'You Can't Be a Princess'

[mebeforee]

Bullying is a possibility no matter what a child does. I think in this case I would equip my child with what to say in the event someone teases or makes fun of him. I think confidence is key, and of course if someone is going too far to alert an adult and get help. I'd also tell their teacher about my child's choice...it could be a great learning opportunity for everyone.

The problem with hiding from the bullies is that there will ALWAYS be a bully. You can only protect your child for so long, but eventually they will face opposition and discrimination. Allowing your son to dress up as a princess in school will be helpful in paving the way for acceptance, especially if the kids involved are fairly open-minded. He can explain why he chose the costume to them and show them it's not a big deal. After all, if he chooses to dress like a female later in life or wear makeup or exhibit any sort of "feminine" traits, it's best if he begins to learn coping mechanisms now when he is still young and under the supervision of (hopefully) open-minded and protective adults.

I'm trying to find an amazing documentary made by a child where he goes into his school wearing pink and "girly" clothes and interviews his classmates on their reactions. Most of them were skeptical but willing to listen.

Yes, children will be bullied, probably every child is bullied at some point in their life. I'm not saying that it's entirely avoidable. But the child should - if not already aware - be reminded that the choices they make CAN influence bullying. Like I said, if a child of mine wanted to do this, I'd never tell them they COULDN'T, but I would make sure we had a conversation about what might happen.

Sexuality and gender is extremely volatile, because at this point (at least in the US, I can't speak for anywhere else) the majority of people equate it as an intrinsic and defining part of personality. Which then lends itself to being used to assign value. We're starting to get to a point where society is more willing to accept women and men as equals (though there are obviously still people fighting this). But when a person has a minority sexual orientation or gender identity, that is still linked to value and people devalue and dehumanize people who show differences there.

A very young child might be able to get their peers to listen (and the presence of a camera WOULD have an effect on the way the children reacted to their classmate's behavior, too. It's on film, if they are too horrible to him, he can go home and show the tape to his parents, who can show it to their parents. A lot of kids would resist being openly cruel to him in a way where they'd be caught so easily.) And when children get a bit older and start to understand social hierarchies more, they begin to tear each other down. It's true that kids are going to be bullied for a whole spread of things, but some things are still highly targeted. A boy wearing a dress is going to be bullied, there is no question to it right now. If the child is aware of this and still wants to do it, that's their choice, but I don't believe they're any lesser if they would rather avoid that. Bullying can be very traumatic and if the child does not want to be subjected to the particularly vicious type of bullying that crossdressing is likely to receive, they should just as easily be allowed to change their mind about the costume.

ETA: The biggest problem I have with the parents in the video is that they are unwilling to listen to the child's thoughts and feelings, or include the child in the conversation. I understand why the second mother wanted to keep the boy from wearing the dress, but I disagree with her reaction. It should still have been HIS choice what HE wears on HIS body. But to not discuss the possibilities with him would also be negligent, imho. Depending on how his peers react, it could turn out to be one of the worst experiences of his life, and teach him only to keep those feelings and interests hidden.

[Libby Liberal]

Somewhere I have pictures of the year my daughter was Darth Vader for Halloween, while a friend's son was Ariel. (Their choices.) It was so cute. I never would have thought to worry if we were confusing their future sexual identities.

[wendy-sparkles]

Yes, children will be bullied, probably every child is bullied at some point in their life. I'm not saying that it's entirely avoidable. But the child should - if not already aware - be reminded that the choices they make CAN influence bullying. Like I said, if a child of mine wanted to do this, I'd never tell them they COULDN'T, but I would make sure we had a conversation about what might happen.

That's getting awfully close to victim blaming...

[Guest Anonymous]

That's getting awfully close to victim blaming...

I agree. I understand the desire to protect a child from bullying. And yet at the same time, if home and family are not safe places where you can be your true self, then where in the world is safe?

