Jump to content
IGNORED

The Term 'Not Treating Someone Like A Lady"


debrand

Recommended Posts

Many people use the terms, ladies or gentlemen to simply mean that someone is polite and repsectful of others. I've also heard the term, lady to refer to a woman who is unusually poised and gracious.

Yet, I've also heard men say that they won't treat certain women like ladies. In this instance, they are using the word, lady to mean a woman who remains in a certain sphere. A woman can loose the title lady in any number of tiny ways. If she curses-even once-or wears a skirt that is too short or argues with a man, she is no longer entitled to being called a lady. To hell with her, if she dares carry her own packages or ask to open her own door.

There is something threatening about the phrase, "Not treating someone like a lady". I imagine that the speaker means that he doesn't have to show the woman respect and consideration at all. She has now entered the subhuman category and can be treated with rudeness or even threatened. At least, that has always been how I hear the phrase, "She doesn't deserve to be treated like a lady."

However, I really don't know what the phrase means. I've never asked asked men who claim that certain women need less regard than others what they mean by the phrase. To be honest, I've always avoided such men.

I was curious if any of you had any explanation for the term. Do you have any real life examples?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm 35, and that's not a phrase I hear my peers use. It *is* something I heard my parents say, but they would be almost 80, if they were living. Now that you mention it, I don't have a really good idea what it means, and I would love to ask someone who uses the phrase.

There is the male counterpart of being a "gentleman," and, of course, both descend from the concept of gentry, so it's a class issue as much as a gender issue - BUT - I don't think I've heard anyone say, "He doesn't deserve to be treated like a gentleman."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Actually I've heard the phrase "he's no gentleman" probably more often then "she's no lady". Usually referring to a man who has an affair or is otherwise stepping outside the bounds of polite society. Remember the dialog in Gone with the Wind?

Scarlett: Sir, you are no gentleman.

Rhett: And you, miss, are no lady.

A quick googling found the term applied to athletes, politicians, and in movie lyrics. The phrase "she's no lady" returned mainly song lyrics. Other than our patriarchal fundies I don't actually think the term is used that differently by society.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Apparently some politicians still use the phrase.

I am not a fan of Michelle Bachmann but I thought that Specter was out of line in this story.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/glennthru ... _lady.html

When Specter tried to counter, Bachmann, darling of the Tea Party movement, kept on talking, which didn't sit well with the one-time Philadelphia DA, who is a stickler for politeness and protocol.

"I'm going to treat you like a lady," Mr. Specter shot back. "Now act like one."

Ms. Bachmann replied, "I am a lady."

Things went on along this line for a while -- with Specter later asking Bachmann to "act like a lady," according to the PPG's Daniel Malloy.

Bachmann is hardly a beloved figure in Democratic circles. But how many liberal women, whom Specter badly needs to defeat front-running Pat Toomey, would appreciate being told to "act like a lady" by a male debate partner?

http://jillianbarclay.hubpages.com/hub/ ... ssman-West

I was offended by GOP Congressman Allen West's email to Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman-Schultz (D). As a woman, I was mortified that a fellow elected representative would act in such a disrespectful manner to his fellow colleague. Part of the email is reprinted here:

" Look, Debbie, I understand that I after I departed the House floor you directed your floor speech comments directly towards me. Let me make myself perfectly clear, you want a personal fight, I am happy to oblige. You are the most vile, unprofessional and despicable member of the US House of Representatives. If you have something to say to me, stop being a coward and say it to my face, otherwise, shut the heck up."

