Josh Duggar Has a New Job?

[silvia]

I'm sure as few of them would escape as the Amish. The purpose of Rumspringa, from the perspective of the elders, isn't to let the kids get a taste of the real world, it's to show them how evil the real world is. To that end, they set up the kids to fail and come back.

I think to a certain extent this is true. During Rumspringa, the Amish kids are flung pell-mell into a world for which their upbringing has in no way prepared them. Rarely having faced temptation, they haven't learned to resist it, so it's no wonder that when presented with an endless buffet of "worldly" temptations like alcohol, sex, and drugs, they gorge themselves sick (ex. Faron Yoder in one of my favorite films, The Devil's Playground). It's entirely possible a Duggar escapee would have a similar experience. This is the major downside of the extreme sheltering approach to parenting: it works well enough when the kid is confined to the greenhouse environment of home, but the second they get out, all hell breaks loose.

I saw the same thing happen to a lesser degree at college when super-sheltered kids suddenly had unfettered access to alcohol. Never having been allowed to exercise their powers of self-control, they did the expected thing--and the worst cases ended up in the infirmary or having their stomachs pumped.

[SpicyCat]

GLAAD has pretty much slammed Joshie boy for this one, AND it's going out into more main stream news. So not going to help him.

http://www.eonline.com/news/398273/19-k ... hate-group

[ILoveJellybeans]

I think to a certain extent this is true. During Rumspringa, the Amish kids are flung pell-mell into a world for which their upbringing has in no way prepared them. Rarely having faced temptation, they haven't learned to resist it, so it's no wonder that when presented with an endless buffet of "worldly" temptations like alcohol, sex, and drugs, they gorge themselves sick (ex. Faron Yoder in one of my favorite films, The Devil's Playground). It's entirely possible a Duggar escapee would have a similar experience. This is the major downside of the extreme sheltering approach to parenting: it works well enough when the kid is confined to the greenhouse environment of home, but the second they get out, all hell breaks loose.

I saw the same thing happen to a lesser degree at college when super-sheltered kids suddenly had unfettered access to alcohol. Never having been allowed to exercise their powers of self-control, they did the expected thing--and the worst cases ended up in the infirmary or having their stomachs pumped.

Yeah, I can see that happening to escaped fundie kids. Its probably a good thing that Josh hasnt got into drinking, as I blame Michelle and Jimbobs sheltering for him putting on so much weight by eating out every single day.

Its a problem with sheltering, theyve been taught a very black and white way of thinking, and havent been taught that some things are okay in small doses-things are either good or evil, so its easy to go from one side to another instead of in moderation. Once they learn that things their parents have told them are wrong-learning about evolution and realising its better than creationism, meeting worldly people who are nicer to them than their parents were, theyre likely to disbelieve the other stuff their parents told them as well and might go towards the other way. Theyve also been kept away from some things completely, and not told about things-once theyve realised that purity is bullshit, how do they know how not to end up pregnant or catch herpes? Also a lot of fundie kids werent taught about proper portion sizes-theyre used to eating tiny amounts that are barely enough to feed them, but also only ever cooking tator tot casserole for a family of 10.

I think the best chance an escaped fundie would have, is having someone already on the outside who knows about stuff like that to help them, as a lot of fundies are uneducated, with no work skills and lacking in important knowledge that people need in the real world.

[nokidsmom]

I think the best chance an escaped fundie would have, is having someone already on the outside who knows about stuff like that to help them, as a lot of fundies are uneducated, with no work skills and lacking in important knowledge that people need in the real world.

In addition to having someone on the outside to help them, hopefully that someone is honestly trying to help and not take advantage. A fundie leaving the lifestyle and going out into the world is going to be pretty vulnerable and will have no functioning BS detector, therefore falling victim to someone who doesn't have the best of intentions.

ETA: Don't remember example of fundies but am thinking of a Amish girl who escaped with help of her soon-to-be husband some years ago. She published a book I think. A lot of folks thought it was all romantic but my takeaway upon reading some excerpts from the book was that the guy was a total creep.

[Ellimenopy]

In various Duggar escape threads, I have theorized that most likely means of escape, out of all possible escape scenarios, for the J'slaves has been marriage to a fundie-lite. But the kicker is going through JB. And it would have to be a guy who says all the right things and looks Godly enough for JB to approve, then goes fundie-lite post marriage as well as says "no" to participating in the TLC dog and pony show, provided the show is still on which it probably won't.

