Pet Peeve about "Mission Trips"

[Mela99]

. I also learned that when my ex was a kid, his parents made up a fake Christian school and made the kids sell candy and say they were raising money for that school. :o

Is this man your father in law? Is he still like this?

I read that Fred Phelps used to send his kids out selling candy all the time (with, apparently quotas for them and beatings for failing to meet said quotas)

. . . .

[snarkopolis]

Ugh, I was not aware that Biola offered a Masters in Messianic Jewish Studies. I know a lot of people who've attended/attend Biola, and I'm aware of some of the struggles of Biola Queer Underground, but I had no idea the school did this sort of thing. I thought the school was place for hipster fundie-lites, not a seminary for faux-Jews. Sorry for going off-topic, but this really rubbed me the wrong way.

An accordian IS NOT a blessing :penguin-no:

[DifferentGurl]

An accordian IS NOT a blessing :penguin-no:

But what if you always wanted an accordion but was unable to buy one?

[scc12]

I get pissed off at every one where they're more concerned with handing out bibles than food or medicine. Jesus wanted people to eat too, y'know.

me too.It's simple....the ppl can't even HEAR you unless their basic needs are met first.You'd think it would be common sense that they need to be fed and healed before they can open their minds to any type of preaching or reading the bible at all.

SO send the dr's,the meds,the food....FIRST.

[RandomTrivia]

I heard a program about "voluntourism" (including mission trips) on the CBC radio which I found interesting. The speaker was saying as many here already have, that it's probably a better value for the money to just send money (or possibly supplies, but usually just money is the best thing - they have supplies locally that fit all the local measurements, etc) rather than go volunteer.

Do you happen to remember which program this was on? It sounds interesting.

[Shirley MacLaine]

. I also learned that when my ex was a kid, his parents made up a fake Christian school and made the kids sell candy and say they were raising money for that school. :o

Oh my god, I did this! Sort of. I actually did go to a Christian school, but my friend and I lied that we were fundraising for the school. I was maybe eight or nine and we went door to door (it was his idea - I knew it was wrong but I went along because I wanted him to think I was cool). I don't even remember what we did with the money or how much we made, I just remember the guilt.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

Do you happen to remember which program this was on? It sounds interesting.

Just googled it up again now! It was an episode of "Q".

http://www.cbc.ca/q/2011/08/30/do-gap-y ... than-good/

[Persinette]

. I also learned that when my ex was a kid, his parents made up a fake Christian school and made the kids sell candy and say they were raising money for that school. :o

Is this man your father in law? Is he still like this?

I read that Fred Phelps used to send his kids out selling candy all the time (with, apparently quotas for them and beatings for failing to meet said quotas)

Ex-FIL now, but yeah, he's still like that--though his kids are all grown up and married and/or out of state, and I don't THINK he's forced candy selling on the grandkids yet...he's all kinds of fucked up (though not quite Phelps-level fucked up...I don't think the kids got beatings for not selling...but they were good at it, so maybe it never came up). I finally blocked him on fb last week, which made me an eensy bit sad cause I'll miss gawking at all the crazy, but I had to for my sanity.

[Persinette]

Oh my god, I did this! Sort of. I actually did go to a Christian school, but my friend and I lied that we were fundraising for the school. I was maybe eight or nine and we went door to door (it was his idea - I knew it was wrong but I went along because I wanted him to think I was cool). I don't even remember what we did with the money or how much we made, I just remember the guilt.

...see I think that's actually pretty funny/cute since it was your idea :)

[Shirley MacLaine]

I was a little baby Razing Ruth in the making!

[GeoBQn]

Just googled it up again now! It was an episode of "Q".

http://www.cbc.ca/q/2011/08/30/do-gap-y ... than-good/

I also recommend goodintents.org. They have lots of good articles about how to make responsible decisions about donating and volunteering overseas.

[Rescinded and Mended]

This thread makes me think of when the Duggars went to the Chinese orphanage. They handed out backpacks and played with the kids, and then insisted that everyone make these "ribbons" where you wrote down your wishes on strips of clear plastic and tied them to the trees outside.

