings, and they all look pretty normal, maybe fundie-light?

Johnny was the pastor at Kentucky Hill Baptist Church, in Jellico, TN which has since closed. I think he's now the pastor at Beacon Baptist Church in Darden, TN, but I couldn't find any info on it other than the address. Given that Whit went to a public school, isn't a part of the ATI and attends college (and that Kelly mentioned all these things alongside saying that they accept her anyway), I'd say their church is quite different to the Bates's one.

All in all I'm happy for Zach and Whit. They look like a sweet couple and she looks stunning, even in modest clothes. Looking forward to more news about their wedding! :popcorn2:

[Mrs Ms]

How do you know that you've read to many fundie courtship and engagement announcements?

In my case, by reading that Zach organized for Whitney to get time off and thinking "Wow, that's considerate. He didn't just take her away but actually talked with her work, college and family[*]!"

Damn, sad that the bar is set sooooo low :cry:

[*](Well, obviously he HAD to talk with her father)

[Miggy]

Re: Gil's income (from a few pages back)

Do we know if he gets paid much for preaching at their church? Even if it isn't much, it would be consistent income unlike the tree business.

[bal maiden]

This reply from Kelly in the comments suggests they would not shun their kids should they leave the fold. Which is nice, I suppose?! Also "raising puppets" is the perfect descriptor for what JB an Jichelle are doing.

Dear Missie,

Well, we try to teach our children values as they are growing up. We especially try to teach them to study and seek God on their own, as well. We try to encourage them to have wise friends that are headed in the same direction. We try to encourage them to avoid mainstream media which tends to have very low morals. We try to encourage them to be faithful to a local Bible church and to hear good solid Biblical preaching. We try to keep very open communication and spend time hearing their goals, fears, desires, etc. But there does come a time of adulthood where they make their choices. Our love is there for them no matter what those choices might be…the years of childhood were to prepare them for this day. We are available for counsel and we certainly offer advice freely! But nonetheless, there comes a time for them to fly, right??? We’re there for them if they need us, but our goal is not to raise puppets! I think they teach us more than we actually teach them! And our views change often, when we’ve considered their wise perspectives on things! Love, Kelly

[nokidsmom]

I know that when I'm around my inlaws I watch how I dress much more closely than I normally would just because I don't want to offend them and if I ever go to church with them again I'll probably wear a skirt because I respect that's how their church is.

That's what I am thinking. She and her family seem fairly fundie-lite but she's probably around enough fundies even before Zach to know to dress more conservatively around them. But she's not around them 24/7.

I suspect her being fundie-lite is what attracted Zach. Since I suspected Sarah Reith was as well it appears to be the common denominator with both of Zach's "girlfriends" which says something. He may want a more mainstream life and given Kelly's remarks, knows he's not going to be rejected by his family if he doesn't live his life exactly like them.

[xReems]

I completely understand Whitney if she wanted to wear skirts to impress her future in-laws. It does not make it a bad thing, especially if she's doing something out of respect. When I was in South Africa for my man's sister's wedding, we attended the "Ashram" (temple him and his family grew up in) and I even told my boyfriend I wanted to go back their the day before we left to receive blessings from "Didi". I didn't grow up in the Ashram (my family and I grew up in Vaishnav mandir) but I wanted to do it out of respect for his family. It was my way of showing them that even though we grew up in different religious settings, that does not mean I am going to be stubborn and not accept my future family's beliefs. It made them happy to know that once the boy and I get married, we're going to raise our children in a Vaishnav mandir and Ashram.

It could be that Whitney respected her future family's beliefs and out of respect wanted to wear skirts. It doesn't necessarily mean that she won't ever wear pants but she felt like she wanted to do it out of respect. I don't see anything wrong with it, unless she was coerced into it. What I'm hoping is that both bring in their own beliefs and find common ground in it.

Even the Bates family has bizarre beliefs, compared to J'Chelle, I think Kelly genuinely loves and admires her children. I think she realizes that even though she wants them to be a certain way, she also knows that they have to make their own decisions. Even though Whitney did not grow up in an ATI environment, I think Kelly just sees happiness Zach has, which, to her, is all that matters.