However, given J'chelle's recent comments about Jinger I am pretty convinced that even this means of escape, is not going to be possible. That's one mama who clearly doesn't want her daughters, never mind they are freaking adults, to ever leave. I not sure she's keen on the boys leaving either, but knows that in ATI land that has to happen because if nothing else because it will reflect badly on them. So she will settle on them leaving but living near the compound. But for daughters, they can justify keeping them around under the cover of SAHD-hood.

Also agreed that the girls are probably seen as too worldly at this point. And probably high maintenance because they are used to a lot of perks.

Sometimes I wonder what would happen if a small group of us women just showed up at the gate of the compound and asked to speak to Jana.

[Patsy]

The thing with the "200 year plan" is that people have "multigenerational faithfulness" to one patriarch. By that logic, daughters don't factor into this plan--if they get married, they will be popping out babies for someone else's 200 year plan. They really have no incentive to marry off the daughters.

I'd never thought about that. Wow. The idiotic idea really is dependent on sons' perpetual submission, and has nothing to do with the daughters... Good point!

[nokidsmom]

I'd never thought about that. Wow. The idiotic idea really is dependent on sons' perpetual submission, and has nothing to do with the daughters... Good point!

I didn't know that either. So much for world domination.

I remember from sociology classes in college that women were critical to the continuation of a society but many societies practiced female infanticide, thereby eliminating the very people they needed for it's continuation. So 200 year plan is pretty much shot.

[IReallyAmHopewell]

I just read that the article has been discredited. quiverfullmyblog.wordpress.com/2013/03/14/oldest-duggar-moving-to-dc/

This is my blog--I couldn't find anything other than the original article, then discussion here and elsewhere made it seem like it might not be true. I will be deleting it when I have time.

[DefraudedByPlaid]

The thing with the "200 year plan" is that people have "multigenerational faithfulness" to one patriarch. By that logic, daughters don't factor into this plan--if they get married, they will be popping out babies for someone else's 200 year plan. They really have no incentive to marry off the daughters.

I still don't fully get how the need for a son to go out and have his own family "vision" works, if really they mean (whether they admit it or not) that that vision must fit in with the founding patriarch's vision. Maybe the VF, QF, ATI royalty see it as their rights to demand obedience from their adult sons: "We have popular, self-sustaining businesses and the most WORTHY, AMAZING visions. Let sons of low-ranking families come to us. Why should our sons leave for asub-par vivision?"

Do the original, founding patriarchs of the 200-year plans see themselves like the twelve tribes of Israel, where the founder's deeds and identity determine your "tribe's" future identity and role?

[Chibi Author]

I think to a certain extent this is true. During Rumspringa, the Amish kids are flung pell-mell into a world for which their upbringing has in no way prepared them. Rarely having faced temptation, they haven't learned to resist it, so it's no wonder that when presented with an endless buffet of "worldly" temptations like alcohol, sex, and drugs, they gorge themselves sick (ex. Faron Yoder in one of my favorite films, The Devil's Playground). It's entirely possible a Duggar escapee would have a similar experience. This is the major downside of the extreme sheltering approach to parenting: it works well enough when the kid is confined to the greenhouse environment of home, but the second they get out, all hell breaks loose.

I saw the same thing happen to a lesser degree at college when super-sheltered kids suddenly had unfettered access to alcohol. Never having been allowed to exercise their powers of self-control, they did the expected thing--and the worst cases ended up in the infirmary or having their stomachs pumped.

This is a bit of a soapbox, and I'm sorry in advance; but Rumspringa is not a time when Amish kids are thrown into the world. It's technically a time for them to go to the weekly singings, socialize, and start dating. There are kids who are more "wild", i.e. have cell phone, smoke, listen to music, go out partying, etc. And some parents are more willing to look the other way, figuring that the "wild" behavior will run its course and the kid will mature, join the church, and get married.

As far as I know, they're never actively encouraged to choose whether or not to join the church. It's just expected that you will, and if you do end up leaving, it's wholly dependent on each family on how to treat you after that.

aboutamish.blogspot.com/2012/06/that-rumspringa-misconception-again.html

irawagler.com/?p=605

(Both Saloma and Ira's biographies are well worth reading, if you're interested in some of the lesser-known aspects of Amish-ness.)

Sorry for the rant. Carry on.