[mebeforee]

But that's not really what's being suggested here, this is a child picking out a halloween costume, presumably to wear to school/parties/trick-or-treating. There's an external factor that parents can't control, especially when it comes to schoolmates. I think most people wouldn't worry about or have a talk with their kid if they were playing dress-up at home, but I do think it's natural that most parents don't want their child to be bullied. I was bullied a lot as a kid, even though I didn't do anything unusual compared to my classmates, and my parents were really great about helping me learn how to deal with it and be strong through those tough experiences. But I think in general most parents will try first and foremost to help their child avoid bullying, and will only teach coping stuff if the child is already being targeted.

And I'm not victim blaming, I don't think there's anything wrong with what the child wants. But I think parents need to make the options clear and have a direct conversation with their kids about why other people might target. It's an informing thing, I mean, the bullies (and probably their parents, they're picking up those ideas from somewhere) will be blaming the kid. They'll be saying he brings it on himself, if he wears a dress. It's not true, because a little boy dressing up as Belle obviously doesn't deserve to be bullied for it. They're still in the wrong. But it's unfortunately also true that, if a little boy wears a Belle costume, he IS going to be bullied, especially for older children. Ignoring that fact isn't going to help the child or change society, it's going to set the kid up for a nasty shock when people are hateful toward him. He should be the one who decides what he wears, it is HIS body, but I think it's unfair not to talk about the perceived significance of that choice and allow him to make an informed decision. It's stupid and horrible that people act the way they do about this stuff, but the fact that it's invalid doesn't change that the child could have a really horrible experience and he or she should know that there are people out there who are very aggressive about gender and clothing choices.

[valsa]

It's stupid and horrible that people act the way they do about this stuff, but the fact that it's invalid doesn't change that the child could have a really horrible experience and he or she should know that there are people out there who are very aggressive about gender and clothing choices.

And there's a way to inform that doesn't imply that it's his choices that cause the bullying.

My hypothetical future son can go trick-or-treating as anything he wants, including a princess or a ballerina or anything else generically girly. And I will caution him that some people may say hurtful things about it. However, it will not be because his choices influence their behavior- it will be because they are close-minded and ignorant and deserving of pity. The emphasis belongs on something being wrong with the people who have a problem with the costume, not that something is wrong with the boy who wants to dress like a girl.

[mebeforee]

I agree entirely, that's what I'm trying to get across here. I just find it difficult to phrase things in a way that someone on the forum won't find fault with, probably a losing battle, there are too many users and I'm just not articulate enough, I guess. I don't think there's anything at all wrong with a little boy dressing up as whatever he wants, but there are people out there who do and they can be very cruel. I'm not saying anyone should dissuade their kids from wearing what they want, just that I understand why parents might be worried. I think kids should be prepared for what might happen, because it is an issue that people can be really terrible about.

[valsa]

I understand why parents might be worried.

As a lesbian, I have a big issue with this reasoning. When I came out to my mother in high school, she was less than thrilled. She knew enough from the media and dealing with my older brother (also gay) that she knew being gay could get you teased (at best) or killed (at worst) However, none of that makes a damn bit of difference towards my sexual orientation. I am what I am.

What the video played up with the mom was the "what if he doesn't grow out of it?" and "I want to nip it in the bud" aspect, which I think is important. The bottom line is that, with kids, you never know for sure. The kid could just be going through a phase, which means denying him the princess costume will probably just leave him with some memories of resentment and, sadly, likely re-enforce the gender stereotype for yet another generation.

But what if the kid isn't going through a phase? What if he is transgender and refusing to let him wear the costume just re-enforces that there's something wrong with him and the way he feels about himself (or herself, as it is)? Again, that mother can be worried about bullies all she wants but it's not going to make a damn bit of difference when it comes to the fact you can't change the gender identity of a trans child. They are what they are. Additionally, they need what they need- which is support from the people they're closest to.