Additionally West said that Ms. Wasserman-Schultz has proven that "you are not a lady" and "shall not be afforded due respect from me!!" He also sent copies of the email to several members of the House and Senate "alerting them to her heinous characterless behavior!"[/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

From my experience "lady" means "woman who acts like I think a woman should act". Step one foot outside that and you pretty much default to "bitch" (if you dare stand up for yourself or get angry about anything, etc) or "slut" (if you have sex with someone the speaker doesn't approve of you having sex with, if you don't have sex with the speaker, if you dare to enjoy sex or your sexuality, if you don't wear the "right" things, etc)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

From my experience "lady" means "woman who acts like I think a woman should act". Step one foot outside that and you pretty much default to "bitch" (if you dare stand up for yourself or get angry about anything, etc) or "slut" (if you have sex with someone the speaker doesn't approve of you having sex with, if you don't have sex with the speaker, if you dare to enjoy sex or your sexuality, if you don't wear the "right" things, etc)

Slut is a code word for "woman who won't fuck me". I've had 2 sexual partners and yet I've been called a slut relentlessly by a bunch of so called "nice guys".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Slut is a code word for "woman who won't fuck me". I've had 2 sexual partners and yet I've been called a slut relentlessly by a bunch of so called "nice guys".

Yeah, I've never been able to follow that logic. "Slut"* typically denotes a woman who both has many, many sexual partners and has no quality standards with regard to the men she sleeps with. If a woman refuses to sleep with a certain man, she obviously has quality standards he doesn't meet and her quality standards probably stop her from sleeping with an insane number of men.

* I'd like to point out that I hate the word "slut" and do not approve of the definition I've used here. I'm only going by what I've seen as mainstream culture's definition of "slut".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

http://townhall.com/columnists/evalorra ... page/full/

Here is an article about treating women like ladies.

Our society holds conservatives to a higher moral standard. When a woman acts like a lady she gains the respect both of men and other women. Besides, why would a conservative woman ever want to be mistaken for a liberal woman?

I have heard many of my male peers place women into three categories: “the ones to mess around with, the ones to date, and the ones to marry.†Though this is a rather crude way of categorizing women, it shows that men do recognize and value the qualities that make a woman a lady. Ladies are the kind of women that men can take home to Mom and Dad and that most men want to marry. Being considered “marriage material†is an indicator that a woman is to be respected; most men who deem a woman as such treat her with the utmost respect. For men, ladies are at the top of the female totem pole, and conservative women need to take pride in the fact that they are worthy of time, love, and commitment.

Granted, she does not say that use the phrase, "not treating a woman like a lady'.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah, I've never been able to follow that logic. "Slut"* typically denotes a woman who both has many, many sexual partners and has no quality standards with regard to the men she sleeps with. If a woman refuses to sleep with a certain man, she obviously has quality standards he doesn't meet and her quality standards probably stop her from sleeping with an insane number of men.

* I'd like to point out that I hate the word "slut" and do not approve of the definition I've used here. I'm only going by what I've seen as mainstream culture's definition of "slut".

I detest the word, slut because it doesn't always mean simply a woman who has a lot of sexual partners. Some people view any woman who is sexually active as being defective somehow. So, a woman who has premarital sex must be stupid, not like herself, hurting in some way, etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some people view any woman who is sexually active as being defective somehow. So, a woman who has premarital sex must be stupid, not like herself, hurting in some way, etc.

True, though I don't think that's mainstream culture's view (of course the definition of "many partners" does vary)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

True, though I don't think that's mainstream culture's view (of course the definition of "many partners" does vary)

That definition probably comes from when I was younger. Luckily, I think that the views on women's sexuality are changing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've actually more often heard that phrase directed at men, when I've heard it at all, i.e. "Shame on you! That's not how you treat a lady." In elementary school and junior high, teachers always seemed big on "ladies first" and they would call us "ladies" or "gentlemen" if they were trying to get us to shut up and stop screwing around, sort of the group equivalent of being called by your full name when you're in trouble, I guess. Like they would say to a bunch of guys who were screwing around, "Gentlemen, have you finished your assignment yet?" I think my choir director would do that, too. That's about the only time I've ever heard people referred to as "ladies" or "gentlemen" though (other than, "Good evening, ladies and gentlemen, please turn of your cell phones before the performance begins.")