[Milly-Molly-Mandy]

In addition to having someone on the outside to help them, hopefully that someone is honestly trying to help and not take advantage. A fundie leaving the lifestyle and going out into the world is going to be pretty vulnerable and will have no functioning BS detector, therefore falling victim to someone who doesn't have the best of intentions.

ETA: Don't remember example of fundies but am thinking of a Amish girl who escaped with help of her soon-to-be husband some years ago. She published a book I think. A lot of folks thought it was all romantic but my takeaway upon reading some excerpts from the book was that the guy was a total creep.

Do you remember the name of the book? Sounds good!

[mrs]

This is a bit of a soapbox, and I'm sorry in advance; but Rumspringa is not a time when Amish kids are thrown into the world. It's technically a time for them to go to the weekly singings, socialize, and start dating. There are kids who are more "wild", i.e. have cell phone, smoke, listen to music, go out partying, etc. And some parents are more willing to look the other way, figuring that the "wild" behavior will run its course and the kid will mature, join the church, and get married.

As far as I know, they're never actively encouraged to choose whether or not to join the church. It's just expected that you will, and if you do end up leaving, it's wholly dependent on each family on how to treat you after that.

aboutamish.blogspot.com/2012/06/that-rumspringa-misconception-again.html

irawagler.com/?p=605

(Both Saloma and Ira's biographies are well worth reading, if you're interested in some of the lesser-known aspects of Amish-ness.)

Sorry for the rant. Carry on.

Thanks for the info! Here is a link to the PBS documentary one of the authors is featured in: http://video.pbs.org/video/2200745636/ .

I think when Josh married Anna, he had a Rumpspringa of sorts... the cable tv, social media, FAST FOOD,etc.

[nokidsmom]

Do you remember the name of the book? Sounds good!

The name of the book was "Crossing Over". Not remembering the author name at the moment but she came from an Amish settlement in Iowa.

[Anosmia]

If Josh and Anna do move to DC and if Jinger does join them to provide help with the kids (or whatever the excuse may be), she won't even need to go wild in bars and clubs in order to experience freedom. Just having a bedroom to herself will be freedom. Being able to go shopping alone will be freedom. Going for a walk by herself will be freedom. Relishing the freedom of not being chained to her family may give her the courage and fortitude to widen the scope a bit. Watch TV. Go to a museum. Become friendly with people who are not part of the family. Wear pants. Even baby steps are a way out of the prison. Two of Fred Phelps's granddaughters defected from the WBC recently, so I think there's hope for anyone.

Also, I live near DC, so I would totally stalk the hell out of Josh, Anna, and Jinger.

[lilah]

I seriously doubt that in the unlikely event Josh actually gets hired he'd really be able to hack it in DC.

He'd either have to chose between living in the city with a nice commute but having to rent an apartment at a very high price, or living more inexpesnively in the suburbs and have a really awful commute. In general the cost of living is very high. And while there are still Aldis and dollar stores in genral it's a different ball game than Arkansas

Both Josh and Anna would have a lot of culture shock since most of the DC area is very liberal and they might end up being neighbors with people who are gay or minorities or athiests (or all of the above)

[browngrl]

I think that if Josh gets the job things could go one of two ways. They will either be terrified by the feminists/intellectuals/atheists or by the people of other cultures and run back home with their tails between their legs more determined than ever to build walls between themselves and "the others" or they will actually open their minds and see that their beliefs are full of holes and just maybe they will learn and grow. I hope it is the latter but I suspect it will be the former.

[salex]

I think that if Josh gets the job things could go one of two ways. They will either be terrified by the feminists/intellectuals/atheists or by the people of other cultures and run back home with their tails between their legs more determined than ever to build walls between themselves and "the others" or they will actually open their minds and see that their beliefs are full of holes and just maybe they will learn and grow. I hope it is the latter but I suspect it will be the former.

I think if they work for FRC, their beliefs are more likely to solidify and become more aggressive, as opposed to opening up to new people and views.

[lilwriter85]

If Josh and Anna do move to DC, I see them doing their best to avoid the ebil atheists, feminists, and gays.

[raydianse]

While I do not how much Josh/Anna pay for rent on their home, I would suspect that they are aware of how much renting a place in DC or the DC area is going to cost them. Money and finances play a very important role in their teaching gospel for them to be unaware of what they are jumping into. Who knows, TLC or whoever Josh is going to work for could be paying for their living expenses.