[mebeforee]

I understand what you're saying and I agree, but again, I'm not saying that the child shouldn't be allowed to. And my sympathy isn't that they are worried about the child's sexuality, because I don't think that matters at all and my older brother is also gay, so my family went through some situations with that socially, but we came out of it stronger. I think it's natural for parents to want to protect their children from bullying and harassment, though. That's what I understand in terms of their worry. I feel like we're talking about two subtly different aspects of the same topic. My point isn't that the child shouldn't be supported or that they shouldn't be allowed to wear the costume, it's that the parents should be having honest conversation with them about it so they are prepared for possible aggression/teasing.

And my sympathy for those parents doesn't extend to the eventual decision they came to, I don't think they were at all right to tell the child he should pick something else. I just understand why they are worried, because kids ARE pretty brutal about that stuff and I think a lot of parents instinctively try to protect their kids from that. But I think there needs to be a line between being concerned and actually controlling the child. It's not like he wants to go trick-or-treating naked, and it's not like he's doing something bad that needs to be disciplined. There's no reason to make him think he's wrong on any level, because he's not.

[mebeforee]

And yeah, the 'will he grow out of it' thing really irritated me. Especially because the mothers taped would offer this without any apparent prompting. Like, 'if this is the first time, just nip it in the bud, but if she's been doing this for awhile it's going to be really hard to get this under control' blah blah blah. And the child asking 'why is it wrong?' and the parent just looking blankly, then saying to the other mother 'how do you explain it?' They can't explain it because they don't have an answer. They don't know why it's "wrong" because it actually isn't wrong. That's why they can't explain it to a child who doesn't see the problem at all. There's a lot going on in that video, but there was only one parent I could understand at all and it was the woman who was worried about the boy getting bullied. And I still disagreed with how she handled it. But I was really disappointed that no one stood up for those kids until the last woman.

[notsocommon]

My daughter wanted to be a teenage mutant ninja turtle, or a Nijago character. Only thing that stopped us was the $30 price tag! It was fun watching reactions as she ran past the 'girl' aisle and went straight for the 'boy' one, though.

[Claddagh]

It's just a Hallowe'en costume. What harm is it going to cause letting a boy dress as a princess or a girl as a super hero?

In Jr. High a group of boys dressed up as cheerleaders.

[crazyforkate]

My cousin has a three-year-old daughter, and although she's not the girliest of women, her mom and sister have been forcing "princess" crap on the kid since she was born. I guess eventually my cousin just gave in, because the little girl is just always drowned in princess stuff no matter what she actually wants (and over her sensible dad's objections). Her aunt especially tells her "You're a princess, you're a princess" all the freaking time. At a recent family reunion, they were pushing the little girl away from all the sports and games and making her play with dolls and wear pink frilly things. It was so sad. Thinking of posting this on Facebook and passive-aggressively tagging them in it.

[HOTW]

I find this kind of attitude extremely depressing. That gender roles are the "only" thing that is important. I used to wear dresses a lot as a kid I liked them still do but I was the long haired "pretty" girl who parents told me I couldn't climb trees wearing dresses..Once someone told me I would get it all dirty so I took to holding the hem in my teeth and showing the whole world my panties(or lack of if I was wearing tights-couldn't stand wearing both!) My mother was always thrilled " :x " when someone told me I couldnt do something so my solution was always worse! We used to run around the house naked and neighbours would be shocked by the fact that we saw each other naked!! :shock:

My son wears a kilt and people usually stare at him in it as well. He thinks that they need to get over it. And when people ask if he is stark under it he smiles and asks them if they want a peek.. :clap:

[swissbeauty]

My cousin has a three-year-old daughter, and although she's not the girliest of women, her mom and sister have been forcing "princess" crap on the kid since she was born. I guess eventually my cousin just gave in, because the little girl is just always drowned in princess stuff no matter what she actually wants (and over her sensible dad's objections). Her aunt especially tells her "You're a princess, you're a princess" all the freaking time. At a recent family reunion, they were pushing the little girl away from all the sports and games and making her play with dolls and wear pink frilly things. It was so sad. Thinking of posting this on Facebook and passive-aggressively tagging them in it.