In a blink-and-you'll-miss-it camera shot of the trees, most of the "wishes" were bible verses and a very specific one written by one of the Duggar littles that said "I hope you find Jesus."

Patronizing and insulting. How does any of this put food and other resources toward the well-being of these orphans? Meh.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

This thread makes me think of when the Duggars went to the Chinese orphanage. They handed out backpacks and played with the kids, and then insisted that everyone make these "ribbons" where you wrote down your wishes on strips of clear plastic and tied them to the trees outside.

In a blink-and-you'll-miss-it camera shot of the trees, most of the "wishes" were bible verses and a very specific one written by one of the Duggar littles that said "I hope you find Jesus."

Patronizing and insulting. How does any of this put food and other resources toward the well-being of these orphans? Meh.

Did this happen in the summer?

There's a holiday in Japan (originally a Chinese holiday too, it's very old) in the summer, which is about observing the Milky Way (the 銀河 or silver river) it's the one day when some separated lovers are able to meet across the river, so it's a sort of love holiday and people tie wishes written on thin strips of paper to bamboo branches and also decorate the trees with various paper decorations too (think like a Xmas tree but it's poems and wishes and paper decorations, and usually on bamboo rather than pines). In Japan it's "tanabata" 七夕.

Or was the Duggar thing more of a "tie a yellow ribbon round the old oak tree" style of ribbon? I suppose I should go scour YouTube.

...anyway if it WAS the traditional holiday (and do they do it that way in modern China? Not sure) and they were writing "I hope you find Jesus" it'd be... I dunno. Weird, to me, but I'm a heathen... :)

[GeoBQn]

There's also when the Duggars went to Joplin after the tornado, apparently on their own after local officals specifically ordered people not to come volunteer unless they were with an organized group.

Or the episode where they volunteer with Habitat for Humanity, wearing inappropriate clothing and footwear, and bringing children who were too young to help--forcing the real volunteers to find other activities for them.

Or anytime that the Duggars went somewhere to volunteer, ever.

[Rescinded and Mended]

Did this happen in the summer?

There's a holiday in Japan (originally a Chinese holiday too, it's very old) in the summer, which is about observing the Milky Way (the 銀河 or silver river) it's the one day when some separated lovers are able to meet across the river, so it's a sort of love holiday and people tie wishes written on thin strips of paper to bamboo branches and also decorate the trees with various paper decorations too (think like a Xmas tree but it's poems and wishes and paper decorations, and usually on bamboo rather than pines). In Japan it's "tanabata" 七夕.

Or was the Duggar thing more of a "tie a yellow ribbon round the old oak tree" style of ribbon? I suppose I should go scour YouTube.

...anyway if it WAS the traditional holiday (and do they do it that way in modern China? Not sure) and they were writing "I hope you find Jesus" it'd be... I dunno. Weird, to me, but I'm a heathen... :)

gardenvarietycitizen, that is beautiful. That's the sort of traditional festival that I would love to see and even be a part of. It sounds so reverential of true love.

According to a website I found, the Duggars were in Beijing on September 24th of 2012, so it would be after summer ended. I'm not sure whose idea it was, but the ribbons were just small strips of clear plastic marked with a black sharpie pen. Also not sure if any holiday was involved, either, only that Michelle seemed to say at one point, "Hey, let's do this!"

www.greatwalladventure.com/DuggarFamily ... enture.htm

Maybe she and Jim Bob heard about the tradition you mentioned while they were there, and decided to use it to promote themselves and their faith?

[rward]

. . . .

I see these kids downtown all the time, three of them, dressed oddly, selling candy but they never tell you exactly what for. I've called the cops numerous times, but it doesn't seem to do any good. I suspect (know but can't prove) that these children are supporting their family with this scam, but I guess nobody cares.

[DifferentGurl]

me too.It's simple....the ppl can't even HEAR you unless their basic needs are met first.You'd think it would be common sense that they need to be fed and healed before they can open their minds to any type of preaching or reading the bible at all.

SO send the dr's,the meds,the food....FIRST.