And we aren't talking about people who are paupers, they have probably have made a pretty decent salary from TLC. Granted if they start shopping at Whole Foods everyday or now actually buy full price/brand new clothes then that changes things, but I don't see that happening because Anna is pretty frugal herself.

I am sure they are going to have plenty of friends when they move, people visiting them, and people who think like them who work with Josh. They also will have a church community, probably. While some of other people may not be as strict ie girls can wear pants, and children attend schools. And if nothing else this will open up a huge group of people for them to try and reach to show the word of God.

I think this will be a great opportunity for Anna to actually bloom into her own, without being under Mama Duggar's thumb.

And while I am excited for them, I think that Joshypoo won't be able to handle being away from his parents and his bubble and they will be heading home within a year at the most.

[Buzzard]

While I do not how much Josh/Anna pay for rent on their home, I would suspect that they are aware of how much renting a place in DC or the DC area is going to cost them. Money and finances play a very important role in their teaching gospel for them to be unaware of what they are jumping into. Who knows, TLC or whoever Josh is going to work for could be paying for their living expenses.

I say this now as a threat, not a promise. If TLC pays for Josh Duggar to live in DC and work at Family Research Council. THAT. MEANS. WAR. I dont mean, "Dear TLC, you suck" posts. I dont mean trolling their facebook page. I mean all out, balls to the wall, targeting advertisers, posting executive's email addresses, mailing fish to their headquarters WAR.

TLC pulled "All American Muslim" and various other shows. If they support FRC... :twisted:

[JenniferJuniper]

I say this now as a threat, not a promise. If TLC pays for Josh Duggar to live in DC and work at Family Research Council. THAT. MEANS. WAR. I dont mean, "Dear TLC, you suck" posts. I dont mean trolling their facebook page. I mean all out, balls to the wall, targeting advertisers, posting executive's email addresses, mailing fish to their headquarters WAR.

TLC pulled "All American Muslim" and various other shows. If they support FRC... :twisted:

I don't see it happening. They'd essentially be promoting an anti-gay hate group, and that's not somewhere a network like TLC really wants to go.

[Talitha Cumi]

Boob and Mullet probably "those who've left Gothard's Umbrella of Protection" horror stories to keep them in line.

Hah, that reminds me of a podcast I just heard.

The lead singer of one of my favorite bands (Brendon Urie of Panic! at the Disco) was raised Mormon. When he was a teen, he began questioning the whole setup, which finally culminated in him refusing to go on a mission, citing his band as the reason. His parents kicked him out, but he got an apartment, worked after school and on weekends, and finished high school. Then his band got signed and became huge.

The podcast hosts were interviewing him, and asked "So, they tell you terrible things will happen if you leave, right? What do you think a kid thinks now, going 'well HE left, and he got all this stuff! he isn't being punished!'"

Brendon answered "Yeah, I'm totally being punished. It's the best punishment in the world." 8-) 8-) 8-)

[gustava]

While I do not how much Josh/Anna pay for rent on their home, I would suspect that they are aware of how much renting a place in DC or the DC area is going to cost them. Money and finances play a very important role in their teaching gospel for them to be unaware of what they are jumping into. Who knows, TLC or whoever Josh is going to work for could be paying for their living expenses.

And we aren't talking about people who are paupers, they have probably have made a pretty decent salary from TLC. Granted if they start shopping at Whole Foods everyday or now actually buy full price/brand new clothes then that changes things, but I don't see that happening because Anna is pretty frugal herself.

I am sure they are going to have plenty of friends when they move, people visiting them, and people who think like them who work with Josh. They also will have a church community, probably. While some of other people may not be as strict ie girls can wear pants, and children attend schools. And if nothing else this will open up a huge group of people for them to try and reach to show the word of God.

I think this will be a great opportunity for Anna to actually bloom into her own, without being under Mama Duggar's thumb.

And while I am excited for them, I think that Joshypoo won't be able to handle being away from his parents and his bubble and they will be heading home within a year at the most.

Sounds as if you know them.

[Buzzard]

I don't see it happening. They'd essentially be promoting an anti-gay hate group, and that's not somewhere a network like TLC really wants to go.

I would REALLY hope that TLC is smart enough to stay on this side of that bridge but I have little faith.

[lagenialester]

I just do not see how Josh Duggar can be qualified for any sort of job that isn't handed to him by Jim Boob. The SDRT is just not going to cut it in a place like DC. No way.