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some of the reasons I have heard/seen why a man won't treat a woman like a lady;

She is too old for their taste.

She is fat.

She is ugly in their eyes.

She has red hair.

She is divorced.

She has kids.

She is crazy.

She drinks alcohol sometimes.

She smokes.

She lives alone.

She makes more money than I do.

She looks poor.

She is serving me such as in a waitress.

So it seems like the only reason some men act like a gentleman is to get women into bed and to hell with the ones he doesn't think are good enough for his bed. :evil:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm not sure, in person, I've ever heard someone use "lady" or "gentleman" in a negative sense "You're no lady." Like O Latin, it's usually coming from teachers, and usually in the sense of, "I'm going to speak to you all like ladies and gentlemen."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

From my experience "lady" means "woman who acts like I think a woman should act". Step one foot outside that and you pretty much default to "bitch" (if you dare stand up for yourself or get angry about anything, etc) or "slut" (if you have sex with someone the speaker doesn't approve of you having sex with, if you don't have sex with the speaker, if you dare to enjoy sex or your sexuality, if you don't wear the "right" things, etc)

I'd agree with this one. I'd also agree that the definition here for "slut" is the most accurate one.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I thought of this thread when I read this article:

msn.foxsports.com/nascar/story/san-diego-anchor-suspended-for-danica-patrick-comment-022912

A sports anchor in California got suspended for saying that Danica Patrick "is such a pretty girl...but what's not attractive is that she's sexy and she knows it" and for saying that he would describe her with a word that "starts with a B and it's not beautiful."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Makes me think of all the times I worked on campaigns with old men who weren't used to working with women. They didn't want to be blatant misogynist tools, because we were supposedly such progressive lefty organizers, so they would refer to me as "young lady" rather than by my name, and then attempt to send me for coffee. Good times.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was on a quasi-date once (guy I was interested in and his friends) and the other boys started making crude jokes. This was freshman year of college... I knew all of them pretty well and this was pretty typical for any time we hung out. The boy I liked said something like "Stop, there's a lady here!"

At the time I took it as a compliment but now I want to slap myself for even thinking he was dating material because that incident pretty much sums up his personality... he and his (girl) friend now have an ongoing joke about how he needs a trophy wife but um, there's a lot of truth to that. Definitely, if not totally misogynistic, arrogant and pretentious. He's a poli sci major and Republican. He called me "dear" and it sounded like Rhett Butler so that's why I was so head over heels for him. *headdesk* I can handle the crude jokes thank you very much and I am not going to be your accessory for your Santorum campaign.

Anyway, that's really the only time I've heard it from my peers beyond sororities/fraternities (often they will call the whole group "ladies" or "gentlemen" respectively).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You all better treat me like the lady that I am!!! Seriously, though, the whole "I'll treat you like a lady, now act like one" exchange just sounds like a thinly-veiled threat to me. As in, "get yourself in line before I hit you." In a patriarchy, any word specifically used to address women can have a negative connotation. Plus, it's just an iteration on the "No true Scotsman" fallacy that fundie men just loooooooooove for some reason. All true ladies are submissive, love makin' babies, pink crafts, etc. In other words, a load of total horse shit.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You all better treat me like the lady that I am!!! Seriously, though, the whole "I'll treat you like a lady, now act like one" exchange just sounds like a thinly-veiled threat to me. As in, "get yourself in line before I hit you." In a patriarchy, any word specifically used to address women can have a negative connotation. Plus, it's just an iteration on the "No true Scotsman" fallacy that fundie men just loooooooooove for some reason. All true ladies are submissive, love makin' babies, pink crafts, etc. In other words, a load of total horse shit.

This.