Ugh. That's extremely harmful to her daughter and her daughter's sense of identity. I would recommend, if just for a second opinion, she check out the book "Cinderella Ate My Daughter" or this great article http://www.parents.com/kids/development ... orenstein/

[NjoyingNsanity]

I never really understood it either my son wanted to dress up as a girl for Halloween when he was five we let him dress, tiara, long curly wig and all he's sixteen now and very much in love with his first really serious girlfriend. It didn't turn him gay or cause him to be gender confused, heck if that were true I should be the biggest butchest lesbian around. My dad and grandfather desperately wanted me to be a boy so much so that growing up I was bought more toy guns, cars and sports equipment than Barbies. I played with the little boy next door and my older step-brother and his friends allot, so I was either playing with Hotwheels cars, Transformers or G.

I. Joes. I hated it when they'd want to play with their Star Wars stuff because I always had to be Princess Leia.

My girls are also huge superhero fans they absolutely loved the Avengers movie as well as Ironman, Spiderman and Thor. My oldest daughter has quite the crush on Tom Hiddleston. Thanks to their dad they are fans of the Smallville version of Superman and the old He-man and Transformers cartoons. While we won't be having any female superheroes this year we will be having a Goth girl, a vampress, a fairy and a monkey so despite liking boys stuff my girls are still pretty girly.

[Guest Anonymous]

My daughters love to dress in lace and frills but play with green army men. We gave them the choice between dresses or boyish clothes, and they went to the dresses. I usually wear jeans and plain turtlenecks, so where they got the dress-love from is a mystery. I think it's more fun to twirl in dresses and to touch the difference textures. Even girly pants and t's don't interest them. If they wanted to dress as Spidey, big deal. They can.

A friend's son wanted a Dora birthday party, and when she was getting decorations, someone asked how old her daughter was going to be. She corrected the lady that it was for her son, and the lady and another lady, using the word loosely, verbally jumped her and told her she was going to turn her son gay. Lots of girls like Harry Potter, and the Vatican approves of the series. Does that mean girls are going to be turned into lesbians? So why would Dora turn a kid gay? The kid either is or isn't, and he probably just likes Dora. If he's gay, so what.

And my brother used to like dressing up as a princess. We have lots of pictures. He's the furthest thing from gay. Sometimes it's just fun to wear different things. The outfit I'm wearing was bought from the men's department and I'm straight. It's just something comfortable to wear and has nothing at all to do with sexuality.

The nation's first openly transsexual major. M-to-F, who prefers male pronouns, is married to a woman.

Clothing doesn't make sexuality. People need to get over their hang ups!

[tingeofginge]

This kind of stuff makes me so mad. I have two sons. My eight year old loved to dress up with his girl cousin in her pretty dresses and paint his nails up until he was 6 or so. Actually, he'd probably still paint his nails but the kids at school made fun of him for it and he's so sensitive that no matter what I say he refuses to do it anymore. :(

My four year old loves Dora. I don't get why people think the show is only for girls. Just because the main character is a girl? It's so ridiculous. To get him motivated to potty train, we got him Dora undies that are *gasp* made for girls. He also had a Dora birthday this year.

I always tell them, "there are no girls things and boys things--just things, and you can like what you like". Both are dressing up as boy characters for Halloween this year, but I would have no problem if they had wanted to be something "girly". As others have said, wearing or playing with things that aren't "made for boys" will not make them gay. If it turns out that one or both of them is gay, it is no big deal anyway. I wish people would stop with all the gendered stuff and just let their kids be who they are. Especially because their closed minds rub off on their kids who then turn around and tease my kid when he doesn't conform to gender stereotypes.