Kinda makes me think of this one clip from "Voice of Martyrs" where they secretly sent Bibles into North Korea. I think I was like "The North Koreans need food! Not bibles!" What if a North Korean soldier saw an ordinary citizen pick up a Bible? They would send them and their family to the concentration camps! Just for picking it up and seeing what it was! Is that what you wants VOM, to send citizens to concentration camps because of your Bibles?

[YPestis]

I remember a few years back this very conservative kook who railed about this type of volun-tourism. Only his target was "rich liberals" who wanted to work out their "white guilt". He said these kids would go to Africa for a few weeks, spend a bunch of money, do nothing useful and then come home feeling better about themselves. He pointed out it was more about the rich white kids feeling good and having something great to put on their resumes than helping starving orphans. I thought he had a point, but I was suspicious of the man's motives as he cloaked most of his rants in rants against mythical, heathen, unAmerican "liberals". It's a shame I can no longer get in contact with him. I would love to hear his reply to these uber-conservatives also doing something similar, with probably a longer history of volun-tourism than those guilt-feeling white liberals he loves to bash.

I think it's great if teens want to go to third world countries. However, I think it needs to be made clear that they are doing it to educate themselves, as observers rather than doers. There are few people in developed nations who has the skillsets and stamina to enter an impoverished country and affect true change. People like the Duggars are just too self-absorbed to realize that.

I think missionaries have a long history of doing great things in developing nations. My mom used to tell me she grew up near a major medical university, the first of it's kind in her province, which were founded and built by Christian missionaries in the early 20th century. However, their useless counterparts, people like the Duggars and other Bible-passing groups, are just like the rich American kids who spends $5000 to dig wells in an African village. Don't pass it off as more than an educational and personal experience. Passing out bibles is fine, but that's not equivalent to opening up a medical clinic. Spending thousands on this trip is a good use of money as trips abroad generally will cost that much, and going to a third world country is far more educational than blowing off in Cancun. However, that the plane ticket alone could pay for ten times the workers in a poor village, so don't think that the $5k spent is a "donation" to starving orphans.

It always infuriates me that fundies like the Duggars and Maxwells are so keen on passing Bibles and spreading the gospels. If they only did a bit of research, they would know how horrible the situation is in places like Sudan and North Korea. Trust me, it's NOT because they are in dire need of bibles. They need food! medicine! clothing! That should be the priority of any good missionary. The bible thing should be an accessory to all that. Too bad people like the Duggars and Maxwells are too dense and ignorant to realize that.

[Shirley MacLaine]

I remember a few years back this very conservative kook who railed about this type of volun-tourism. Only his target was "rich liberals" who wanted to work out their "white guilt". He said these kids would go to Africa for a few weeks, spend a bunch of money, do nothing useful and then come home feeling better about themselves. He pointed out it was more about the rich white kids feeling good and having something great to put on their resumes than helping starving orphans. I thought he had a point, but I was suspicious of the man's motives as he cloaked most of his rants in rants against mythical, heathen, unAmerican "liberals".

Well, thinking that it's just ~liberals~ who do this kind of thing is obviously bullshit, but as for the rest of it, hey, even a broken clock is right twice a day

[RandomTrivia]

Just googled it up again now! It was an episode of "Q".

http://www.cbc.ca/q/2011/08/30/do-gap-y ... than-good/

Thanks! I'll have to listen to it (if it's not blocked because of my location).

[JTN]

Back in the day(early 1990s), I used to work for a travel agency that specialized in mission trips... especially to Russia. One of the problems that kept cropping up (leading to us moving away from these trips) was the local population would routinely come out and get baptized and saved multiple times a month because, well, they would get free swag from the Americans visiting and since it was a mission tourism thing... no group was there for more than a week.

At the time, I was taking Russian as my language at my university and the woman who organized these trips dropped a bunch of letters in my lap to translate... some of my favorite bits were things like "if you don't give a car, we are going to die" or "Jesus has told us you will give us money and we expect it now"... I can't remember the exact phrasing, but it was something like that...

I've never had much use for mission trips after that job. I found most the ministers to be greedy (want a free trip), the people borderline delusional (I decided to go when I saw this picture in the promotional material and decided Jesus was speaking to me), and the work they were doing was mostly silly and self-aggrandizing.

