Knowing It All, and Telling Others How It Should Be Done

[Arete]

A really egrerious example that comes to mind is Josh and Anna Duggar. Two people who met as teenagers, did a "courtship", got married, popped out 2 kids, and now think they are experts on dating, marriage, and children.

I have met a lot of couples like apple1, where they are married for decades and when you ask them the secret, they tell you there is no secret. They played it by ear day to day and the most they will tell you is remember to love one another. They NEVER set themselves up as experts. Yet two completed uneducate and uncurious 22 year olds have the nerve to bill themselves as experts and to think they are qualified to give strangers advice. Really burns my toast.

[Inky]

I confess to doing a lot of spouting about parenting before I had kids, and I'm not fundie. I'm ashamed of myself now.

Don't beat yourself up. Trisha Ashworth said "I was a really good mom before I had kids." Most of us have been there.

Of course, the master of child rearing always says it best "Somewhere it is written that parents who are critical of other people's children and publicly admit they can do better are asking for it." Erma Bombeck

I find it ridiculous that the Duggar girls are giving advice on guys, & dating. Their version of courtship is nothing like that of most of the rest of the world.

[Maggie Mae]

Don't beat yourself up. Trisha Ashworth said "I was a really good mom before I had kids." Most of us have been there.

Of course, the master of child rearing always says it best "Somewhere it is written that parents who are critical of other people's children and publicly admit they can do better are asking for it." Erma Bombeck

I find it ridiculous that the Duggar girls are giving advice on guys, & dating. Their version of courtship is nothing like that of most of the rest of the world.

I find it more ridiculous that anyone is listening to them. I'd rather take advice from someone who's actually been on a date or lives in situation that is similar to my own.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

Bloggers are a somewhat self-selected group, both fundies ones and non-fundie ones. Probably a lot of people once they actually DO get a lot of experience and know what they're doing also realize that they don't know everything and become more humble so they're less likely to write advice blogs.

Isn't there some proverb like that? You realize you know a lot when you realize you don't really know anything.

FWIW I have a secular coworker who seems to think he has the secret to being the perfect parent every time, surely he can get any baby to sleep, he would brag about his nephews who were whining when they came over with their parents (his brother and wife) would go right to sleep for him, etc. Other parents at my workplace would sort of just "yeah, whatever" humor him but that was it. Sure enough, he had his own kid, realized it's not all that easy when there's nowhere to send the kid home to and your house isn't a novelty! I have no kids of my own but the guy was even managing to annoy ME.

[luckystone]

And this is something that I keep seeing in these fundie blogs. Unmarried women talking about marriage, people without kids talking about proper parenting, newlyweds giving sage advice on how to make your marriage last. First time moms pontificating on the proper way to manage your house with half a dozen children.

YES! I see that all the time. I think it is because they have these narrow set of beliefs and think if you follow those then everything will turn out great, because this is what they have been told, and because that is what god would make happen, and they want to share that knowledge with others. I think it's a thing.

I definitely see it less often on other sites. There are a few irritating people on other boards who think after their first relationship or new marriage or first child or starting uni they are qualified for advice on everything to do with relationships and children and education and jobs, but definitely fewer than fundies, and it's delivered in a slightly more opinionative way (rather than doling out advice).

I suppose I'm a bit like that (aren't we all) in the sense I've already made up my mind on some parenting things and think I know what I'll do. I think CIO/smacking/etc are wrong and am not afraid to say so. But I've never had a child, maybe if I do I'll get so stressed out I'll just leave them alone to cry all the time except for when I come in to hit them. (Not joking...I'm not great with stress and sleep deprivation so who knows.)

[jaynie]

I suppose I'm a bit like that (aren't we all) in the sense I've already made up my mind on some parenting things and think I know what I'll do. I think CIO/smacking/etc are wrong and am not afraid to say so. But I've never had a child, maybe if I do I'll get so stressed out I'll just leave them alone to cry all the time except for when I come in to hit them. (Not joking...I'm not great with stress and sleep deprivation so who knows.)

I think (I hope, being also childless and sometimes a bit preachy) that there is a difference between insisting that there is absolutely one thing that works for everyone, and saying that there are some things that work for no one. Corporal punishment, to use your example, has been demonstrated very thoroughly not to work, and in fact to cause a lot of harm, and I don't think you need parenting experience to say so (since it's really easy to back up with, uh, facts). But if you then came along and said "The only way to correct your children's behavior is to make them stand on their heads in a disused swimming pool singing the ABC song backwards" you'd probably be rightly ignored by sane people (even if you HAD kids).

[Itsnotaclowncar]

I think at least part of the problem is that they just don't seem to have anything going on in there lives other than headship and kids. Since a lot of their blogs are their "ministries" rather than something they do for fun all the posts have to be something serious or practical. I mean I'm 25 and if I blogged way more of my posts would be about the books I've read or restaurants or concerts not how my relationship works. I have other things going on and no motivation to sell my lifestyle.

[phoenissadido]

I remember a saying that was on a plague in a friend's home about choosing your spouse wisely; it will be 90% of your happiness or 90% of your misery.