My step-father, who I remember kicking my mom's Bible across the room; and another time, ripping it up, and screaming "FUCK YOU AND YOUR GOD", eventually came to accept Jesus into his heart once he realized that he could better control my mother that way. He used to beat the shit out of her (big surprise), and he would actually say that if she would act like a lady (meaning, obey him and his every command unquestioningly), he would treat her like one, but since she acted like "a fucking butch" (by occasionally questioning him), he was most definitely not going to treat her like a lady. He would say, "You fucking butch. You want to act like a man, I will treat you like one". So yes, I do read it, when coming from a man, as a "now get in line before I hit you" type of comment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree with Ladyamylynn and Dinaberries. It always gives the impression that if you don't perform in the way they think a lady should, they will disrespect you

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree with Ladyamylynn and Dinaberries. It always gives the impression that if you don't perform in the way they think a lady should, they will disrespect you

That's the impression I get, that if you don't act like a "lady" or more accurately, submissive to them, they'll disrespect you. In a way the B-word really means Being In Total Control of Herself. In that case, I'm glad I'm a bitch.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest Anonymous

The only way I can explain it is that conservative society believes that women who don't "keep sweet" or are on the lower end of the economic/social ladder aren't worthy of being treated with respect, and deserve to be called names, harassed, etc. It makes me furious! All women and men deserve to be treated with dignity and respect.

EDITED: for clarification

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.



  • Trending Content

  • Recent Status Updates

    • Maggie Mae

      Maggie Mae

      What do people do in the Sonoran desert? I've hiked the hikes I wanted to do. Seems like all that is left is golf, shopping at chains that exist everywhere, and stuff I've done. Oh and eating. I can only eat so many times a day. It's too cold to rent a paddleboard or swim. 
      · 0 replies
    • KnittingOwl

      KnittingOwl

      First snow storm of the season hit today. It got windy tonight, and we lost power. Somehow this continues to be a shock to PSE. Why they refuse to upgrade the infrastructure or do something so that 10s of thousands of people don’t lose power and heat literally every time it’s windy, I do not understand. We live in the Pacific Northwest. It gets windy!
      · 3 replies
    • louisa05

      louisa05

      Nebraska's new football coach is an evangelical bullshit artist who participates in "Man Up Ministries" conferences in the off season. Their motto is "Fighting for Biblical Manhood". Excuse me while I go vomit. 
      · 2 replies
    • 47of74

      47of74

      Don't know I'd charge quite that much though.
       

      · 0 replies
    • 47of74

      47of74

      Wisconsin’s first thanksgiving 

      · 0 replies
    • mango_fandango

      mango_fandango

      Long time no visit…
      COVID has finally caught up with me. Dad tested positive first, last Friday, then my mother, brother and I all tested positive today. Main symptom is feeling really really tired. Hopefully it doesn’t get much worse 🤞 
      · 1 reply
    • 47of74

      47of74

      Yeah probably not the best place to put that quote...

      · 0 replies
    • 47of74

      47of74

      If I still did the Catholic thing with confession this would be the priest who heard mine..

      · 0 replies
    • BlackberryGirl

      BlackberryGirl

      Do I wear it?
      i was given a vintage, 70 year old mink coat. It fits like it was made for me. Somehow my cousin, who is 8 years older than me came into 3 gorgeous fur coats from a granddaughter of a woman her mother knew. We’re talking women who died in the mid 60’s.  None of them would fit her or any other of the women in my family. Yay for essentially being a ball. Everyone else is about 5’7 or more and all outweigh me by 50+. 
       
      it is just gorgeous. What women in Skokie and Highland Park many years ago, when I still lived there would call a “serviceable” fur. It was the fur they’d wear to a good restaurant, but not the opera or symphony.
      do I wear it? I’d love to, and I live in hunting country so fur isn’t looked down on. But is it wrong?  Arrrgh god its pretty.
      · 6 replies
    • JoyfulSel

      JoyfulSel

      A modern day love story: Guy reaches out to you, you think he's cute so you start talking to him, give him your number. Guy then messages if you're free, you reply yes, guy never responds again. Love that. 👌
      · 1 reply
  • Recent Blog Entries

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.