Like I said, I do give her credit for changing their courtship beliefs around when things didn't work with Zach and Sarah. There are so many fundie families out there who stick with the same model, thinking it'll continue to work, when it doesn't. I think if you see a flaw, you should change it. Yes, I'm talking to you Steve MaxHell :naughty: :nenner:

[RosyDaisy]

Beacon Baptist Church is part of Beech River Baptist Association. Info on the association can be found here: http://www.brbaweb.org/Default.asp. They claim to be a group of independent Baptist churches.

Anyway......Kelly loves the attention her blog is getting, and she knows that some of the readers aren't fundie. Therefore she sugar coats a lot of things. She's smart enough to know that if she spews hate, she will lose followers and attention. Oh, and that smile of hers....that's what I call a shit eatin' grin. The only difference between her and Michelle Duggar is that Kelly had to be more involved in her kids' lives because she didn't have 4 daughters in a row to be sister moms to new blessings.

I admit I may be partly wrong about Zach and Whitney. However, I do not believe that Zach and Whitney would be allowed to marry if Whitney wasn't willing to toe the family line. And yes, Whitney may love Zach enough to do whatever he says. But, I have a feeling that she's going to be in for a rude awakening once the honeymoon is over and the reality that she is expected to be a submissive helpmeet and brood sow. The very fact that she was "convicted" to wear skirts after talking to the Bateses, and that Zach "arranged" for her to take time off from work and school is very telling of their life to come.

[tlcarlaw]

I think Kelly seemed really genuine in her answer about how they loved and accepted Whitney long before she started wearing skirts. I agree that Whitney may be wearing them because she wants to fit in with them but I don't think there was any pressure to do so.

As far as taking her to Florida as a surprise I thought that was sweet. Of course if she had a big test or project that she missed that would of been terrible but considering Zach seems to adore her I'm sure he was smart enough to make sure she wasn't missing something important at school or work before he made the arraignments. For all we know she may of just missed one class and if he arranged someone to take notes for her or get the assignments it doesn't seem like it would be a big deal. As far as her missing work who wouldn't want to miss a couple days of work to take a trip to florida. I mean it's not like she has a big important job it's only Sonic so as long as he got someone to cover her shift for her then I'm sure she could care less.

[DutchGirl]

I don't know about the schoolstuff, but at my job I make the schedules. And I made a cover-up schedule for a guy who got a surprise trip from his parents once and it was no trouble at all, even fun to be part of the suprise in a way. If Zach did it in this way I think it's just sweet.

[scc12]

I thought it was fine that Zach arranged a proposal he thought Whitney would like and was deserving of.

As for the rest of it,I would be more convinced it was of her own free will if Kelly ever says anything like... "such and such has decided not to wear skirts,and will keep her job after the wedding...'

[RosyDaisy]

No way in hell will Whitney be allowed to finish college or work after she is married. Nope. Ain't gonna happen. As I said before she will forced to become a submissive helpmeet and brood sow.

[scc12]

No way in hell will Whitney be allowed to finish college or work after she is married. Nope. Ain't gonna happen. As I said before she will forced to become a submissive helpmeet and brood sow.

that's what I think,too.sonic-gone.school-done.now it's time to concentrate on getting pregnant asap.and making homelife wunnerful for Zach.

I supposed it wouldn't be too safe for her to be skating around sonic pregnant anyway,though.

[Dandruff]

I feel for Zach since he seems pretty shy and had to endure a televised courtship that failed. I'm sure it was a learning experience for all of them, but he bore the brunt of it. Kelly's posts suggest to me that Zach and Whitney spent time getting to know each other unchaperoned (unless we count other patrons of Sonic) and it wouldn't surprise me at all if Whitney dated before meeting him. That said - I also believe the marriage will be pretty 'traditional', but we may not find out too much if they settle into a quiet life.

[lexiloumarie]

Erin's finishing school after getting married. I guess we'll have to wait and see. Kori Wissman hasn't gotten pregnant yet, and still works and look at how fundie they are.

[Kira]

The difference is Kori isn't from a fundie family. Erin and Whitney have fundie parents. The rule seems to be that boys can marry whomever they want. If Chad and Zach had courted women outside of the fundie world I would be more optimistic.

[sunshine]

The difference is Kori isn't from a fundie family. Erin and Whitney have fundie parents. The rule seems to be that boys can marry whomever they want. If Chad and Zach had courted women outside of the fundie world I would be more optimistic.

Somebody posted on their blog that fundie men are looking for women who are non-fundie. The reason is the fundie fathers have high expectations on the type of men that their daughters will marry.