:lol:

As a single 23 year old with not a kid in sight, I sort of note down interesting things I read on mommy blogs, but I bet it all goes out the window if I actually have one >.>

[jessablessa4realz]

I have been married for 35 years, to my one and only husband.

Honestly, I really don't have a whole lot of marriage advice, outside of loving each other.

ETA - but I doubt that one line would be enough to blog about. :roll:

You know, that's the thing. What works in your marriage, works for you. I moved to Australia from the United States to be with my husband (also an American and a long story of how he ended up here) and I know a lot of people couldn't have done that. These fundie freaks think everyone should be a "Jesus"bot. What I find utterly fascinating is the fact that majority of the parents and leaders involved in the movement had a choice of living fundie or mainstream and are denying their children the same freedom. It makes me wonder what happened to these people in the mainstream world. Not necessarily what "evil" happened to them but more so what "evil" they did. Which, in turn, makes me question their qualification for giving advice.

Congrats on 35 years!!!!

[JesusFightClub]

A really egrerious example that comes to mind is Josh and Anna Duggar. Two people who met as teenagers, did a "courtship", got married, popped out 2 kids, and now think they are experts on dating, marriage, and children.

I have met a lot of couples like apple1, where they are married for decades and when you ask them the secret, they tell you there is no secret. They played it by ear day to day and the most they will tell you is remember to love one another. They NEVER set themselves up as experts. Yet two completed uneducate and uncurious 22 year olds have the nerve to bill themselves as experts and to think they are qualified to give strangers advice. Really burns my toast.

Totally agree. I also think about Burris when she writes about her marriage which is a very interesting and loving story. I would take apple1 and Burris's advice in a heartbeat over a fundie's, be they newlywed or not.

[luckystone]

The other problem with marriage advice is that you can only control your behaviour and not the other person's, and even if you try your hardest, follow all the advice in the world and are perfect some people will decide to cheat/leave/whatever because of issues of their own and it is their own decision. Advice for people to change their own behaviour and try their best is fine but in fundie blogs it's often delivered with the undertone of (and if they decide they want to give it up and be single, it's because you weren't doing it right, not because of them).

[formergothardite]

I confess to doing a lot of spouting about parenting before I had kids, and I'm not fundie. I'm ashamed of myself now.

So did I. And I was a pretty darn perfect parent and knew all the answers before I had kids. Kids ruined my perfect parenting.

[Funky Chicken]

This is why I haven't had kids. I have an unblemished record as a perfect parent and it would be a shame to spoil it!

[Juliakitty]

So did I. And I was a pretty darn perfect parent and knew all the answers before I had kids. Kids ruined my perfect parenting.

In my own defense, though, I never promoted spanking/smacking/whatever they call it! :o The main thing I overlooked was how utterly and thoroughly exhausting it is to be responsible for meeting every need that another person has, 24/7, and how hard it is to do what you think you ought to do when you're that tired.

[dawbs]

I think of the authors of "an open embrace" (sam and bethany) are a pretty egregious and tremendously sad example.

[snarkbillie]

There is a woman at my old church who was married, I shit you not, for 2 weeks and decided to start a "marriage ministry" so she could "mentor" the married couples of the church. :doh:

[apple1]

Thanks to all for the kind words.

[Swamptribe]

I've been married 27 years, we just make it up as we go.

[icecreamycakeycake]

Married 22 years.

Only one person gets to be crazy at a time.

[bea]

Oh, wow, I forgot about Sam and Bethany. At least they publicly recanted their position - though Open Embrace is still for sale, and still being held up as an example people should strive for by some churches. They conveniently leave out the fact that after four back-to-back pregnancies, what sounds like a profoundly dysfunctional marriage that was largely dysfunctional because of the fundie teachings about marriage and submission, and PPD that nearly killed Bethany, the Torodes separated and divorced and both seem much happier now.

Actually, Sam Torode just had a self-published book on Amazon called "The Dirty Parts of the Bible," a novel about a preacher's kid who goes on a road trip. It sold quite well, and he's a very popular book cover designer. Bethany is living in Nashville, has a steady boyfriend, and seems to be healing from what sounds like a completely hellish experience of too-early marriage and too many kids too close together too young.

[Austin]

QFT! In addition to being lucky enough to find the right person, choose that person wisely. I'm amazed at the half assed way some people go into marriage. A wedding ring is a symbol of your love and fidelity, it isn't a magic ring that makes everything better.

I third that truth. We will be married 30 years on Tuesday & we've had stressful times to work through now and again but I've been struck lately, during moments of introspection, that we really have been damned lucky in many ways.

[cate]

Isn't there some proverb like that? You realize you know a lot when you realize you don't really know anything.

He who knows not and knows he knows not is wise; teach him.

He who knows not and knows not he knows not is a fool; shun him.

[changemanagement]

Married for 25 years. Married my friend. But that's what worked for us.

I could never give advice for raising kids. I didn't know what the heck I was doing and winged it. At best, the personality of the kid drove the parenting style. We're satisfied.

You end up trusting your instinct.

[snarkbillie]

Married 22 years.

Only one person gets to be crazy at a time.

My husband and I have that rule too! :lol:

[Swamptribe]

My husband and I have that rule too! :lol:

It is a rule to live by.