[Culottes]

This is what I have always found odd about church groups that go do mission work (rebuild homes, churches, playgrounds) on a very poor reservation in my home state. They spend many hours and money working to fix it all up, only to have those living on the reservation tear out things that can be sold for cash. Paying locals to fix it up themselves would provide some income and may prevent them from selling their homes off piece by piece...instead of them just expecting it to be fixed again in a few months.

I was born & raised on a reservation. The items were likely sold to either provide for basic needs (food, housing, utilities), or for alcohol or other drugs. Sadly, there is an epidemic of substance and alcohol abuse on reservations.

[JMarie]

I also hate it when fundies go on "mission" trips to places that seem to have a reasonable standard of living for the average person e.g. San Francisco, Paris, New Zealand. Just call it what it is - i.e. a VACATION.

Like Mitt Romney in France for 2 1/2 years, so he could avoid fighting in Vietnam

[Rescinded and Mended]

I was born & raised on a reservation. The items were likely sold to either provide for basic needs (food, housing, utilities), or for alcohol or other drugs. Sadly, there is an epidemic of substance and alcohol abuse on reservations.

I saw a documentary about life in North Korea on National Geographic once. It was filmed illegally by a citizen who later escaped. One of the first scenes was in a marketplace, and there were bundles of supplies delivered by missionaries - food, medicine, etc. These bundles had been seized and put up for sale by the government...they were never given to their recipients.

At a nearby kiosk, a vendor cooked food to sell. Any bits he dropped on the ground were quickly grabbed and eaten by hungry children.

I agree with everyone here who believes that mission trips seem to be more about the people who undertake them than about those who are receiving the help. But in that instance, I wish the supplies could have gone to the needy, or at least those poor children. :(

[jaelh]

Well, thinking that it's just ~liberals~ who do this kind of thing is obviously bullshit, but as for the rest of it, hey, even a broken clock is right twice a day

He is talking about a very specific phenomena, that occurs mainly with "gap years kids" and on the backpacker circuit. "Volunteer tourism" is targeted at rich, western kids who want to salve their guilt. 100% no questions. Yes, there are other groups - but what he's talking about is a subset of a whole. And a very large, very wealthy, very distorting subset. The mission stuff is problematic, but at least they're honest in their impart their worldview crap.

I have no context for what YPestis has posted, but no questions - he has a point. It may be the product of a distorted view point (ie: he's a conservative kook, and thus wants to find things wrong with liberals); it doesn't make him wrong. There is a whole industry built up around this, and it doesn't target conservatives.

From my point of view, the problem is that "western liberals" are egregious in their hypocrisy. Most conservatives aren't going to explain their trip or experience in the language of post colonialism, anti-racism and international development. Liberals do.

Separate out volunteering trips, that are intended to be *all about* helping locals, from mission trips, which necessarily have a touch of saving heathen souls via a bit of house building. If you were to tell a rich liberal kid that they were going to civilise the barbarians by giving them the truth they'd recoil at the suggestion. Skydog forbid you suggest that some "human rights education programs" are exactly.the.%&^.same. And therein lies the problem. (the whole atheist education thing in Cambodia being promoted on Dispatches from the Culture War makes my skin crawl. Really, atheism is going to help the Cambodian's shed their barbaric Buddhist practices? I mean, it's not like the genocide in Cambodia was a genocide conducted by those whose beliefs were proudly atheist [see])

I think short term volunteering programs, esp. any program that takes work away from local communities (see house building; distributing those stupid shoes etc... ) are deeply, deeply problematic. No matter what, volunteers end up getting more out of their experience than local communities (see notable exceptions like doctors training others to do cleft palette surgery and the like.. but these exceptions are so rare they make the case, and the volunteers themselves still get massive amounts out of their trip).

Volunteering (short term, anyway) makes poor people a prop for the emotional development of rich people. And short term volunteers fundamentally distort local practice - they put people out of work; they "create" need which results in increases in child trafficking; projects have little long term benefit; money is wasted etc..

I really like this article: http://www.sallyhetherington.com/?p=5015 and http://goodintents.org/staffing-or-empl ... d-go-wrong

fwiw: Good intents is a great site.