[Miggy]

I don't know about Whitney but I think Erin will keep working throughout her marriage, even after having kids herself. Teaching Piano at home is acceptable in fundy land and Erin obviously enjoys her teaching. It is easy enough to work teaching around babies (I speak from experience) and there will always be a sister/sister-in-law on hand to look after babies during lessons. It won't make Chad & Erin any less fundy but it might make them a lot better off financially than some other families.

[nelliebelle1197]

Hmm, I don't know... I don't think it would bother me that much, especially for what seems like a short trip (2 days I think?). But then again I'm making the assumption that if someone were to plan that for me they would be considerate enough to creep around and find out my schedule, talk to friends, etc. to make sure I didn't have any big deadlines looming or plans and would be able to "afford" the absence. I'm also someone who does better most of the time self studying over going to lecture classes, anyway.

She is in some sort of medical billing course, right? That is a trade school certificate at most, not an academic university degree. I doubt she does research papers or has intense study groups or lectures. A lot of those medical billing certificates are done online, either wholly or partially. I doubt she had research papers or library work to do for that. And a lot of them are also scams, so I hope Whitney's is a real trade school.

ETA: Here is Kelly's comment

Lauren H. July 19, 2013 at 7:04 pm

Congratulations to Zach and Whitney! They look very happy and comfortable together.

Just out or curiosity, what is Whitney studying? Do she and Zach have any specific plans yet for after they marry?

Reply

Kelly July 19, 2013 at 8:46 pm

Dear Lauren,

She is studying medical billing and coding and medical insurance. Love, Kelly

Reply

thebatesfamily.com/2013/07/17/courtship-chronicle/

[scc12]

aren't erin and chad going to like in OK later on,though? that would mean few or no sisters around to help.

[Miggy]

Chad has sisters and I am sure the younger Bates girls will visit regularly.

[nokidsmom]

She is in some sort of medical billing course, right? That is a trade school certificate at most, not an academic university degree. I doubt she does research papers or has intense study groups or lectures. A lot of those medical billing certificates are done online, either wholly or partially. I doubt she had research papers or library work to do for that. And a lot of them are also scams, so I hope Whitney's is a real trade school.

I actually hold a medical billing certificate from our local CC, earned last year. There were no big research papers (only one short paper in on class), there were lectures, and one study group in an insurance class. But was by no means like an academic program (I hold a BA degree also). I took three years to complete the program part-time but taking it full-time would be about a year.

And yes, you do need to be careful which programs you take. There are lot of diploma mill type schools are not accredited with coding associations and will do the certificate holder no good. The school I went to was accredited but it was one of only three in my area that were and I live in a large metro area.

[anjulibai]

I don't know about Whitney but I think Erin will keep working throughout her marriage, even after having kids herself. Teaching Piano at home is acceptable in fundy land and Erin obviously enjoys her teaching. It is easy enough to work teaching around babies (I speak from experience) and there will always be a sister/sister-in-law on hand to look after babies during lessons. It won't make Chad & Erin any less fundy but it might make them a lot better off financially than some other families.

I also imagine she'll continue to release CDs of her music. There's definitely a market for it, and she does play beautifully. Between that and teaching students, she'll allow them to be quite comfortable.

[SquirrelySquirrel]

I know a couple of people who have done medical billing/coding from home and made a decent living. Perhaps some of the Bates offspring are learning from their parents' financial mistakes and see the wisdom in a two income family.

Anna did attempt to work at the car lot, but you could tell it wasn't her forte, and it seems she didn't last there too long after Mac's arrival. Erin bringing in even $50 a week from piano lessons or Whitney bringing in something from coding would be a big help, I'm sure, when there are little mouths to feed.

[melie612]

I actually commented on the engagement post, congratulating the happy couple and asking if Whitney would work in the medical billing/office field after they were married. I think it was ignored, as it was never posted and she has posted a lot of other comments since and answered questions.

[marmalade]

No way in hell will Whitney be allowed to finish college or work after she is married. Nope. Ain't gonna happen. As I said before she will forced to become a submissive helpmeet and brood sow.

I asked Kelly about Whitney's schooling. Kelly responded that Whitney's graduating this semesterl, so that will be done, likely on or around the second week of December. I did not dare ask about work in the same post, lest she figure out I wasn't a fundie and just fishing.

edited for clarity